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For the past 6 years I've been working and paying tax/social security abroad, plus HMRC self assessment because I still live in Scotland. Over that time I've been trying to pay my national insurance contributions as well, but I'm at a loss. I've spoken to HMRC and filled in all the necessary forms but all I get is an email saying they'll be in touch with how to pay and then radio silence. Every time I call them to see what's going on I get pointed back towards the forms I've already filled in. My accountant doesn't know what to do, and it's just dawned on me that I'm 15 years away from when I'd like to retire and I'm still short 13 years of NI if I want to retire with full contributions.
Does anyone here work with HMRC or know who I should contact, or just how I can pay the bloody NI that I need to?
I assume you've already tried the standard approach?
https://www.gov.uk/check-national-insurance-record
Going through that, I was able to top up previous years.
Are you able to log into the uk gov website and check your NI record there?
If so, you should have the option to buy short or missing years up to 6 years ago I think.
Bought a year and a partial year a few months back but I'm tax resident in the UK, I'm not sure how it works if you are tax resident elsewhere.. Worth a look though I guess.
I've tried the online stuff but I'm not able to just top up that way, as far as I know because it's foreign earned and taxed income even though I still pay tax in the UK as well.
I was just given a reference number for each year I wanted to top up and did a bank transfer. There didn't seem to be any check on where the bank funds originated.
Are you referring to voluntary contributions? Class 2 or Class 3??
If so, you complete (on-line) a CF83 form and wait....and wait. Completion on-line requires a Government Gateway ID (I think it's called that) so first step might be to find or get this gateway ID.
I'm going thru this process now. I submitted my on-line CF83 on September 9th and got a 12 digit confirmation of submission immediately but the process warned me not to expect any response to whether the submission was "approved" until October 7 (so at least one month later). Assuming it is approved, they will let you know whether Class 2 or Class 3 rates apply and then you'll need to figure out payment methods (I'll use Direct Debit)
I did it by calling and eventually I got someone who gave me the bank number to make the transfer to along with the reference to put in the transfer. It took a few calls though. Have you tried using the number for people outside the UK rather than the 0300 number (+ 44 191 203 7010). It is possible that they route the call differently to people than might be able to help you better. The process from when I first applied to make voluntary contributions to actually doing it was about a year
Are you referring to voluntary contributions? Class 2 or Class 3??
That's correct. I completed the latest form in January this year and in mid-March received the reply saying something odd like I'd be "allowed" to make voluntary contributions and they'd be in touch. Since then nothing and when I call I just get passed round the houses until someone tells me to fill in the form again.
I'll try the outside UK number, thanks.
My experience is similar to Vlad. I called DWP (from the UK, after I’d returned) and spoke to someone. They told me to fill out the form, which I did, listing periods abroad. Then I called again and someone gave me an appointment for MONTHS later when someone would call me. They did so and confirmed I could pay class 2 and told me a reference number and an HMRC phone number to call to make the payment. It’s ludicrously inefficient. My wife went through a similar charade, made the payment and had to call DWP half a dozen times to get her records updated correctly.
The bright side is that class 2 contributions are an absolute steal.
The bright side is that class 2 contributions are an absolute steal.
Hmmm, I wouldn't call them a steal. For my pension, I was told that for every £200 per year I'd have to pay, I'd get around ~£250 per year extra pension. I can't remember the exact numbers (so don't quite me!) but it wasn't fantastic as I could invest that £200 and get reasonable returns/compound interest myself...
What potentially works in my favour is that £200/year I'll have to pay will be pulled from my long term savings/investments so didn't cost me £200 on the way in and I'll only have a few years of "lost" investment yet I'll get a guaranteed ~20% return within 5 years (I'll be claiming my pension in 5 years time, and it will subject to the triple-lock growth assuming that isn't scrapped)
Class 3 contributions (around £800-900 per year) would be far too expensive to make it worthwhile for me
So, it may be worth doing the calcs for your own circumstances but buying voluntary contributions isn't always a no-brainer IMO
Class 3 contributions (around £800-900 per year) would be far too expensive to make it worthwhile for me
That I can't figure out. For every year you top up you get an extra £340-ish per year in pension payments. As long as you draw your state pension for at least 3 years you're quids in.
I used to send a cheque to nsi to buy voluntary years when I was abroad. It all worked ok, just attach note to cheque to say which year you are buying. I m now UK tax resident and can go through govt gateway, all the years have been credited correctly.
It is a good investment, payback c 3 years. If sadly you die before claiming you get no guarantee as you would with a dB or annuity.
I ve got the address of nsi somewhere if you want it.
That I can't figure out. For every year you top up you get an extra £340-ish per year in pension payments. As long as you draw your state pension for at least 3 years you're quids in
And for class 2 contributions, it's even better.
Hmmm, I wouldn't call them a steal. For my pension, I was told that for every £200 per year I'd have to pay, I'd get around ~£250 per year extra pension. I can't remember the exact numbers (so don't quite me!) but it wasn't fantasticas I could invest that £200 and get reasonable returns/compound interest myself...
so £200 now buys you a £250 annuity from 67 to death? If you can do better than that I’d like to employ you to manage my investments
so £200 now buys you a £250 annuity from 67 to death? If you can do better than that I’d like to employ you to manage my investments
I think you've misunderstood me. I have multiple* missing years so I'd have to buy multiple years at £200 each but, assuming I buy back the last six years PLUS the next FIVE years (I'm 61 currently) and maybe the CURRENT year, its gonna cost me in the region of £2400 in total for, at best, at extra £250 per year.
My parents both died when they were 65, so, although I don't have any health problems and I dont intend to die early, it's not a foregone conclusion that I'll be around long enough to benefit. In the meantime, that £2400 is already invested and making decent returns - those returns will still be available to MrsVlad when I pop my clogs whereas my state pension will die when I do.....
(* I've at least 18 missing years currently but I'm not sure how many I will be allowed to buy back and Ill obviously need to pay some for the next few years as I'm not 67 yet
Edit: granted, my original post didn't make it clear I had multiple years to buy!
Each year you buy will give you about £340 extra pension per year for ever. A year of class 3 contributions is about 900 and class 2 about 250. So I don’t see where your calculation comes from
multiple years at £200 each but, assuming I buy back the last six years PLUS the next FIVE years (I'm 61 currently) and maybe the CURRENT year, its gonna cost me in the region of £2400 in total for, at best, at extra £250 per year.
If you paid 11-12 x £200 in class 2 contributions, you'd get an extra £3740-4080 per year. The only situation where it's a bad deal is you pegging it within your first 7 months of taking the state pension.