[Closed] Fancy reading this thread?

Would read again

Shall we run a sweepstake on the first Premium member to smugly post about being a premium member?

£5 on druid 😀

#ABP

Everything works perfectly for us 😆

I have become intimately familiar with Classified Rules of late

£5 on druid

I reckon dissonance.

Have you thought of getting premium?

What do I win?

Everything works perfectly for us

Well almost.

I would have replied earlier, but I had to log in again, again !

I'm only here to say that I, for one, do not fancy reading this thread, although I am interested in a number of other popular singletrack forum topics.

But they do value your privacy.

But they do value your privacy.

233 times.

How about a sweepstake on who is first to refer to themselves as a 'big hitter' 🙂

I'm not sure anyone here explicitly refers to themselves as a Big Hitter, not even me.

Plenty of them about tho.

I( reckon half the time I try to read a thread on my phone I get an ad or end up somewhere else on the site.  Never happens on other sites I use.

Yesterday I had an ad covering the burger menu so was completely stuck - couldn't naviagate the site at all

Ads what ads...

*shares*

*watches notifications tick along inexorably *

._ _._.  .

_ .... ._. . ._ _..

_ ._ _. _. _._ ...

Burger menu?  I can see your beef.

 I had an ad covering the burger menu 

There's a burger menu? Cancelling my P

Result - 'm getting an ad for plus size bras

😀

I'm on another forum that has nothing to do with bikes.

Far more members than here and far, far busier.

Only ad is one banner ad at top of page. No adverts anywhere else.  No subscription. No tie in with any commercial activity.

Far, far better lay out and interface than this xxxx.

Almost instant loading of main pages and individual threads. Pictures galore.

What's the difference? Guys who run it are not taking a wage out of it so they don't front load the adverts or force you to pay to avoid them.

If the magazine was as good as claimed it wouldn't need this place to subsidise it.

I wonder just how much you could remove and still have a working forum.  Working that is for the people who post on it.

Just how much would that actually cost to run.  Fee for hosting it, s/w licence ?  Possibly not much more.  I wonder then if you could cover that with a donation / one or two sponsorship type things.

Then we could all have an ad free experience 🙂

Guys who run it are not taking a wage out of it

Well, the ones who run this one are.

If the magazine was as good as claimed it wouldn’t need this place to subsidise it

If what?

That other forum sounds awesome. Why not stay over there? Bye!

HOw much would it cost to run - next to nothing judging by the other fora I use.  As above - one small ad that is not flashing and obtrusive pays for all the hosting etc  Off the shelf software.

Its the issue we all know - the advertising income from this forum is used to prop up the magazine and the online publishing content.  So they have to maximise the income to support the rest of the stuff no one actually wants to pay to read and that cannot support itself by advertising.

How dare anyone expect to earn a wage.

HOw much would it cost to run – next to nothing judging by the other fora I use.

Quite a lot as it’s not just a forum. No, I don’t mean the magazine.

I wonder then if you could cover that with a donation / one or two sponsorship type things.

About £20 per year should do it and you’ll even get free magazine every few months.

Forums are surprisingly expensive to run. Hosting on a scale needed by a site like this, with the quality of serivce expected, is not cheap. Sorry, it just isn't.

You then need to maintain the software - install security patches etc. You need to somehow manage the content - keep all of us in line somehow. It costs time and that costs money.

Frankly, sitting and moaning about a few adverts when you can easily make them go away for 5 pence a day is just daft.

Rachel

a site like this, with the quality of service

You just made me blow my viognier out of my nose.

Only ad is one banner ad at top of page. No adverts anywhere else. No subscription. No tie in with any commercial activity.

That does indeed sound awesome.

Anyone else wondering what that that one banner ad is?  😉

You need to somehow manage the content – keep all of us in line somehow. It costs time and that costs money.

This is done by volunteers Drac and co do not get paid.

Mark has acknowledged thatthe forum and its adverts are used to prop up the rest of STW.  the adverts on here are what pays the wages of the people who create the rest of it.  If theforum was standalone then the need for adverts would be much lower

Personally I feel the adverts on here are self defeating - being so awful and obtrusive leads people to adblock.  Less obtrusive ads would remove the need to adblock

Personally I feel the adverts on here are self defeating – being so awful and obtrusive leads people to adblock.  Less obtrusive ads would remove the need to adblock

The figures suggest otherwise.

To address only four very active members (cynical, tj, perchy, flashy), who's input I always like seeing:  go P

I just don't understand why you wouldn't help to maintain the forum of which you are a valued part.

Personally I feel the adverts on here are self defeating – being so awful and obtrusive leads people to adblock.  Less obtrusive ads would remove the need to adblock

So you are saying folks who use such things would turn them off for websites that don’t have that many ads? Really?

Happens on loads of sites with lots of content, the way the pages reformat themselves as content arrives is a ball ache.

I really have very little reason I can explain for that bar the fact there is really no advantage to me in doing so.  If it was standalone and not cross subsiding something I have zero interest in then I might.  A forum only subscription that was smaller might tempt me.  Bundling it up with a load of things that I have zero interest in puts me right off.

Also I consider the forum contributors to be content creators ie without the nonsense we post then there is no forum and no advertising income.  I resent being asked to pay to create content that is then used to make money for others.  I also resent that they took a post of mine including my pictures and put it on their facebook feed without asking me or even crediting me.  Presumably i have signed away my copyyright by putting it on this form but its unethical in my book

I will ponder this a little as its a good question.  Maybe I am just tight fisted.

I just don’t understand why you wouldn’t help to maintain the forum of which you are a valued part.

We do...... by providing free content that STW can monetise and by clicking loads of page impressions that provide advertising revenue.

In return we get to use the forum for free.

Also, i need to be able to source hot Russian chicks so the adverts come in useful.

A forum only subscription that was smaller might tempt me.  Bundling it up with a load of things that I have zero interest in puts me right off.

It’s £20pa you don’t need to read the digital mag if it so pleases you and there’s no paper wastage from you ignoring it. Given you kept asking to be unbanned which we did seems odd you don’t want to contribute other than some posts repeating yourself.

Ways you can support us and the forum..

Subscribe

Place a classified ad and pay for it to be highlighted

Post links to amazing deals you've spotted on the internet that you think other forum users may like (PSA posts)

Click an ad now and then if it's for something you may be interested in (Not fake clicks)

Buy a reusable bamboo coffee cup

or a t-shirt

or a beanie

or a copy of the mag

Read stories on the front page, especially if they are in the 'sponsored' category.

Ultimately, if you like this place then support it with actual cash. Your very presence is not nearly as lucrative as you may think. If you don't want to support us then that's ok but the experience we create with the cash from the people who do support us will be aimed squarely at those users.

Oh and the reason parts of the page load as you scroll is so that you don't waste data on your connection by loading the whole page if you aren't scrolling down. The ads load after the content so that you get the content first and aren't left waiting for it while ads load. It's called 'lazy load' and it's pretty standard these days.

This is done by volunteers Drac and co do not get paid.

Volunteers you say? No wonder he always sounds so grumpy!

Sounds?

Ok

I was asked the question as to why I don't pay

1) I am tightfisted.  I don't pay for anything on the net bar I did give one small website I use £50 as they were about to fold as they couldn't pay their server fees.

2) Marks attitude.  This has hardened my attitude and his post above just confirms his disdain for the people who provide the content on the forum that creates the ad revenue that pays his wages ". Your very presence is not nearly as lucrative as you may think. If you don’t want to support us then that’s ok but the experience we create with the cash from the people who do support us will be aimed squarely at those users."

Without posters on the forum there is no content thus no advertising revenue and no jobs for those at STW.  But we who create the content can go hang unless we pay for the privilege of providing the content that creates the revenue that funds STW  ( awaits banhammer)  If we non P users are not lucrative then why not go subscription only?   My guess is that if they did then traffic would fall to the point the forum dies and then no revenue at all.

3) the awful software.

I would support micropayments for reading articles and the like.  I would donate if I made a big sale on the classifieds.

I suspect some of this tho is self justification for reason one.

I suspect some of this tho is self justification for reason one.

Yes me too.

Given 3 involves money to put right and I believe you've totally misread what Mark said.

Sounds?

screen reader to dodge the ads?

"So you are saying folks who use such things would turn them off for websites that don’t have that many ads? Really?"

Some of us never used naughty add-ons on any website until this place became so overrun with adverts.  And yes, mine only runs on a few sites, here and Bikeradar mainly.  I have no problem whatsoever being shown ads that don't take over a website rendering it unreadable, especially if they are topic-specific.  The embedded one to the right showing CRC's deals for example is fine, it doesn't detract from the content I'm reading and it is relevant to the site and my interests.  Anything that pops-up or flashes away maniacally is a no-no.  It's like everything on the web: done well it's great, done badly and it's complete and utter *.  Lazy Load as Mark calls it falls in the second category for me as if I have a slow connection or a slow device it takes ages to stop jumping around.  Just deliver a few ads straight away with the content, the only reason the page is so data hungry is because of the **** ads!!

Not having a go at Mark or STW by the way, you're just trying your best to survive against all the other websites and the rules for the way adverting is being delivered is driven by the clickbait sites who hoover up all the cash with their stories over multiple pages (more clicks...) etc.  But the user experience is shockingly bad, it's only the user-generated forum content that I come back for.

Ultimately, if you like this place then support it with actual cash. Your very presence is not nearly as lucrative as you may think. If you don’t want to support us then that’s ok but the experience we create with the cash from the people who do support us will be aimed squarely at those users.

If non-subscribing posters don't support you, then why haven't you gone subscription-only?

I have to say that this issue of monetising web content and the fall in publishing revenues for hard copy affects almost every website / publisher and its not just STW that have to squeeze every last drop of money out to survive and believe it or not I have a great deal of sympathy for the somewhat precarious position they find themselves in.  I would not like to be there and I can believe to find themselves in this position is very difficult.  My guess is a few years ago the magazine looked like it would be profitable and that everything was on a sound financial basis and now it looks far less rosy.

different sites have approached this in different ways.  Some go advert heavy, some go subscription only, some like the guardian make pleas for voluntary donations

If we are not careful we will end up with a split between fan / amateur produced stuff that is unreliable in its content, sites with paid "advertorial" that cannot be trusted and our only sources of good information behind a pay wall

Whats the solution?  I really do not know.  I am aware that people with attitudes like mine to paying for web content are a part of the problem.

As for STW - I would pay a smaller subscription for the forum only I think.  I simply am not interested in the rest of it so its no added value to me.

I have tried to be honest here as I think its an issue with much wider implications than just on STW.  the death of easily available quality journalism would impoverish our society and it really looks to be coming and coming fast.

Your very presence is not nearly as lucrative as you may think.

Why all the ads then? If they’re not aimed at me as a freeloading non subscriber then who are they for?

To be honest, it’s quite lucrative for me  in that i get to do exactly the same stuff that I would if I had a subscription but for £20 less. The only content I consume on here is user generated.

Whats the solution?  I really do not know.  I am aware that people with attitudes like mine to paying for web content are a part of the problem.

That's it.  This forum isn't expensive, especially given the amount of time some folks spend on here.  It's just that there is still a feeling that it should be free because other people can do it for free, even if this is the place you come back to to argue.  Some people have even gone away for a long time only to come back because this place is good 😉 .  You might not like parts of it but that's the way that communities work. Some folks DO like the magazine and the rest of the site and the forum is actually the combination of everyone rather than just the bubble of forum only folks.  Not wanting to pay is what has forced the majority of news to be click bait with all the resultant ability to manipulate opinion by crap ads being the only way to pay for news and journalism

So yes TJ, Brexit is YOUR fault*

* that last line might not be 100% serious

Why all the ads then? If they’re not aimed at me as a freeloading non subscriber then who are they for?

To help fund. As he said it's not lucrative though.

Ta leffeboy
*hangs head in shame*

You pay for the proof reading.

https://flic.kr/p/MXpBZB

To me it's like what I was taught as a kid in the Highlands.

If you're using a path and you see something that needs fixed, then fix it there and then if you can.

I use the STW forum, and for my very small payment, its path is maintained. Seems fair to me.