[Closed] for Woppit - a matter of faith

As a militant atheist .... I like that

Nicely done.

I have often wondered if everything we see and know about is a dream that you have whilst you are still in the womb. Then one day you're born, but you'd still remember everything and still be you. So delivery wards would be full of babies talking to each other about what they'd experienced. If everyone's dream was sufficiently diverse that world would be a pretty crazy place..

Religion .. Still a load of tosh though

As a child in the womb there is a lot of evidence that mother is there, sounds, movement? If we are to suspend disbelief that the children can talk to each other then they would hear and understand mothers voice also, leaving them in no doubt.

I have yet to hear God's voice.

I appear to have accidentally logged in to Facebook.

Er toys.. I don't think you're supposed to be trying to take the story apart. It's simply an illustration, and a nice one too.

An illustration of what? Its religous propaganda. What I am supposed to do is surely up to me?

Cougar. 😆

If we take Yunkis point, that he only dreams in science, but this made him feel differently, it is a bit of tosh really as the babies would eb basing their belief on their observations, and how they interpreted them. So if they could talk and hear, they woudl hear mummys vocie talklign about when they come out.

I have yet to hear God's voice.

you iz not takin enuff mushrooms blaad

cougar and toys - you are philistines, philosophy is obviously not your cuppa

I didn't have a point, hence I stated that it made me smile.. it hasn't changed my view, it just made me smile..

Yunki, this is not philosophy, I think you will find any skeptic rationalist such as me (and cougar I think) will have a firm grasp of philosophy. Do you even know what the word means?

I have often wondered if everything we see and know about is a dream that you have whilst you are still in the womb

Oh right so much like the Bible its not real then and doe snot stand up to actual analysis 😉

Nice story mind but religion is still bobbins

Do you even know what the word means?

oh piss off you mumpy eejut..

From wiki - Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental problems, such as those connected with reality, existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language.

skeptic rationalist such as me

you sound more like a petulant wee boy this morning... that can't spell

Yunki from wikipedia (it had pictures so it must be true)

Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental problems, such as those connected with reality, existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language.Philosophy is distinguished from other ways of addressing such problems by its critical, generally systematic approach and [b]its reliance on rational argument.[/b]

[url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skepticism ]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skepticism[/url]

See here for how it is spelt.

And please try not to be rude, I was only joining the discussion. I think resorting to insult is a sign of frustration. Perhaps you would like to have a discussion?

Ah, so it's an early start for the ritualistic weekly STW religion argument... I can already see the 800+ posts that lead absolutely nowhere. 😉

Love Yunki's story though.

EDIT: Oh, and the Wiki definition of philosophy! How Plato, Rousseau and Heidegger managed to define themselves pre-Wiki I'll never know.

cougar and toys - you are philistines, philosophy is obviously not your cuppa

I have no issues with philosophy, it's twaddle I'm not keen on.

oh piss off you mumpy eejut..

Fear leads to anger; anger leads to hate; hate leads to a couple of days off the forum. Play nicely.

its reliance on rational argument.

twaddle

meh..

rulebook schmulebook.. 🙄

fear

why are folk afraid to think abstractly..?

there's some on here that get their knickers in a real twist about it.. even if it's other folk doing it..

toys19 - Member
Yunki, this is not philosophy, I think you will find any skeptic rationalist such as me (and cougar I think) will have a firm grasp of philosophy. Do you even know what the word means?

I'm a skeptic too so count me in. The only time I've ever believed way probably in the womb, soon as I'd matured to 3 years I dismissed the man made nonsense

rulebook schmulebook..

Kwality comeback, I'm beaten.

I appear to have accidentally logged in to Facebook.

Cougar that's brilliantly and hysterically satirical. 😀

Pretty mawkish stuff, and not even a good allegory for religious belief in life after death.

Toys - I'm not trying to beat you mate.. I have no interest in doing that..
And I'm not trying to recruit people to a religious cult.. I'm as agnostic as the next man

I'm just posting an interesting and sentimental passage that I saw this morning (yes on facebook.. 🙄 )

I meant no offence, my heartfelt apologies go out to the sneering few.. 😀

yunki.
Fair enough. I wasn't trying to be miserable, I genuinely felt compelled to pull it apart as it really had no meaning.

I'm not sure I desrved to be insulted though?

yunki - Member
I'm just posting an interesting and sentimental passage that I saw this morning

What's it sentimental about? It's just an awful analogy attempting to make atheism look like an obviously flawed position. But it's bobbins.

I just thought it was quite creative that's all..

it made me grin, sorry that it made some angry
not my intention at all..

Yunki, I havent got angry, so far the only anger I have seen is you getting angry with me.

do you even know what the word means?

I was quite insulted by that comment.. as I believe was your intention..

I think it snowballed from there
I can't help myself once the fur starts flying 😀

I appear to have accidentally logged in to Facebook.

Hit like if you love your mother.

cougar and toys - you are philistines, philosophy is obviously not your cuppa

I think I was questioning why you thought philosphy is not my thing, when in fact it is what drives my skepticism. It convinced me that you do not know what it means. Which you patently don't.

rulebook schmulebook..

we are all but yeast

Funnily enough, another STW thread has decended into a tit-fot-tat battle between internet personas.

Nearly enough to make a grown man flounce.

Cougar - Moderator

I appear to have accidentally logged in to Facebook.

😆

Nearly enough to make a grown man flounce.

Do we have any of those on here?

Not that I can see.

Not that I can see.

Blind faith. 😉

Which you patently don't.

what is the correct word then, in your experience, for the considering of ideas..?

Oh camo16, its not blind faith, its lack of evidence. Not return to a thread is not a sign of a flounce, there could be myriad reasons to not return. Flouncing is announcing.

Flouncing is announcing.

Awesome – I love that!

I've done some research

theology would seem a word perhaps less likely to incur the jeering wraith of the disciples of anal

So is theology not your cuppa then toys..? 8)

I've done some research

theology would seem a word perhaps less likely to incur the jeering wraith of the disciples of anal

So is theology not your cuppa then toys..?

Bang on yunki. Theology is not my cuppa. Spit. (although intelligent theologists often end up atheists, so it cannot be all bad)
On a pedantic spelling note "wrath" is probably the word you wanted, unless you were making a spiritual joke.

can I claim the Edinburgh defence regarding the spelling..?

I'll concede it, I quite like the "Jeering Ghost of My Arse".

yunki - Member
theology would seem a word perhaps less likely to incur the jeering wraith of the disciples of anal

Perhaps you should have just shared it on facebook if you were after a load of sycophantic 'oooooooooos' and 'that's so freaking deep'.

But well done on maintaining the shrill hyperbole.

you misunderstand lifer..

if I had shared that on facebook, I would have been inundated with worried folk wondering if I was ok, or whether my account had been hacked

I just found it amusing.. as was monsieur nutt's peice

simple pleasures..

Been reading about Theology on that there wiki and it seems I might like it (see my bold highlight):

Theology might be undertaken to help the theologian:

understand more truly his or her own religious tradition,[5]
understand more truly another religious tradition,[6]
make comparisons among religious traditions,[7]
defend or justify a religious tradition,
facilitate reform of a particular tradition,[8]
assist in the propagation of a religious tradition,[9] or
draw on the resources of a tradition to address some present situation or need,[10]
draw on the resources of a tradition to explore possible ways of interpreting the world,[11] or
explore the nature of divinity without reference to any specific tradition.
[b] challenge (ex. biblical criticism) or oppose (ex. irreligion) a religious tradition or the religious world-view.
[/b]

You don't have to believe something in order to study it.

Indeed, I had not considered that in my rejection of Theology. I take it back.

As an aside surfing that wiki I found this wiki [url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irreligion ]irreligion[/url].
We are the 6th most irreligious country in the world with an average of 52% being irreligious. That is heartening.
USA is the 32nd with 19.5% being irreligious, which is scary..

I guess I was asking for trouble posting it..

This is not aimed at you as such toys19 - but it's a strange and sad feeling being on the receiving end of the atheist sneering.. often I've been doing the sneering myself in the past, and worse

I didn't realise quite how agnostic I was either until this morning

And yes, in case you were wondering, I was probably already more than a bit tense.. baby yunki has been behaving in ways very much [i]not[/i] in accordance with the Geneva convention again lately

I'm not sure I desrved to be insulted though?

Although, you probably [u]deserved[/u] it.

yunki - Member
This is not aimed at you as such toys19 - but it's a strange and sad feeling being on the receiving end of the atheist sneering..

Oh for goodness sake.

Just so we're clear,

I'm not sneering because I'm an atheist. I'm sneering because it was sentimental twaddle designed to appeal to emotion. IMHO.

what does that mean lifer..?

are you in a mood..?

cougar - sentimental twaddle

ahhh.. so this is all fear led then..?

the athiests are worried about this piece of writing and getting defensive..?

so it's a powerful bit of twaddle..?

loum, thats jsut a symptom of my typlexia...
ynki, lack of sleep?
For the record, I was not sneering, it might have come across as such so apologies, but I do like to examine that which is in front of me, can't help it. To be honest, it was the easiest dismantling of a piece of twaddle I've done in a long time.

The point of vigorous discussion is to learn, I learned that theology is not all bad, if it can be used to kick religion then happy days. I also learned about irreligion, which has proven more useful.
I don't know what you learned but I hope you can make a positive out of it.

Sorry I'm late - just noticed this was for me. Erm....

Babies in the womb have no language and cannot talk.

But, you know... thanks anyway.

I've learned that the term 'freethought' is incredibly ironic.. 😀

No mood here just bored with the 'woe is me' hyperbole* (as I've already mentioned).

What do atheists have to fear? We own the future.

*

yunki - Member
I've learned that the term 'freethought' is incredibly ironic..

What do atheists have to fear? We own the future.

logic and reason certainly seem to be the en vogue default religious standpoint

the 'woe is me' hyperbole*

lifer I don't really know what you're going on about, is the bathos confusing you..?

😆

This has the makings of one of the greats

Please keep it up

I can only keep going til baby wakes up and starts whingeing again.. but I'll do my best

not philosophy!?

given the obvious spin on plato and beyond someone I think must be having the proverbial giraffe.

"I can only keep going til baby wakes up and starts whingeing again"

Thats not whingeing... thats singing.

The light, the light it's beautiful,
Mum you're wonderful and loving
This Dad fella ain't bad either.

😆

An illustration of what? Its religous propaganda.

I chose not to read it like that, but I could see how you might (and it may well have been intended that way).

It just points out that in some situations, you may think you know everything, but only because you don't have the facility to perceive anything else.

It could be considered an illustration of the Dunning-Kruger effect.

It just points out that in some situations, you may think you know everything, but only because you don't have the facility to perceive anything else.

This is the greatest slur on any scientist. It is patently untrue, and if you know science , you know it is in true.
The dunning kruger thing is a pathetic insult.

I [u]think[/u] it was Einstein who said " As the pool of light gets bigger, so the circumference of darkness around it expands"

The one thing I know is that I know very little.
We can dismantle science if you want, there are some great ways to show its limitations, but the OP's original paragraph is not a good way to do it.

is the bathos confusing you..?

Nope, missed it, please highlight. And as for:

yunki - Member

"the 'woe is me' hyperbole*"

lifer I don't really know what you're going on about

How about:

yunki - Member
why are folk afraid to think abstractly..?

there's some on here that get their knickers in a real twist about it.. even if it's other folk doing it..

yunki - Member
sorry that it made some angry

yunki - Member
incur the jeering wraith of the disciples of anal

yunki - Member
but it's a strange and sad feeling being on the receiving end of the atheist sneering.. often I've been doing the sneering myself in the past, and worse

yunki - Member
I've learned that the term 'freethought' is incredibly ironic..

You don't think there's any hyperbole in there? Given that all that has happened is people have said that a passage you've copied from facebook is rubbish/not the amazingly deep sentiment you thought it was.

It just points out that in some situations, you may think you know everything, but only because you don't have the facility to perceive anything else.

More "God of the gaps" Molly?

i didn't think it was amazingly deep you cretin 😆

yunki, try not to be insulting.

Then why the butt hurt?

it's really hard not to be insulting..

I'm not very bright and I'm being baited, if y'all were in my front room, literally instead of by proxy, I imagine that I would be Mr Pokey Eyerson by now.. 😳

I posted a nice twee thing hoping for a few folk to get around and warm themselves over the pathos and a bandload of bootboys jump in for a ****fest

it's irritating

Well you are being baited, I dunno if you are not very bright, I would say what you posted originally is not bright, but we all make mistakes..

Your perception of me/us is a bit sad, I just didn't think it was very sentimental, was flawed, and pretty lame. I know you did not create it.

Do you mean bathos or pathos, they mean different things?

I know I know very little. I certainly dont know how to pronounce hyperbole

the athiests are worried about this piece of writing and getting defensive..?

PS very funny so far Yunki

That's how I read it yunki - twee, but in a good way. Nothing to get worked up about.

The dunning kruger thing is a pathetic insult.

I think you are taking my posts here personally, they were not intended to be so.

I was not accusing you of displaying the DK effect. I was pointing out that DK could be considered an inevitable consequence of our position as human beings.

toys19 - bathos, pathos..?

as I typed it

bathos in the first post, pathos in the second

I posted a nice twee thing hoping for a few folk to get around and warm themselves over the pathos

Oh. I thought you were trying to get in touch.

I like it also Yunki,
Saw it for what it was....
Not a reason to act smart assy and rude.
Think the mod/cougar could have been clearer and stopped the baiting/thread bashing sooner.

molgripos, fair enough

galactus Think the mod/cougar could have been clearer and stopped the baiting/thread bashing sooner.

I don't think so, you can't post twaddle and not expect to have to accountfor yourself. Forum is about discussion you know. As far as I can see the bashing/insults mostly came from Yunki.

yeah sorry woppit..

my tongue in cheek has become foot in mouth I think

The reason why some don't see it as twee is that it isn't [i]actually[/i] about babies. Recast it as two men in a condemned cell talking about what happens when they are let out and I don't see the winsomeness.

Recast it as two men in a condemned cell talking about what happens when they are let out

nope.. you're right

I would have still loved it for exactly the same reasons.. but I may have seen that it could stir up some negativity amongst certain extremist forum members.. ('scuse the hyperbole lifer, I'm starting to think it's just part of my natural pattern of discourse 😳 )

I think maybe my teething baby is playing havoc with my hormones and blinding my foresight.. it was just too cute for me OK..?
I will endeavour to wake up colder and more analytical tomorrow morning..