[Closed] Hi-Fi upgrades - worthwhile, or emperors new clothes? (turntable content)

I went through a few years of upgrading hi-fi but when I eventually put together a set-up I really liked I then stuck with that, barring the occasional tweak to include streaming capability etc.

I've got two turntables - one is a Linn LP12 that is in my main system in my Edinburgh place. It was well set-up when I got it and I've left it that way. There are loads of upgrades possible (many of them pretty expensive) but I've left it as standard because I already love the way it sounds. The only significant upgrade I've made with the turntable was putting it onto a decent wall mounted rack.

The other turntable is an old Thorens TD160Mk2 and that I have played around with upgrading - arm, counterweight, various cartridges and mats etc. The Thorens was getting on a but anyway so the changes did make a big difference to how it sounds and how it looks. The biggest change was a cartridge upgrade - I'd been through various ones on it (various moving magnet Linn's plus a few others) but ended up with a Denon DL110 high output moving coil and that sounds really good.

I'm sure you can make some noticable improvements with upgrades to your Planar 2 but based on my own experience I'm not convinced I'd hear a significant improvement in sound from most of the uses you mentioned - things like twin belts etc.

Decent speaker stands I do find make a difference compared to not having any, but I'm not sure I'd spend a lot of cash on those either. I've spent quite a bit of hi-fi racks over the years but while I've found the isolation makes a difference, especially with turntables, I'm not convinced I can hear a significant difference between a basic Target rack I used to use and the expensive Mana Acoustics stuff that replaced it.

As long as cables are decent I've not found that using really expensive ones makes a difference so will never go down that route (I've got one £100+ interconnect but would be lying if I said I could hear a difference between that and a £30 one).

A better external phono stage might make a difference - it did in my system - but to be honest I'd say your system looks pretty well balanced and unless you're upgrading all of it I'd be surprised if there were huge gaines to be made. It might be better looking into the streaming side of things and adding a solution for that onto your system.

A wall shelf for the turntable works well.

I think the RB250 is probably the most modded hi-fi part in history (maybe), so there will be a million forum threads on that.

I was never very happy with my Marantz equipment personally. In fact the KI signature stuff sometimes sounded worse to my ears than the normal. I wish I'd kept the NAD 3020 instead until I got a load of Naim stuff.

I was [url= http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/24/style/international/music-technology-comes-full-circle.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur&bicmp=AD&bicmlukp=WT.mc_id&bicmst=1409232722000&bicmet=1419773522000&_r=2 ]reading yesterday[/url] that Rega have had a bumper year with their turntables this year.

After being a long time customer of http://www.theaudioworks.co.uk/ I am completely convinced in their setup methods.
They make their own range of stands/feet/etc all designed to be 'dead'.
The amount of energy in their systems is always incredible.

For a time, they sold a piece of Hi-Fi I designed and we did a couple of shows together and each time, I'd never heard it sounding better than when it was surrounded by their stands/powerblocks/etc.

http://www.musicworks-hifi.com/

They started with MDF, then Acrylic and now a material called Peek, so there are probably some things you could make yourself.

I look at your system and see 2 weak links, the cart and speakers.
I started down a similar path as you and there is a massive jump in quality once you go from a Rega cart to something from ortofon/Benz/sumiko etc. I'm currently using a sumiko blue point special which is getting on a bit now but it blows anything from Rega out of the water. You will need a washer under the arm though but that's an easy mod

The best upgrade I made to my turntable was a decent DAC so I could play Lossless audio files from my computer!!

I've got an LP12, but it never gets used as I just do not see how a turntable and vinyl can sound as good as digital audio. I've played brand new 180gm vinyl and compared it back to back with digital copies of the same stuff, and the vinyl just isn't as good and pops and crackles right from the word go, let alone trying to play older vinyl that I inherited from my Dad.

>offers music advice
>justinbieber

pops and crackles

Fewer pops and crackles are better, but there are lots of more/equally important aspects at play.

Ha! Yeah, I realise the name doesn't particularly qualify me for talking about music, but you know what, I'm not actually Justin Bieber. It's just a stupid nickname given to me in north Wales while on a biking holiday.

And I stick by what I said - vinyl might be right for some people and if it's set up absolutely perfectly then it might sound really good, but the quality falls of the cliff far too quickly for me and spoils my enjoyment.

I'd rather listen to something that is 99% good for 100% of the time, rather than something which might be 100% good for only 50% of the time.

Speakers look like the weakest link in that lot. You can get some brilliant second-hand speakers if you're patient/lucky. Also if you're able to, room treatments would probably make the biggest difference.

I haven't fully delved into the digital/mp3 world yet

I love giant slaying equipment and solutions

On that basis you should really embrace the new tech. Even a budget HD player or network streamer will certainly render your CD63 totally obsolete. Let's put it this way I now have a Naim CDX sitting around gathering dust.

As for the turntable, original stylus can't be good. How old is it? A whole new higher quality cart as suggested above should make much more difference than any of the other tweaks you mentioned. I used to change the stylus on my Linn K9 on an annual basis when I was regularly spinning vinyl. Now it's once in a blue moon.

Now it's once in a blue moon.

And I stick by what I said - vinyl might be right for some people and if it's set up absolutely perfectly then it might sound really good, but the quality falls of the cliff far too quickly for me and spoils my enjoyment.

Vinyl is vinyl though. It has a distinct sound. Not technically better but certainly has a character all of its own. I still prefer certain specific music played over a quality turntable (Linn LP12 etc) eg. Led Zep since the digital re-masters were absolute shite (have both vinyl and CD versions of all their albums). The vinyl versions sound right for the period, whereas the CD versions just sound compressed and very low quality, especially through a high end CD player. Same goes for a lot of 70's/80's albums that were originally mastered for vinyl.

Anything vaguely modern i.e. 90's to present day I much prefer through CD or lossless disk. But vinyl still has a place for older stuff, especially if you have a decent vinyl collection.

Usual one-word answer... 😀

I'd go speakers and cartridge. With things like the twin belts and aluminium sub platter, what makes you think the current setup is causing problems?

For the cash you'd invest in the Planar 2, you could probably sell the Planar 2 and put the cash toward a P3/24 or something instead - you'd get the arm upgrade that way as well.

Try thinking about it in the same way as a bike - say you installed a really expensive stem - would you expect it to transform the whole experience? Probably not - things like the aluminium sub platter are probably in the same regime. (All speculation, I hasten to add. I'm still using the standard platter on my Planar 3 and haven't found it too woefully lacking).

Then again, that doesn't mean the stem isn't a valid thing to buy - it'll look nice and make you happy. If buying that stuff makes you happy, go for it 🙂

Being suspicious is a good thing with hifi. People can sell all sorts because most people lack the equipment to actually definitively say whether or not A is better than B - so have to make emotional judgements. As we all know, these are easily fooled! So yeah. Emperors new clothes gets my vote - save your cash and upgrade the whole thing when you're ready. Speakers will be the most obvious gain.

Edit: If you like what you hear with the speakers, keep 'em! No point changing stuff because random people say something else is better. No-one else can ever hear what you hear 😀

Some great tips already, thanks guys.
Regarding vinyl quality, I find that the better you have isolated the turntable, the more that pops and crackles simply disappear. I have a mix of new 180g records, and 60s/70s/80s/90s various and on many occasions I'm blown away with just how clear and dynamic the sound is from them (let alone with a few upgrades).
For example, I've backed to back the Beck Sea Change CD with the two vinyl copies I have (one a Mo-Fi version) and quite simply, the vinyl versions ooze a depth and dare I say it 'warmth' that the (excellent) CD does not portray.
Last night my Sonic Youth, Dylan and Fleetwood Mac albums sounded fab on vinyl.
Considering I picked up my turntable for something like £90 (low mileage 2nd hand) and it's humble cartridge, it sounds fab already. That's what i love about considered budget hifi.

Interesting to read comments regarding my speakers. Remembering that my initial ethos is for giant slaying equipment - the reviews on the BX2's were enough for me to at least give them a trial. I home tested them alongside a pair of considerably more expensive B&Ws and I simply preferred the BX2's. I consider them an upgrade from my long term Mission 771's anyway, which didn't have enough bass response for me.
I will upgrade my speakers again once I find a pair that I'm certain I'll enjoy more, but for now, pound for pound my monitor audios are brilliant.

I have a Rega wall stand for my turntable but have yet to set it up, looking forward to hearing the results. In the meantime, I'll trial a granite plinth under my TT and see how that goes.
I'd like to upgrade the cartridge and have a hankering for an Ortofon blue or red - but that won't be for a while yet, if at all - as I may decide to do something silly like blow a wedge on an RP6.. Or 8..

Re speaker cable/interconnects, I agree - I'm not fussed for the expensive gear.

Thanks for the links too, I'll certainly check them out. Keep it coming!

`Marantz PM66 KI (c/w ishiwata phono stage)

Same hear.
Lovely, aren't they?

but I've recently ordered a set of granite plinths to rest my separates and speakers on.

I've got a Planar 3 with the RB300 and a Rega Elys 2 cartridge, on an old Target steel stand.

Idly looked into upgrading the Rega, came to a different conclusion -
I'd go for a new Rega motor with an outboard supply.
An acrylic platter.
Possibly subplatter & bearing.
A new cartridge - the Elys is really detailed and tracks amazingly well, but lacks a bit of sparkle.

But it sounds great as it is, so I'll leave it for the mo.
🙂

If you like tinkering, your plan sounds great, but you could always sell your RP2 and get a better turntable if you don't.

Agreed Rusty - the P2 and amp combo works really well. I like the motor upgrade idea, I'm just playing with small tweaks at the moment in order to begin to see what a P2 can do, before splashing too much cash on it.
I'm a big fan of the Michael Lim upgrade forum so when he released a budget version of his alu subplatter, I couldn't resist adding it to an order - really keen to see if it's a worthy upgrade - if not, it'll sell for a good price!

I'm aiming for a wide open soundstage - with distinct separation. Every now and again, on a certain track my system hits the sweet spot. Hopefully with tweaking I can make it more consistent.
When I experimented with the rubber strap hifi stand as mentioned earlier there was an immediate and big improvement - it seems to me that there are no good vibrations, let's keep things isolated!

A great upgrade to your deck will be getting that shelf up. Isolation from the floor makes a massive difference. I've had a number of TT's over the years (Roksan, Nottingham Analog, VPI) and currently use a Clearaudio. I'd like to think I know a fair bit about TT's.

A Rega 2 is a decent budget TT however I'd not go too mad on the upgrades, for 500 or so you could pick up something a fair bit better, 1000 and you're into a second hand VPI scout, Clearaudio Champion, Notts Analog etc.

If your keen to keep the Rega I'd just replace the Cartridge and get a decent phono stage. The upgrades you're suggesting are all worth trying but a new cart will really up the ante, I'd suggest a Denon DL301 or DL110 and something like a Trichord Dino/Rega fono. On Ebay you can get a NVA phono 1 stage, they are excellent stages and very good value, I've got a phono 2 and it's leagues ahead of others I've used.

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I'm assuming you've set up the deck properly especially the VTA (a pain to do on the planar) and have a decent alignment protector and tracking pressure gauge, setting it up properly makes a massive difference as I'm sure you know.

A Rega P6 in unused mint condition went for £450 on pink fish recently.
I would go that route if you are looking for a decent upgrade. Rega's don't seem to benefit from fiddling. I've got a P3 with an Ortofon MC cartridge & it's fab.
There is still something special about holding a 180gm vinyl record, looking at the message scratched into the inner groove, putting it on the turntable & admiring the sleeve & cover.

Alas, mine is set up fairly crudely (embarrased face emoticon).
Happy to take your suggestions on which bits and pieces and what not to buy in order to get best set up. Please remember the budget though..

I'll get the stand on the wall pronto, good to hear positive results elsewhere. Then it looks like I may need to go cartridge shopping

I wouldn't be able to resist a mint P6 for that money. Lovely.

Edit: shit, someone's gone and listed an RP25 minus arm for £200 on ePay.. I love the look of them, I wonder if my RB250 can do it justice?.. Would be a nice potential upgrade from my plinth and motor

So you need a 2 point cartridge alignment protractor which you can get on ebay for a few quid and a Shure stylus gauge for the tracking weight. If you can, go for an moving coil cartridge like the DL301 if your amp has a MC stage the DL 110 or something if not, I do think well made budget MC's are inherently better sounding so perhaps look at a high output MC..

Get over to the vinyl engine it's a great resource for set up and so on.

I have BX2's. Love 'em.

Look at the technology in them vs the rest of the MA range. You can pay hundreds more from the same company, and you don't really get anything different.

I think they sound great.... though I did add a hefty sub.

justinbieber - I beliebe you're perfectly qualified, just pulling your tonearm, matey 🙂

http://www.vinylengine.com/tools.shtml

Cheers jools

Get yourself on eBay and buy some thick acrylic - the guy I used cut it and flame polished the sides for free. Bang a set of sorbothane fet on and you've got a decent plinth on the cheap to play about with for you TT/amp etc.

[IMG] [/IMG]

Two aluminium brackets and a set of screws/rawlplugs. Levelled with long screws to the wood. I tried glass and foam and stuff, makes no difference.

It look extremely wonky, but the CoG is in the middle 🙂

About £15 all in.

Love it
Thumbs up for substance over style 🙂

About £15 all in.

The Rega shelf used to only be about £30. Don't know these days. But it couldn't be levelled after installation which made it fiddly.

Anything lightweight and level on the wall should be good. It's isolation from the floor you're looking for, so ideally on an external wall that goes down to foundations. If it's an interior stud wall that is sat on the floor, it doesn't work as well.

They are £100 now! I picked one up unused for £50.
You're right in that they can't be levelled after fitting, but some adjustable feet for the TT should sort that if required.

This ones nice

[img] [/img]

I've got one of these, in fact this is mine it's a Stands unique transition shelf

[img] [/img]

I've got a couple of McIntosh MT5 turntables which I got in just so we had a couple of decks to play/dj on now and then, to be honest they we're a bit of an excessive splurge as most of the time the cat sleeps on them.

Get a couple of mates round - each one lifts up a speaker with its stand, sit in your listening position, and get them to move forwards and backwards, etc, to find the best position where the stereo appears to 'snap' into place.

Also look at room treatment/furnishing - for instance if your have a 3 piece setup and the chairs are big and 'fluffy' then put them on the outside of each speaker so they catch the 'first reflections'.

Look at your carpet/rugs - if your system is too 'dark' try a less thick rug, etc.

Really - it looks like it's from the skip

Well, I had one day, a budget of frak-all and quite frankly I just wanted the fastest way to make the thing work, which it previously didn't do because of the [img] [/img] subwoofer, which sounds best against the wall, so it's now replaced one of the bookshelves that was under the curtains in this pic. As you can see in the new layout, the sub would make too many vibrations and so I had the aforementioned time/budget to get the damn thing off the bookshelf. Oh, and it can't be symmetrical because the brickwork is not quite as wide as the Rega/Sony.

[IMG] [/IMG]

From head height, it's only the front of the chipboard that catches the eye, but seeing as I'm still not being paid by anyone, have just spend all my spare money taking the white rabbit to the vet, have an emergency lodger in my office forcing me to spend all bloody day in the living room and have two house rabbits, AND it works perfectly well allowing me to actually use the damn player, I think I've done rather well.

If anyone wants to send me a free HiFi Racks choppingboard, as above, I'd be very grateful. Actually, that's going to be the mod to my homebrew rack, a giant solid chopping board.

Anyone who feels like pointing out that one of the brackets isn't straight [let alone central] is welcome to come round to my place and drill another, straighter, hole in the engineering bricks that form that wall. My tools consist of a drillbit, and a hammer to tap it. No drill, and certainly no SDS drill.

Lastly the whole lot, ALL of it, cost me about £400. Including cables.

I see your point, it doesn't look like it cost £5k, but it sounds brilliant, so seeing as I have been a student with no spare money for the last 4 years, I think I'm doing OK, don't you?

Covering the walls and floor with something soft would make more difference than better components in there IMO. How much would a few hundred egg boxes cost?

Then more power. Normally I listen using a conventional stereo (BX2s etc.). I had a play with the PA normally used for three voices in the same room. Well over 200W per channel even wiring speakers in series to up resistance and limit power. Tunes from the likes of Slade, AC/DC and Téléphone sound (and feel) great - never mind the quality , feel the quantity. Detached house with triple glazing BTW.

I think I'm doing OK, don't you?

OK. I'm just getting pretty fed up of doing everything on a budget and with spare parts, so I guess I'm a bit touchy about it!

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EDIT: Feel free to ponder why I have 12 channels of amplification 🙂

[img] [/img]

Tries to resuscitate the thread he killed and backs away slowly......

New tangent time.

So I should have £5-600 in january and I've come to realise that my living room has a floorstander shaped hole (or 2). The issue is that I'm not really sure what to get. I've already got an amp (Cambridge Audio SR10, it was a bargain) and a cd player (Pioneer PD S703, another bargain), I was having a look at the Klipsch RF52 IIs but I can't find a real world shop that's local to me so I can have a listen.

What are the real best value floorstanders?

There is still something special about holding a 180gm vinyl record, looking at the message scratched into the inner groove, putting it on the turntable & admiring the sleeve & cover.

If I had 600 for some floorstanders I'd find a pair of PMC FB1s secondhand. Get the ones with the soft dome tweeter stick about 60 watts + up em and enjoy.

[url= https://www.gearslutz.com/board/studio-building-acoustics/610173-acoustics-treatment-reference-guide-look-here.html ]Room Acoustic Guide[/url]

That's the only advice i'll offer - it's pointless building a system without taking room acoustics into consideration as a starting point.

A few corner bass traps, some acoustic wall panelling, perhaps panels on the ceiling and acoustic foam behind the speakers - all available in different grades to control specific frequencies. It's quite easy to tailor the sound you want from equipment and upgrades once you have a good listening environment to start with.

If I had a dedicated room I'd do all that but you can get a long way just putting the speakers in the right place, some well placed bits of furniture and deep rugs etc. I'm lucky as I've arranged the lounge around my system, my wife appreciates good music too, although she's still peeved I sold my 3/5a's with the subs as she said they were better and smaller than all the others...

Floorstanders - I'm still in love with my Rega Ela mkii speakers (mine are cherry veneer).

You can find them for <£150 which is unbelievable.

One of the sweetest mid-ranges around for live vocals. They still surprise me now after 16 years of ownership. They're now partnered with a source worth 5k (although just a Nait amp) and I'm still reluctant to change them.

I'm hoping to arrange my room around the system, it will certainly take more of a center stage then it used to.

I particularly like the fancy wooden turntable rack earlier in the thread, has got me thinking a bit more about how I mount my Planar 2.

Incedently, what do you guys think of swapping my plinth and motor for the RP25 that i mentioned? £200 for the uprated deck and motor - and I could just stick on my tonearm and other upgrades..?
Seems a relatively cheap way to an almost complete P25.. (Would be nice to have an RB600 though)

I'd love to hear some quality Rega speakers, nice to hear that you are still completely satisfied with yours

Right now I'm concentrating mostly on the turntable and snapping up various little upgrades. Namely:
Twin belt pulley with silicon belts
Alu sub platter
Rubber/cork mat
Thrust bearing
Motor isolation shroud
Upper plinth metal bracing
Tungsten counterweight from RB300 (RB250 fitted)

I have a Thorens TD126 with SME S3 tonearm and Ortofon 530 mk2 cart. The biggest improvement I found was to put it on a thick oak offcut (from our kitchen worktop), and run a layer of blutak round the inside of the platter. Cost £0.

Have you timed your TT speed? I wonder if the bluetack slowed it a little? (sometimes prefereable)

Have you timed your TT speed? I wonder if the bluetack slowed it a little? (sometimes prefereable)

Speed is adjustable and it has a timing strobe. I can't recall if I had to tweak it after the blutack mod though.

Bluetak on a hard platter will add a degree of damping. It won't affect the speed unless it's touching something else, in which case you've put it on the wrong bit 🙂 HTH

The best vinyl I ever found and played? Paul Simon - Hearts and Bones, Donald Fagen - The Nightfly, and Dire Straits - Love Over Gold, Bob Ludwig and Masterdisk the common factor.
He's still mastering recordings, but not at Masterdisk any more, but he is The Man as far as I'm

I got a copy of the Nightfly for £3 recently - just had a look and my copy is mastered by Bob Ludwig. Can't remember if holy light came down from heaven when I listened to it or not though. Guess I should have another listen and see

Do report back and tell us! I'm intrigued 🙂

Few of us have the luxury of a dedicated listening room. Decent kit will sound better than rubbish even in a normal living room. My ATC speakers sound a lot better than anything else I've had in my well furnished space. Bass traps, etc. are the icing on the cake and impractical in most households.

I don't think anyone would disagree with you, it's all down to personal circumstances and budget

Decent kit will sound better than rubbish even in a normal living room

That's certainly my experience too.

As a bit of an aside again, what forums etc do people use to get their hi-fi fix? The STW of audio as it were?

Pink Fish Media is the forum I use.

I've been loving vinyl engine the last 24hrs.

Have new silicone belt fitted this afternoon, also have a 'vibration jacket' to fit over the motor this evening. Dubious, but worth a punt at the price!

Thinking of ordering a ceramic bearing for the new sub platter - any observations here guys?
Well actually, maybe two, the other for the thrust bearing I'm going to fit

EDIT: Feel free to ponder why I have 12 channels of amplification

Active FTW 😀

Thinking of ordering a ceramic bearing for the new sub platter - any observations here guys? Well actually, maybe two, the other for the thrust bearing I'm going to fit.

I doubt I'd be able to hear a difference unless the existing bearings were knackered, but your mileage may vary.

When I was doing up my TD160 the things I could hear a difference with were:
- switching to a vinyl mat (I actually bought it because it looked good but I'm convinced it improved the sound a tad, maybe just because it's flatter)
- setting the arm at the correct height/angle. The RB250 is a little low and it was previously bodged on. Getting a proper adaptor looked better and seemed to make the deck perform better as well.
- changing cartridges - it wasn't just about whether they were better cartridges (the one I liked best wasn't the most expensive I tried) but which suited the system best. With my TD160 that was a Denon DL110
- phono stage - the Naim amp I'm using has a very good phono stage but the two-box external one I'm doing now is a bit smoother and more to my taste. It was system dependent though - with my main system (also Naim amps but seperate pre/power/pre-amp power-supply) the built in Naim phono stage suited it better.
- wall rack - in my Edinburgh house I had footfall issues so moving the LP12 to a wall mounted table was a huge upgrade. In my London flat the floor is more solid and I've not had any footfall issues so haven't used a wall mounted table here.

Messing around with cables, counterweights, bearings, braces, top-plates, plinths and the likes I can't say I've found made a difference or at least not that I could hear. I haven't done anything with power supplies yet although that is one thing I might change on my LP12 although mainly there to make playing 45's easier.

I'm on Pink Fish Media and Hifi Wigwam really just for the classifieds now but I sometimes have a read. There's a rega p9 going for £450 at the mo, frankly if you can stretch just get a new deck it's easier and cheaper long term.
Over the years I've come to a couple of conclusions about hifi - Right or wrong.

Speakers make the most difference to the sound but not the absolute quality. I'd still rather have 5k speakers on 2k of electrics, oh and size matters!

Amps don't make all that much difference you'd be surprised at how little amp you need, see naits, exposure XX, NVA,Sugden etc etc (I've had a Lavardin IT it was alright I suppose but 5k better than a nait 2? -nope)
If you have a TT stick it on a shelf and think of it as a precision measuring device, it is. Get the best cartridge/phono stage you can, with TT's engineering matters so more money usually [u]is [/u]better.
Room set up makes a massive difference I like this guide, http://www.audiophysic.de/aufstellung/index_e.html
Cables - Not going there, suffice to say I use cheap van damme cable all round. I worked in a shop so tried some uber expensive cables didn't notice any difference TBH but could spot equipment changes easily, it was enough to convince me..

In my London flat I have a very simple system - Thorens TD160mk2 turntable (RB250 and DL110), custom made two-box phone stage, Sheng Da valve CD player, Naim Nait 3 integrated amp, Rega Kyte speakers (currently on the floor!), QED headphone amp and AKG headphones. Everything except the headphones was 2nd hand and fairly cheap but it sounds good. I think there might be a few expensive cables in there but only because I had still had them from earlier cable dablings!

It was quite fun putting it together 2nd hand - the Rega Kytes in particular a great little set of speakers and didn't cost much at all. The turntable was originally a spare I used occasionally as a backup for the LP12. It was originally a bit ratty but a few simple upgrades had it sounding good., and it looks decent now as well.

The turntable is spinning a bit of Sinatra at the moment. Very relaxing!

I did a lot of dabling over the years - a lot of it wasted money - until I understood what I liked and also that what was important to me was the balance of the system, not whether an individual component was the best or not. For example the Naim integrated I use sounds better with a more relaxed CD player (hence the one I use with a valve output stage) than it did paired with a much more expensive Naim CD player. Conversely the system in my place up in Edinburgh had better amps and the Naim CD player is much better in it.

I worked in hi fi retail and manufacturing for a bit and tinkered with my turntable (a TD160)

A good PSU made a huge difference (I used a Linn Valhalla, £50 sh 20 years ago), as did rewiring the tonearm with enamelled copper wire, and decent light rigid supports for TT and speakers especially. Oh and a ringmat.

I've had a Lavardin IT it was alright I suppose but 5k better than a nait 2? -nope

I've still got a Nait 2 I bought from new. Haven't used it in years, but it's a great little amp and perfect for use with turntables - I used it with a Linn Axis. 13 watts per channel has never sounded so powerful! Seriously makes a mockery of quoting wattage on amps. I should really get this system back up and running with some modern high-end speakers. I reckon it would be pretty cool for a nostalgic vinyl session.

Replaced it with a Naim pre/power combo and a Naim CDX, which is just stunning. It was an expensive upgrade at the time, but the difference in sound quality was epic. That's still the best system I've ever heard without spending serious amounts of cash.

Having said that, I'm now convinced that CD is dead in the water with hard disk/ network players reaching maturity.

more good advice, thanks guys.

Jules - im particularly enjoying following your links. Im also intigued by the P9 for £450! where was it listed?.. I cant spot it..

Sitting here devouring pages of hi-fi info whilst listening to Dream River by Bill Callahan, so darn relaxing. Great mix too.

Sorry P6 Here http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=162366&page=2&highlight=Rega

But it looks like this though!
[img] [/img]

Ah yes, spotted that.. It's, awful, isn't it.
However, it's a cracking price. I'd be tempted to buy a replacement plinth into favourite colour (green!) for £175 ish and then try and flog the Union Jack for anything over £100..

I did not spot that sorry but he hasn't posted any pics?

Says Union Jack version on first post.

After wanting to try them out for god knows how long, I finally installed some granite plinths today! First real upgrade for this system fitted.
First impressions, after amp warmed up there's certainly a little more punch to the bass on Dylan's Pat Garrett soundtrack (vinyl), I'm also picking up more distinct separation (lovely!) and crisper twangs to the fabulous guitar string plucking. So far so good 🙂
Bass is generally better controlled.
Tom Waits Closing Time (CD) never sounded so smokey bar real.

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You're not going to like me saying so but that is the worst place possible for the TT. Get it away from that speaker on a shelf and get the speakers on stands. It will make more difference than spending any more cash.

I was thinking granite slabs on flimsy bookshelves isn't the best possible upgrade.

I concur. Get a shelf up 🙂

Mine was more extreme, the whole lot was sitting on a sub.

The the low frequency feedback would have caused the cones to fly out of my speakers when I used the TT.

At higher frequencies the same ting will be happening, but just to a lower degree.

Does it ever howl if you turn it up, sited like that?

NB - don't test it!

Does this make three, or four people on this thread with BX2's?

And Regas?

Don't understand -

Heavy granite plinths, but they just sit on flimsy wooden bookshelves - so all your doing is tranfering energy at a different audio range into the system - and the cartridge is so close to the speaker that negative feedback is almost certainly occuring - the car will be influenced by the speaker output.

Put the speakers on stands, with nowt between them, to get some semblance of a sound stage, and ensure the tt and amp are a distance away and out the direct sound path -

Woah tigers!!

Maybe I should have explained better..
Yes my set up is far from ideal (still sounds pretty good to be fair), but I have a wall bracket for the TT, and speaker stands in the pipe line. I only moved in a few weeks ago so haven't had a chance to get it all set up optimally yet.
I won't dare add another pic till I do 🙂

Interestingly, (well, to me anyway) there is still a surprising amount of energy present in the wooden shelves. Upon touch you can still quite easily feel low frequencies doing their thing, although to a lesser extent than before I added the granite. I assumed that with granite that thick that there would more isolation. Surprising how much energy the speakers must be kicking out.
So, speakers will be seperated and on stands. Turntable will be isolated on external wall. Unfortunately I don't have much opportunity to relocate the seperates to a dedicated rack, only onto a narrower shelf. I'm considering having some acrylic (or some other material) shelves custom made to take their place in the modular stand (the shelves are joined to the stand via metal rod type brackets which could fit into similarly cut acrylic).
Thoughts on this idea?

Juju, can you explain what you mean by different energy being transferred please?
I thought the granite would make a decent isolation block and prevent low frequencies travelling down and Into the wood.
Playback was definitely improved so they must be doing something right?..

Once the speakers are on stands say 6 -8 feet apart & a couple of feet from any walls and that TT is on a wall shelf & not that shelving unit you will be a much happier camper. If you can sit against the opposite wall at least 8 feet away that will be good too.
Speakers belong on stands you can't isolate them like that. These would be perfect and the price is cheap http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Partington-ANSA-60-Hi-Fi-Speaker-Stands-/251732373977?pt=UK_Sound_Vision_Speaker_Stands_Brackets&hash=item3a9c6b31d9

yes, I spotted those stands a couple days ago and am considering them.

Have heart set on a set of Atacama's in white though - which from a purely aesthetic point of view will blend into the background alot easier.

Building up couage to stick the Rega wall bracket up this afternoon..