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Hi all,
The render on the rear of my terraced Welsh valleys house has blown. I'm considering having EWI, are there any grants available? I'm not on any benefits.
I've been quoted between 6k and 10.5k which I think is ridiculous!
When I question the cost I usually get all the standard responses of "Since Covid" "materials have doubled in pice" blah blah blah.
Cheers
Jon
“Since Covid” “materials have doubled in pice”
Well, they have!
6-10.5k for the whole house or just the rear? Sounds like a good price for the whole house.
I need internal wall insulation, which I understand is cheaper than external, and have been quoted 10.5k as well. Worth asking around though as I found someone else who said "about 3k"...
Oh and as for grants, the only one I know of is the ECO scheme but I believe you need some benefits to be eligible.
While I'm at it, I'll hijack this thread slightly for a bit of a rant...
We have an old solid wall property and signed up for ECO in April as we are eligible.
The scheme had ended but restarted in the summer so a company came out and did the survey.
Yep all fine, no problems, we'll give you internal wall insulation, room-in-roof insulation, fancy heating controls and TRVs, all for free! Yay!
We are doing some building work anyway, so we'll just ask them to not bother plastering any external walls as it will be redone anyway later with the insulation.
ECO people say before work can be done we need a damp proof course, no problem, it's free, just need to book a date.
Same things drags on for weeks... "trying to book a date for the DPC"...
Then all of a sudden they drop the whole thing. Turns out the DPC was not included but was a requirement that they were going to shell out for themselves. As it's more expensive than they thought, it's no longer worth it for them. Oh also, (thrown in as an afterthought), another requirement is that your cellar needs tanking. Without it, the job is too high risk that they won't get repaid by the ECO funding company.
WTF! That's 10k+ by itself. We can't do that.
Called another provider, hoping that maybe the requirements are different (it was unclear where exactly these requirements were coming from).
They did a survey and said the cellar etc is no problem. Can't do room-in-roof insulation as that's not part of ECO, they also can't do any for of insulation unless it comes with something else, like solar panels or ASHP.
Ok, fine by me, reservations about ASHP in this house notwithstanding.
Then they drop it as well.
Apparently they need to get the house to a certain energy rating in order to qualify for funding.
As our house needs so much work, they'd need to give us the full works in order to meet that energy rating, which is above the funding limit.
So, nothing.
Makes no sense to me. The coldest and most uninsulated houses get nothing at all due to this rule. But hey, computer says no.
So here we are, several young children constantly complaining of cold, my wife is due another in March, we have no plaster at all on many walls as the builders aren't doing it, and all the grant people have bailed... because our house neds too much work. So they won't do anything. Aargh!
Builder wants 10.5k to insulate alone, so he can jump in a lake.
Found someone else who can do it for around 3k, we'll still have to take out a loan but this is much more manageable. Just hope it's not some cowboy... but he seems to have a good reputation. We'll see. Hope he can do it soon, we're cold!
Sorry for the hijack. Feel free to ignore me! Just had to get some frustration out I think.
Ossify, It sounds like you've been through the mill, hope you get a decent job done after all that!
My quotes are for the rear of the property only! also I've been told by then that the Prices go up 8% in January, what a surprise!
I'm still getting quotes hoping that I'll find something more reasonable.
Cheers
3k sounds too good to be true. What are you expecting them to do for you?
3k sounds too good to be true. What are you expecting them to do for you?
Sshh! 😉
Stick insulation backed plasterboard (probably around 50mm) on all the external walls of the house and skim.
It'll probably end up more what with patching up other areas and so on.
This price might not include removing all the existing plaster (render), which I may do myself. Anyway it's a "probably" price at this point not a proper quote. Apparently he has a really cheap source for the boards themselves.
Apparently he has a really cheap source for the boards themselves.
That would set my alarms off; 'apparently' is open to interpretation - what happens if he doesn't?
Cheap source or cheap boards? Either way, that's a hmmm from me
Yeah all stuff I'll be looking into in more detail before going ahead with anything. I trust the person who regularly uses this plasterer and recommended him to me (a local builder well known in the community who stands to lose reputation & business) so we'll see.
This price might not include removing all the existing plaster (render), which I may do myself.
😬
You'd better find out as that can be spendy. Scaffolding (does his price include this, or is it on you... I suspect the latter at that price), skips and labour to remove render is not trivial.
Decent insulation boards are not cheap but your quote sounds it.
How is he going to deal with around the windows (cills, etc)?
e.on used to do some external wall insulation
- https://www.eonenergy.com/green-homes-grant.html -
https://www.eonenergy.com/green-homes-grant.html
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/how-claim-5000-green-energy-18569483
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I’m sure I read about a news scheme of £1,500 to households in certain tax bands, only I can’t find it now !
External wall insulation needs to be done properly or you'll have massive problems with dampness and condensation, which will be more expensive to put right than spending the extra money up front and getting it done correctly.
It needs to be carefully detailed around windows, doors, boiler flues and extract fans, and at the roofline too (picture if you don't have a deep enough soffit, your insulation will sit proud of it).
I did a three day course with Cadw (Welsh governments historic environment service) on this a few years ago, and I would really suggest getting someone who knows what they're doing to do this work properly, and spending the right amount on it.
If you're planning to live in the property long term, the cost of doing it right will be insignificant, and if you aren't planning on staying in the property long term, it won't be worth doing at all as you'll not see the benefit payback period wise on your energy bills.
Fwiw about 10k sounds right to be honest.
P.s I'm not a contractor so I'm not saying this for personal gain, I'm a chartered surveyor so I care about what people spend their own cash on when it comes to their house.
That video from Roger the dodgy builder is a great example of how not to do it. He leaves a thermal bridge around the windows and bottom of the wall that will cause condensation problems internally. The building needs to be assessed by someone that knows what they are doing and then be specified properly. Generally builders don’t understand all the detail required.as above getting it wrong can be very expensive. Any jobs getting eco funding should be assessed and undertaken using pas 2035.
I doubt £3K would be enough to actually buy the materials and fittings needed let alone install them...... I would be highly sceptical about a quote that cheap! As Airvent says this needs to be done correctly (I'm also a construction professional) or you can cause more problems than you solve and potential add to costs for remedial works to put it right. EWI is definitely worth doing if its done correctly and the property is suitable but you need to work out what the exact specification is going to be to avoid damp issues and ensure a competent contractor carries out the work.
There are a lot of cowboys trading on the grant funded works for this type of thing then you will never get them back to sort anything out. Get proper advice and recommendations from a trusted source ie a local energy improvement charity or advice group.
We had to have the internal insulation removed from our house (in Wales also) as it was causing damp problems.
Don't insulate for the sake of it. & don't get cowboys in.
We had a damp wall in a cold room. Very thin solid brick wall etc.
Stripped old plaster which was water proof and covered in cheap paint layer, also not breathable.
Thin batons with air holes drill up into the ceiling void in line with the batons. Insulated plasterboard, and plaster on top.
Noticeably warmer (wall isn’t cold to touch) and no damp.
We’ve just had quotes for EWI, when the first one came back I thought they were joking, then the other 3 quotes came in the same ball park - it’s an expensive job.
From what I could find, the more generous schemes are closed other than the ECO scheme, for which you need to be claiming benefits.
EWI installation is still VAT free though. In our case, all quotes came back with no VAT on the whole job (not just EWI materials).
If you need rendering done, then there may not be a huge amount of difference in it (rendering + VAT compared with EWI and render without VAT).
As mentioned before, detailing is important and is where it can get more expensive, especially if you don’t have large enough soffits to accommodate increase in wall thickness.