Without looking it up do you know what happened on each day?
I know what happens but I can't believe they squeezed it into 4 days.
There's a meal, Jesus gets dobbed in. There's a trial , the Romans can't be arsed to get involved. Jesus gets nailed up ,dies, gets taken down then ressurects.
Surely a week's worth of action.
At my s.i.ls and even as a former re teacher she's not sure of the timeline.
No idea, so I’m guessing the meal and betrayal happened on the first day. Followed by a speedy trial and crucifixion on the second. Death on the third. Resurrection on the fourth. Not sure when the chocolate eggs and rabbits got involved.
I also appreciate the irony of a carpenter being taken out by wood and nails.
<atheist>
It's all fictional anyway so make up whatever narrative best suits. Might as well argue whether Into The Spider-Verse is considered canon in the MCU.
</atheist>
The resurrection is supposed to have happened three days after crucifixion. Though the date of Easter is a hijack of the pagan equinox which makes sense if you think about it, both (and many others no doubt) are all wrapped up around rebirth with the onset of Spring. Starting anew, eggs hatching, fertility, all that happy stuff.
The notion of whether biblical "days" are actual days or metaphorical days seems to be somewhat contested.
BBC article talks about deciding what day Easter falls, plus general calendar date correction (not sure if I knew this or not).
Last supper was after the ordinary Jewish Passover celebratory meal, nothing happened on Saturday.
I’m with Cougs on this one.
Pagan
Festival
Hijack
Although that’s not to say any of these things happened or didn’t happen, it’s just that it was a convenient way to integrate Christianity into pre Christian festivals .
Ah...the last supper...
Table for 26 please...
But there are 13 of you...
We all want to sit on the same side!
John Hegley has it covered.
^^^class 😃
It varies as it’s the first full moon after spring equinox, because well it’s nothing to do with the resurrection.
Testing my childhood memories of going to a CoE school.
Good Friday is when he was nailed to the cross, Easter Sunday is to mark when he resurrected pushing the stone out of the way. I was told that’s why we roll paste eggs down a hill. Does anyone even do paste eggs anymore?
I was often sent out the class or asked to be quiet as none of it made sense.
Ah…the last supper…
Table for 26 please…
But there are 13 of you…
We all want to sit on the same side!
Makes you think....
/x-files theme intensifies/
jca
Full MemberAh…the last supper…
Table for 26 please…
But there are 13 of you…
We all want to sit on the same side!
"TONIGHT WE DINE IN HELL!"
"FFS Judas, that's so inappropriate"
"Oh OK just me then I guess"
If Easter was the actual time of the crucifixion and resurrection, it would obviously fall on exactly the same dates every year.
It doesn’t, so clearly it’s a Christian tradition grafted onto a roughly similar pagan festival that’s vaguely around the same time of year.
Possibly Eostra, hence the oddly coincidental similarities in the names…
Oh, and what I did, having just got indoors from washing the car and feeding the wildlife, was spend a frantic half hour or so scouring Dentons Directory, and trying to find a plumber who offered 24 hours emergency repairs who was actually working, and not shut down for the weekend!
I’d just emptied the kitchen waste bin to feel something wet on my face and pattering of water on the floor, to see fast dripping water from one end of the ceiling fluorescent light fitting! Took the bulb out and the cover off to see water running down from the wiring through the ceiling.
Managed to get a number from a local bloke who turned up about 6-ish, it seemed to be coming from under the floor of the spare bedroom/junk room, so I shifted some stuff and he pulled up the carpet and prised up one end of a floorboard, (thankfully it’s a pre-war house with floorboards!), took up the landing carpet and took up another floorboard and it was wet underneath one end. Literally a pinhole in the cold-water supply pipe right on the top! A jet of water about a foot long when he turned on the water!
Easy fix with a whizzy tool that cut a section about a foot long out, then slip-over joints on a new bit of pipe and another whizzy cordless tool that compressed the joints closed. Brilliant stuff, no more than twenty minutes to fix the issue.
Huge relief, I’d have had to stay home until Tuesday emptying buckets every couple of hours until I could have got someone in otherwise.
Not my ideal way of spending an Easter Weekend! Still, I’ve lived here for around fifty years, and that’s the first actual pipe leakage in all that time!
And now it’s pissing down outside again! 😖
Anybody else feel that, if Jesus was a real person, all the added supernatural shenanigans actually take away from his story. The little kernels of, what seem like, truth paint a picture of a militant nice guy. Flipping over money lenders tables, supporting the poor and ill are actions I can get behind. Magic tricks, son of a deity, raising from the dead, not so much.
it would obviously fall on exactly the same dates every year.
No it wouldn't because the Passover occurred on the night of a full moon and full moons don't follow the same dates every year.
It has no connection with pagan festivals which might have also occurred about that time in northern Europe. The date for Christmas on the other hand probably has.
Of course its christianity pasted on top of the pagan traditions. As above its obvious in the symbolism. It would have occured on a fixed date not variable. The date of a a anniversary cannot change. Its a fairy story taked on to existing festivals like all Christian traditions
Spring fertility festivals predate christianity and are worldwide not just northern Europe
Eggs rabbits and lambs are pre Christian spring fertility symbols co opted by Christians
Its just another load of mumbo jumbo to control.the masses.
It is surprising how little you know about the subject TJ, especially as you obviously have very strong views on it.
I suggest you do a bit of research to help you understand it better. Maybe look at the Hebrew month of Nisan which refers to the barley harvest and how that occurs in March-April in Egypt. It certainly has a link with a pre Christian religion but that is Judaism, not paganism.
Of course its christianity pasted on top of the pagan traditions.
Ernie's correct TJ it has to do with Jewish festivals (hence lunar) being as you know, Christianity being an off shoot of Judaism an all.
Point missed ernie.
Spring fertility festivals are worldwide and predate christianity and Judaism and are worldwide
Bunnies and eggs have nothing to do with christianity
Yes judaism and christianity also have a spring festival. Its all fairy stories.
Nickc. Both you and ernie miss the point. Spring fertility festcals and their symbols predate both Judaism and christianity.
Bunnies and eggs are pagan symbols. Or can you point to where in the bible bunnies and eggs are?
Christianity bulit its sucuss on co opting previous religeon
Point missed ernie.
Totally I would say.
Bunnies and eggs have nothing to do with christianity
Which is exactly my point. Have you ever been actually inside a church?
From elsewhere on the Internet. Interpretation / validation is left as an exercise for the reader.
>>
Adrian Bott
26/March/2013
·
NO, IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT ISHTAR - SOME MYTHBUSTING EASTER FACTS FROM YOUR FRIENDLY PAGAN SCEPTIC
1. The festival of Pascha was celebrated for centuries before the conversion of the Anglo-Saxons who named it 'Easter' in their own relatively small part of the world. (It's still called Pascha, or a variant thereof, outside those areas.) So no, it wasn't 'originally pagan' or about a Goddess of sex and fertility. Much to the disappointment of us English folk, the world does not revolve around what went on in England.
2. Bede, our only source for the Goddess Eostre, states that the festival of Easter was named after the 'old observance' of Eostre's feasts during the month of Eosturmonath. He does not say that anything survived of these feasts except that name. Some scholars have suggested that Bede made her up, and academia is still divided on this point, although it remains unclear what his motive for doing so might have been.
3. No, Eostre's symbol wasn't a hare. That was an unsupported guess made by the folklorist Adolf Holzmann in 1874. Holzmann was baffled by the Easter Hare tradition, finding it 'unintelligible', and guessed that 'the hare was probably the sacred animal of Ostara'. Later writers misrepresented his guess as a statement of fact.
4. No, votive inscriptions from the Rhine don't refer to Eostre; they're to the Matronae Austriahenae, who may well be linguistically related, however.
5. No, eggs were not symbols of Eostre either. There are no known symbols of Eostre. Our sole source - Bede - doesn't mention any.
6. No, hot cross buns weren't eaten by the pagan Saxons. That ludicrous claim comes from the long-outdated 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica.
7. No, Eostre is not the root of the word 'oestrogen'. That comes from Latin 'oestrus' meaning 'frenzy', used in sexual context since 380 BC. Oestrogen was discovered in the 1920s, the human ovum in 1827. Unsurprisingly, Anglo-Saxon goddesses played zero part in either process.
8. Yes, if Eostre existed, she was probably a dawn-goddess (see Indo-European mythology) though Dr Philip Shaw suggests she was possibly the goddess of a local region, probably Kent.
9. No, Eostre isn't a form of Ishtar or Astarte. That comes from a certain strand of Christian belief that all pagan gods are played by the same small cast of demons. Ishtar was ancient Babylonian, Eostre (if she existed) Anglo-Saxon; thousands of miles and many hundreds of years apart.
10. There is, however, linguistic evidence to suggest a Proto-Indo-European dawn goddess (Hausos) who may be the antecedent of Eostre. This is NOT the same thing as postulating a single entity who turns up across the centuries in different guises. That's Time Lords you're thinking of.
11. No, Ostara is not an old name for the Spring Equinox. Only modern pagans use it in that way. The Spring Equinox was first called 'Ostara' in the 1970s.
12. As rabbits were introduced to Britain by the Romans and are not an indigenous species, it is impossible for rabbits to have been sacred to any indigenous British Goddess.
13. No, Jacob Grimm didn't uncover a rich oral history that mentioned the Goddess Ostara. Grimm found no direct evidence for a Goddess called Ostara at all. He never claimed to have done so.
14. Yes, Grimm hypothesised the existence of the Goddess Ostara. He did so because he didn’t have any direct evidence of her. If he had encountered direct evidence, oral or otherwise, he would have recorded it.
15. No, people who debunk pagan myths about Easter aren't all Christians. In fact, many fundamentalist Christians don’t like Easter; they think it’s unbiblical and unchristian to celebrate it. It therefore suits them down to the ground to claim that Easter was originally Pagan. By contrast, the number of pagans who find ill-informed claims embarrassing and worthy of careful correction is growing rather high.
It's Jewish, not Pagan, if you look at any of the Romance languages at what they called Easter, it's a variation of Pesakh, see Pascha (Latin) Pasque (Italian) and Paques (French) the word Easter comes from a German word Eostre and was only recorded in the 8th C anyway, well after Christianity had been well founded in Europe. No doubt there were equinox/lux based fertility rites or festivals, but the dates of the Christian/Jewish feast of Passover wasn't transposed, it just happened to mostly be about the same in the Northern hemisphere. No doubt it helped to convert folks to new forms of celebration that the dates of old/new festivals were similar, but then early christian (Jewish still) celebration were lunar based - same as many pagan religions so it's not a massive surprise.
Ernie/TJ: Could it not be a bit of both? Ie, not originating from anything Pagan but Pagan influences added later?
It would have occured on a fixed date not variable. The date of an anniversary cannot change.
Ernie certainly has this bit right. It does occur on a fixed date (or at least, it did, originating from Pesach/Passover), just using a different calendar not the Gregorian one.
Not really knowing anything about it, I always assumed the eggs were a similar reason to why Jews eat them in a period of mourning - symbolising the circle of life.
Anyway, I don't really see why when religions have festivals at similar times or for similar reasons that they necessarily have to be copying or derived from each other. Surely if you believe in [insert deity of your choice] then that deity will have something to do with the harvest, seasons or whatever and will be celebrated at the relevant time, regardless of what other religions might be doing.
Pesach will be here soon, it starts on the fixed date of 15/Nissan, meaning anytime between 26/March & 25/April of any given solar year 😉
Edit: Like wot nick said 😁
Does it not make sense that pretty much everyone, at some point, celebrated something at a similar time of year. All these different celebrations have got mixed up over hundreds of years and borrowed bits from each other. Therefore we’ve ended up with celebrations of spring, new life, fertility, prophets, executions, resurrections, gods, lunar cycles etc that can be argued about on the internet for all eternity.
Just eat your chocolate and accept it’s all ancient bollocks from a time when we didn’t understand how the world works.
Just eat your chocolate and accept it’s all ancient bollocks from a time when we didn’t understand how the world works.
Amen! You should start a new religion based on that. I'd join!
Amen! You should start a new religion based on that. I’d join!
A religion based on eating fatty foods and arguing on the internet? We all belong anyway 😂
Does it not make sense that pretty much everyone, at some point, celebrated a form of spring happening.
Yup. But the Passover commemorates the exodus from Egypt, not the changing seasons.
To be fair this probably needs a contribution from SaxonRider
Sorry Ernie, I edited that bit to be more wide reaching. Looks like your quote now doesn’t make sense. That’s on me. Most world religions current and past seem to share a lot of similar themes. It’s because they’re all stories trying to explain how the world works. Still can’t believe the most boring ones are the most popular. I’d take the Norse and Greek pantheons over ‘bloke talking a lot and performing street magic’ that seem to make up the big three.
Where’s that packet of mini eggs!
But the Passover commemorates the exodus from Egypt, not the changing seasons.
It does but TBF it is also associated with the Omer temple offering marking the beginning of the barley harvest, so there is some harvest connection, although it's not the reason for the Passover holiday itself.
that pretty much everyone, at some point, celebrated something at a similar time of year.
I think this is probably true. many many religions are/were lunar based and if your religious days fall on things like "the first new moon after the equinox" it's going to be about the same date as all those other religions who make similar sorts of calculations...
so there is some harvest connection,
Yup the Jews recalled the exodus from Egypt in relation to the time of year that it occurred.
