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The new family tent arrived today in anticipation of future years with less flying, two week holidays under canvas etc. My lads LOVE camping. Mrs G-D is warming to it but she wanted more space - if it was 2 solid weeks under canvas rain or shine then it had to be big. Enter the Khyam AirTek 8 with a discount code. It's huge. Not like a large Ginsters is huge but like the planet Jupiter is huge.
The bagged tent (without carpet and other ancillaries) takes up about 2/3 of the boot of my Passat estate and it has its own gravitational field. If away for 2 weeks we're likely to have one or both of kayaks (2x roto-moulded 2-3 person boats) and/or bikes with us. I've done the sums and we aren't going to manage this on the current boot and a roofbox.
So what the hell do people with big tents and a busy couple of weeks of outdoorsing do to transport masses of kit? I have checked and the answer is not send the tent back and buy a smaller one!
The options we've come up with are:
1) Trailer with lid - left loaded up with core kit during the summer maybe with a rack on top to take bikes or kayaks. One specific issue is we don't have a garage so I could kind of see a theft risk here. I think it might need to be a custom build. I'm a pre 97 licence holder and I've towed a fair bit over the years so no fears there.
2) Get a SWB or MWB crew cab van or Caravelle/minibus (leave rear row of seats out). Probably needs me to have a small car as a panel van won't go down well for work travel and also mileage/fuel and insurance costs for business use of a panel van in a desk job might be pretty steep.
3) Crew cab truck with one of those steel tops on, bikes on big towbar rack or on top of the hard top.
4) Conventional large (e.g. Galaxy) or van based (Caddy/Tourneo) people carrier. I reckon the van-based ones are more the ticket of these options.
The Passat I'm ambivalent about whether we keep it or not. It's paid for so we could hold it temporarily but with a van as well it won't all go on the drive.
We have 6x4' trailer with a high canopy. Towed by a Doblo. Off to the Alps every summer for 3-4 weeks with lots of fun stuff. It cost £450, and has proved to be an excellent purchase.
We have a massive vango airbeam, with a serious amount of kit and also a passat estate, plus 2 toddlers who need a huge amount of kit, including a buggy. We manage (just)
https://m.imgur.com/gallery/e2Zo3zd
Take the spare wheel out, get a roofbox and towbar rack for the car.(next step for us so we can get an even bigger roofbox)
We have a massive vango airbeam, with a serious amount of kit and also a passat estate, plus 2 toddlers who need a huge amount of kit, including a buggy. We manage (juzt)
https://m.imgur.com/gallery/e2Zo3zd
Take the spare wheel out, get a roofbox and towbar rack for the car.(next step for us so we can get an even bigger roofbox)
Not sure why you’d need a custom build trailer. Have seen plenty with bike racks on top using standard roof bars. Kayaks might be trickier as you probably need more length, so leave them on the roof. All camping kit in trailer. You can insure trailers against theft but will probably want a pointless clamp and maybe hitch lock. A ground annchor under the trailer axel is much more effective. If you are going to leave stuff in it you’ll need good locks there too - but I think it will get damp so would prefer to unload it.
Roofbox or trailer. I had a trailer for a while but storing it was a challenge as we dont have easy access to the back of our house (narrow passageway) so got rid after I finished a building project as it was a hassle in the garage.
Roofbox good but only for lighter stuff, storage in the garage hanging from the roof was easy.
Trailer if you have space, roofbox if you dont.
Van.
Been there, done that as they say. A van is the answer. You don't have to pay VW scene tax either.
As a kid we used to go for long holidays in an ordinary car with a huge tent. Everything just got packed in including stuff inside the car. Roof rack is your friend here
Why would work care what you drive if you have a desk job? Get a van and balls to then. Modern ones look as decent as any car.
Hire a van for the holidays?
Tow bar cargo rack?
Box trailer with the bikes sitting on top (kayaks on the roof rack).... Best solution.
Family of four, 8 person tent, plus huge porch extension, airbeds, sleeping bags, duvets, pillows, cooking stuff, toys when they were little etc etc, in an Octavia estate and a roof box.
None of it used in last 3-4 years and unlikely to be used in the foreseeable future
A consensus hooray! 😉
Why would work care what you drive if you have a desk job? Get a van and balls to then. Modern ones look as decent as any car.
This often gets said but in practice this isn't just commuting but also regular business travel (sorry that wasn't so clear) in a client facing role. In the same way I don't wear smart jeans to work and have to wear a suit. It's also because of costs and convenience.
Those of you who've got it all in the car I assume you have packed floor to ceiling? If so how are you securing it all so it doesn't lurch forward?
When i was my boys age and we camped as a family there was usually a very large trailer involved. When we were younger dad used to wedge stuff everywhere in the car to make it fit but we'd be travelling with knees by our ears. Very much like the TJ experience!
We also have surfer's issue of no accessible rear access.
Glad to see no votes for the truck or people carrier so far!
Anyone got experience of insuring a van as an accountant
I Run a Transit Custom Double cab as a daily for just these reasons.
It swallows pretty much everything.
Its like a car inside and looks smart enough, no one objects to riding in it as it has more room in the back seats than most cars and is very comfortable.
I have the factory fit, fold down roof bars for Canoe transport, but it also means itll fit in Multi storey car parks with them folded flat too.
It has got a towbar if we are taking absolutely everything plus the dogs, and i did buy a trailer this year too, as its just easier.
Trailer here. Previous couple of years we've had a roof box, and it was a real fight to fit things in. Car is an A6 estate, so not exactly small. 4 bikes on the back, 1 on the roof next to the box.
Got the trailer for this year, and it's been great. Over 4 times as much space as the roof box, really is no hassle to tow, and can get six bikes on top. The only real downside is that channel crossings are really quite a lot more expensive. A mate of mine has a very similar trailer, and rents a lock up to store it in.
We don't have space for a trailer either, so went with a cargo rack and bag. Actually, I just used a £40 Amazon basics cargo bag (450 litres I think) and strapped it to my Thule bike carrier with two ratchet straps. I can get our SUP, the kids boogies boards and a load of other stuff in there. It will take our Vango airhub awning aswell, no problem.
Probably not much help but this is how we ended up with a trailer tent. All the camping kit is stored and travels in it.
Depending on what storage space you have available, have a look for a Duuo trailer, they dismantle and store upright. I've got one and don't have a garage, but I can wheel it down the side of my house to the back garden. I'll also be looking to move it on shortly if it's of any help to you.
We (family of four) manage with a c-max, towbar bike rack and large roofbox. The middle seat is taken out and left at home, and tent poles go under the kids' feet. This is with a large 6-man steel pole tent plus extension. I had a look at a friend's airbeam and the total pack size and weight was about the same.
We've had similar musings, but since we only go camping three or four times per year, it doesn't make much sense to change car. So far we've managed with the biggest roof box we could find, but if we need more space we'll probably just hire a trailer as needed. Even hiring a bigger vehicle once per year is probably better than driving around in something huge all year for no good reason.
We manage (just) previously with an estate (Audi A6) and now in a XC60 by very careful packing and a roofbox.
We did two weeks camping in Cornwall this summer, 2 adults, two kids decent sized airbeam tent and we got everything we needed in a Skoda Yeti. Had two boards on the roof so no roof box.
Cooked everyday and had a great time!
Maybe you have too much stuff!!
We just took two cars. One for camping gear and one for kids and luggage. I looked at trailer, vans etc and concluded it was cheaper and easier to just take both cars and pay for an extra tank of fuel. This is obviously less viable if going to the alps though.
This is why the thought of going camping with the family is horrific! My car is already full - 3 kids in back, stuff in boot and roofbox, will need space for dog, bikes on the towbar
At the moment I'm preferring to go wildcamping/bikepacking for short trips and then self catering for family holidays, rather than week long camping trips. The thought of moving house for a week scares me and this thread isn't helping!
Trailer - nice little erde - you will barely know it’s there...
Brenderup 1150s/1205s with an ABS lid and bike rack is the trailer of choice.
The 1205 is absolutely massive
We have a T4 Caravelle and a mahoooooosive tent, have done for several years now. Mrs S believes in taking everything from the house as well as the garage when we go, but loves camping, and I just got tired of trying to fight it into a people carrier with 3 boys, dog and 5 bikes. Didn't work.
Local short weekends we can get away with just folding the back seat up, but for the big holiday (and a week they usually do in DOrset whilst I'm at work) I remove the rear seats - loses 40Kg of weight and gains a foot and a bit of load space. Far more civilised then.
We do get a lot of other use out of the van though, biking climbing, paddling etc. and just generally carting 3 boys and assorted friends. Also a good way to get half the village to a party and taxis home, haven't paid for my drinks for ages.
Gone round Europe for the past 7 years in our T5 Caravelle. We have a 600 roof box this year had to take 6 bikes 5 on the back one on the roof. The inside is packed to the rafters. The fridge and 8 man tent in the footwell.
Next year we may take 7 bikes dreading it. I would like a trailer but the wife isn't keen.
A big vehicle is a big compromise if you are only using its size once or twice a year.....
Boot volume here for most cars https://www.automobiledimension.com/ usually measured to top of rear seats.
The biggest of MPVs e.g. a galaxy will gain you a bit more over a passat. If you are willing to unbolt the rearmost seats and pack to the roof it will be quite a lot bigger.
Use a dog guard or similar bulkhead to stop stuff coming forwards.
The long wheelbase rifter or berlingo could be a shout.
Something like a short wheelbase Tourneo Connect or a VW caddy will almost double the boot space and not be too bad on fuel but is a step further away from car dynamics than an MPV.
It might be best to just rent a crew van (combi van) if it's only once or twice a year. Though I have no idea of the cost.
Actually a trailer is easily the best option if you can stash it somewhere.
If you need to do bikes AND kayaks then a decent trailer whit bikes on top of that, and kayaks on the roof would be best.
For shorter trips I;d have thought you bed OK to get away with tent in the boot, bikes on the back, and a massive roofbox? Pack the soft stuff around the kids and use a doggy safety net to enable you to pack up to the roof in the car.
VW caravelle here. Here’s ours, it’s far removed from a Panel Van It’s fantastic big family-into-outdoorsy-stuff transport.
That said, it’s also the least reliable vehicle I’ve ever owned. That includes a period of time as a student with a wretched fiat 126.
We get we have done 5 adult size people and dog in the Peugeot tepee partner (Berlingo). Not a huge tent but loads of stuff. Fine with a huge roof box and grill across the rear seat head rests. I love it as a daily drive and it can do 50mph on my commute. Really really wouldn't prefer to drive a car. The driving position is so much better.
They now do a long wheel base which would be perfect for you. The vw caddy maxi would be ideal as well. Crew cab Peugeot expert would work as well
We didn't use our tent this year..its an oldish Vango 6 man tent ..we arent "serious" campers ..the missus just wouldnt go anywhere without a hook-up ..however with a couple of teenagers in tow the last time we went anywhere involved two vehicles a Vauxhall Insignia Sport Tourer (estate) with roof box ..and a Nissan X-trail..and every inch of space was taken in both cars !..
I don't have any answers for you ..but just thought I would wish you good luck !
That said, it’s also the least reliable vehicle I’ve ever owned
Funnily enough my dad's 54 plate one would fit the same description for him!
I think my reticence about jenga packing a normal car comes from not wanting to spend half a day at both ends of a 3-4 day trip or cheeky weekend doing it. Something about my obsessive nature likes the result but it's dead time that I want to spend with the two hooligans. If it was once a year for a two week trip and nothing else then that would be different.
I drop the seats a lot in the car so trying to avoid the fixed dog guard solution (been there, done that and been irritated by it rapidly).
I am wobbling between van and trailer now.
Van has other advantages - can hide bikes in it while away and for those go somewhere straight from work rides and it's a portable changing room. Downside is getting kayaks or small dinghies on top. Transit Custom looking appealing in SWB form so far.
Upside of the trailer is I get a normal car for all the boring functional journeys. Big downside of the trailer option is storage because it would live in the space that my sailing dinghy sits in over the winter. Which means paying to store that somewhere
I have come to the solid conclusion that I have far too many priorities and am not especially good at compromise.
Does nobody else see the irony in the OP's username and predicament?
Anyway, we managed to just squeeze in to a Peugeot 5008 with a large roofbox on top last year with 3 kids and a 40kg 6 man steel pole tent. This year we got a 4x3ft trailer so we could take the dogs too and not need a second car. The idea was that the dogs would have most of the boot and everything else would be in the roofbox and trailer. Eventually the dogs ended up in the rear footwells and the boot was full of stuff. It's that general rule that whatever space you have you'll fill and wish you had more! Project for next spring is a height extension to the trailer!
We also have friends who hire a crewcab van for 2 weeks every summer for their main camping holiday. I can see the logic in that if it's only once a year but we like to get away a few times throughout the summer.
@pocpoc the irony is not lost on me! I used to have a garage but it got replaced by a wooden outbuilding. When we extended the rear of the house a few years back we also reduced the width of the access to the garden from a car width to a pedestrian gate. Benefit of hindsight as in the olden days when I chose my name we could have just put the trailer down the bottom of the garden.
You could sell your new tent and buy my massive family trailer tent with roof rack attachments so you can carry as many bikes as you like 🙂
We moved on to a caravan.
The latest generation of berlingo-like vehicles are available in lwb as well as regular. The grand tourneo connect as example can fit 1300l of stuff in, whilst still having 5 seats up. Should be a good deal more car-like and less expensive than a VW van, although does look a bit like a mobility van
Morning lovely people of STW.
Off to have a look at a Tourneo Connect and a Transit Connect today more for information than purchasing at this stage.
Anyone know if the "Grand" Tourneo Connect is longer or is it just the extra row of seats?
Keep the car ditch the trailer and get one of these?
https://www.roofbox.co.uk/tow-bar-boxes/
Its longer, available with and without the extra seats
Grand Tourneo Connect is longer. When we looked at one you couldn't remove all the rear seats so we opted for the normal one which you could.
Gets our daughter out and about when she can't convince us to take the camper.
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Tourneo LWB Custom is massive inside. We can fit 4 29ers with wheels on and four people and still have room for kit and the dog
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Another caravelle here. Didn't want a camper, but for the odd night it's good enough with the seats flat and thermorests. Cooking stuff lives in the van permanently.
Longer trips, we've got a 45kg canvas tent which takes up the entire boot of a car. Plus bikes, boxes of food... Both being teachers we're sometimes away all summer. Anything smaller would be a squeeze.
We have a khyam 8 too, used once so far, great bit of kit. We fitted everything for a family of 4 in a Kia Sportage, I used our Thule tow bar bike rack with a cheap amazon cargo bag to carry all the light random tat we need (cooking gear, duvet, pillows, scooters, kids toys). It was a squeeze, probably get a trailer at some point as there was no space for bikes
Replying mostly to bookmark for future reference.
We've just got a Big Tent for family camping this year. It's a six berth canvas thing which basically takes up the whole boot of the car.
With a bit of ingenuity we get the family of five, the tent, off-the-floor campbeds for all, many blankets, and the usual clothing, food, cooking gear, etc, into a Honda FR-V with a roof box. It is a tight squeeze though, and involves bags under the kid's feet, and stuff belted into the middle seat in the front. It also takes bloody ages to pack!
I think the logical next step is probably a trailer.
Trouble with a trailer is you might as well have a caravan
Thanks folks.
@tracey Mrs G-d has seen the Transit Custom (which I am really really liking) and has mutinied! The salesman tried to help.
I've just been and sized up a Grand Tourneo Connect. It's really nice so having a test drive next week. Then it's that or one of the trailers someone recommended.
The balance is between buying a trailer outright and trying to figure out the storage problem for 5-6 months a year VS. buying a more lifestyle/function over form vehicle that will more easily eat bikes and kit than my Passat.
With the car now 7 years old and not having been super reliable a switch of daily driver wouldn't be unwelcome but with a trailer we could do that and have more options for what to replace it with when the time comes.
Consider a hyundai i800 over a caravelle.
Same size but far cheaper to buy and some say more reliable...
if you're considering the grand tourneo connect, you should also look at the citroen berlingo/peugeot rifter/vauxhall combo - they're all the same car, all released in the last year, and all have an 'xl' (lwb) option that should be broadly comparible.
Trouble with a trailer is you might as well have a caravan
Not really. Even the largest camping trailers are a lot smaller and easier to tow than a caravan, and a lot less of an investment. Plus, it's not a caravan.
Hire a trailer?
Hiring (van or trailer) not an option I'm prepared to deal with. Trying to get to pick up and drop off at most places opening hours, different kit each time, someone else's stock/maintenance and not having the right accessories just makes it a bind. Renting something specific for a one off job is one thing but not regularly.
Waiting on a trailer quote as well now.
With a bit of internet beavering I've managed to find a trailer that I think can be got down under the magic 800mm height to be turned on its side and moved through our side gate.
Just waiting for our local stockist to confirm that the lid and side extensions we would want can be removed.
If we go that way we will hopefully be trying the whole setup out in early October and will post some pics for anyone who else who's currently looking into.
I did test pack the car today and worked out that we could almost manage to squash all the tent and cooking gear into the boot if packing to the roof but no space for clothes, sports gear, bedding. That lot might just all go in a roof box but that would knacker taking kayaks on holiday so that's not happening!
Really grateful to everyone who offered words and pics. 😁
A timely thread! cheers g-d! Looking at Combi vans at the moment. We've always got everything in the car before, but another 3-4kgs of human arriving early next year is going to cut down the load somewhat.
Last time we bought a car, we didn't have any preconceived ideas about what we were going to get; we went to Car Giant and sat and poked around in pretty much all the big estates on the market. Ended up with a(nother) Mondeo Estate.
Is there such a thing as Van Giant?
Quick update for anyone who's interested:
TRAILERS
Checked out the trailers. Not managed to find the recommended Brenderup 1205S in the metal but looked at the similarly sized Ansemms 750KG hard top model (without side extensions), which was a really well built piece of kit. My goodness it's big though - I could pack nothing in the car and I'd wager I'd get everything into the trailer (although at single height the tent would need refolding).
Good bits were that it has a hard top with rails so you could load it and then put 3-4 bike carriers on top (using conventional car roof rack clamped to those rails) and with its width I think it would be pretty stable while half tucking the bikes in behind the car.
The 500KG version is probably a more 'normal' size but has the disadvantage of being narrower and therefore possibly not as stable with a bunch of bikes up top and would require dense/close packing of the bikes on a roof rack.
VAN BASED CAR
The Grand Tourneo Connect test drive didn't happen (mix up and illness at the garage). Having talked about the seat delete option it seems that the rear two unbolt fairly easily to create a massive boot or they can be deleted in production but then you lose the ability to ever fit them (as they remove the rails and rear seat belts - but you don't get any extra other stuff like a load cover).
Possible others:
Caddy Maxi Life
Berlingo XL
If anyone's got any views of regular daily/long motorway use of these happy to hear them.
Caddy Maxi life owner here. Daily driver.. I would think it's close to the footprint of a Passat sized estate. 5 seat version. Rear seats fold forward or can be removed easily.
Have the 6 speed version with tailgate. The newer ones are very car like inside and lost the van style cheaper plastics and very large wing mirrors. Very happy with ours.
I've driven the Grand Tourneo Connect for work - as a cyclists taxi service. The rear seats are very flexible to use. We'd regularly fit or remove the 3rd row as required. A bit heavy to move the pair, but the single is easily manhandled. They can be flipped up to create space. You can even flip up the 2nd row, move it forward, then fit the 3rd row into the space of the 2nd row. I've had tandems and passengers in it at the same time. The boss is just selling one at the moment, with around 175,000 miles on the clock. That should give an idea of longevity.
Personally, I find the suspension a bit soft and wallowy, particularly when empty or lightly loaded but that's likely because they've tried to keep it comfy for passengers. My own Trafic is, by comparison, much firmer and rolls less. Other than that, its a very pleasant place to sit and drive.
I've got the Anssems GT750-251, which is the biggest unbraked trailer they do, and it's great. Like you I was a bit nervous about going for such a large one, but I think it was the right choice. Larger trailers are actually easier to tow and reverse because you can see them, and once you've bitten the bullet of towing, you may as well tow a bigger one.
Took it down to the Alps this summer with six bikes on top and it was rock solid.
Residuals on them seem insanely good too. Price for new was only a bit more than what people were asking 2nd hand.
I could pack nothing in the car and I’d wager I’d get everything into the trailer
Nah, your camping kit will expand to use all available space 🙂
Sorry for the numpty question? How do you know if your car can tow these big trailers safely?
We have a pretty weedy sportage 1.6 petrol with a tow bar, fitted for the bike rack, would it be okay with a trailer and camping gear - its mostly bulky rather than heavy
Max unbaked and braked weights are quoted in your car handbook.
I've got the van version of the Connect. It drives great, like any modern car. The sat upright driving position is really comfortable, I drove from Cheshire to mid Belgium earlier this year with no bother.
Check the gvw of the car, the plated weight of your trailer and see if its below the train weight of the car. The car weights will be on a data plate on the car usually inside a door.
If your license is post 97 the max total train weight you are allowed is 3500. But I think you can tow a 750kg trailer whatever the vehicle. Have a Google.
I would suggest you get the biggest trailer your local tip allows... I think most are 2m max... Extends the usefulness of the trailer.
We were in a similar position to op. Ended up with a small daxara 127 trailer for following reasons:
- lots cheaper than van. Second hand trailer, towbar and some accessories (locks, load bars etc) came in under £650
- don't have to pull it around everywhere. Opens up choice of next car/van
- don't lose much value. Only sunk cost is towbar fitting (£250)
- whilst away you can use it to dump stuff in. A bit like a towable shed 🙂
- works with a number of vehicles eg. can use with my mum's camper van
We have a similar space/ gate based conundrum, which is why we ended up with a smaller model. Still big enough though, especially with the lid and Load bars. With 2 teens / 2 adults, We've been able to take all the bikes , paddle boards etc away where we wouldn't have been able to do previously.
Only downside really is storage when not in use, and slight worry about theft whist away. Sorted that with locks. Don't notice any difference on journey time or fuel.
There is nothing in the handbook, there are some towing websites which state 750 / 1200kg. That should be more than enough...
The bagged tent (without carpet and other ancillaries) takes up about 2/3 of the boot of my Passat estate and it has its own gravitational field.
It’s probably got its own postcode and shows on Google Earth! 😉
@DT78 there aren't many cars that size that won't pull 500-750kg trailers.
If you know what you're looking for the trailer weights may be on a plate in the boot or door areas.
For example our 1.0 Focus will pull 750kg (I wouldn't want to do it regularly as I reckon that car has a delicate/small clutch).
@pdw I totally agree size is everything with trailers! I used to tow 5m long dinghies regularly while still in my teens. Small (short) trailers are, however, bloody awful. I am a bit rusty on the reversing but when I borrowed a trailer recently I found it came back fairly quickly. Although an hour or two of concentrated practice probably wouldn't go amiss and a lesson or two for Mrs G-d who has never towed anything.
I've got a possible custom combined dinghy and camping trailer design washing round in my head. Could use to tow our dinghy and then take that off and put kayaks where the boat would go (bottom layer) for holidays and a top layer with roof box(es). The advantage of which is the boat would live on it over the winter at home solving my storage problem.
Still a toss up with the van options though! I like the load it and go functionality.
Thanks for the feedback @scotroutes and @rickmeister hopefully driving both caddy life and Tourneo Connect this week if I can get demos sorted.
There is nothing in the handbook, there are some towing websites which state 750 / 1200kg. That should be more than enough…
No it's not usually in the handbook as every engine / trim variation will be different.
There will be a VIN data plate stuck to the car somewhere, usually inside the drivers door.
This is the one for a Ford:
First weight is Gross vehicle weight. (max fully laden vehicle weight)
Second is the max train weight. (above plus max trailer weight)
(check handbook for this interpretation).
Subtract the first from the second 4200-2505 = 1695kg is the max plated trailer this car can tow. Note it goes of the plated weight (max) of the trailer, even if its empty you can't tow a bigger plated trailer.
But when you factor in when you got your driving licence is gets more complicated. If you passed test before 1997 you are fine to crack on as above.
With a post 1997 licence you are allowed to drive a car up to 3500kg GVW with a 750kg plated or under trailer.
However with a post 1997 licence you can't have a train weight over 3500kg if the trailer is plated over 750kg unless you do a trailer test.
So with this Ford a post-97 holder can tow 3500-2505 = 995kg plated trailer max.
PS the rules seem odd as I am allowed to tow a 1200kg caravan with a 1.2 Skoda Fabia, but not a Land Rover Freelander 2.
Conventional wisdom would say the heavier car would make for a much safer rig, but rules is rules.
even if its empty you can’t tow a bigger plated trailer.
I thought that had been changed quite a while ago because someone realised the stupidity of it ... With trailers plated to CE and type approval requirements it was hard / impractical to down/up plate trailers to suit vehicle by vehicle plating needs and the actual train weight became the measure.
It came up on here a while back in a towing thread that either I started on this very point and someone put the links up.
See cleetonator's post half way down for the link.
Anyone got experience of insuring a van as an accountant
I'm an accountant and am on my second van.
Never had a problem. Well, had to change insurers when I bought my first as the old one didn't vans but after that it's been fine, that was July 2012.
Had a panel van which became a camper, and currently have a panel van which is becoming a camper.
Old van was an 2004 2.0 SWB Transit, was £240-ish per year to insure (protected NCD, two drivers, parked on the road) current one is 2013 2.2 LWB Transit, £360 per year.
Not insured for business use mind, just SDP& Commuting, I'm in industry rather than practice so work travel is minimal
We run the Anssems GT750, plus Ford Galaxy and top box. Go to France every year for 2-3 weeks and its a great setup.
Family of 5 - trailer takes 4 bikes, car has another bike on top with the top box.
Boogie boards fit under the bikes on the trailer.
We take a huge tent - Cabanon Awaya 5 x 5 m, platform for cooking, stove etc.
Wife loves the Galaxy for transporting kids and dogs year round
I just thought I'd pop back and update now that we've settled on a solution in case the process we went through helps anyone else.
Combi/crew panel van
We looked at spending about £10-12k on a 5/6 seat crew van to try and find one in good order where we could use the load bay for loading all our gear inside for big trips and for winter days hiking and biking we'd have a changing room/discreet storage. The idea was we'd try to make things work with a van and my wife's car.
We ruled this out in the end as it's really hard to find a crew cab in half decent condition with air con (one mod-con I would not accept being missing for a daily user) and even many newer vans were missing it. The Vito's were the best spec'd but no bulkheads in the ones we found.
Van based people carrier - Grand Tourneo/Caddy Maxi
Drove the Grand Tourneo. It was fine and pleasant and would have done the job I'm sure, especially with the rear row of seats removed but tow bar nose weight was only 75kg (can't therefore put 4 bikes on it) and it was still very van like. Caddy Maxi was better on weights on paper but for the price really didn't seem great value (new or 2nd hand).
Was a bit worried with my annual mileage and a lot of time travelling solo it would have become a chore on a day to day basis to have something that van like without the full advantage of it being a van would probably have got on my wick in the end.
The common thing that counted against the van/van like options was fuel economy, slower and more fuel burned than a decent estate or normal MPV didn't sit well given I do quite a few miles on my own in any given year.
Galaxy/Sharan/MPV
Not quite as much usable space as the van based MPV options but would probably have squeezed everything in without too\ much trouble and both options I looked at were better on nose and roof weights than the van based stuff. All are much nicer inside but the prices are (to me) eye-watering at the age/condition we'd want to buy at and then I remembered someone on here had a Galaxy and had still added a small trailer.
Big (ish) trailer
This is what we've settled on, probably the Anssemms GT750-201-HT1 (or maybe even VT1) or something from one of the other brands of similar size.
Main reasons:
(1) It will take a normal "estate car" roof rack so solves the taking kayaks + bikes problem and should be big enough to carry stuff without groaning at the seams.
(2) Big enough I can potentially downsize my car for reduced day to day running costs (so long as it will still tow 750kg and carry 75kg on the roof)
(3) No concerns about securing the load in a way that won't land in the kids laps if stopping suddenly and any gas bottles can go in trailer not in car.
(4) If it turns out to be a pants solution the amount lost on it after a year's use is nothing like a year's vehicle depreciation.
I think you are right to go for a wider trailer, the small narrow ones are hard enough to reverse, especially when the tow car is loaded up so you cannot see the trailer through the rear window. At least wider once will be visible in the wing mirrors (even if its also going awry when it comes into view)