[Closed] Gender privilege

any chance of repeating that in swahili?

I'm beginning to think Katie Hopkins was right when she said most women don't want equal treatment, they want special treatment.

Thus spoken like someone who doesn't understand what "equality" means. Sometimes providing equality requires special treatment.

Thus spoken like someone who doesn't understand what "equality" means. Sometimes providing equality requires special treatment.

Equality is not having to work 7 years longer because you were born with a winky rather than a hooha.

I'm beginning to think Katie Hopkins was right

I know you have a user name to live up to, but that's taking it a bit far...

cranberry - Member

Equality is not having to work 7 years longer because you were born with a winky rather than a hooha.

You don't have to work to retirement age and a man earns on average £300000 more than a woman over 52 years which could be used to retire earlier.

Providing equality can't mean specially treatment. Its all about being fair. Put in cyclists terms: Chris Hoy and you/me/ fat average cyclist both on the track. Is fair us both starting together and me getting to 100 metres when Sir Chris does the 250 or me being given a flying start and him being pushed away when I have 100 to go thus putting us over the lines at the same time. To me the former is fair, not the latter. If I object to, say, employees because they miss the bogs because they are a man or get grumpy once a month then that's my prerogative. To say its unfair is unfair on me surely? When a group wants equality it should be true equality. Eg same pensions and age. Equal!

Yes, but the wage gap is due to career gaps and choices of which industries/careers to go into, so that "average woman earns less" argument is due to lifestyle and career choices.

You can work as long as you want, but women shouldn't be legally entitled to a pension far younger than men. It is shocking sexism and there is simply no excuse for it.

*walts for geetee’s arrival*

legend - Member
*walts for geetee’s arrival*

Sustaining the human race isn't a "lifestyle choice". And it's not exclusively down to that either, earnings are not directly equivalent even where a woman has worked a career without gaps.

mattsccm - Member

Providing equality can't mean specially treatment. Its all about being fair.

But if you say no special treatment, let's be fair, you'll never correct an existing unfairness. Just getting a level playing field isn't enough when up til now you've been playing on a slope.

the gender pay gap is unfair
WOmen retiring earlier is unfair [ and it was never an attempt to redress the gender pay gap and if it was it was a shit way of doing it]

two wrongs dont make a right.

& women live longer.

No reason for the pension age gap*

*Lots of women end up looking after an elderly relative. Then again lots of men work in massively physical jobs. Maybe there could be flexibility in the pension age?

i suspect that male footballers account for most of the overall pay gap between genders and between the rich and poor

legend - Member
*walts for geetee’s arrival*
I assumed this thread was an attempt to wear out his keyboard.

Or else to make him explode with frustration being unable to join in knowing the pasting he’ll take.

Anyway - Chris Hoy set off up the road 10 minutes before me, but now we’re both pedalling so it’s fair.

Cranberry succinctly sums it up. Society is full of "equality when it suits us" nonsense.

utter bollox

There is a group of women - MRs tj is one who had their retirement age raised by 7 years with 5 years notice. Men had their retirement age raised by two years. If you cannot understand why this is unfair then I pity you. Phased in over a longer time - fair. to make someone in their mid 50s approaching retirement work another 7 years for their pension is simply wrong.

Yep. The aim of equalizing it is fair. Suddenly changing it with little notice is not. A more phased approach would have been better.

You all know that all this retirement pish is all unfair, right?

We're getting shafted and we all seem to be happily taking it.

But squabble among yourselves, that'll fix it.

[quote=scotroutes ]Yep. The aim of equalizing it is fair. Suddenly changing it with little notice is not. A more phased approach would have been better.

Agreed but they are separate issues and we were discussing whether both genders should retire at the same age - well it what i thought we were.

If you cannot understand why this is unfair then I pity you

Getting to equality is uncomfortable for those who lose their privilege.

Yep. The aim of equalizing it is fair. Suddenly changing it with little notice is not. A more phased approach would have been better.

Nail on head.

scotroutes - Member

Yep. The aim of equalizing it is fair. Suddenly changing it with little notice is not. A more phased approach would have been better.

well said
#
Mrs TJ would have no issue with that. for some women the notice period was well under five years

I don't know how to 'do' images on an ipad, so someone will have to help me out with the equality vs equity image that's probably due about now...

Well at least it's something later generations won't have to worry about. Work till you die, true equality.

When the lads in here take even the slightest action on making women more equal then they can have their opinions...

If I go to a wedding ,a funeral or a posh restaurant (even if it’s on a tropical island) I have to encase all my body in clothing. From my toes to the noose around my neck.
Ladies don’t have to.
That’s an equality I would like.

[quote=zippykona ]If I go to a wedding ,a funeral or a posh restaurant (even if it’s on a tropical island) I have to encase all my body in clothing. From my toes to the noose around my neck.
Ladies don’t have to.
That’s an equality I would like.

Wear a kilt?

My wife never goes to the bar, even when she pays she still makes me go.
We'll never get proper gender equality until attitudes like this are changed!!

why zippy? Why do you have to do this?

eit - and the ladies dress can only be worn to one wedding. You probably only have one suit you wear time and time again 😉

I don't know how to 'do' images on an ipad, so someone will have to help me out with the equality vs equity image that's probably due about now...

why zippy? Why do you have to do this?

I always thought "The Krypton Factor" was a bit unfair.
If you were a fat knacker you got a big head start on the assault course. They never gave the thick ones loads of free points in the knowledge bit.

There is a group of women - MRs tj is one who had their retirement age raised by 7 years with 5 years notice.

No there isn’t. The rise in the age at which women can claim the State Pension to be the same as men, i.e. 65 was passed into law in the late 1990s and it was well advertised at the time. Thats almost twenty years and was deliberately phased to be as slow as possible to ease the change. It is wrong to state that it was done over a period of seven years. Claiming ignorance of this fact is laughable too. This is a change that didn’t affect me but I and many others were well aware of it.

Why is ignorance laughable. I had no idea but why should I?
Face it. Currently if you are in anyway "thought" to be a minority you at favoured.
As a white, married, heterosexual, employed, married, non child owning, working, motorcycling , shooting, fit and able male I am in the most discriminated class there is. I get nothing. Now that's not fair. Need means bugger all.

yes research does indeed show straight white men to be the most persecuted group in in society right now

The claim that it “wasn’t well advertised” and “we didnae know” is laughable. Not knowing is I’m afraid not an excuse that is accepted in any other part of life so I don’t see why it should be accepted here.

Oh and too be clear as a straight white male I do not think of myself as either a minority or discriminated against.

As a white, married, heterosexual, employed, married, non child owning, working, motorcycling , shooting, fit and able male I am in the most discriminated class there is. I get nothing. Now that's not fair.

Dry your eyes princess.

The claim that it “wasn’t well advertised” and “we didnae know” is laughable. Not knowing is I’m afraid not an excuse that is accepted in any other part of life so I don’t see why it should be accepted here.

Ignorance is bliss and an excuse for a latte?

As a white, married, heterosexual, employed, married, non child owning, working, motorcycling , shooting, fit and able male I am in the most discriminated class there is. I

Hmmmm tomorrow-
Me out of bed at 5 drive to airport on plane 8.30 to the south, 1 hour in Taxi, 7 hour workshop to deliver back in taxi back on plane home 10pm

The other person - may rise at 9 coffee bit of TV, lunch, walk the dog.... to fair I will have a sandwich awaiting me....

That people is equality...

There will be gender equality when men decide there will be. That's never going to happen though as for too many it would be like turkeys voting for Christmas. Anyways, most woman would shit themselves if they woke up next week and found themselves with true equality, not the kind they get to pick and choose.

Anyways, most woman would shit themselves if they woke up next week and found themselves with true equality, not the kind they get to pick and choose.

What utter nonsense and sexist bullshine. this is precisely the sort of mansplaining that creates sexisim

Lol the men are revolting on thread... What sort of equality are they going to be upset about? Earnings, sexism, harassment, abuse, being overlooked for jobs in case they get pregnant?

gonfishin - simply wrong I am afraid.

What utter nonsense and sexist bullshine. this is precisely the sort of mansplaining that creates sexisim

I was about to say something similar but it's probably better coming from a man than from me.
Those of you complaining vaguely about sexism against men, explain what "all women" are apparently doing wrong rather than moaning about your partners having an easier job. Maybe try to be a bit more grateful that we juggle having babies and working, and perhaps be grateful that many more of us are in higher education, and working in science and medicine these days after decades of it not apparently being appropriate for women.

gonfishin

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-conference-womens-retirement-age-lowered-64-debbie-abrahams-waspi-a7965196.html

http://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/CBP-7405

vickypea
Fortunatly these dinosaur head in sand poor little men types are dying out. Can't happen too soon

Vicky - a lot of men fully appreciate the challenges that women face and recognise the real value in the roles of being a mother and “manager” of the household in addition to working in some cases. You may find that it’s a certain body of women who look down and degrade those incredibly valuable contributions that women make to happy and successful families and children. So please don’t tar us all with the same brush

I actively encouraged Mrs THM to focus on changing her career to focus on what she enjoyed doing (music) rather than high-flying 😉 career and so that she could enjoy being a mother fully. She’s brilliant at it. I am very very lucky too.

Not everyone is a dinosaur, acting inappropriately and then blaming the female victim in question. Plenty of men respect women and treat them appropriately

TJ the initial change was made in 1995. It was speeded up in 2011 and then increased for both men and women after that but the initial change happened 22 years ago. N.B. This is the age at which one can claim the state pension it is not necessarily the age at which you can retire. That can happen before or after this age.

It is also true that a different state pension age for men and women cannot be justified, unless of course you want to use life expectancies…

Fortunatly these dinosaur head in sand poor little men types are dying out. Can't happen too soon

Yep I don't know any in real life. They just pop up here occasionally but thankfully are far outweighed by more modern thinking men.

My wife has a very successful "high flying" job. She's bloody good at it too. She's due to have our first child in 4 months, then she'll have a year off before I quit or massively reduce my less well paid, less important jobs and take over the child rearing while she goes back to her career. Neither of us expect to retire before 70 and neither of us expect, nor have we knowingly received, special treatment.
The entitled attitude on some of you is ridiculous. 99% of women aren't asking for special treatment, they're just asking for a fair go. Now, occasionally, women may have to be given "special treatment" temporarily in certain situations in order for them to have a fair go. If you can't understand that then you are part of the problem, not the solution.
As for straight white males being victims of discrimination...
😆

****ing idiots.

As always (and shown in this thread), those with privilege don't know they have it and assume any positives in their life are based on what they have done and not the privilege they have been lucky to have (race, gender, money, family etc,.)

mansplaining

Even funnier when [s]a cuck[/s] an 'enlightened' bloke uses the term. 😆

Men who use the term mansplanning non ironically are the same type of men who have man caves (the only bit of their homes they have any say over), have to ask permission from their partners before going out and probably pee sitting down.

Even funnier when [s]a cuck[/s] an 'enlightened' bloke uses the term.

You've not even got a reasonable argument, just veiled insults. How is calling someone who respects women a cuck any different from being called a (sorry mods) "n***er lover" back in less "enlightened" times?

Teamhurtmore- I completely agree with you! I'm certainly not tarring all men with the same brush, I spend a lot of time with male friends partly because of all the MTB I do. I tried to make my comment directed as "those men who vaguely complain about sexism against men" but I'm sorry if that wasn't clear.

Equality is not having to work 7 years longer because you were born with a winky rather than a hooha.

When a group wants equality it should be true equality. Eg same pensions and age. Equal!

Hmmmm tomorrow-
Me out of bed at 5 drive to airport on plane 8.30 to the south, 1 hour in Taxi, 7 hour workshop to deliver back in taxi back on plane home 10pm
The other person - may rise at 9 coffee bit of TV, lunch, walk the dog.... to fair I will have a sandwich awaiting me....
That people is equality...

most woman would shit themselves if they woke up next week and found themselves with true equality,

This, all of this.

those with privilege don't know they have it

The privilege of being a man seems is all about work, which isn't a privilege it's a chore.

The privilege of being a woman seems to be spending weekdays doing things they want to do and drinking Costa Coffee with friends. Which, surprisingly doesn't pay as much as work. There are very few men IME who would say no if their wife said “You give up work, I'll get a proper job”.

Men who use the term mansplanning non ironically are the same type of men who have man caves (the only bit of their homes they have any say over), have to ask permission from their partners before going out and probably pee sitting down.

Which I suspect might be all of us. 🙁

She's due to have our first child in 4 months, then she'll have a year off before I quit or massively reduce my less well paid, less important jobs and take over the child rearing while she goes back to her career.

Is that what she told you? Sucker. 😀

Vickypea, Your comment was perfectly clear, it just had selective reading applied to it.

The privilege of being a man seems is all about work, which isn't a privilege it's a chore.

Whereas the privilege of being a woman is to be able to do most of the domestic chores which, unlike work, don’t provide pay or career progression.

I’d say some of the views on this thread are Neanderthal, but that’s unfair on Neanderthals.

And the idea that I, as a white male heterosexual, am in any way disadvantaged by society is so delusional to be laughable.

In our shop the Saturday before Mothering Sunday is the busiest day of the year.
Dads will come in with flowers and buy even more gifts.
For Father’s Day the mums come in and choose our smallest box of chocolates and fill it with all the ones she likes as “ he won’t care”.
We used to sell a small teddy in an aeroplane . The small boys would be instantly attracted to it and start playing with it. They would be told to put it down. The young girls would see the pink unicorn cuddle it and most times mum would buy it.
I work with ladies and they all have grandsons. A scan has revealed that a granddaughter is on the way.
They’ve told me that every woman really wants a little girl.

Whereas the privilege of being a woman is to be able to do most of the domestic chores which, unlike work, don’t provide pay or career progression.

I'm pretty sure couples typically share domestic tasks but even if they don't domestic tasks aren't a 55 hour a week commitment, very few blokes are thinking "Great, I can work full time which allows me to avoid domestic chores.".

For Father’s Day the mums come in and choose our smallest box of chocolates and fill it with all the ones she likes as “ he won’t care”.

Which is true. Blokes are pretty easy going about presents or lack thereof.

women are good at some things, men at others, I couldn't be a firefighter but plenty women put their lives on the line every day.

If you can walk the walk then everyone gets the same, you can't just stamp your feet because of what's between your legs when it suits and play the gender card when it doesn't

TJ your own link disproves your claim

The Pensions Act 1995 provided for the State Pension age (SPA) for women to increase from 60 to 65 over the period April 2010 to 2020. The Coalition Government legislated in the Pensions Act 2011 to accelerate the latter part of this timetable, starting in April 2016 when women’s SPA was 63 so that it will now reach 65 in November 2018

Essentially prove this claim

Mrs tj is one who had their retirement age raised by 7 years with 5 years notice.

TJ your own link disproves your claim

The Pensions Act 1995 provided for the State Pension age (SPA) for women to increase from 60 to 65 over the period April 2010 to 2020. The Coalition Government legislated in the Pensions Act 2011 to accelerate the latter part of this timetable, starting in April 2016 when women’s SPA was 63 so that it will now reach 65 in November 2018

Essentially prove this claim

Mrs tj is one who had their retirement age raised by 7 years with 5 years notice.

I think it will be difficut primarily because its not what actually happened.

try to be a bit more grateful that we juggle having babies and working, and perhaps be grateful That many more of us are in higher education, and working in science and medicine these days after decades of it not apparently being appropriate for women.

most people are in higher education before they have children
sex does not determine access to higher education
I gave up a career in science that was higher paid than my wife's to look after the kids
science isn't a gender specific job. at no point have I ever thought if only that prof was a man.
woman tend to look after the children because they have the boobies and they don't want to go back to work. Most the female scientists and medics I know are working part time even though their kids are older now.

When I did my undergraduate degree 20 years ago 2/3 of the class were female. I was the only bloke in the lab when I did my PhD (not including my supervisor).

I'm pretty sure couples typically share domestic tasks but even if they don't domestic tasks aren't a 55 hour a week commitment, very few blokes are thinking "Great, I can work full time which allows me to avoid domestic chores.".

You've not even got a reasonable argument, just veiled insults. How is calling someone who respects women a cuck any different from being called a (sorry mods) "n***er lover" back in less "enlightened" times?

I'm making an obvious observation and the only insults on this thread are coming from those peddling this flawed narrative. 😆

is Mrs Troll letting you online tonight enfht?
[img] [/img]

The privilege of being a man seems is all about work, which isn't a privilege it's a chore.

The privilege of being a woman seems to be spending weekdays doing things they want to do.......

Okay, so you don't understand privilege. How your relationships are setup has nothing to do with privilege. If you don't think your relationships have equality/seem fair then that is your problem to sort out.

perhaps your projecting your situation on others

Typical amongst my friends and aquaintances.

You know I’ve tried to make relatively informed points based on the facts of how the state pension age has actually changed. It does however rather seem that there are people determined to make derogatory comments and indulge in Whataboutery which is rather sad.

I di not think my points were me being a dinosaur and Junkyard I don’t believe that TJs comment was specifically addressed to me. Happy to be corrected though.

The privilege of being a woman seems to be spending weekdays doing things they want to do and drinking Costa Coffee with friends. Which, surprisingly doesn't pay as much as work.

You obviously have a very limited experience of women.

The privilege of being a man seems is all about work, which isn't a privilege it's a chore.

The privilege of being a woman seems to be spending weekdays doing things they want to do.......

Okay, so you don't understand privilege.

So men are privileged a way that so subtle not everyone understands it. Doesn't sound like much of a privilege!

So men are privileged a way that so subtle not everyone understands it. Doesn't sound like much of a privilege!

A hundred years ago millions of men took full advantage of the privilege of being slaughtered in the trenches.
Yes that war was caused by men willy waving but other men paid the price.

"A hundred years ago"...What's your point?