[Closed] How do Thornton's do it?

But their toffee is awesome!

Yep, I shame myself every time I pick up 2 family sized sacks of toffee for a fiver, it barely lasts two days 😳

The shareholders obviously thought they had to, 'diversify' or something...

It is amazing that a specialist shop sells worse chocolate than the average supermarket. How it keeps going is a mystery.

Their chocolate ( like fro many companies) comes from a bulk supplier - Barry Callebaut. It will be bought on spec ... so I guess they have down graded their product. Mind you, it has been awful for many years ....

The previous 3 boxes I ate ( 🙂 ) were M&S ones and much nicer.

Thorntons supply m and s.

could say the same about Lindt the stuff is ghastly!

They sell what the public wants. The public don’t want ‘proper chocolate’. They want the sickly sweet stuff. So point having a shop full of proper chocolate nobody wants. Their toffee is nice though.

You can say the same about a great many products. Why do people by crappy coffee off the high street, drink crappy tea by the gallon, eat crappy curry out of a bucket from their local take away? There are better options of all those things but people don’t want it.

wrightyson - Member
Thorntons supply m and s.

POSTED 5 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

Even if this were true, it's not the same chocolate.

It is true. Well certainly used to be. Main factory is 10 mins from us and a mate was management there. They used to spend more time and care over the m and s stuff than their own. I believe they did/still supply Tesco as well.

At least it’s not Hershey’s. Why would you make chocolate that actually tastes like vomit?

Left Thorntons behind a long timne ago. Now addiicted to Hotel Chocolat.

They sell what the public wants. The public don’t want ‘proper chocolate’. They want the sickly sweet stuff. So point having a shop full of proper chocolate nobody wants. Their toffee is nice though.

You can say the same about a great many products. Why do people by crappy coffee off the high street, drink crappy tea by the gallon, eat crappy curry out of a bucket from their local take away? There are better options of all those things but people don’t want it.

This (apart from the toffee bit) it's just glorified crap chocolate that a large portion of the population adores.
Paul Young does some good stuff, not cheap though! Would still rather spend £20 there than in thorntons.

The public buys what is marketed to them and requires no thinking.

At least it’s not Hershey’s. Why would you make chocolate that actually tastes like vomit?

https://www.chemistryworld.com/podcasts/butyric-acid/1017662.article

It's all about the original toffee, love that stuff.

and it's like eating those cheap chocolate coins.

I love those 🙂

They market themselves as a premium product. And to the great unwashed whose idea of good chocolate is a Twirl they probably [i]are [/i]a premium product. It's a bit like asking "how does Stella Artois do it?" I suppose.

There's plenty better out there. Hotel Chocolat as seadog said, Montezuma, others. But they're not really household names in the same way Thornton's is.

In any case, it's all shit compared to anything you'd buy from an independent chocolatier in Brussels.

Im so glad to hear the opinions above re thorntons, hersheys and lindt, i can’t stand any of them, I honestly thought it was just me.
Thorntons toffe is lovely though.

It still has a long way to fall before descending to the depths of that cardboard covered chocolate ..Ferrero Rocher..now that is [i]real[/i] crap..

If you opened those cheap chocolate coins carefully you could reseal the case minus the chocolate, fool someone with an empty. I thought Thorntons was reserved for last-minute giftage, what kind of monster would buy that stuff for themself?

Back in t day some 15/20 years ago before the move to alfreton, Thorntons was located in belper, it could on some days make you feel queasy on a warm afternoon walking through the town due to the sweet sickly smell that would emanate from the factory. Especially the hard boiled section. I did a days trial on the chocolate packing line (ahem) and you could eat as much as you wanted whilst filling the formers. Busy busy old place back then.

What's wrong with Lindt? I quite like their 85% dark choccy bars.

No idea re thorntons but the asda 70% choc on offer last week was lush, 1 quid for 100g, went back for more and it was all gone so must have been poular.

What's wrong with Lindt?

Sickly balls

Edit: could easily be a Rick & Morty character name

Their dark chocolate isn't sickly at all.

years ago you were pleased to receive a box of Thorntons, now you wonder who you pissed off to receive a box

wordnumb - Member

what kind of monster would buy that stuff for themself?

I bought 8 boxes of the original toffee one day, from the factory store- it was all christmasy so they were cheap in February. Then I went to the pound shop and got £20 worth of haribo jelly babies. Lucky for me I'm already diabetic really.

Chocolate,almost as addictive for me as biscuits(see my other thread).

You lot any idea how snobby you sound?

Thorntons is ok as a cheap alternative to Cadbury's etc, imo. It's not fancy, but it's ok. Well, the dark ones are. Milk chocolate is worse with more cocoa solids in it, imo. If it's going to be milk it might as well be full of sugar and come in a purple packet.

Oh and I like Ferrero Rocher too. I also like Walker's crisps, Robinson's squash, Cadbury's Fingers, Lion bars, liquorice allsorts and even Vimto. I know, how dare I?

I like all of those things too, Mol. And Thornton's. (I know.)

Is there a nice milk chocolate other than Cadbury's Dairy lovely sugary Milk?

I like posh chocolate, but never found nice posh milk chocolate.

Lindor however... mmmm baby!

I agree about the continental specialist thing. Best thing I ever put in my mouth was some choc (very expensive) from a shop in Amsterdam. They know how to do it over there.

£20 worth of haribo jelly babies.

😯 😯

I'm a big fan of the jelly sweet, but just a handful of those makes me feel queasy.

I obviously need to JBTFU

You lot any idea how snobby you sound?

Yes.

Rob Hilton - Member

I'm a big fan of the jelly sweet, but just a handful of those makes me feel queasy.

I use them for riding so they get eaten a couple at a time, it's just that I go through enough to buy in bulk

(in the pound shop, even when you're buying £20 worth of haribo jelly babies, they still always offer you a cheap chocolate orange or 4-pack of polos at the counter. I'm not sure that's appropriate)

I use them for riding so they get eaten a couple at a time, it's just that I go through enough to buy in bulk

Sensible approach - Rob is a big fan of the bulk-buy strategy.

Unfortunately Rob is also a compulsive bulimic and that many bags of sweets within easy reach would make for a *very* unhappy episode.

Have I just wondered on to mumsnet?

molgrips - Member
You lot any idea how snobby you sound?

Yeah, almost as snobby as trying to get an aesthetically pleasing microwave oven.

😆 😆

Not even in the same category...

[url= https://www.chemistryworld.com/podcasts/butyric-acid/1017662.article ]https://www.chemistryworld.com/podcasts/butyric-acid/1017662.article[/url]

Thanks for the link.

That explains why it tastes so different but not why the hell anyone would want it in their mouth. The day my parents bought a bar of it back from a trip to the states for me nd my sister goes down as a bitter disappointment.

We used to do it too - in WWII, I believe. We just stopped and they didn't.

Well that explains why Hershey’s tastes so bad! 🙁

Cadburys is god awful as well. Except the Irish stuff, they still make it on licence to the original recipe, Home Bargains and such sell it as grey import and the difference is night and day.

Thorntons has been crap for years. Kinnerton grade.

Whether you think it's terrible, or just "ok" (don't think anyone is arguing that it's better than that?), I think the original question still stands: how has a national chain of shops selling nothing but "ok" (at best) chocolate, stayed open?

Net income in its annual report of 2016 was reported at a loss of - £30.8 million with a drop in staff and number of shops across the UK

I have the same question about Lush cosmetics.....

I'm quite partial to some of Aldi's choccy.

I think the original question still stands: how has a national chain of shops selling nothing but "ok" (at best) chocolate, stayed open?

Because it’s OK, like virtually every other item for sale on the high street. Why not ask: how has H&M stayed open selling nothing but OK clothes? The answer is the same: because ‘OK’ is what enough people either find acceptable or don’t know better than.

As I said: stick to the Thornton's toffee, which is lovely.

Ferrero Rocher..now that is real crap

Ferrero? You mean the people who own Thornton's?

I think the name has a lot to do with it. Old clueless types still think it's a quality brand, because it sounds like a name they can trust.

Old clueless types still think it's a quality brand, because it sounds like a name they can trust.

Bit harsh. We can't all be edgy chocolatiers.

You lot any idea how snobby you sound?

other cultures actually take pride in the quality of the food they eat. This is not a normal position to take in the UK. Eating good quality food with good quality ingredients takes a lot of time, and money, in the UK.

Thornton’s is shit has been for awhile but yes I will eat it. Their toffee is very good though.

But then again I don’t even have a microwave so I have to style.

I would say the original Thorntons stuff is pretty good.

All the new different selection boxes are a bit crap though.

@ScottChegg..now I hadn't realised that until you said ..but if standards have dropped to that level ..no wonder folks are complaining ( I wouldn't know ).
I also hadn't realised that amongst other brands they own Tic Tacs, Kinder & Nutella ..

Lidl chocolate is great. Very partial to their fruit and nut milk. Good plain too.

Meh. I can still eat a chocolate orange even after they changed the formula.

other cultures actually take pride in the quality of the food they eat. This is not a normal position to take in the UK.

Being a snob isn't about eating good stuff or buying good stuff or whatever.

It's about loudly proclaiming how awful the other stuff and insinuating that the people who buy it are awful or ignorant, and that you're better.

And there is far more good food available and being eaten in the UK than in many other countries I've been to.

I love chocolate, however I get a migraine just from looking longingly at some, so screw the lot of you.

Cadburys is god awful as well. Except the Irish stuff, they still make it on licence to the original recipe, Home Bargains and such sell it as grey import and the difference is night and day.

Hmm, didn't know that. I will have to investigate, next time I'm passing that shop. Any evidence of palm oil as an ingredient and I'm out. 😉

This is good enough for me..

[img] ?v=20170514115439[/img]

And there is far more good food available and being eaten in the UK than in many other countries I've been to.

unfortunately some of it is expensive compared to other alternatives, however we are accustomed to cheap and rubbish food being readily available.

Not necessarily such a bad thing. At least people who are really poor can afford food. Anecdotally food in the Mid-western US is significantly more expensive and generally worse.

Three_Fish - Member
I think the original question still stands: how has a national chain of shops selling nothing but "ok" (at best) chocolate, stayed open?
Because it’s OK, like virtually every other item for sale on the high street. Why not ask: how has H&M stayed open selling nothing but OK clothes? The answer is the same: because ‘OK’ is what enough people either find acceptable or don’t know better than.

Egh? That analogy isn't even remotely close - they are completely different. "No reason for HMV to go out of business, I mean, look at Starbucks - they're doing fantastically well" 🙄

Also, did you read this bit:

Net income in its annual report of 2016 was reported at a loss of - £30.8 million with a drop in staff and number of shops across the UK

So the answer to the question "how can they survive?" is (spoiler alert) "they can't" - at least not with their current model.

Logical move is to give up all but their most profitable shops, and enter into a partnership with an existing retailer(s)..... probably not H&M though

Thornton's for me is the same as Vienetta in that when I was a kid I genuinely thought it was really posh and classy but realised as an adult that it was total junk.

Not a massive chocolate fan, but if I get my paws on Läderach then I can hardly stop till it is gone.

That analogy isn't even remotely close

Because it’s not an analogy; it’s a comparison of the standard/quality of produce that allows much of the high street to be profitable, which, current tribulations aside, Thornton’s have been for decades. I could have used Starbucks or any other retailer that one associates with high street or retail park trading. They survive, and often thrive, because they are ‘OK’, not because they’re exceptional or luxurious or tailor-made. They’re OK and pretty much anyone can afford them.

Thornton’s is cheap is it ? Certainly wasn’t when I last went in.

Personally I don’t rate Hotel Chocolate or whatever poncey name they give themselves for selling overly sweet overly expensive crap

Much more partial to Holdsworth chocolates.

Oh and Lindt Milk Chocolate, it should be wrong but I love it!

STW at it's best 🙂

Pick a pretentious name brand that no-one knows, made by Augustine Monks and sweated out by Arabian goats, then tell everyone they eat only that...

Superiority at it's best this place 🙂

Thornton’s is cheap is it?

It is, relatively; yes.

Personally I don’t rate Hotel Chocolate or whatever poncey name they give themselves for selling overly sweet overly expensive crap

THe dark choc is nice I tend to get a the 70 squid ostrich EASTER egg after EASTER when it’s half price.

Couldn’t pay full and tbh hard to stomach half.

I Think Thornton's position is appearing to be expensive but not so much that you cant afford it and it’s primarily for gifting anyway.

I was gifted some of this from the continent and boy did it hit the spot! Absolutely spot on, top notch stuff
[url= https://www.sterk.amsterdam/lindt-creation-moelleux-au-chocolat.html ]https://www.sterk.amsterdam/lindt-creation-moelleux-au-chocolat.html[/url]

Three_Fish - Member
That analogy isn't even remotely close
Because it’s not an analogy; it’s a comparison of the standard/quality of produce that allows much of the high street to be profitable, which, current tribulations aside, Thornton’s have been for decades. I could have used Starbucks or any other retailer that one associates with high street or retail park trading. They survive, and often thrive, because they are ‘OK’, not because they’re exceptional or luxurious or tailor-made. They’re OK and pretty much anyone can afford them.

Analogy:

a comparison between one thing and another, typically for the purpose of explanation or clarification

Pedantry aside (you started it), I'm not disagreeing with you - I agree that it's possible for a high street retailer to survive, even if their product is inferior/mediocre/poor value. But there is a lot more to consider than just that - they survive DESPITE being just OK (not because of it), as their business model has other mitigating factors.

People are literally writing papers on what Thornton's did wrong and became a failing company, just at the time that Hotel Chocolat were showing everyone how to be sucessful in that space. From one such article:

Thornton’s is a classic case of a company failing to evolve, losing touch with its customer base and being overtaken by its competitors as a consequence.

H&M would be a textbook example of the exact opposite behavior of Thorntons - they have an extremely strong brand, their clothes are priced very competitively, they spend a lot of money keeping their designs up-to date (even driving the market) and they deliver very good value for money for the average high-street shopper. Obviously their tshirt isn't comparable to the quality of one 3x the price, but that's not their market.

Having a high street presence can only mitigate so far, and presents downsides as well. Thorntons are selling a relatively low value product of questionable quality and value-for-money vs it's competitors, who's products are for sale on literally every street corner, but without the costs associated with running their own shops. They are being squeezed by the supermarket at one end of their demographic, and "luxury" chocolate brands at the other - which are also available at the supermarket.

They tried to respond by stacking-high and selling-cheap, giving deep discounts after seasonal rushes, but that only drove the perceived value of their product down and made things worse.

A friend of ours had quite a senior international role at Ferrero Rocher, kept going on about the heritage, quality and their 'premium products'.

Had the rug pulled from under his feet when 'another' said "any confectionery delivered to the sales floor on a pallet is not a premium product" 😆

Mmmmm, Ferrero Rocher.

Have eaten my way through 40 of those chocolety nutty crunchy balls over this past month.

They must be good, sure they used to feed them to ambassadors...

Wife says no palm oil in Irish Cadburys.

Lindt dark chocolate with salt for me please....

Not keen on the Aldi dark chocolate but their milk chocolate with hazelnuts is rather tasty (and I don't normally like milk).

"STW at it’s best 🙂

Pick a pretentious name brand that no-one knows, made by Augustine Monks and sweated out by Arabian goats, then tell everyone they eat only that…

Superiority at it’s best this place 🙂" (where's the quotey button gone?)

Great innit? I can't believe no-one knows how Thorntons are still in business ( & by the queue outside the door of the Harrogate branch before crimbo they seem to be doing ok)

Hotel Chocolat? Rip off merchants of the highest order.