[Closed] Handy pasteable letter/email to your MP to vote against Brexit. 5 min job.

Sorry, been busy. We've not voted out have we?

🙂

My MP will simply do whatever gets him in the PM seat 😐

My local MP is David Cameron, er...

You may want to change the 'European Communities Act 1927' to 1972...

get on with life man...ffs

the majority vote won, move on

You just wont let it lie will you?

ton - Member
get on with life man...ffs

POSTED 1 HOUR AGO # REPORT-POST
rmacattack - Member
the majority vote won, move on

It's good to finally see people getting engaged with politics and actually taking the time to understand the implications of some of this stuff. Being flippant is all well and good but whats your great plan? Just grumble on?

Let it go?
What the pound?
http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=USD&view=1W
Probably a good time
Investor confidence?
Yep let that go
Good trade deals - yep let them all go

As parliament needs to vote to invoke article 50 it's not over. Don't knock people forgiving a shit.

Also - worth a refresh on this one

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/apr/20/accuracy-is-for-snake-oil-pussies-vote-leaves-campaign-director-defies-mps

This is the kind of thing that needs to be rammed down the throats of the Leave voters. Most voted on the understanding that things said, written on the sides of big red buses would come to fruition.

Those promises have now proved false, if not, to say the least out right lies.

People did not vote fairly and freely as the they were fed lies. Democracy has not been served.

[b]This is not an election where, in 5 years time, we can change our minds.[/b]

Nope, I'm not moving on until the way forward becomes clear. Part of the reason for this mess is the lack of sensible people taking more of an interest in politics and more of a stand in what they believe in. I blame myself to some extent and am going to change my behaviour starting now.

might want to change your behaviour to respect the views of others as equal to ones own instead of denigrating them as some how less intelligent or misinformed. You would be more tolerant

Cutting and pasting someone else's words is just a repeat of the stupidity that got us into this mess, the simplistic clichés, the jingoist memes and the lies.

Write to your MP, tell him how you feel about this whole **** up, but for god sake use your own words.

You lost me at "write a letter".

All I'm asking is for my mp to do his constitutional duty. If you agree with me then maybe I saved you some time and you can think of doing the same using those words or others. If you don't agree with me that's fine, don't write, I respect your views.

I'm sure nobody would take someone else's words at face value without thinking for a moment whether there was any truth in what they were saying.

Oh, hang on...

to be honest it would have more impact if we wrote it on the side of a bus....

There's a difference between "respecting people's views", "letting it go", "just moving on" and actually wanting to take part in reasoned political debate over an important issue.

There's also a reason why referenda aren't generally legally binding, particularly in cases where there is no clear majority.

So I'll not be "letting it go" cos I actually feel like there is an opportunity here to both break or strengthen the country I choose to live and work in. The rise of right- wing policies and thinking is a scary thought. Your grandfathers fought against it and many lost their lives over it, so why back down now?

I agree. It's too big an issue to just say "Oh well" and move on. I'd be happier if anyone in the brexit camp had any idea whatsoever what the **** they were going to do. Without that, I don't see a single reason to stop trying to influence the process.

This. It is unacceptable to knowingly lie as part of a demographic process. They lied. They misled millions of people.

"This is the kind of thing that needs to be rammed down the throats of the Leave voters. Most voted on the understanding that things said, written on the sides of big red buses would come to fruition.

Those promises have now proved false, if not, to say the least out right lies.

People did not vote fairly and freely as the they were fed lies. Democracy has not been served."

Dear MP

Please ignore the democratic will of the majority of a poorly educated, ill informed, easily misled, disenfranchised electorate.

Maybe if you, your predecessors, and the EU had come out of your Ivory Towers and connected to the people you are supposed to represent at some point in the last 40 years you wouldn't be so far up shit creek while Farage runs off laughing with your paddle.

Love and hugs

MoreCash

so far up shit creek while Farage runs off laughing with your paddle.

Please don't misunderstand me, I'm dismayed at the result and ardently pro Europe but, arguing that we should now try to nullify the result of a democratically held referendum because we don't like the outcome is exactly the sort of crap people didn't like about Europe.

We lost - I personally feel that's not just the leave camp but everybody in Europe and the wider world.
Going forward in Europe [s]is[/s] was about democracy, freedom, equality and defending the rights of people of all faiths creeds sexes and points of view,to now propose riding roughshod over those very things largely goes to ratify arguments about Europe being bad for the UK[s people], being undemocratic and being unrepresentative. Not everyone who voted out believed the lies they were fed, many of them wouldn't believe a thing a politician (tory especially) said even if it were that the sun will rise in the East tomorrow.

We as a divided (and diminished) nation need to figure out how to do this and do it as well as we can rather than trying to further alienate and disenfranchise a huge section of our populace by ignoring their opinion because we "know better".

Play the cards you are dealt not the ones you wish you had and sure as hell don't try and cheat and lie your way out of it to prove you're better than the cheats and liars we blame for getting us here.

Democracy isn't just ticking a box, it's an ongoing debate. Until a50 is enacted that debate is still very much alive. It's kinda similar to Rooney scoring an unjustified penalty, then watching the team flounder as they realise they can't win after all.

Dear MP,

Please ignore the result of the Referendum.

Peace, Love and kisses

If I bought a lovely new bike today online, and when they sent it to me it was in fact not what they advertised, I'd send it back and ask for a refund.

I'm not sure how this is different.

Door. Horse. Bolted.

jambalaya - Member
Dear MP,
Please ignore the result of the Referendum.
Peace, Love and kisses

Not saying it would be a wise move politically, but it would possibly be a welcome principled one if there are any brave enough to do so.

Play the cards you are dealt not the ones you wish you had and sure as hell don't try and cheat and lie your way out of it to prove you're better than the cheats and liars we blame for getting us here.

Why do the Remainians feel that they have the right to countermand the referendum?

Petulant ****ing ****s. The bastard me, me, me generation. My view is the most important.

If they'd won it my a very small margin I expect that they'd be happy to consider it legitimate and not worry about the feelings of those who voted leave. ****s.

Suck it up losers. You lost.

it's an ongoing debate.

Which loses participants as it becomes apparent their voice isn't being heard. A big part of the problem is people don't feel they're heard, don't feel represented and don't feel fairly treated.

To change that you need to get the people who voted leave to agitate for a rerun or for notice not to be served.

Being in the loosing side and pushing for that isn't about being democratic and having a debate, it's about being petulant,undemocratic and unilateral. It's no different to a parent asking their child what they want for dinner then giving them cabbage anyway, it might be better for them but if you want people to learn rather than just shrug and not care you have to educate not ignore.

Why do the Remainians feel that they have the right to countermand the referendum?

Petulant **** ****s. Suck it up losers. You lost.

Screw that, use whatever you have to get the right result. [b]and become the very thing you complain about[/b] If your going to play the game of thrones... sorry wrong thread. It's a result parliament doesn't support, the [b]minority of [/b] people don't support and the country won't benefit from.

History is full of people who thought the end justified the means and historically they're exactly the people we have fought so very hard to ensure didn't come to power in Europe.

Party politics is 100% based on one group who aren't in power holding those in power to account. Are all opposition parties just petulant losers who need to suck it up an move on, because they generally have less of a mandate than the remain camp. Blinkered attitudes while the leavers try to find someone brave enough to take the bullet and move on a50.

Very true, why is screwing the economy, trade, the people, the future and a united progressive Europe not the right thing. When the "best we can hope for" alternative seems to be the exact deal we have now but costing more with no control and no veto??

Does the project look like it's well thought out, has a plan, has any way of delivering all those things it so helpfully (didn't really) promise to gullible people?

If there was any prospect of the UK being better off more people would be with you, there isn't - the best guess is spending 2-5 years trying to get close to where we are now. Read some of the job and prospect threads - jobs and investment is being pulled, research is going to move, big business will be gone people are emotive and hostile because their futures are being ****ed with for a pathetic ideological idea that delivers nothing.

I'm sorry, but "suck it up and move on" doesn't cover the multitude of possibilities that might now occur.

It's not a simple case of being "in or out". It's not a binary decision.

There is now a negotiation to try and balance the needs of business, generally in favour of being in the EU and having freedom of movement, with all the people who voted out.

There is nothing wrong with the 48% contacting their MP's and making sure their argument is heard so it can be represented in the ongoing negotiations, especially since many of them (e.g. me!) will be worried about losing their jobs.

This doesn't mean overturning the referendum.

There's been a distinct lack of convincing arguments to go ahead with Brexit since the vote.

"Suck it up."

"Let it go."

"Stop whining."

But all the actual evidence points toward it being a [i]really[/i] bad idea, as the Leave promises are revealed as fantasies and pipe dreams.

Obviously some of you Leavers will disagree, but I understand that's easier for you than changing your mind based on facts and critical thinking.

Why do the Remainians feel that they have the right to countermand the referendum?

Because the 52% voted for unicorns, and unicorns don't exist.

Simple question...
Is leave worth it if
We have Free Movement of People
Have to respect EU rules on trade
Have to pay any saving to the EU in return for our trade
Set the economy back by at least the duration of the negotiation
Lose a number of high tax paying businesses and employers from the UK

Face it, Article 50 will never be invoked. It can't be. Talking about it has already done an immense amount of harm, which will only intensify over the coming months with the ongoing leadership vacuum on both sides of the house.

Suck it up losers. You lost.

But sadly, it's not just the brexiters that lost, we all did.

Democracy does not start with the campaign or end with the vote. It is ongoing.

Even if we leave people can campaign to rejoin. This after all would only the reverse of what Farage was doing for 17 years.

Because the 52% voted for unicorns, and unicorns don't exist.

SUCK IT UP AND GIVE ME MY UNICORN!

My Local MP is Boris Johnsons little brother...
Might email it to him anyway..

trouble is, the Unicorn campaign wasn't very clear, half the voters wanted a blue unicorn and hate red unicorns, and the other half think a blue unicorn would be a disaster.

And unicorns only come in red or blue.

26% blue unicorn, 26% red unicorn. 48% voted to keep the horse we've got already.

Democracy is not as simple as one person one vote. Jefferson talks about the need for 'educated citizenry' and whilst i would not call the voting population uneducated, I think many were uninformed or lied to and an uninformed poll is not democracy.

Yes, i believe in democracy, but part of the 'suck it up' argument must also be that we have exactly the kind of parliamentary democracy we chose as such, our MPs represent their constituents and can be expected to act in our best interests and respond to our requests, lobbying or petitions. That's democracy too. so 'suck it up'.

For the 'move on' crowd, where is it you suggest we move on to? What is it you think should happen now, beyond leaving the EU. What 'control' which you were desperate for will you exercise? What do you want to do? What do you imagine will happen that will improve life for us?

This referendum is a case of ask a stupid question, get a very stupid answer.

Purple unicorn please

ah I see, you want people to vote but then you want our MPs to ignore this and vote according to their principles?

Can you see a problem with this? Undemocratic?

[img] [/img]

ah I see, you want people to vote but then you want our MPs to ignore this and vote according to their principles?

Can you see a problem with this? Undemocratic?

I want the MPs to do what they think is best for the country, it's why we have a parliament, it's why they are our representatives. We voted for them and they are individually responsible. Entirely democratic.

This is a valid argument

Jefferson talks about the need for 'educated citizenry' and whilst i would not call the voting population uneducated, I think many were uninformed or lied to and an uninformed poll is not democracy.

We seem to have one or two generations now with no political engagement or understanding, or less capacity to understand the implications of political actions beyond the short term

But as a disappointed remain voter, so is this:

arguing that we should now try to nullify the result of a democratically held referendum because we don't like the outcome is exactly the sort of crap people didn't like about Europe.

We as a divided (and diminished) nation need to figure out how to do this and do it as well as we can rather than trying to further alienate and disenfranchise a huge section of our populace by ignoring their opinion because we "know better".

I'm not in the "suck it up" camp, but I'm struggling to see how we can square the circle and move forward without it becoming increasingly fractious and destabilising. And I can certainly see no one even on the fringes of the political leadership campaigns with the integrity, courage and vision to achieve it either.

And god only knows what might get sucked to the top in this particular vacuum.

26% blue unicorn, 26% red red unicorn. 48% Stick with the horse we've got.

Just spend billions of pounds strapping a horn on the horse, renaming it a unicorn, and pretending the 52% got what they wanted.

screwing the economy, trade, the people, the future and a united progressive Europe

Indeed, and since doing that will be far more electorally harmful than ignoring[1] the finely balanced referendum result, it won't happen.

Article 50 will not be invoked.

So relax. Stop the hysteria.

[1] Perhaps the ignoring will need to be spun a bit to make it look like 'not ignoring' but none the less, it will be ignored.

ah I see, you want people to vote but then you want our MPs to ignore this and vote according to their principles?

Can you see a problem with this? Undemocratic?

As I said above, it seems the only reason Leave can now put forward is "we won the referendum".

The unwillingness to address the subsequent backtracking by their campaign leaders is not going unnoticed.

[quote="Pawsy_Bear"]ah I see, you want people to vote but then you want our MPs to ignore this and vote according to their principles?

Can you see a problem with this? Undemocratic?Well, not really. For a democracy to work the people need to be adequately educated to understand what they are voting for. Going by whats been trending on google.co.uk since the Leave result, i'd put quite a significant amount of cash on them not understanding, or fact checking by using the daily mail.

One snippet that springs to mind is an Asmiov quote that a colleague used a few weeks ago in relation to something else altogether, “Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”

Democracy seems to be too dangerous a toy for us lot to be allowed to play with.

If you saw a toddler with a loaded gun, you'd take it off of them.

This makes me feel sick to the core - you either have democracy and the gullible screw up everyone's lives including their own, or you do the 'right' thing and ignore the gullible.

I can't get my head around the Strength Through Ignorance Britain.

A nation that now seems to model itself on kamikaze pilots, because blind self-harm is now seen as desirable to prove a point.

ah I see, you want people to vote but then you want our MPs to ignore this and vote according to their principles?

Can you see a problem with this? Undemocratic?

We as a divided (and diminished) nation need to figure out how to do this and do it as well as we can rather than trying to further alienate and disenfranchise a huge section of our populace by ignoring their opinion because we "know better

I think this starts with anyone from the leave camp either at political level or at individual (forum) level demonstrating to us that there is a rational reason for leaving and that there is a vision or plan of what to do when we leave. otherwise. If they are unable to do this, and those who voted remain are able to do so, then the evidence is that remainers do / did in fact 'know better'.

So please, put the debate to bed, let any of the leavers here come forward to explain their vision and we can start to 'move on'

And TBH, reading some of the stuff on here, and face book, and the internet at large does make me think we need a staged voting progress. Starting off with multiple choice questions about the facts as they actually are, instead of how the politicians spin them.

Indeed, and since doing that will be far more electorally harmful than ignoring[1] the finely balanced referendum result, it won't happen.

Article 50 will not be invoked.

So relax. Stop the hysteria.

[1] Perhaps the ignoring will need to be spun a bit to make it look like 'not ignoring' but none the less, it will be ignored.

So please, put the debate to bed, let any of the leavers here come forward to explain their vision and we can start to 'move on'

Give them time, as soon as they write something it gets taken off the list by one of the bosses

Why not just limit voting on important issues like this to party members?

[img] [/img]

CharlieMungus - Member

I want the MPs to do what they think is best for the country, it's why we have a parliament, it's why they are our representatives. We voted for them and they are individually responsible. Entirely democratic.

They could have course have done this before the referendum, and told us that no, it's dangerous to give "a toddler a loaded gun" and tabled a motion to prevent the referendum being held. In practice you're wanting them to decide it was a silly idea after we've shot ourselves dig the bullet out and make everything back the way it was.

Their ignorance is I'm afraid to say no less valid than your knowledge. The political classes of this and many other countries had, until last Thursday, a vested interest in keeping us stupid. The failure is in not educating, in cultivating apathy and alienating people from the democratic process. It isn't the "fault" of the electorate when the explanation of the system they're given is "it's too complicated you wouldn't understand" and "that's just the way it is".

We should, I thoroughly agree, be making our opinions known to our MP and asking them to represent us, we should be holding them to account and demanding the sort of settlement we reach with the EU. But the way forward is categorically not backwards.

The referendum saw the largest voter turn-out in my voting life, we should take the positives (and there are not many) from this and use this to engage with people to motive and re-enfranchise,to involve people and develop a society in which people feel they are represented and believe politics is something which involves them rather than just effecting them.

The lesson to be learned from this debacle is painful but,if it wakes people up to the reality of their responsibility that's a good thing, if it makes people hold our politicians to account that's a good thing, if it makes us think "what will they do? Will they help me? Is this in my interest and the interest of my children" rather than crossing the box next to their favourite colour once every five years that's a good thing. If it means we end up years from now with a choice of good candidates rather than least worst that's a very good thing indeed.

It pains me to say it but these are things a remain vote wouldn't achieve in my life time. They are things which not enacting article 50 will do more to prevent that it will to encourage.

The financial losses are inevitable, but markets do founder and fall also inevitable is that they do recover. (and I hope they do so sooner not later as like many my job is distinctly at risk.)

We can try and make something of this,to go forward, to make ourselves better or we can squabble and fight and make a bad situation worse, taking what hope there is and swap it for a smug sense of satisfaction as Rome burns and we play or fiddle having told everyone this is what will happen.

This country that the leavers want back, it's a country with an unwritten constitution which has evolved through 300 years of fudge, muddle and compromise. This is supposed to be one of its primary virtues. The same goes for the body we are presently trying to extricate ourselves from. There is no precedent in UK history, nor the history of the EU, for leaping off the edge of a cliff in this fashion. I guess that's why the Scottish independence referendum panned out in the way it did, and why the next one, if there is one, will probably do the same.

I can't see that either body is going to change that, despite the fact that all parties are presently reeling from the vote and waiting for the dust to settle on its implications.

Such a cruel paradox - When in earnest1 the notion that 'out' is attributable to a lack of education or intelligence ..

I voted remain, I wholeheartedly want to remain and I think leaving will be a financial and moral disaster for the reasons some leavers want to leave.

I'll send the letter, but what I DON'T want to happen is for the Commons to reject the referendum - we cannot have 17m people getting off their arse and voting for a thing and then be seen to be ignoring them, that will make things worse - there are lots of reasons why we find ourselves here, and voters feeling ignored by their Government is pretty near the top.

Equally, 16m people got off their arse and voted to maintain the status quo and I think most people on both sides will agree that the offering the Leave campaign gave has turned out be less than accurate - the NHS won't be getting £250m a week and there will be financial pain.

I don't want them to have a plan that makes 17m people happy, or 16m people happy because really it'll make 33m unhappy because the argument will only carry on and be louder and messier than ever.

What we need is a plan that can make 90% of the 33m happy.

Brexiters and Remainers, this is of course completely hypothetical but if our new Prime Minster offered a Hybrid Membership within the EU:

Reduced payments and equally reduced economic development money for the UK - say 50%.

Free movement of workers within the EU in exchange for membership of the free market, but limited to existing members, veto power over new member states and/or free moment for those member states.

Would that be enough for you to be happy?

Democracy doesn't always work:

[url= https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/apr/17/boaty-mcboatface-wins-poll-to-name-polar-research-vessel ]Boaty McBoatface[/url]

Brexiters and Remainers, this is of course completely hypothetical but if our new Prime Minster offered a Hybrid Membership within the EU:

Reduced payments and equally reduced economic development money for the UK - say 50%.

Free movement of workers within the EU in exchange for membership of the free market, but limited to existing members, veto power over new member states and/or free moment for those member states.

Would that be enough for you to be happy?

But all the actual evidence points toward it being a really bad idea

Which is worse though, Brexit or Jeremy C unt 😆

You just wont let it lie will you?

Well, no, not until this country returns to democratic rule; not novelty referundums that put decisions in the hands of the uneducated masses, NONE of whom I voted for…

Just to be clear, in the letter I postedi didn't ask for my mp to vote against the referendum. I only asked him to vote against if it was not in our interests to.

Important difference

There is still an outside chance that negotiations bring forth a path where it is in fact in our interest to leave (however personally I do not see where this is coming from at the moment)

However the title does, sorry for that, it's inaccurate

The failure is in not educating, in cultivating apathy and alienating people from the democratic process

I absolutely agree with this. Chickens have come home to roost. Not that it helps us with anything in the meantime.....

Chickens have come home to roost

put decisions in the hands of the uneducated masses

Quite right. We can't have hoi polloi having a say in anything.

😐

The failure is in not educating, in cultivating apathy and alienating people from the democratic process

Agree also. Would add to that a lack of support, financial and otherwise, for communities affected by the decline of heavy industry and /or those affected by migrant influx (I say this as someone who is pro-migration)

Their ignorance is I'm afraid to say no less valid than your knowledge.

The UK joined for trading not for handing over sovereignty, and definitely not to be ruled over by unelected self-serving cretins. And still you fools bleat on about democracy after losing a democratic vote. If it wasn't so pathetic it would be funny.