(asking for a friend)
Friend is not enjoying (understatement) his current place of work. Many factors have contributed to this, including the unsafe working practices enforced by the boss which resulted in the entire office contracting COVID. He's hoping to line up a new job in the near future and give in his notice.
Although he has no desire to ever bump into this (small, niche) company again (and will be moving into an unrelated industry), he doesn't like burning bridges or leaving a bad taste despite it being very tempting to do so. He is friendly with the team and holds them in high regard professionally.
His current plan:
Hand in notice verbally whilst handing over a written letter and then email after (same as letter). Ask to take off notice period using accrued holidays, meaning he can leave the same day. If asked for reasoning, state "personal reasons" and refuse to give further details (is this reasonable?).
Also, he's planning to ask in writing that his personal details be removed from company records by the end of the calendar month (address, bank details, phone/email...) - apparently his boss has previous for harassing current/ex employees.
Any further advice for my friend?
The best way to leave is to get laid off with a cheque - he should aim for this.
I don't think you can do that nicely.
If you want to be out on the day, and cut all future contact, then sure. But there's no "nice" about it.
Shouldn’t need to give any reasons
Dear company/manager
Please accept this as notice of my resignation.
My final day will be (today + notice period).
I have N days holiday accumulated so I wound like to use these now.
My final working day will be (today + notice period - holidays)
Regards
Your friend
Sounds like his bridges might be burnt for him if management is going to *stalk* him.
In the words if Douglas Adams, so long, and thanks for all the fish.
Shouldn’t need to give any reasons
This 👆
My final day will be (today + notice period).
I have N days holiday accumulated so I wound like to use these now.
My final working day will be (today + notice period – holidays)
I am not 100% on what the law is on this but I believe the employer could reject the request to use accrued holiday (because, for example, the employment contract says an employee must give ten days notice for holiday requests). Obviously the employer would have to pay the employee for any entitlement owed, but they may prefer to do that if they are busy and would prefer not to be suddenly be an employee down without notice.
The above is true. Is that a persistent cough?
I think your friends plan is not a million miles away, but they should bear in mind:
Like it or not, he will be asked why and also where he's going to. Saying its for "personal reasons" will provoke further questions so it may be easier to have some kind of reason to give. He can always make something up, but by having something it'll make the conversation easier.
Re. asking for details to be removed, by all means do that but only do it once he has received his final pay, reference and P45. That kind of response will get a reaction from the business, it's better to get that reaction once the money is in your pocket. If they're worried about harassment then just block him on your phone, e-mail and other such things.
To Whom it May Concern,
I hereby terminate my employment from day/month/year consistent with all applicable terms of employment. I thank you for the opportunities you have provided for me and wish you well for the future,
Sincerely,
Ex Employee
As above. Just give them notice and don't bother with histrionics.
On holidays, since they need to be approved just waltzing out won;t go down well. It's possible he'll have to work notice and get paid for the hols at the end.
As for deleting data, there is plenty that will need to be retained, e.g. tax details for HMRC. If there is form for stalking, just wait until there's a whiff of it and then push back. Otherwise just ignore.
Final point, if he wants to be sly... I'm guessing that the company didn't do a RIDDOR notification to the HSE if everyone got ill from COVID at the same time. If there were practices that meant it was likely everyone caught COVID at work and there were (and maybe still are?) issues with complying with the COVID Secure laws/Health & Safety at Work Act, he could keep the management very busy with a Health Officer brandishing a warrant....
Make sure you(r friend) gets your (his) notice period exactly right. I once resigned and my horrible boss decided that because I'd handed in my resignation after work hours (I was on a client site) that I had to work an extra day. And if I didn't; he would class it as leaving without notice and not back pay me the accrued holidays that I'd been unable to take due to him being an unreasonable scumbag.
So I had to work on Monday 2nd January - on a client site no less - and delay my new job by one day. Thankfully my new company were understanding; as were the client I had to work for - once they'd got over the surprise of having me back for one day after the holidays we went to the pub and drank beer instead.
My only regret is that I was young and naive; I should have told him to get stuffed.
My friend says thanks, this is very useful. He thinks he might give very vanilla responses if pushed on the "why", but doesn't want to be drawn into it as he'll end up saying something nasty/completely honest.
He thinks HSE might become aware of the ongoing unsafe working practices shortly after he leaves, possibly as a sort of "leaving gift" to his ex-colleagues who he'd really rather didn't suffer any further.
Bookmarking for a friend.
Anyone that quits at the same time as declaring they're no longer working to use accrued holiday should consider the bridge burned. He should be aware that will only go down well if the company wants him gone.
There are also legal requirements regarding the retention of records relating to employees, payroll etc. IANAL but most are for 6 years. Its unlikely the company will be willing to purge your friends records, but at the same time such records should only be available to those with a geniune need to access such info from time to time (HR/Legal), not just a random manager.
As to why, be honest, another company has offered a nicer job in a better situation.
There's no reason for the boss to be shirty about it.
Oh, and don’t say ‘the money is better’, they might make a counter-offer, which could be awkward if you/he still wants to quit
Like this?
link to image rather than posting image, as it has sweary words
Onzadog
Free Member
The above is true. Is that a persistent cough?
Best not to report it via the NHS app, otherwise the entire workforce he's been in contact with might also be getting 2 weeks holliday.
Your mates boss makes mine look like a saint by comparison.
I'd say the option he's thinking off is the one I have always gone for and it's normally worked well. Although I normally give a reason.
From someone who has just retired on the basis of short-term frustrations from an excellent job of 32 years, I would say: tell your friend to think VERY carefully indeed before burning those boats. The frustrations may be real but the times are unreal. Does your friend possess the mental stamina to resign and find a new job in the present times? If your friend is finding it hard to cope with the present stress, what makes him or her think leaving the job will suddenly magic away all the stress?
Also, he’s planning to ask in writing that his personal details be removed from company records by the end of the calendar month (address, bank details, phone/email…)
Is there a way of knowing whether they have done this ?
Download the company customer database and take that to his next employment, if staying in that industry.
Mate Dave(deceased) was the manager of a plant hire company and did just that. Especially when you consider by plant we're talking about companies hiring multiple jcb's,cranes and big civil engineering plant.
I'd think twice about data theft.
It's ok if it's in your head but stealing files hello Mr policeman
Dear company/manager
Please accept this as notice of my resignation.
My final day will be (today + notice period).
I have N days holiday accumulated so I wound like to use these now.
My final working day will be (today + notice period – holidays)Regards
Your friend
Pretty much this.
Then come in for the rest of the notice, be super nice to everyone, do the minimum, smile and shrug shoulders if your boss is an arse, what's he going to do?
The more annoying the manager, the more relaxer and happy you respond. It will either be a low stress time (you've already quit so who cares) or they'll stick you on gardening leave.
So how did it work our for Dominic?
Download the company customer database and take that to his next employment, if staying in that industry.
Mate Dave(deceased) was the manager of a plant hire company and did just that. Especially when you consider by plant we’re talking about companies hiring multiple jcb’s,cranes and big civil engineering plant
and I'd terminate your 'mate' Dave's employment immediately.
dyna-ti
Download the company customer database and take that to his next employment, if staying in that industry.
No don't do that. It's unethical.
I sacked an new employee who brought the customer list from his last employer. Would you trust such a person with your customer list?
As above - just the very simple notice letter. No need to give any reason and if the boss asks you do not have to tell him
Working for an employer is simply a business transaction: your time/effort/skills for their money. It's all a game. Terminating your employment with a generic letter of notice (or even telling the whole truth) isn't going to burn any bridges, and if it does then f*ck them as it's all on them.
First, ask politely to use your holidays. If declined then ask again sternly with a reason why you want/need to use them. If there's a valid reason for your holidays being declined (e.g. workloads) then just work them so it's not you that's being unreasonable; however, if it's the employer being unreasonable then go off sick and get paid your holidays.
As above – just the very simple notice letter. No need to give any reason and if the boss asks you do not have to tell him
But he can use force to get you to tell him.
Oh.
Sorry.
Wrong thread.
^😁
I would book the leave first and make sure it’s approved, then on the day before it starts hand in the notice stating your last day is x date.
Friend definitely won't be doing anything unethical. He thinks he'll probably not mention the data stuff unless it becomes a problem in the future. He won't be giving notice without first having signed a contract elsewhere.
Don’t take company data. A firm in the same business unit as ours did this and even though they did not use it directly they have now had to close having run up a legal bill of north of £250k defending a claim from their old company.
As for the rest of it best thing to do, as others have said, is just deliver a bland ‘I’m leaving on this date’ letter and gave a bland back story ready.
In respect of personal data GDPR dictates a company can keep it for as long as they need to comply with legislation etc so I don’t very much they’ll agree to just delete it all after a month.
Seeing as he's dead two years I dont think that will apply.
Update:
Friend managed to get out. Handed in notice politely, ensured that all work was finished or handed over by the end of the day, and then toddled off into the sunset.
He's just had his final pay (no payslip as yet) - has been underpaid by a four figure sum.
Employer currently has 3 or 4 employment tribunals active against them from current and previous employees, so presumably this is the route that he's expecting my friend to go down. Reading the citizen's advice page it would seem that employment tribunals are a complete waste of time as more than half of all successful cases are never paid in full anyway.
Any tips? Friend can't afford to just let it slide, he's got too many bills to pay... But also has no wish to drag out his contact with previous employer.
Oh, and happy new year (from myself and my friend)
My friend would possibly write a solicitors letter and ccj him
My other friend would probably turn up and have a chat with some friends and maybe contact some customers and advise that their supply partner is a dirty thieving turd.
In such instances, check your home insurance policy. They often cover legal advice and have a helpline for employment issues.
Yes definitely do this and then go engage a proper employment lawyer pronto.
including the unsafe working practices enforced by the boss which resulted in the entire office contracting COVID.
With regards to that bit, I'd be playing less nice. HSE reporting for mal practice and be looking to sue over deliberate failing in their duty of care towards their workforce.
So your friend aready knew about the impending claims from other employees and still left after doing a full shift .* Your friend is a better person than I.
It's a simple contract of time/payment this working for a living lark. Unless your employer is a top boss and if they where you would be staying.
If you can afford it just move on or superglue the locks on his new car like a plumber friend of mine did *actually a friend