[Closed] Engineering types - a question on drawings and spec's

Tech datasheet for specific items of equipment - tanks, pumps, skids.

General specification for systems, eg Purified Water.

Reference these on your P&ID or GA but don't duplicate the info - one of them will get forgotten when you make an update.

(Project Manager, Life Science/ Pharma design)

I'm Technical Publications Manager in the same field.

for construction - drawing and sometimes accompanying technical specification document - depending on size of project. I`ve also compiled BIM model information on certain projects.

much depends on how you want to record stuff, as a client, i suppose. what systems you use etc.

specific technical specification for the item. drawings reference spec if required.

Using the same drawing or document number;

Sheet 1. GA
Sheet 2. Technical specification
Sheet 3. P&ID
Sheet 4. Tag labels
Sheet 5. Electrical schematics.

etc, etc.

Multiple pages all controlled by 1 document number.

Separate numbers as it means you can revise them independently.

Some high level details can be useful in n a P&ID but mostly this.

Tech datasheet for specific items of equipment – tanks, pumps, skids.

General specification for systems, eg Purified Water.

Reference these on your P&ID or GA but don’t duplicate the info – one of them will get forgotten when you make an update.

25+ years engineer in oil and gas

Using the same drawing or document number;

Sheet 1. GA
Sheet 2. Technical specification
Sheet 3. P&ID
Sheet 4. Tag labels
Sheet 5. Electrical schematics.

etc, etc.

Multiple pages all controlled by 1 document number.

That's not going to get through a BIM audit to easily.

Separate numbers as it means you can revise them independently.

+1

GA drawing normally has details of service connections/water/electricity/etc.
Separate technical spec sheet if needed.
Separate P&ID (referenced from GA) and separate electrical drawings/diagrams.

Don't duplicate information as it makes configuration control a nightmare when you update something.

Project Manager - 15 years building complex systems for Navy Ships and Submarines.

Let's not make life easy or be sensible:

Drawing suggests something and maybe even goes so far as to mention the specification...

Reads contract specific specification, refers to County Council standard details

Reads CC standard details, refers to clause in contract spec

Contact spec which refers to specification for highway works

Specification for highway works (SHW) refers to 6 different clauses and SHW Highway Construction Details

HCD refers to clauses in contract specific specification

Contract specification missing those clauses

Open TQ/RFI to try and work out what we're actually meant to do

Get told it's in document "blah" and such a silly question

Explain we have never been issued said document and perhaps kindly they could send it over?

Where do you include critical attributes and utility requirements? In a technical spec, on a drawing (e.g. a GA or P&ID) or both.

To answer the question directly.... P&ID might include some of the key attributes, e.g. design flow and duty for a pump. GA would include dimension data. Utility requirements would appear on the relevant utility summaries. But the master reference for equipment info would be the datasheet.

I don't think I've ever seen the below approach, sounds difficult. Perhaps OK for a package of vendor info, but then the client/operator would likely re-number the docs into their overall system anyway.

Using the same drawing or document number;

Sheet 1. GA
Sheet 2. Technical specification
Sheet 3. P&ID
Sheet 4. Tag labels
Sheet 5. Electrical schematics.

etc, etc.

Multiple pages all controlled by 1 document number

Interesting thanks.

So what title do you assign to the spec / data sheet?

Ours are generally for pharmaceutical containment solutions.

So:

Equipment Specification
Design specification
Technical specification
Product specification

We currently call it a functional design specification but we are removing the automation (PLC/HMI) aspect therefore the word functional is pretty redundant.

BS1192 makes it nice and simple, no need for actual naming then 😉

e.g.

PR1-XYZ-V1-01-SP-A-15:05:15-0001-S1-PO5

There isn't that simpler...

However you do it, it'll likely end up a mess without really strict/good document/data management and control.

So make damn sure you get this phase right and that everyone knows exactly how things need to be created/numbered - especially if you have vendors involved.

*15 year career in fixing engineering document/data messes.

The best place to put all your critical data is a database that forms the single source of truth for the plant, that you can then pull data from as you need, it also means that if you change a value in one place, it changes for everything.

PR1-XYZ-V1-01-SP-A-15:05:15-0001-S1-PO5

There isn’t that simpler…

Yes?

It's an architectural specification for coastal surveying compiled by XYZ for Project1 for system V1 level one (BEP will tell me what's they are let's say Fife coast, kinshaldy beach). It's version one and it's suitable me on the design team to use for my own design input (it's been checked and approved for sharing within the design team)

There is only one place in the project I will find it. Once I have found it I know what I can use it for and what it's about, I haven't had to have something forwarded, I haven't had to ask if it's up to date or ready for checking.

And that's without the perfectly acceptable addition of metadata that can be added on the end to tell you what's in it. Have you got a better system that you don't need to explain?

Any ideas on spec' title as asked above?

Have you got a better system that you don’t need to explain?

I was being a little tongue in cheek/ironic with my wink and "..." it's as you point out very straight forwards once you get people past the initial "change is bad" philosophy.

My issue (I roll my eyes and get on with my life) generally is Client announcing everything should be BIM but no EIR available, or someone promising the world pre-contract within the Pre-BEP when something far simpler would suffice cue pointless documents or random hoops to jump through to fulfil the contract, or someone announcing they want it delivered such and such a way despite the BEP having been agreed two years ago.

I don't think I'm really helping derek_starship with my twaddle though (other than bumping the thread)

Where do you include critical attributes and utility requirements? In a technical spec, on a drawing (e.g. a GA or P&ID) or both.

In a database, linked to the equipment on the drawing, and exportable as a datapoint on a spec/datasheet as required.

Information such as MoC, surface finish, noise / light levels, compressed air / electricity / gas supplies etc.

Again, in a database linked to their relevant plant, either in a drawing on in the Master Tag Record as needed, some of that information may be plant-wide or a sub-attribute dependent on other information, and as such stored/pulled from elsewhere, but that's what linking is for.