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Have you ever wondered what it must be like to be Homer Simpson?
Imagine having a level of intelligence and ignorance which allows you to sail through life relatively unscathed, taking bugger all seriously including a carefree attitude to food health and beer with nothing much more than dribbling into a bowl of popcorn in front of your favourite sport on TV at weekends to worry about.
it’s beginning to sound appealing for me at least….
Slightly tongue in cheek, ‘course.
Homer Simpson is supposed to be "everyman" after all. I've colleagues at work who're blissfully ignorant about just about eveything outside their own bubbles, people proudly claim 'Oh, I don't watch the news, its boring' and so on. Them seem perfectly happy, leave them to it.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realise half of them are stupider than that. - George Carlin.
I think of that often.
It's a funny world - to me only stupid people without a grasp of statistics are impressed by that George Carlin quote.
Unless of course I'm stupid and don't realize he was aware of the error in the statement - or in humanity the median is the same as the average.
to me only stupid people without a grasp of statistics are impressed by that George Carlin quote
FFS, it's a joke not an academic research paper.
If you work hard enough at your drinking, it's pretty simple to get to the blissful ignorance zone.
Have you ever wondered what it must be like to be Homer Simpson?
He seems pretty OK to me... I may not be Homer Simpson, but the ethos is pretty sound to me. I care about very very few things in the world and only things i can directly affect.
Mortgage rates, don't care. American politics, don't care. UK politics, don't care..... etc etc
It may be blinkered to many on here, but it works for me. My biggest worry today is whether or not i have cake before tea or after.
I can see the attraction to some degree. I worry about a lot of stuff and have recently cut down massively on the amount of news I consume, because of the endless corrosive negativity. I do feel better for it. Maybe Homer is a guru for our times?
cake before tea or after
As in a “cup of” or in the Northern sense aka Dinner?
Doh!
As in a “cup of” or in the Northern sense aka Dinner?
You've met me, i'm Northern 🙂
I can also see the attraction, but ignoring it because it doesn't affect you directly is OK, until it does. And then you don't know why it affects so you're confused and mad and then someone tells you it's someone else's fault and before you know it you've joined a naked cult that worships the high priest and Supreme Ruler, Nigfarg. Or suttin'.
I completely agree with you OP.
I'm an "intelligent overthinker", and life is full of stress and worry. Don't get me wrong - my traits have gotten me a good education and a well paid job..but the balance is thinking, being aware etc etc..
My younger sister has quite marked learning dissability - manages life OK, but will never earn a wage, drive a car etc.
She's literally the happiest person I know - nothing bothers her..she's perfectly happy running a 9min/km run every few days, and dresses in lovely clothes she loves. Everything she wears she says is "amazing". Everything she does she's perfectly happy with.
There's me worrying I'm too smart/too casual...will my shoes match. What impact my car does/doesn't have... Am i detraining if I run a bit slower etc etc.
At the end of life we'll both die, and have both made very little impact on the whole world!
Oh well!
DrP
As in a “cup of” or in the Northern sense aka Dinner?
I'm Northern but have never ever said that. Tea is a tasty beverage not a meal !
My wife is originally from Kent and uses "tea" to describe the evening meal. Apart from that she's wonderful so no need for a new patio.
Myth....busted
You and me are quite mentally similar Dr P!
I tend to dribble into a bag of crisps rather than popcorn
We have some M&S Turkey Gravy crisps in the cupboard for Fridays movie night. Mmmmm… beer.
He seems pretty OK to me… I may not be Homer Simpson, but the ethos is pretty sound to me. I care about very very few things in the world and only things i can directly affect
This.
The biggest think I ever did to improve my wellbeing was to stop worrying about things that don't affect me. I care deeply about my family and friends, I care deeply about my local area, I care deeply about myself and how I act towards others.
But the bigger stuff that others worry about? Nah. I look at a new website once per day so I have a very high level view of what's going on and that's that. My Twitter feed is just things I like, bikes, running, cricket, bit of football, bit of comedy, Insta, YouTube, Facebook are all the same. If something that's not in those categories pops up it very quickly gets blocked.
Unless either I can influence it, or it has a direct influence on me then it gets ignored.
Some will say I'm naïve in this approach, and maybe I am, but I'd rather be naïve and happy than informed and sad.
The flipside... A friend is an intelligent, serial overthinker. He recently said "I wish I could go back to the days when I didn't know about all this shit" [war, climate breakdown, politics, general shithousery].
I'm guessing that's where the OP is coming from.
Probably best not to get too worked up over the Homer's of this world, or you'll end up like ole Grimey.
I think it's good to be aware, but not immersed, in current events.
I know about Gaza, Sudan, Yemen, Ukraine, Trump, Musk, Hamas, Putin, and any other number of horrors I can influence in no way whatsoever.
Exposing myself daily to images of smashed up children in Gaza will only make things worse. Yet, I know people who do this, on here included, and the effect on their mental health is all too obvious.
Put the effort into what you can change. Personal health being a good place to start, given the running down of our health services and the looming chronic disease burden on it.
I think there are plenty of people who are deliberately ignorant so they can have an easy life.
Perspective. There are events and people that I can influence and those that I can't. I've tended to stop "caring" about the latter and now spend my emotional and physical energies on the former. Having said that, I'm also acutely aware of the need to look after myself too. That's not being selfish, it's that I'm of no use to anyone otherwise.
I think there are plenty of people who are deliberately ignorant so they can have an easy life.
Is that a bad thing?
When I saw the George Carlin quote I was reminded of previous outings when the pedants who did Statistics rather than real applied maths had to deploy their expertise.
And there it is again!
Explaining a joke is like dissecting a frog. You understand it better but the frog dies in the process
There's plenty I wish I had never experienced, the insight makes for an uncomfortable burden and brings me no value in my life now.
Quite the opposite, so I afford myself a degree of separation and enforced ignorance selfishly to preserve my peace.
And if I'm honest it's nowhere near the level it should be really. I foolishly still allow myself to be sucked in by uninformed, idiotic hot takes of people that have no idea how fortunate they are.
Garage beers and bike chat are key contributers to a happy life.
At an individual level it's totally understandable why people want to remove themselves from the information loop. It's something I try to do on occasion too.
The only real problem is when this happens at a social level. Once you have a significant percentage of a countries population become willingly withdrawn from factual news/geopolitics it can (ironically) cause many of the very problems people wish to stay uninformed of.
Just my opinion as always and no more valid that anyone elses.
My solution is to have a quick glance at the BBC news website or have R4 on when I'm having breakfast so I'm not totally ignorant of the main issues. Then I avoid it studiously for the rest of the day. I used to surf Al Jazeera, CNN, Reuters, even Fox and Russia Today for a different perspective. I'd have the radio news on all day, then watch the BBC and C4 evening news, Newsnight etc. I was a bit addicted and it was really affecting my mood.
24 hour news is a curse, there's only ever one token good news story tagged on the end, the rest is relentlessly depressing. Bad news sells and having humanity's worst excesses distilled to their rotten core and piped into your head 24/7 is bad for your mental health ime. There is plenty of uplifting stuff happening in the world if you look for it. If I go on the web or watch TV these days, I try to seek it out. My life has improved as a result.
24 hour news is a curse
Couldn't gree more, it's become an entertainment medium rather than an informational tool.
"When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle."
Edmund Burke, 1770. I'd maybe change bad to stupid though, just through sheer weight of numbers 🙂
A work colleague springs to mind. He's a lovely chap, but we're very different in that his idea of heaven is familiar food, pubs, journeys etc. They go on holiday to the same hotel every year. His face when I described what InterRailing was was a treat! Zero inclination to delve into anything thought provoking or even mildly inconvenient or challenging.
Is that a bad thing?
So far so good. My main issue with this easy life attitude is the environmental impact. They drive Everywhere, even if it's a five minute walk. No recycling if it means rinsing. Also I just learned that they have the heating on 24/7 365 because Mrs Colleague doesn't like cold rooms.
"What about summer?"
"On just on minimum'
"What about during a heatwave?"
"Just open the windows"
Other than that he's bright, charming, witty and a good team player.
Nah, I can't go through life being wrapped in that particular blanket. I may not be able to directly influence Putin, or Meta or the other things that are driving us apart, but I can see what is happening and I can do as many small things as possible to try and balance out them.
It may not help me personally, but it may help others.
Can I ask what some of you have decided we should be less ignorant of? Is it classical music, Japanese carpentry, the Jarrow march or neo-liberal economics. Or have you decided a narrow band of things you are informed about and think that people who live in a different sphere are stupid.
The statistics error above absolutely needs pointed out in this case as it is a compound error - this is a thread discussing male intelligence after all.
I reckon there is a fair chance mert played a blinder and quoted George Carlin on purpose as it fits so well with the thread.
And perhaps blokeuptheroad is in on it too, as he considers secondary school statistics as intellectual........
Stupidity needs checked everywhere, especially on the internet. A world of Homers would be a very bad place. Look at the USA today.....
My solution is to have a quick glance at the BBC news website or have R4 on when I’m having breakfast so I’m not totally ignorant of the main issues. Then I avoid it studiously for the rest of the day.
Same here. I like to be aware of what's going on in the world but don't feel a need to immerse myself in it. For instance I have no desire to consume the endless TV shows about Trump, Boris, Lucy Letby, that far right thing being mentioned on another thread etc etc.
Longarmedmonkey
Full Member
Can I ask what some of you have decided we should be less ignorant of?
I wouldn't say anyone's deciding anything, people are just discussing how they personally deal with the fact we live in a very uncertain world. No harm in that, the absolute opposite in fact.
I don’t think anyone’s decided anything, people are just discussing how they personally deal with the fact we live in a very uncertain world.
Couldn't agree more. However, the words ignorant and stupid come up an awful lot in this thread. How we deal with uncertain and often horrific times, is not the same as judging someone for not knowing something or not wanting to know something that we have decided is important.
And perhaps blokeuptheroad is in on it too, as he considers secondary school statistics as intellectual……..
No I'm just another thicko. I somehow manage to avoid personally insulting fellow contributors on what should have been a light hearted thread though. So on balance, I'm happy with my ignorant lot 🙂
And it's probably fair to say that everyone is burdened by a degree of ignorance on a variety of things no matter how much they try to expand their knowledge & experience base.
Such is the fact we cannot know everything about everything. Being informed is still a subjective standard that I'd argue is impossible to quantify.
I'm okay with that.
No I’m just another thicko.
Don't worry mate, I like crayons as a snack too. {Insert wink emoji here}
Also, you did volunteer to mess about with things that go bang, not really bright is that. {Insert wink & laughing emoji here}
😆 The blue ones are best! 😉
Anyhow, the petty statistics argument. Isn't it reasonable to assume that at a population level IQ is normally distributed? That would suggest that mean, median and mode are the same (near enough) so 50% of the population would fall below any of the usual definitions of average intelligence.
Assumptions in statistics?!
The data must be out there........
heard somehere: "My desire to stay sane has exceeded my desire to stay informed"
Isn’t it reasonable to assume that at a population level IQ is normally distributed?
The tails probably won't be. How big of a problem that is, I don't know.
surely the tail is thick rather than long
This
Instead of this
Assumptions in statistics?!
The data must be out there……..
According to Wikipedia (I know....)
For modern IQ tests, the raw score is transformed to a normal distribution with mean 100 and standard deviation 15
Explaining a joke is like dissecting a frog. You understand it better but the frog dies in the process
Precis.
It's funny cos it's true. Not mathematically accurate.
Homer laying down a truth bomb.
I see plenty of examples of people around me whose ignorance doesn't seem to make them any happier. Looks like a total pain in the arse to be honest. The ability to make informed decisions about your life obviously doesn't guarantee happiness, but I'd hate to be without it all the same.
Also, being apathetic and disengaged arguably plays into the hands of some of the very worst people in the world.
I recall talking to a manager at my last place of work and mentioned Harry, who worked in the warehouse, had helped me with a task.
"Don't like him - He's so thick" I was told.
I always found Harry cheerful, hard working and helpful. I always had a quick chat when I saw him as he was always bright and sunny.
His intellect had never, ever occurred to me. Why would it?
Maybe I need to be more judgemental.
Some of the statistical pedantry on this thread is frankly just mean.
Some of the statistical pedantry on this thread is frankly just mean.
Sure it's not just statistical bell-endery?
Starting to imagine a parallel universe where there's a forum on which a thread exists titled "What type of graph/chart would you like to be?"
Is that a bad thing?
It is when they wear their ignorance as a badge of honour yet still get to make world-altering decisions - without the expertise, information, knowledge and ability to discern fact from fiction to back that up.
I'm referring fairly directly to Brexit but there are any number of other decisions being made by people who are too ignorant to know better, and who often know that they're ignorant but jump in anyway.
In a previous role, my boss was completely IT clueless, used to joke about it, used to be fairly open about her ignorance and brush it off with comments about how computers were all too clever these days and how was an old biddy like her supposed to know, haha, wasn't it all larks. Then - using her seniority within the company - she implemented a change to IT and brought in a universally loathed bit of software in spite of being ignorant about the consequences. Thing is, she wasn't "thick". Good degree, very well read, well travelled, not remotely racist or sexist, and a nice person. But just (almost wilfully) ignorant about IT.
There is a pedant's trap in this post.
Presumably Carlin's joke plays on the idea that most people think they're fairly smart themselves and have a lower opinion of others. We intuitively think we're surrounded by idiots whether or not an IQ test would bear that out.
Anyhow, the petty statistics argument. Isn’t it reasonable to assume that at a population level IQ is normally distributed? That would suggest that mean, median and mode are the same (near enough) so 50% of the population would fall below any of the usual definitions of average intelligence.
I'm glad you said that, because I feel I have an excellent grasp on statistics and I was too afraid to ask why people thought Carlin's quote was incorrect. Even if someone wants to be pedantic about whether 'average' in common parlance means (ha) the mean, the median or the mode, it doesn't make a difference for the reasons you've cited. It's a good example of the 'Mt Stupid' peak that Dunning and Kruger wrote about.
When I was 17, I drank some very good beer.
It’s a funny world – to me only stupid people without a grasp of statistics are impressed by that George Carlin quote.
Unless of course I’m stupid and don’t realize he was aware of the error in the statement – or in humanity the median is the same as the average.
I think he was just being mean.
EDIT - I hadn't seen the last page! D'oh!
But I agree with Superficial... whose username doesn't check out.
There’s me worrying I’m too smart/too casual…will my shoes match. What impact my car does/doesn’t have… Am i detraining if I run a bit slower etc etc.
See, that’s where my life has been different - I always dress casual, except for the odd occasions where shorts, vest tops, tee shirts and skate shoes would be frowned on, I know my car is making minimal impact, and I never run anywhere. Ever.
I’m not unaware of what’s happening in the world, though, I spend a lot of time reading about a lot of stuff happening internationally, but while I like to keep informed, I don’t spiral into worrying, because there’s nothing that I can do about it.