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Budgeting atm.
Is there a system that isnt huge (As per the ones in most coachbuilts) i can fit that will use LPG or Diesel to provide cabin heat in the rear + hot water on demand ?
ive seen systems that do both individually or one that does hot water and blockheating for the enginebay but was hoping there was something combined that would provide cabin heat - am i just missing the obvious?
(ps we dont live on the south coast we want a year round camper we can use in scotland without freezing our tits off - we have tents for that)
you planning on installing a shower t_r?
[url= https://www.eberspacher.com/products/fuel-operated-heaters/combitronic.html ]doesnt look exactly small but..[/url]
Never bothered with a water heater in mine, but did fit an eber. its awesome.
ill settle for an external hot tap just for rinsing off but yeah something along those lines I dont want a shower room/toilet in the van.
combitronic looks cool but it seems to be OEM fit only prices are thin on the ground but i can see that in the USA it was 4500dollar......yowzers
ok via the combitronic site i found the hydroplate system which is a compact unit designed for small home build campers , runs off diesel only (ideal) and does exactly what i need. its £1995 which is pretty acceptable given what a regular EBer costs.
Webasto Thermatop I think its called seems to be the almost go-to option I've read about.
Not sure what/if anything Eberspacher do acts as a water heater as well but it may be worth tracking down a member of the T5 forum called bitoots or something like that. He supplies new and recon'd Eberspachers for really sensible money (I'm sure he quoted me about £700 for one in the T5, fitted). He may be able to offer advice about one that heats water too.
webasto dont do a product that does heating and water according to their site
the thermatop i see is a block heater ?
Crossing posts but eber do the hydroplate system which does "warm" water and 1.3KW hot air heating.
If you're on Facebook, there's a self build Camper van page which is worth asking this question on, for me I'd use separate systems, an Eberspacher D2 for the heating and an on demand gas heater for instant hot water.
There's a chap on the page Dave Maltby I think who can do a Eberspacher D2 for about £560.
"for me I'd use separate systems"
seems to take up quite a bit of space to run both systems though not to mention needing a gas tank as well as a diesel tank ?
Other than redundancy why would you fit seperates ?
Would rather run diesel at night than gas...
You can buy cheap gas water showers from eBay but for decent thermo heating an Eberspacher is brilliant.
Are you cooking in the van? A bigger gas tank for cooking and heating is not much more of a stretch surely? You can then refill at 'the pump' for both diesel and LPG.
If you're not doing a shower then whats the point of a big heavy hot water system?
The solution in my van is an underslung gas tank for cooking and propex heater (filled it once so far and seems like it'll last for ever), and when I need hot water (for a quick wash or whatever) I boil a kettle.
I want an external hot water shower.
Wife does open water swimming. It would be nice to warm up and clean the wet suits etc before getting in the van ....obviously good for mtb too
We entertained this idea for our van. We surf all around uk all year. Surfing on Scotland is December is a reasonably common occurrence, along with mtb obviously!
With eber on inside getting hanged out of wet wetsuit is fine. (We can change in our van). Last week I had a few outside cold showers on Skye and then just jumped into the van...warm almost instantly.
The effort, cost and space of any hot water system made us go for just eber for air and a campsite when we crave a hot shower.
Always worth considering how often you think something will actually be used. Eber is essential though....best thing in our van!!
Normal gas any good?
http://zodi.com/hot-showers/hot-tap-hp-shower
http://www.mrheater.com/sporting/battery-operated-shower-system-1673.html
interesting stuff 😀
Very interesting links....
I've bought a transit minibus I'm going to have converted to camper
if its well insulated couldn't i just use a fan heater to warm it up - powered from couple of leisure batteries and inverter, topped up from solar panels?
for a quick blast now and then?
will be going up to scotland in sept/oct time
or buy a eber heater for about £600 ?
Kampa Geyser water heater just search Internet
Caravans have hot water from gas or 240v so just find all the stuff you need (even buy an old caravan) and fit it?
Failing that some welfare crew vans have hot water.
Joefm
That's one option in looking at but a decent caravan is pricy as usually modern stuff is current and folk want them as spares.
The cheap stuff is mostly ancient stuff that should have been scrapped long ago 🙂
We will see when the time comes
I've a Truma Ultrastore in the loft from my last camper, converting my second van now and it'll be staying in the loft as it's too big, sips power when it's on, and needs a big vent at an inconvenient point, and if I ever want to refit the inside, it's the only item that can't be moved.
It's nice having hot water, but I'd only bother in future if I had a shower.
hot water is easy.
its doing hot water and cab heating in an efficient use of space thats a pain.
the eber hydroplate does look promising though - Would certainly need to see it in action first before i decided if it was worth 2grand or not.....
Throwing a curveball...
You could have a DIY solar coil installation which would be cheap to install and run... basically about 6 small ones of these distributed across the roof:
http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-1-Hour-Solar-Pool-Heater/
You could also go solar for the heating, with something like these:
http://www.builditsolar.com/Experimental/PopCanVsScreen/PopCanVsScreen.htm
Then for non sunny days (and also outdoor barbeques... you need a mount where you can remove it to empty ash anyway)
You can get these for [url= http://www.dieselheaters4u.co.uk/store/c18/CAMPING.html ]£40 delivered with a 4 litre boiler, or £80 with a 8 litre boiler
[/url]
Still need ancillaries such as a flue and suitable heat shielding, but no biggie...
for an outdoor shower, either:
or for full pikey points:
I've done the pokey thing but starting from scratch on a near new vehicle so it lasts a long time rather than just being a couple bits of wood and camp beds in the back.
Outside bbq's covered by gas.
We used a Propex for heating and a second-hand Carver Cascade water heater for, er, hot water. Both running off an underslung LPG tank. Propex is the size of a big shoebox, Cascade is about as compact as an insulated 9l water tank can be. Hot water on tap seems like an unnecessary frippery but once you've had it it's hard to go back 😉
Heating and hot water all in one? Easy! [url= http://www.windysmithy.co.uk/woodburners/henry ]linky[/url]
The Truma Combi range will do heating and hot water, but from gas/electric and are expensive, it's also a bit unit.
For my conversion going on at the moment, I opted for an Eberspacher D2 for heating and a Truma ultrastore 14l for water heating, I too have put an outside shower in. I paid £610 for a brand new D2 with warranty and £325 for the Ultrastore.
I do sometimes wonder if I should have bit the bullet and used a Combi, but my logic was if one crapped out then the other would still work, also I don't have an unlimited amount of gas onboard (undermount LPG tank) and I couldn't find much gas usage data when I was designing the system, so I went safe.
Truma Combi user here 8) Not that big a unit when you consider that it fulfills both functions. 6Kw worth of heating and the 12L water tank heats up to 60deg in about 30 min. The blown air system is noticeable when you initially switch it on but as the temp rises it ramps down and becomes virtually silent.
If you're going down the gas heating route in any form I'd get some form of re-fillable system. Gaslow or underslung tank. We use gas for heating, cooking and the fridge runs on gas most of the time. At this time of year I'd estimate we'd use one full bottle a week (22 l)
Mine's 10 years old and it's had a lot of use. The PCB went south recently and needed replaced. Parts are readily available and still in production.
One thing I would suggest is the addition of a frost protection valve. This automatically drains down the system if it's not switched on and the temp drops below 8deg.
D.
good stuff gents , this is all valuable info . Already the potential bill has reduced significantly 😀
I like the idea of diesel for simplicity but im not against fitting gas - as you say ill be cooking with it and any decent fridge uses gas when offgrid so it makes sense.
any decent fridge uses gas when offgrid so it makes sense
Not so. I much prefer a 12v compressor fridge over gas as no unsightly vents in outside and minimal power consumption, no having to switch over supplies when moving and also the ability to use it if the van is parked out of level.
We have 2x100w solar panels on the roof and they'll pretty much keep up with our Waeco compressor fridge on most summers days.
+1 for compressor fridges. The only time our similar setup has got close to letting us down was over a week in the bottom of a vertical-sided valley in Switzerland - the van didn't see direct sunlight until the afternoon, and it rained about half the time. Still kept going, though 🙂
+2. My fridge will be going under the double bed and opening into the kitchen, so not against any external wall. You can't do that with a 2 or 3 way gas fridge!
Had a Weaco last time but looking at alternatives this time, some have separate compressors with quick connect fittings, so considering putting the compressor under the floor to maximise cooling efficiency (they run for a long time if there is poor airflow)
sorry was confusing compressor fridges with gas. i just know i dont want a peltier cooler.
MY plans also include solar roof panels so would be stupid not to use em 😀
First stop for me to go to a caravan breakers and pick up a water heater and a space heater.
Why don't you want a peltier fridge?
Oh and caravan gas fridges aren't peltier.
+3 for Waeco fridges. Have had two on different vans and they have been excellent.
because peltiers suck in high temps.
they cool down but only a specified difference. theoretical numbers if its 5 outside itll cool to 0
if its 20 outside it will cool to 15.
- irealise quality and size make a difference but it seems like a poor choice to me.
The caravan heaters and water heaters ive seen and used in the past take up alot of space.
the eispacher thing i linked to earlier would fit under a seat.....unless caravans do come with smaller units if you pay more. like you say it would be a good budget option if parts are still availible.
The caravan heaters and water heaters ive seen and used in the past take up alot of space.
Ok but caravan fridges aren't peltier, they are absorbtion fridges. And readily available for cheap.
This kind of water heater:
[img] 
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is barely bigger than the water it holds. This kind of air heater:
[img] 
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in our 'van seems to need about 8" depth, but there is a cupboard behind it that might be essential, might not.
Having just looked for those images though it seems breakers are charging rip-off sums for them. Tbh if it were me I'd start with a damp old scrap caravan as a donor.
as i said in the first thread
anything worth having locally is snapped up by the breaker.
anything you can buy locally that the breaker hasnt already snaffled isnt worth having.
Looked for a damp van?
[url= http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/swift-challenger-2-berth-caravan-with-porch-awning-/172401443798?hash=item2823ed43d6:g:GDMAAOSwawpXvbny ]This[/url] has all the bits, £300 and it's not even damp.
You could fill your boots with that lot. Sink, plumbing, gas pipes/taps/joints, bog, upholstery foam (that's not cheap) curtain rail, everything.
Lewes is a bit far to tow it home on a bunji- don't have a tow bar. but point taken ill have a look for a damp van rather than scrap vans.
There are *loads* of 2 berths around for cheap. eBay is a good place.
Terry - I'm about to dispose of a 4 berth bailey caravan, which has had damp repaired - I've just bought a new one. Working hot water, electrics, stove, fridge, good upholstery etc. It would need collecting from near Perth or Aviemore but you I'm not looking for much for it.
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[url= https://postimage.org/ ]photo storage[/url]
ill drop you an email geoff.
The wife will go nuts ive only just got rid of a shell of a car i was breaking off the back drive but hum ho. projects are projects.
Geoff that looks like ours, with the centre table and chest of drawers we don't have..... Might be interested in those trail rat if you do cannibalise it.
Its a 1995 Bailey Beachcomber. We've had it for 5 seasons and it's the best £1,500 I've ever spent. It's still water tight and comfortable, but the youngest is now too big for the top bunk, so the layout is no longer perfect.
I've just bought a double axle 2009 swift somethingorother which has longer beds and a couple more home comforts. It stays on a seasonal pitch near Aviemore, so the size isn't too much of a problem.