[Closed] How to save the High Street

why bother? I personally never use my high street as its much more convinent for me to shop from home. If it was gone tomorrow I'd not miss it.

you could argue that not everyone is able to buy stuff online - that's a fair point, but education would not be hard to achieve. If that's not done, I think the highstreet will move to providing only those people who can't/don't want to shop online with a shopping experiance

Short of enforcing a limit to online shopping there's not much that can be done. IMO, the Supermarkets, Amazon and eBay have already won this war.

3/4 of your ideas will cost the shops money.
The other idea would probably cost them as well.

I reckon the answer's pretty simple. Sort of. Convenience is why people shop at supermarkets - people are busy and supermarket shopping takes less time than all the different shops plus they're easy to part at, etc.

So, local shops need to sort that aspect out. I often wondered if a bunch of smaller businesses could set up a 'supermarket' where there are still discrete shops but it's all in one big store so that you can get your trolley walk round and get everything and pay at the end just like in a normal supermarket.

longer opening hours = increased overheads
could consider different opening hours, but how many people want to go shopping after a day at work?

points 2 & 3 seem to be directed at taking on supermarkets, who will always win on price even if they have to employ very dirty tricks

free parking, what everywhere? just for shoppers or employees?

Supermarkets have got massive because (1) we buy on price alone (and not quality) and (2) they are very effective at lobbying for planning law changes (which include opening times).

I actually don't think we have any way back.

Nothing will alter the inexorable decline of the high street and none of us will care.

why bother? I personally never use my high street as its much more convinent for me to shop from home. If it was gone tomorrow I'd not miss it.

you could argue that not everyone is able to buy stuff online - that's a fair point, but education would not be hard to achieve. If that's not done, I think the highstreet will move to providing only those people who can't/don't want to shop online with a shopping experiance

But what about when granny needs to pop out and get her prescription but all the pharmacists are closed because they are put out of business by the larger operators and what about if you want to buy a book from someone who has an interest in books and doesn't stock the same mainstream stuff covered by waterstones (and amazon?) and can make a sound recommendation, or the same for a bottle of wine. The high street is about more than buying stuff.

why bother? I personally never use my high street as its much more convinent for me to shop from home. If it was gone tomorrow I'd not miss it.

So, local shops need to sort that aspect out. I often wondered if a bunch of smaller businesses could set up a 'supermarket' where there are still discrete shops but it's all in one big store so that you can get your trolley walk round and get everything and pay at the end just like in a normal supermarket.

the local flea market is like that, and it works well

I'm not sure it'd work against supermarkets as they still have the massive price advantage of volume - unless there's a way to fix that too

Like most problems, it's a bit more complicated than it first seems. The solution is simple but not easy, put people back into the city centres and then city centre shopping will become convenient.
When there are people, shops will provide for them. More shops - more competition, more competition - better service, better service - keener prices, etc...

I disagree. for some folk its about convinience, but I live ~2 miles from the shopping area (which, being Brighton, is well 'stocked' from a shops perspective) and work even closer (~3 minute walk to the edge of the shopping area). The only reason I ever go in is to

visit the bank if there's something I can't do online (mainly paying in cheques).
go to one of the many, excellent pubs.

I'm a young, high earner with lots of disposable income (no kids etc), so I should be just the kinda person that they're reaching out to, yet I don't know any of my (male) peers who'd voluntarily go into town 'shopping' either. The information available on the internet makes the whole experiance far more pleasant.

So, local shops need to sort that aspect out. I often wondered if a bunch of smaller businesses could set up a 'supermarket' where there are still discrete shops but it's all in one big store so that you can get your trolley walk round and get everything and pay at the end just like in a normal supermarket.

Like an indoor market?

EDIT: Beaten to it ^^^

I think the High st is dead, online is the future, small shops (inc. my 2 LBS never have the stock) all we need now is for the Post Office to sort their game out and we'll be ok, the queues to pick up parcels at my local sorting office are a joke.

I think the High st is dead, online is the future

Perhaps, but would you buy shoes online?

Easy - stop / close out of town shopping centres and limit the size of supermarkets

Stop trying to compete with the supermarkets and focus on offering something unique.

That said, in Leek we do have an independent store on the High Street that offers all sorts of foodstuffs at a good price. Long Live "Home and Colonial" 😀

Perhaps, but would you buy shoes online?

Yes i know my size.

The high street is about more than buying stuff...

Yep, it's about getting face to face advice and recommendations. It's abotu viewing the product first hand, trying it on or trying it out. Then ******* off and buying it cheap from Wiggle and the like.

all we need now is for the Post Office to sort their game out and we'll be ok, the queues to pick up parcels at my local sorting office are a joke.

So online shopping saves us having to leave our homes and queue up to buy stuff, oh the technology!

Perhaps, but would you buy shoes online?
Yes i know my size.

in that case i'm sure nothing could go wrong

Not sure why we can't accept that the High St as you're thinking of, with a few exceptions, is largely dead.

Affluent communities, and those too small to support a Tesco Express can get by, but for the majority the lowest common denominator is the best fit in terms of convenience and value for money.

limit the size of supermarkets

I know you don't see branding, but have you noticed what's going on in the real world? I Just did a search for my closest Tessco, out of interest, we've moved to a new town, and 19 of the first 20 results were for Express/Metro type stores. The penetration for these things has been phenomenal.

Affluent communities, and those too small to support a Tesco Express can get by, but for the majority the lowest common denominator is the best fit in terms of convenience and value for money

Perhaps, but that is pretty short-sighted. We'll be left with these soulless housing communities

My local high street seems to be thriving, its dead busy on a weekday afternoon. Only one empty shop and that is because the local town council take a close interest and are very fussy about who they let operate.

That and the fact that half the town are retired people. So there's the answer, a time machine back to the 1950s.

I quite anjoy a pootle up the high street on saturday mornings. Butchers, bakers, greens, hardware shop and stop by the LBS for consumables.

Obviously if I'm away at the weekend this doesn't happen.

So the best option would be to open until 7pm on one or two days a week. Dr's Surgery does this why not shops?

Generally I find the meat, braed or veg to be far better than the supermarkets.

in that case i'm sure nothing could go wrong

also buy my shoes online. In fact, being size 14, this is one place where online outdoes 'real' shops by a huge margin. The only place in my City I'm aware of selling shoes in my size is high and mighty. That's fine for the one pair of smart shoes I buy every 3 years, but for the trainers I wear day in day out, Amazon keeps me supplied in the styles I like, at prices I like. If they don't fit (never happened, I guess I'm not that fussy when it comes to the fit of shoes?) I can just send them back and get one in the next size up/down?

Interestingly Crawley council are resisting a John Lewis opening an out of town store as their preference is for retail to be concentrated in the town centre to keep shoppers coming into the middle.

Yep, it's about getting face to face advice and recommendations. It's abotu viewing the product first hand, trying it on or trying it out. Then ******* off and buying it cheap from Wiggle and the like.

Don't forget it's also about being told 'We can get that in stock for you next week' too 🙂

Mary Portas is correct. Not suprising as she is the retail expert with donkeys years experience (and wearing rather well too).

You cant compete on price/convenience with online, you need to increase the motivation for people to got to town (footfall) and the increased spending comes as a side effect.

I hate going shopping, not because I object to spending the extra, but because shops and high streets and shopping malls and out of town centres are all boring inane banal places.

That and the fact that half the town are retired people. So there's the answer, a time machine back to the 1950s.

What and be surrounded by people with entrenched views, telling you how hard they've had it and that less is more how you need to toughen up. With occasional casual and overt sexism and racism. occasionally....

oh! hold on!

here's an easy one then - if towns want people to come into town - make it *very* attractive for delivery companies to house their 'pickup points' in the city center (even with a storefront). I'm forced to go to my local post office sorting office once a week because of deliveries. Its on the edge of the shopping area so I skip round it. if it was in the middle I'd have no option other than to visit

Don't forget Tesco own One-Stop as well, and Mills Newsagents most people have one of those if not 2 or 3 nearby.

Stop trying to compete with the supermarkets and focus on offering something unique.

this.

Like an indoor market?

Exactly like that but organised so that to practical purposes it works like a single big shop that covers everything that supermarkets sell which IME indoor markets don't.

sugdenr - Member
Mary Portas is correct. Not suprising as she is the retail expert with donkeys years experience (and wearing rather well too).

You cant compete on price/convenience with online, you need to increase the motivation for people to got to town (footfall) and the increased spending comes as a side effect.

What is convenient about buying something online, waiting for the postman to deliver it while you're out, organising a re-delivery to your local post office, then heading to said post office on the high street to pick it up?

As per hels, my local high street is booming. It was dying, but after Sainsbury's moved in the footfall has increased dramatically and other shops have benefited. It has even prompted new shops to open, and this is during economic stagnation and in the North East. It also demonstrate the idea that supermarkets are all bad is myopic. The situation is very complex, and i imagine there are local factors at play which can't be captured in a general report for the government.

here's an easy one then - if towns want people to come into town - make it *very* attractive for delivery companies to house their 'pickup points' in the city center (even with a storefront). I'm forced to go to my local post office sorting office once a week because of deliveries. Its on the edge of the shopping area so I skip round it. if it was in the middle I'd have no option other than to visit

So you want you delivery office to be in a place where you need to walk to it?

What is convenient about buying something online, waiting for the postman to deliver it while you're out, organising a re-delivery to your local post office, then heading to said post office on the high street to pick it up?

The item in question might have been a whole £3 cheaper online. Think of the massive saving! 😉

So you want you delivery office to be in a place where you need to walk to it?

I don't want it there, but for towns it'd be good. Most stuff that's delivered isn't as big as not to be easily carried - you'd obviously need some other solution for the stuff that is..

I don't want it there, but for towns it'd be good. Most stuff that's delivered isn't as big as not to be easily carried - you'd obviously need some other solution for the stuff that is.

so... two delivery offices, one for small stuff, one for big stuff? Put the small stuff one in a pace which you have to walk to and the big stuff one in a place you can drive to, and let the delivery guy decide if you can carry it or not?

What is convenient about buying something online, waiting for the postman to deliver it while you're out, organising a re-delivery to your local post office, then heading to said post office on the high street to pick it up?

Funny, the reasons you've cited don't gel with the reality for most of us, do they?

so... two delivery offices, one for small stuff, one for big stuff? Put the small stuff one in a pace which you have to walk to and the big stuff one in a place you can drive to, and let the delivery guy decide if you can carry it or not?

as I said, I don't want this, but it'd get people into towns

And yeah, why not? or have the office in town, but the 'large items' counter round the back. It'd not force everyone to go into town, but a lot of folk may think 'well I'm here now, I should probably go and see if ....'

So, towns should make it easier for people to pick up the stuff they order on-line. and that will make the towns more successful.

Can I interest you in a driving glove for driving in Europe?

Funny, the reasons you've cited don't gel with the reality for most of us, do they?

They do with me. Most things I order need to be collected.

i think until peoples attitudes change i think the high st will always struggle...ive been on a quiet in house crusade this year to not use the supermarkets and buy as much as i can from humans in shops...not spent any more money but the quality of service/goods has gone right up...i eat better meat/fish now,vegs are loads better etc.bought a telly and a washing machine off a local good independant,he fitted them both for free and did me a wee deal on the telly.all done within a week of ordering..kinda like the service i try and offer customers.

next year a lot of the brands that ill run in the shop will be lbs only brands if i can...if its in crc merlin wiggle ill look at doing something else

Secure cycle parking would help in towns and villages. Make it easier to 'pop in' by bike rather than faffing around queuing for parking spaces and paying for said spaces.

Some towns need a good spuce-up to make them appealing rather than looking run-down and dreary.

For example, nearish to me is a town called Marlborough and it has plenty of independant shops. Sure over the years that I've been shopping there some shops have closed down but, in many cases, others have opened up.

Place is always busy and fortunately there is a large car park set back from the main high street.

The difference is that it is not a clone of anytown, it has some wonderful old buildings and plenty of character.

I have very little option now but to buy from supermarkets - my local high street being almost dead now.

It was very interesting when in the Netherlands to see that all the towns and villages still have thriving high streets full of independent shops - why - basically because out of the centre food stores are not allowed nor are supermarkets over a certain size - so tesco for example simply hasn't bothered even trying asw their tactics have been effectivly countered.

It amy really now be too late for us which is a shame = but if councils stop allowing the massive shopping malls and out of town centres and huge supermarkets then our high streets may have a chance

You know what, I don't really like shopping. I know lots of folk like me. It's not the shop's fault either. I don't think shops are the answer. So what else will make me want to use the town centre? If the shops go to the wall, I might think it's a bit bleak, but it wouldn't bother me that much. So aside from pubs, estate agents and banks, why would I go there? There's a ton of space above shops and in empty buildings that could be residential, but it cost more to convert than for new build, never mind lifts and disability issues. If there is a solution to the high street, I don't think it's going to be from retail.

My high street has a proper hardware store where I can get advice and buy just one screw. Try doing that in homebase.
The spread of those self checkout things is a worry as well. Give it 10 years and your mega hyper shop will be self automated for your convenience. Its all to speed you up at the checkout due to ginormous queues. Queues that exist because everyone is forced to shop in one place.
And don't start me on Ikea aaaggggghhhhh.

Really don't think you can in major towns, being not every part of a town is an affluent area.
Small country village high streets are totally different also usually very affluent so always
buzzing during the day and also used for socialising too, unlike cheaper town high streets
which usually arbour a lot of social crime.

I work in retail property and go to a few conferences. Recently I attended one about the future landscape of retail property, and one of the things discussed was collection lockers. It is a well known fact that Royal Mail provide a proper pants service which simply hasn't kept up to date with modern shopping habits.

Amazon do it already (Hammersmith I think), but other online retailers will soon follow - I think House of Fraser are doing it in Aberdeen. There will soon be many locker facilities where you collect your online purchases. The location of these could have a massive bearing on what happens around them (particularly in high street locations).

On a slightly different matter - many people blame the supermarkets for putting high street retailers out of business. Interestingly, both Asda and Tesco have seen drastic falls in their sales of non-food items, to the point where they are assessing their property portfolio and making adjustments to the square footage they give to non-grocery items.

i think until peoples attitudes change i think the high st will always struggle..

This. Like I said up there: in Britain we don't buy on quality, only price. Watch every supermarket advert - it's all about price.

But, this is a change that we as a nation seem to have invited, or at the very least not been bothered to counter. Sure, it happened drip by drip, but nonetheless our attention was clearly elsewhere.

I was only remarking on this yesterday when in Southport. Once a thriving town with a fantastic shopping street with a variety of independent, expert retailers. Now there are many boarded up shops and too many chains.

It's like we are too scared to make decisions for ourselves, so we allow the tide of large scale retail uniformity suck us in and dumb us down.

As the consumer becomes more discerning online, so we've allowed ourselves to do it again - buy more stuff at ever lower price without ever considering the cost.

The online retailers I like best are those ones with bricks and mortar shops. Best of both. I'm also tending towards buying less, but of higher quality. And that needs experts.

Our high streets need experts.

Amazon do it already (Hammersmith I think), but other online retailers will soon follow - I think House of Fraser are doing it in Aberdeen. There will soon be many locker facilities where you collect your online purchases. The location of these could have a massive bearing on what happens around them (particularly in high street locations).

i'm *really* surprised one of the big supermarket chains isn't doing this already - just have your item delivered to your local tesco instead of home. From most shoppers perspective its fine, as you need to do a food shop anyway. for tesco its great, as it increases footfall into towns. for the vendor its great, as it reduces shipping costs (at a guess tesco could do this for way less than someone doing door-to-door deliveries). Tesco and sainsburys already allow purchases of products brought on their sites to be picked up from a store, so wouldn't be a huge leap of infrastructure to get products from 'anyone' delivered there

obviously, those folk who are at home during the day and hate tesco won't like it, but for the rest of us its a good idea..

Having them in Tesco or Sainsbury's won't save the high street though, will it?

Plus, why would the big supermarkets have goods from their competitors sent to lockers in their store? They'd have to weigh up the loss in sales with the increase in footfall.

Its simple, good shops will evolve and stay open as they offer products and services,

The shops that are closing just aren't good enough and why should we support them.

Wiggle will be on the high street soon to kill off bike shops.

maybe the stupidly expensive rents in town centres need to be looked at.

My local highstreet is still stupidly busy on weekends, too busy for my liking so I avoid it most of the time.

It is convenient for me though. Easy to get to by public transport, and has parking for motorbikes so I don't have to faff about. The shops generally open nice and early, so if I get there before the horde of chavs, it's still a rather peaceful experience.

The big plus points are a) I can get stuff straight away without waiting and b) I can try stuff on.

These are things the online world can't ever compete with.

I'm also getting fed up with the online experience lately as more and more companies are using the huge pile of crap that is YODEL.

It's the changing face of retailing IMO, convenience and choice. The internet for me is about choice, I have access to everything and anything. Convenience would be driving to an out of town retail park, you might not get what you want, but it's straight in and out, with a quick dash around in between. I can't be arsed driving into town, finding somewhere to park, then wandering around a town centre and a load of shops to possibly not get what I want.
Biking analogy would be, Altura and Endura only available at my local bike shop. Internet, absolutely anything and everything, plus bargains, plus Altura and Endura. Also, I don't think I'm alone in wanting my monthly internet charges to do some 'work' for me ie bargains and choice, even 2nd hand bargains.
Friend has a local sports shop, probably closing down in a few months. I feel sorry for him, but he hasn't tried to move on, internet selling in volume, ebay, etc.

but if councils stop allowing the massive shopping malls and out of town centres and huge supermarkets then our high streets may have a chance

Agreed, too much self-serving going on and no accountability.

I have noticed that Waitrose promote local produce although it just so happens they have a farm in Hampshire.

Have decided to go back to a local farm shop for meat following the extremely unpleasant 'minced steak' I bought from Asda. 🙁 Only stopped cos it was getting expensive.

Does anyone else do battle with their conscience about what and where they buy from?

cinnamon_girl You can't beat the village shops at Hartley Wintney in Hampshire.
Was there over the weekend visiting friends Love that place.

grantway - did you take your bike? There's riding to be had in Bramshill Forest including singletrack. Have driven through Hartley Witney a fair few times.

Cinnamon_girl na never knew there was any riding to be had around there Gutted
Thanks for the heads up I will chat with my mate later.
Thought Swinley was the only place near him.
Is Bramshill Forest any good?

Longer opening hours – be open when people finish work
Better customer service – offer the kind of advice you can’t get in Tesco, remember people’s names, actually care

How about, right, if you're gonna demand retail staff work even more unsociable hours than many already do, as well as have to be nice to largely ungrateful and often quite rude customers, pay them a tad more than flipping Minimum Wage? Which of course would mean a big increase in prices of everything...

[i]Ooh let's make everything more convenient for me, sod the effect on anyone else as long as I can buy a new wok at 2am...[/i]

Such a selfish attitude.

Ever lived near something that's open all hours? Had to put up with people driving cars, hooting horns, being noisy in the street etc when you're trying to sleep?

Coming out in the morning to find someone's defecated on yer doorstep?

grantway - Gorrick held a race there earlier in the year, not a regular venue though. Did actually check it out after the race and some of it was incredibly narrow. I also find it very lonely over there, the woodland is pretty dense in places.

Also more riding to be had at Yateley Heath Wood, again used for Gorrick races.

Instead of whingeing and whineing and thinking of new forms of legislation, put your money where your mouth is.

I propose a self imposed/personal moratorium on all non-essential purchases normally undertaken in the superstore or shopping mall.

Whaddaya reckon ??

Do I win £5 ?

Elf - tend to agree with you. We really don't need 24/7 shopping and I don't believe that the workers are paid unsocial hours rates. It's taking advantage of people.

Is there no public loos in your part of That Lahndun?

Yeah there are but they're down Chrisp St Market, and they close about 5pm.

Then there's nothing.

Free parking – removes the excuse for people just popping in

Hasn't it been shown that encouraging cycling, walking and public transport does far more for local shops and town centres than more car parking?

Ever lived near something that's open all hours? Had to put up with people driving cars, hooting horns, being noisy in the street etc when you're trying to sleep?

Coming out in the morning to find someone's defecated on yer doorstep?

Yep, hated London 😉