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I hide my front door key in a combination locked shed for the regular occasions one of us locks ourselves out. It is totally unsecure, you could pull the shed apart with your bare hands and some grunt or even easier rip the window out.
I've started to wonder if I should keep it in a keysafe in the shed. They're not secure, I know but it might slow a thief down a bit. On the other hand once they're in the shed they have time and garden tools to get into it.
But a key is a lot easier to hide than a keysafe, so I fear everything I gain in protection I lose with poor concealment.
Then I thought how about a highly visible key safe with the wrong key in it as a distraction while my key remains hidden. (Or ten visible key safes all with the wrong key...) 😁
Do thieves even bother looking for keys or just break in?
One factor is my property is very overlooked from all sides, a scrote wouldnt want to be fiddling around in my garden for any length of time in daylight.
Flaming; Comedy answers; serious answers all equally welcome.
Leave a spare key with a friendly neighbour?
(Awaits the "your house insurance will be invalid" nonsense)
Then I thought how about a highly visible key safe with the wrong key in it as a distraction while my key remains hidden. (Or ten visible key safes all with the wrong key…)
You joke but my keysafe has my neighbours' key in it and vice-versa.
I have one of those wall mounted key safe things mounted on a wall but hidden up close to a drain pipe and behind a wheelie bin so unless you know its there you are unlikely to stumble across it.
I don't use it much and wouldn't leave a key in there permanently, but seems to be a reasonably secure thing. I ditched the screws and plastic rawl plugs it came with and used proper wall anchors to attach to the wall so you wouldn't be able to prize it off the wall with a screwdriver to something like that. And even if they did prize it off the wall it is a fully enclosed device so you'd need some hefty blows with a heavy hammer to break it open, which is not particularly stealthy for the average burglar. Probably easier to force your way in through the door attacking the door lock as the key safe.
Do thieves even bother looking for keys or just break in?
The scrote that robbed us must've stopped looking for keys when he found a lump of granite to chuck through the window.
We have the spare keys sorted with the neighbours, what I need is how to deal with the kids locking up from inside with key in the lock, then going to sleep or gaming with headphones on and can't be raised by doorbell or phone.
My key is left in the open, on a strut of my porch. No-one would be stupid enough to leave a key out like that, so no-one will look there for it 😛 Been fine for 8 years.
Overthinking, just chuck a key under a pot/stone nowhere near the door.
@Midlifecrashes - Can't you access the Router from outside? Just switch off the internet to gain their attention.
then going to sleep or gaming with headphones on and can’t be raised by doorbell or phone.
Stick a canister of tear gas/legal equivalent in their room and have a remote switch for it mounted by the door (if you are feeling malicious have it next to the doorbell and see how often it gets set off accidently).
For OP I think main thing is not to have the key somewhere obvious eg under mat etc. If it takes more than a minute or so for you to find and get it out I doubt most thieves would bother and would just lob something through the window instead.
I've always been wary of the keysafe things since, er, they're not very:
There's loads round here in town (lots of AirBnB/holiday lets) and I'm surprised more of them haven't been done over.
Our spare/emergency house key is in a tiny backpack on our cat.
We have a tin of cat treats at the back door,shake the tin and the cat will appear in seconds.
It's never failed.
Or
you could always leave a key in a waterproof box underneath an area of decking/woodpile/burnt out car, or just bury it and mark with a small gravestone.
Overthinking, just chuck a key under a pot/stone nowhere near the door.
Get two bricks. Put one right next to your front window and one slightly further away. Hide the key under the one that's slightly further away - thieves will always go for the easiest brick so they won't ever find the key.
Leave a spare key with a friendly neighbour?
This is what we do, we have the keys for several of our friends' houses and likewise they have ours.
I've got one of these key safes. It's down the side of the house, you have to walk around 3 sides of the house to get to it and it's not visible from the front.
I suspect anyone breaking in will snap the euro cylinder in the patio doors (that's what the locksmith did when I locked myself out) or break the double glazing.
I leave mine buried in the summerhouse that’s over the bridge spanning the ornamental lake. I find that thieves will rarely think to look for anything beyond the ha-ha. In any case, most of the time the butler is normally in the house, and unless he’s upstairs in the west wing he will always hear the doorbell.
Agree with the above - your overthinking it.
If they want to get it, they'll just put a flowerpot through your patio door.
Been there, done that.
Had a car broken into while we were in the house and it was parked on the drive. They didn’t bother trying the doors (which were unlocked as partner had just popped in to pick something up, and it was a nice quiet street). Just picked up a cobble from the edge of the garden and heaved it through the window.
Having said that something is always better then nothing unless you live next door to the lock picking lawyer.
The scrote that robbed us must’ve stopped looking for keys when he found a lump of granite to chuck through the window.
Was the key hidden underneath the granite stone?😉
As per a post the other day about locks, most thieves are opportunists, a brick though a windows is quicker than searching for a key
My downstairs neighbour has mine, mostly in case of water leaks or whatever. I have next door's .
I also have a spare buried in the garden in the case the neighbour is out or asleep. Not seen it for about five years, should probably dig it up and check it hadn't rusted away...
Well its about layers of security isn't it. A determined burglar can get through any single measure you take but are they going to spend the time and effort to get through several layers of security.
Firstly are they going to invest the time needed to break into a key lock not knowing if there is a key in there or not?
Are they going to spend time looking under doormats or various rocks in your flowerbeds...I know alot of people who leave keys under rocks.
Ultimately the main way they access houses is either by climbing through open windows, breaking into doors by breaking glass or attacking the hinges or locks so if that is their preferred method of entry they are not even going to be looking for key safes.
The reality is it is unlikely you get random burglars just looking to break into random homes. In recent years the handful of people I've heard of being broken into is almost exclusively to steal car keys so they can nab their car...they're not interested in the contents of the home at all.
In recent years the handful of people I’ve heard of being broken into is almost exclusively to steal car keys so they can nab their car…they’re not interested in the contents of the home at all.
And this is why it's wise to leave your car keys easily accessible by the front door so they don't go rampaging through your house while you and your family are tucked up in bed. If they want it, they're having it, might as well not get yourself done over in the process.
Get one of those Santa door keys, but put your key on it. They'll think you just left the decoration up!
I manage the team that fit keysafes to old people houses for carers and emergency services to use.
We only use the Supra C500 or P500 safe, they are Secured by Design, insurance approved (in most cases) and pretty bombproof. Occasionally our techies have to break in to them and it takes a lot of effort with big power tools, certainly more effort than just lobbing those same tools through a window.
The eBay keysafes you see outside holiday lets can generally be smashed with a hammer. A proper key safe (like those above) will probably be the most secure part of of your house.
Or you could just stick a key under a bit of firewood in the wood store like the rest of us.
you need more spiders... ...mrs poly won't even open my preferred hiding place!
seriously though - if your shed is tidy enough for a thief with no idea where your key is hidden to find it - have a word with yourself! Perhaps put it in an old paint tin or something so its easy for you to find.
I’ve always been wary of the keysafe things since, er, they’re not very:
Have you tried it... I have one (not the same brand - but cheaper) and he makes it look easier than it is. I tried it when that video came out and I think I could probably master it - but I gave up after about 15 minutes. I don't have his special tool so had to fashion one, but I suspect (a) not having his experience (b) not having the same understanding of the internals means I (and therefore your average thief) will just give up and use brute force.
…I know alot of people who leave keys under rocks.
It's okay to do this if the rock is so heavy that no-one can move it. Then the key will be secure.
If you're tech-savvy then a smart (electronic) lock is a great option, you'll need to do your research though as they aren't all created equal!
Has a host of advantages, including the ability to operate it remotely if required, and grant temporary and even day/time-based "keys" for people like pet-sitters & cleaners etc without having to worry about the security aspect of issuing them a physical key.
It's quicker for a tea leaf to lob a stone from the rockery through the big panes of glass in our house than find our secreted somewhere you just wouldn't look, with coded lock as well, spare key.
@zilog6128 what smart lock do you use? (I can't find one which is compatible with our multipoint lock, where you have to push the handle up to engage first)
back on topic - @outofbreath how identifiable is the key, in the shed, as the front door key? There are loads of keys in my shed. I don't know what most of them are. If one was a house key, it would be hard to know which.
key soaked in GT85 and put in a small plastic bag. Left in garden away from door. Safe as.
(Awaits the “your house insurance will be invalid” nonsense)
We discussed this recently and yes, leaving a key with a neighbour will not invalidate your insurance. However, if your neighbour is lax with their security and a burglar gains access to your property with a stolen key then that might.
I have one of those wall mounted key safe things... seems to be a reasonably secure thing.
They're generally about as secure as hanging a key on a hook. I can pop them open in about the time it'd take you to dial in a code you already knew.
As for the OP,
Security through obscurity is probably your friend here. A prospective thief is unlikely to spend a lot of time digging in plant pots and rummaging around in your shed looking for a key when they can easily wang the same plant pot through your back window. I could spend 20 minutes looking for a key or about 5 seconds with a flatblade screwdriver, a cold chisel and a lump hammer to snap the Eurocylinder in half.
If you do want a spare key outside I'd take "well hidden" over a very obvious keysafe any day of the week. Your average scrote is more likely to jemmy it than pick it of course, but they can't do that if they don't know it's there in the first place.
Pro tip: think "where can I hide this?" and then under no circumstances hide it there because your first answer will be the first place a burglar will look.
We only use the Supra C500 or P500 safe, they are Secured by Design, insurance approved (in most cases) and pretty bombproof. Occasionally our techies have to break in to them and it takes a lot of effort with big power tools, certainly more effort than just lobbing those same tools through a window.
This ☝️☝️ that’s standard local authority keysafes , pretty much as frank says bombproof .
most often used for multi agency entry where the person has mobility issues .
we used to use them on void properties , ive noticed the modern housing associations use the cheap e bay stuff, worse than useless , personally we stash ours , but we do have a loud dog 🐶
Why not have a keysafe with nothing in it and the key placed somewhere else? Would a thief spend time opening a keysafe, to find it empty, then think... "hmm, now where's that key then?!".. or just preseume you don't leave one out? or... are not all thieves the same?
And this is why it’s wise to leave your car keys easily accessible by the front door so they don’t go rampaging through your house while you and your family are tucked up in bed. If they want it, they’re having it, might as well not get yourself done over in the process.
Exactly what the police told our neighbours who were broken into. They kept their keys in their bedside table drawers but as you say, that just invites a simple case of car theft to be escalated to something potentially more serious. That's what car insurance if for.
It’s okay to do this if the rock is so heavy that no-one can move it. Then the key will be secure.
The irony is they're more likely to pick up the rock that hides the key and use that to break in through a window not realising there is a key under there at all.
You can only take reasonable and sensible measures. If someone is determined to break in, they will.
Our emergency key is in the electricity meter cupboard.
Just here to make some notes of where people keep keys.
Genuine advice, unless you are confident you live in a very low risk are don’t leave a key or use those crappy key safes. If people have a spare key they’re easy to find within minutes for anyone with experience, I’ll not say how or where. That said unless you’ve got really good modern locks the locks are almost pointless anyway.
Someone once suggested putting it in a tin of paint. You know it's there in an emergency, but no thief is going to stick their hand into the bottom of a tin of magnolia on the off chance the keys in it.
☝️☝️ i live on a council estate where burglary is almost unheard of , that said , we do have the odd pilferage among people known to each other , but that’s self contained , the real asset is the community, no one gets away with much .......wealthy areas have way more problems , student areas are open ground virtually, real lack of awarensss among young kids , who’ve no doubt mostly led very sheltered / cosseted existences ..
If people have a spare key they’re easy to find within minutes for anyone with experience, I’ll not say how or where.
Damn,so my bark coloured key,cable tied half way up the back of the apple tree is high risk 🙁 😉
If people have a spare key they’re easy to find within minutes for anyone with experience, I’ll not say how or where.
Have you got an apple tag on your spare key or something.
I'd eat my hat if anyone found my spare key in minutes - hell I'd give them an hour and more so there would be fun seeing if they worked out what it opened . I'm sure they would have resorted to their A. Plan of a brick before they worked that out.
Obvious plant pot is obvious.
Put this by the front door and leave the real key under a flowerpot.
Will that jar be accompanied with pampas grass?
Aye the thief will just think the house is rather "busy" with that outside the door.
Don't forget your key ?
MIL had a keysafe for the carers visiting as she couldn't move - I wasn't sure they were safe at all, but we had no alternative.
Get a smart lock instead of hiding key.
I have a smart garage door. If someone needs to get in and doesn't have a key, they can use their phone app or give me a ring. Very handy.
Have you got an apple tag on your spare key or something.
No, just 32 years experience of looking for keys or people telling me where they hide it. There are exceptions where people hide them where you’d not look. Trees aren’t necessarily one of them by the way.
Can’t you access the Router from outside? Just switch off the internet to gain their attention
This. Attach the router via a smartplug - then alexa/whomever can turn it off by shouting or the app.
They’re generally about as secure as hanging a key on a hook. I can pop them open in about the time it’d take you to dial in a code you already knew.
Depends on the model, no one has cracked the one we use, I had a good search on Youtube last time this came up and not a single video on it. They had an earlier one which was cracked but then redesigned to isolate the number pins from the release button so the apply tension and fiddle with the buttons thing doesn't work.
https://keysafe.co.uk/c500-keysafe.html
And judging by the number of keysafes you see on houses (of all makes) picking them can't be a popular attack method as they are everywhere now.
Easiest option is to stop locking yourself out of your own home thus negating the need for a spare key or place to hide it. Do people really lock themselves out on a regular basis? I don’t recall ever locking myself out and now I’ve typed that it’ll happen tomorrow
very rare these days as only old folk still use night latch type locks that can slam on you , it’s more i think losing / misplaying key while out ? people off their faces lose all sorts , heads especially , but phones and keys very common ........if you don’t get in such states you should narrow the odds
Can’t you access the Router from outside? Just switch off the internet to gain their attention
This. Attach the router via a smartplug – then alexa/whomever can turn it off by shouting or the app.
Sounds rather complicated when you could just send messages via their game service app (XBOX, PSN, Steam etc.). Constantly.
Easiest option is to stop locking yourself out of your own home thus negating the need for a spare key or place to hide it. Do people really lock themselves out on a regular basis? I don’t recall ever locking myself out and now I’ve typed that it’ll happen tomorrow
Here it’s me nipping out for a run or a ride thinking wife isn’t going out…..don’t take keys then she nips to the shop just before I arrive home.
Keep one in the car. And also bring a spare with you when out in a separate pocket/bag.
This thread reminded me about coming home from school in the days before mobiles and the internet, to discover I'd forgotten house key and nobody was home. I looked through window to side of door to see my key fob on the chest of drawers.
Found a long bamboo pole in the garden, pushed one end through the letterbox and after a few attempts through the keyring, raised the far end of the pole to get the keys to slide down to the letterbox and into my other hand... Saved waiting outside for a couple of hours! 😆
thieves will always go for the easiest brick so they won’t ever find the key.
Oh course they will, it’s easier to hit the window with it if they’re closer!
Our emergency key is in the electricity meter cupboard.
At the risk of repeating myself,
Pro tip: think “where can I hide this?” and then under no circumstances hide it there because your first answer will be the first place a burglar will look.
At the very least, don't make it immediately visible when you open the door.
Depends on the model, no one has cracked the one we use,
I don't know that particular model so you may be right but,
And judging by the number of keysafes you see on houses (of all makes) picking them can’t be a popular attack method as they are everywhere now.
picking was never a popular attack method outside of legitimate locksmiths attempting to gain access non-destructively. The question you need to consider is whether it can be opened with a four pound lump hammer and either a wrecking bar or a robust flatblade.
Easiest option is to stop locking yourself out of your own home thus negating the need for a spare key or place to hide it. Do people really lock themselves out on a regular basis? I don’t recall ever locking myself out and now I’ve typed that it’ll happen tomorrow
I'm almost inclined to say "try it and see what you'd do."
I was locked out once. Years ago I'd replaced the Yale-style latch lock with a 5-lever mortice at the behest of my insurer's. Then one day my then-girlfriend locked it when I no longer carried the key. A single size 8 drop-kick delivered by a 10-stone weakling was sufficient to blast the strike plate clean off the doorframe.
Much later, a phone call from an ex who'd locked herself out, same style of lock. I shimmed that in less time than it took to cut up a 2L Coke bottle to fashion the shim. I quote her, "well, that was sobering."
In the corporate world we have penetration testing and disaster recovery testing. Test your own security, if you can stove in your front door then so can anyone else.
Best place to hide a spare key is nowhere near the door. If someone's going to search for it, they'll start closest to the door they're trying to get into and then broaden the search, thus taking longer and potentially more likely to give up/run out of time/get caught.
Way back when i was living in a flat alone I locked myself out, while rushing up and down stairs packing my car to go and see my girlfriend on the south coast. Luckily my neighbour was a joiner and was happy enough to drill out the lock and fit a new one in the time it took me to finish packing. Did have to give a spare key to the rental agency though.
Nowadays I live in a place so isolated there's nobody that would hear if someone decided to break in. It's not really worth locking the place, but we still do out of habit. There's no locks on the windows though. I once accidentally broke into my own shed by riding my motorbike through the roller door! They're useless.
picking was never a popular attack method outside of legitimate locksmiths attempting to gain access non-destructively. The question you need to consider is whether it can be opened with a four pound lump hammer and either a wrecking bar or a robust flatblade.
As I said before, my technicians fit these keysafes for a living, they know their way around them very well. When they need to force access, they can only do it by spending a long time attaching it with angle grinder. They are very, very secure, almost certainly not the weak spot on any house.
If you have a four pound lump hammer in your hand then there are much easier ways of getting inside!
There is however a world of a difference, and price, between a Supra P500 and an £14 ebay special.
very rare these days as only old folk still use night latch type locks that can slam on you
I had a look at the doors in B&Q and the most expensive one there still had the lock-yourself-out type latch. Worst design ever.
don’t take keys
Always take keys. And a phone. You won't need them until you do!
Get a fake doggy poo on garden lawn and stick it in that. Just be careful you know which is fake
I don’t know that particular model so you may be right but,
Supra C500.
https://keysafe.co.uk/products/key-safes/police-preferred/c500-keysafe.html
Get a fake doggy poo on garden lawn and stick it in that. Just be careful you know which is fake
What…fake dog poo?
Souvenirs, novelties, party tricks... 🤣
🖐️
I wonder how many burglars google "Where should I hide my spare key ?" 😕
Out of interest, for those saying the night latch is a bad design.. what is the alternative for a door with an existing night latch and mortise lock? Short of replacing the door that is…
Under a piece of granite by the front door.
Out of interest, for those saying the night latch is a bad design..
Given its been the most common lock in the UK for as long as I can remember and there isn't a national outcry over people locking themselves out, it would seem to be a bit of a 'non issue'.
What's good about it is, you can't forget to lock the front door as long as you close it and you can always get out (say in the event of a fire) without a key.
I once had a Mondeo with push button start. I forgot something in the house, left the car running, took keys to open house, searched for whatever I had left behind, departed the house, got in car. Realised I had a running car and had left the keys in the now locked house.
These days, I have spare key outside and my car key (no longer push button) and house key on separate keyrings... But my front door requires manual locking! So I definitely won't go through that again 😁
hmmm, it’s a design that is inherently insecure , the keep is held by three small screws to the frame , a kick and it breaks , but crucially many do inadvertently end up locked out , when i worked for the council it was not uncommon , people would put the latch on , go out , to the garden , the door would slam in wind , the latch would release and bingo they’re locked out .
So apart from being insecure and locking people out , i suppose they work , but really , no one should fit them any more .
bassmandan , if you’ve a mortice lock , then you’re fairly secure from a door point of view , the latch is unnecessary security wise , is your mortice a five lever with handle or a deadlock type ( just a key , no handle ) .
If so , you can fit a five lever with handle etc to compliment it , do away with the night latch , double secure then , and never accidentally get locked out , the only issue is being trapped inside in a emergency , keys in locks is best when inside with these , no one has a chance in a smoke filled emergency of finding keys and then the holes .....
What he said ☝ only with better punctuation.
Yale-style slam latches are a terrible, outdated design. The ease of which it's possible to accidentally lock yourself out is offset only by the ease of which it's possible to break back in again. The best thing you can do to improve your security is remove it.
If "leaving the house without locking it" is an actual genuine concern then I'd question whether you're safe to be out of the house unaccompanied in the first place.
TBH being accidentally locked out is way down my list of concerns. It's happened once, about 15 years ago.
We've got one of the more expensive night latches that auto deadlocks with a little pin that pushes in as the door closes (to stop the latch being pushed back without a key) so tend to only use the mortice lock when out for the day etc (rather than nipping round the shops). I figure someone kicking in my front door is likely to be quite noticeable.
I'd not considered getting a 5 lever lock with a handle, the only question then is what do you do with the sodding great hole the night latch leaves in the door?
you can leave the brass barrel in or as is usual plug it with timber , if it’s a real fancy hardwood door , unless you can get matching timber to make a plug out of , a brass barrel doesnt look that bad from outside ......
for the regular occasions one of us locks ourselves out.
Sorry if someone has already mentioned it but just stop doing this. It's idiotic.
Gave it some thought today and can only recall being locked in by drunken friends. Had a few mates over drinking and I had to go to bed early so told them they could stay as long as they liked if they locked up and posted the key. Dickheads only did the first bit.
I once thought I was locked out. My neighbour was halfway through dismantling the lock on my door when I found the key in one of my pockets. He was not amused.
If you’re doing it on a regular basis you need to move in with an adult. Can’t fathom why you’d want to hide a key somewhere. Surely if you can lock yourself out on a frequent basis you’re not remembering where you hid that key.