[Closed] Get your dancing on grave boots ready

They'll still manage fine and be happy.

You know, over the last 20 yrs or so we've fostered 24 kids [& adopted one of them] if you really think that the bulk of those kids have the same opportunities as you [or I] have/had, I think you must live on the moon

You're that dense, I really don't think I'll bother responding any more to you - bye

Since Hora's turned up, I've pretty much lost interest in this thread tbh. The sun is shining, and life's too short to waste arguing with the likes of Surf-Mat and Hora, over the faults of society. Bit like trying to ride yer bike with busted tyres....

All the hard worker folk however get on with it, move to where the work is and pay through the nose in mortgage/insurance policies etc etc to help support the economy.

if you really think that the bulk of those kids have the same opportunities as you [or I] have/had,

but that was down to their own ****up parents/parenting skill-void.

However someone who pays £45 a week rent yet works will NEVER want to leave such a cushy home number that has all the maintanence etc paid for.

hora - Member

"if you really think that the bulk of those kids have the same opportunities as you [or I] have/had, "

but that was down to their own **** parents/parenting skill-void.

True to some extent but it still means the child does not have equality of opportunity.

Surf-Mat I'm hoping your reference to Bobby McFerrin (with his historical opposition to right wing politics) is a nod to the well crafted troll you've displayed here, and not further evidence of ignorance?

but that was down to their own **** parents/parenting skill-void.

go on then, father dead, mother in latter stages of terminal cancer - what did they do wrong

no they do not have the financial resources to take advantage of the rights they have.

I have stated my point and I fully accept some people cannot afford this and that and the other

not being rude like but what is the point in that point? Life isn't like that as has been pointed out many many times above. I completely agree with your point, it's just the world doesn't work in an ideal way. So, accepting your point, what do we do with that information?

Will you stop bringing it back to financial ability

Will you stop bringing it back to financial reality

Fixed that for you.

go on then, father dead, mother in latter stages of terminal cancer - what did they do wrong

24 times? Thats harsh isn't it?

A council house should be for life then folks?

Thing is on STW these arguments never get anywhere as there are clearly two camps;

The Poor/rich who still have hope in living.
The Poor/rich who are embittered by life.

If you really want to succeed it is possible to rise above your social background, I can think of at least 10 people I know well who are now
successful professional people. I grew up with them in Brixton/Streatham in the 70's fair to say that back then it was a proper shithole. We had riots, high immigration, shite schools, hefty unemployment and they were all from working class backgrounds every factor that would appeat to mean that we were destined to fail. We were all "estate" kids too. Most of them are in the "real" professions.

The common factor is that we are all foreigners Asian, Black and Arab and our parents ruled with a rod of iron. Whatever we were surrounded by wasn't what we were going to be. I think that is where lots of people fall down these days - Shite parenting skills and no discipline it's the job of parents to sort their kids not the state.

I lived on less than £10 per week for two months at uni

that just about sums up the thatcher supporters of this thread and their total and utter denial of reality..

did you live on that..? HOW did you cope you poor little bear!? my goodness.. and mum and dad couldn't help you out? for two whole months..!!?

oh how you've ****in suffered.. I bet that scarred you.. it must have for you to even recall such an horrific ordeal... do you want a cuddle little lamb..?

I am disgusted by the ignorance of some people... I can't read this any longer as it makes me want to weep at the deluded arrogance of it all..

EAT THE RICH

24 times? Thats harsh isn't it?

no Hora, as you well know that was an example, the last one we looked after

Now, are you going to answer the question?
What did her parents do wrong?

The common factor is that we are all foreigners Asian, Black and Arab

Racist. 😛

Again though - a few case studies doesn't change the economic reality for the vast majority of people.

mastiles_fanylion - Member

"no they do not have the financial resources to take advantage of the rights they have."

Will you stop bringing it back to financial ability - I have stated my point and I fully accept some people cannot afford this and that and the other - that is always going to happen as we can't all be equally well off

And its an unfortunate fact that financial wellbeing affects your opportunities

Please explain to me how a single mum in a council house is going to be able to get her kid into the good school from another area. She cannot move house to do so. You can. So your kids get opportunities that hers do not

Just one simple and obvious case

Joolsburger - things have changed since then. How many of them could not afford to go to uni now?

My partner went to university from a working class background. She would not have gone if the rules then are as they are now. Neither a borrower nor a lender be.

hora - embittered Member

I fundamentally disagree with your posts on this so I have updated your membership status.

There is a lot of this going on here (not that I'm surprised ...)

[img] [/img]

1/24. Less than 4% of your sample study you used as your sweeping-example?

hora - embittered Member

I'm as disgusted with your use of capital letters as I am with my grasp of basic mathematics.

I find the whole 'let's all go out and celebrate when she dies' bollox, pathetic, childish, and a sign of political immaturity.

Most of them couldn't afford uni then! Parents saved every penny and went without so they didn't. It is I believe statisically correct to say that Asians especially do significantly better in education and it's not an accident that they do. Of course the University fee structure is shocking but it's being driven in no small part by the requirement for everyone to go to uni when most or many would be better suited to apprenticeships etc. Universities used to educate the gifted now they run courses in nonsense paid for by the taxpayer at expense we cant afford.

My view is that lots of people seem to think that they are in some way owed something by dint of being born in this country and the world simply doesn't work that way.

1/24. Less than 4% of your sample study you used as your sweeping-example?

Hora, that 4% [as you put it] was probably one of the milder situations -
your brains really are brand new aren't they?
I suspect your life expectancy has already passed your I.Q. [going in opposite directions] so I'll save you further embarrassment

Uplink, do you mean 'brand new' in a similar way to the emperor's 'brand new' clothes? 😆

Julesburger. You got considerably more support in the 70s at university than you do now. it was perfectly possible to be from a poor family and graduate without debts or support from your parents. My girlfriend did. it is not possible now

Please explain to me how a single mum in a council house is going to be able to get her kid into the good school from another area. She cannot move house to do so. You can. So your kids get opportunities that hers do not

But it still doesn't alter the fact she has the right to.

MF - so her child does not have the opportunity yours do = inequality of opportunity

But it still doesn't alter the fact she has the right to.

Surely having a 'right' must in some way infer the ability to exercise it?

You're that dense, I really don't think I'll bother responding any more to you - bye

Well done for the fostering - amazing but as for not responding any more - who are you exactly? I cannot recall your username?

Please explain to me how a single mum in a council house is going to be able to get her kid into the good school from another area. She cannot move house to do so. You can. So your kids get opportunities that hers do not

Thats true but they did their degrees between 86-2002. The point still stands, a strong family behind you makes a hell of a difference.

So now most people here hate those with a bit of money AND a supportive family?

Dammit, beginning to wish I'd started out as a penniless orphan just so I can fit in.

But it still doesn't alter the fact she has the right to.

Surely having a 'right' must in some way infer the ability to exercise it?

An example, to point out the absurdity - and [b][i]distaste[/i][/b] of this argument...

Would it be appropriate for someone from a black, asian, or any other ethnic background, to be called a f*king *@37#[insert whatever demeaning racial slur] in their workplace?

After all, they have the right not to be subjected to racial discrimination in the workplace - but perhaps they work for one of the public bodies previouslly assessedas being institutionally racist.

But they've got the [i]right[/i], so its ok, yes?

... or is it the reality that important?

joolsburger - Member

Thats true but they did their degrees between 86-2002. The point still stands, a strong family behind you makes a hell of a difference.

You did say 70s in your original post

I do suspect tho that those who had little money but who did degrees when there was more support for people with no money would be less likely to go to university now

mastiles_fanylion - Member

But it still doesn't alter the fact she has the right to.

As a man of Harrogate, I'm sure you'll be able to confirm that my son has a right to go to Harrogate Ladies College then?
They seem to do well in OFSTED stuff etc & it seems well regarded, & I'm betting that the perks aren't too bad for a young man

Surf-Mat - Member

So now most people here hate those with a bit of money AND a supportive family?

Like who
What many of us dislike is that being from a family that is both supportive and had a bit of money gives you an unfair advantage in life.

I am from exactly the sort of background you are. Nice and cosy middle class. I am certain that gave me an advantage in life but I don't call those less advantaged than me lazy and useless

"Dammit, beginning to wish I'd started out as a penniless orphan just so I can fit in."

So do I; so you can learn something about empathy and humility two qualities you clearly lack.

Please point out where I have called anyone lazy and useless...

I'm waiting...

I'm still waiting...

So now most people here hate those with a bit of money AND a supportive family?
Dammit, beginning to wish I'd started out as a penniless orphan just so I can fit in.

I don't think people in general have a problem with either thing. It's more how you justify your views I suspect.

So now most people here hate those with a bit of money AND a supportive family?

Mat, please tell me you're trolling? [i]Please?[/i]

So now [b]most people here[/b] hate those with a bit of money AND a supportive family?

Where in the name of the Sweet Little Baby Jesus of Nazareth did you get [i]that[/i] idea from?? 😯

You're wibbling nonsense now. Time for an afternoon nap, I'd say. It'll do you good. You'll wake up feeling refreshed and invigorated.

Oops.

So now most people here hate those with a bit of money AND a supportive family?

Are you really this much of a nob or are you just trolling?

Those with money have an "unfair" advantage.
Those with supportive families have an "unfair advantage"

Which is deemed unfair and so at the mercy of self righteous STWers who all grew up down a coal mine, working 150 hours a week for 1p a month and are therefore far far better qualified to make social observations that anyone else...

Is she not dead yet? I've polished my spats rather nicely.

So when we look back in 5 yrs time who will we hate most?

The idiots that created the mess this time round
Or those who were left to clear it up?

Surf-Mat you're taking this one too far now. You're starting to sound an utter prick. No one can interpret what others are saying so poorly, make such inflamatory and ignorant comments, display such a lack of conversational skills, yet get on with people from a variety of backgrounds in the real world.

Chapeau, it's been a good troll, but drop it now.

On a different note, I found my old 1991 Tag F1 watch last night. ****, its face is as small as a ladies watch compared to my latest watch 🙁

Surf-Mat - Member

Please point out where I have called anyone lazy and useless...

I'm waiting...

I'm still waiting...

Surf-Mat - Member

Now do the a similar group of people who are deeply unhappy - in some cases the reason for their discontent will be some horrible disaster. [b]For the rest they will simply blame everyone else for their state of mind - the government, their boss, anyone. [/b]

Surf-Mat - Member

Again, blame others if you can but I still back it up - you make your own luck in life. [b]Or you moan at others that do.[/b]

Surf-Mat - Member

BTW, my dad left school aged 16 and never received a penny of support from his parents. He's had ups from hard graft and major downs that to many "weren't his fault" (e.g late 80s recession) [b]- does he bleat and moan about how unfair things are?[/b] No he finds work and he gets paid for it. And always has done.

Surf-Mat - Member

matt..........how do you think you would cope in a nice terrace house in a nice pit village.
with you views on thatcher???

Why would I move to such a place?

You make your own luck in life -[b] moaning at others and venting rage because it's "someone else's fault" [/b]gets you nowhere.

........... what have I learnt? You make your own luck and you don't blame anyone else when/if it all goes to sh1t - which it has done plenty of times for me and my family.

I think the inference is fairly clear is it not?

Won't she just die?

As a man of Harrogate, I'm sure you'll be able to confirm that my son has a right to go to Harrogate Ladies College then?

I think the inference is fairly clear is it not?

Not it's not. I have no doubt many of these moaners work hard. That doesn't stop them moaning.
I have no doubt many of these moaners do useful things. That doesn't stop them moaning.

TSY - you are cross. That's what forums are for - debating things in which some get cross. You disagree, no need to have a heart seizure about it.

Same for ton too - he disagrees and now goes into full rage mode.

Life's too short ladies and gents. Stop moaning and get on with it. If all you can do it get angry, do something else.

If you can't provide a stable, supportive home and afford to raise a family in the way you'd like them raised don't have kids.

Life is both hard and cruel -- why does that surprise people??

Surf-Mat, I'm not cross. I'm despairing. I honestly thought you were trolling. 😆

If you can't provide a stable, supportive home and afford to raise a family in the way you'd like them raised don't have kids.

Even though more kids means linked-more benefits and possibly a bigger house?

The ****less aren't stupid. They know you'd dont get many 4bedroom houses on council estates so an easy way up the property ladder is to bang more money earners out..

Problem is alot of councils are keeping them squeezed in.

Funny how only the racist Mail has the balls to raise this topic.

surf Matt - its pretty clear to must of us. If people don't succeed than they are lazy moaners and its their own fault. That what you repeatedly say.

joolsburger - Member

...............
Life is both hard and cruel -- why does that surprise people??

Don't surprise me at all. I would like to see everyone get an equal opportunity regardless of their background tho.

Hora- shut up now you're just being silly. Either discuss the issues sensibly, or say nowt. Don't start ranting on about your own blinkered ignorant ill-informed prejudices.

And give me that watch. You owe me £60 anyway.

matt, never been in a full rage in my life.
people like you do get me close.
overprivalidged, cosseted, mollycoddled titty fed ****s with no idea about real life.

Ahh yes of course ton, you've had it SO tough that your opinions are ten times more valid?

Don't forget to vent your rage at those you consider to have had an unfair start in life. Or maybe you could do something about it? Or just be contented with your lot in life?

I can imagine you won't even talk to anyone you consider "privileged?" You pour scorn on them for being "****s." Far less waste of energy to get on with anyone IMO. No idea about life? Can you please justify that rather scathing and pathetic remark? No you can't can you? Because you feel hard done by. You've conveniently missed the bits about not having had a penny of support since I was 14. The numerous labouring jobs. The very long period of being utterly skint. No no no you are so blinded by your self pity and sense of unfairness aren't you? I'll give you unfair - you try losing a pefectly healthy baby 2 week before it's due because it's cord got knotted around it's neck. You try comforting your wife who has to carry a dead baby for two days before it's induced.

Now THAT IS UNFAIR. Not some bleating miserable sod who hates everything and everyone because he thinks he's had it tougher than them.

Well get off your fat arse and DO SOMETHING about it. Lose some weight, look for a better job, just DO SOMETHING rather than ranting at others.

Moan moan moan, unfair, bleat, moan.

Beer anyone?

I don't think beer would be a good idea in this here at the moment 😀

mollycoddled titty fed ****s

Ha ha! Quote of the month, surely??!?!

😆

Brilliant...

matt, i talk to all and sundry, but once in a while you come up against a **** who thinks himself better and above everyone, and you with your replies on the post have proven this.....
you are a ****. who thinks himself better than the rest. the worst kind of **** in my eyes.

Beer anyone?

I have a feeling you'd get glassed. 😆

In a rare moment I completely agee with ton, this forum harbours quite a few people like this, Ton at least you can be thankful they are not part of your circle of real life friends.. 🙄

I thought this was about stamping on a dead Baroness?

Thatchers fault, all this bad feeling and grumpiness....

Thatchers fault, all this bad feeling and grumpiness....

It is. It actually is.

I thought this was about stamping on a dead Baroness?

Everyone's getting impatient waiting for the match to start 😈

It is. It actually is.

It's the right time of year for effigies on bonfires, too 😆

nickf - Member

As for Thatcher, she may well be an irrelevance now, but the damage she did to the North-East is something I lived through and can never forgive.

You mean the death of unsustainable loss-making industries? The North East is a better place now than it ever was. I grew up there and lived through it - coal was a corpse that was being propped up by subsidies that would have never survived.

You're wibbling nonsense[b] now[/b].

at the mercy of self righteous STWers

"You mean the death of unsustainable loss-making industries? The North East is a better place now than it ever was. I grew up there and lived through it - coal was a corpse that was being propped up by subsidies that would have never survived."

Hahahhahhahhahhahhahhahhhahhhahahhahhahhhhahahahahahahahhahahhahha!!!

Have you ever been to Easington Colliery? Hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

Surf-matt - you have previously stated that you work in your wife's PR agency....

If we both applied for the position, assuming it had been advertised, if I was better suited, would I have got the job, or would your connections give you an 'unfair' advantage?

So 'success' is not all down to graft and determination, is it?? Some people have an 'unfair' advantage.

If someone gets shut out enough times by this kind of situation, or see it happen to those around them, they may become embittered? Maybe some of that is fueling the dislike of Thatcher?

Have you ever been to Easington Colliery?

It was a dump when coal was being mined - it is a dump now.

I think Surf-Mat is demonstrating the things I said earlier about Thatcher's legacy was one of selfishness, Mat's alright and f*ck the rest. Unfortunately he doesn't appear to realise that owning your own house and a bling BMW a tory boy does not make. You are not part of their club, you are being used by the tories to feather their own nests, and when you outgrow your usage, you will be sh4t on from a great height. They are taking the pi55 out of you and you don't realise it. 😉

coal was a corpse that was being propped up by subsidies that would have never survived."

IIRC wasnt it other fuels that got huge subsidies during that period. I recall Scargill saying if Coal had the same subsidies as NS Oil it could be mined and given away free and still turn a profit!
Coal may be dirty but if its employment is not replaced by something else then I suspect many communities would welcome its return.