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At vapes don't leave ****ing filthy butts all over the street. I've got 3 smokers in the road my house backs onto and the fagbutts all over the paths are just skank.
I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I've noticed vape smoke.
Thats not heavy drinking thats hard core alcoholism
But it wasn't alcoholism.... because I could stop any time with no problem.
I wasn't waking up craving a drink etc. I'd just be out with friends of a night.
I was frequently working in dry countries and I'd just stop... get bad and go out on the piss with my mates a few weeks/months later.
My point really is different addictions hit different people very differently. Most of the people still smoking are in the group that find it much harder or they would have given up.
Lots of people get over opiates and still can't stop smoking whereas others quit smoking really easily..
Excluding last week when I was on holiday and had wine with a meal I can go a month or longer and not touch a drop... but put me where i can't get nicotine and I'm immediately on edge and going stir crazy... and it prevents me working.
Essentially tho - the vape smoke has been inside someone, so it's full of their germs etc.. breathing all of that crap in when it's already been inside someone is kind of gross in my eyes.
I have no problem with people smoking or vaping in general & think the current regulations about smoking/vaping in public places is fine & needs no tightening or loosening.
I dont care I about your better life I just want to live mine without myself or my family having to breath in your vape.
the vape smoke has been inside someone, so it’s full of their germs etc..
Any chance you could stop breathing within 50metres of my vicinity please? 😆
Essentially tho – the vape smoke has been inside someone, so it’s full of their germs etc.. breathing all of that crap in when it’s already been inside someone is kind of gross in my eyes.
Agreed, it's almost like their breath has become visible. I wouldn't want to be breathing in the air someone else has had in their lungs previously. Oh wait....that doesn't work does it!!!!
People don't really think through what they type much. Prince John....I'm seeing the Prince Regent from Black Adder! Nice chap but farking stoopid!
But it wasn’t alcoholism…. because I could stop any time with no problem.
This is a complicated subject.
I drink a lot of alcohol, not a lot of spirits but lots of beer and wine.
I drink way to excess when I'm home but as I work offshore and onboard dry ships, for 4 to 6 mths of the year, I just stop once I'm there. According to some, from the quantity I can typically drink, I should not just stop as it will make me ill. It doesn't. I just stop. This is normally around 4 weeks but frequently it's 7 or 8 weeks.
I definitely feel better for not drinking for a few weeks. However, I don't crave alcohol when I'm working but the first thing I do when I get to the airport on the way home is to have a beer.
Some people would say this makes me alcohol dependent and hence an alcoholic. Others say if you don't "need" a drink everyday then you are not an alcoholic.
Personally, I enjoy a drink but know it's not good for you and will probably reduce my intake when I'm at home in the future.
I'm quite typical of people in my industry and I know plenty who drink a lot more than I do when home and then never touch drop for weeks at a time.
Addiction is a complicated thing.
There are some proper wee snowflakes on here... 🙂
People don’t really think through what they type much
My thinking was more the massive cloud of vapour when someone exhales vaping, compared to the amount of breath you see on a cold day
There are some proper wee snowflakes on here…
I know, make one joke about vaping or asking them to be considerate and they are off on one like the American gun nuts.
My thinking was more the massive cloud of vapour when someone exhales vaping, compared to the amount of breath you see on a cold day
🙂 Still not got it have you! You really think that the boundary of air from someone's lungs on a cold day is the visible breath? Bless xxx
clue - think about a ripe fart. One of those ones that emanates as a tiny little pocket of gas but the person the other side of the room falls over. Then think how much more air is in a full lung full of expelled breath. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean its not travelling.
Still not got it have you! You really think that the boundary of air from someone’s lungs on a cold day is the visible breath? Bless xxx
That's highly patronising - well done. Your mummy must be proud of her little vaping child.
Your mummy must be proud of her little vaping child.
Never vaped in my life. Or smoked for that matter. My childish mind just finds incomprehension amusing sometimes. Lots of reasons to be anti smoking (and some anti vaping) but yours was not one of them.
I wonder if any studies have been made to see if the transfer of airborne germs is increased in vapor which would probably make a very nice carrier.
I dont care I about your better life I just want to live mine without myself or my family having to breath in your vape.
the vape smoke has been inside someone, so it’s full of their germs etc..
Any chance you could stop breathing within 50metres of
I like the way you have combined posts from two people for effect.
Why would there be any more germs in vapour than in your breath?
Perhaps you need to get one of these? It’s a really really scary world out there. Pretty much everything is trying to kill you! Especially bastard vapers like me!
I like the way you have combined posts from two people for effect.
Yes, you are correct, not like I needed to, they were ridiculous enough on their own! 😆
Why would there be any more? Because there's a lot more moisture to cling to? It would also probably give a nicer conditions for longer survival on any hard surfaces. I think it's a reasonable question when the topic is use in public areas. Perhaps hospital waiting rooms etc. Thank you for the sarcastic picture though.
I’d stay in that oxygen tent if I were you
So
I dont care I about your better life I just want to live mine without myself or my family having to breath in your vape.
Is ridiculous
Yes, you are correct, not like I needed to, they were ridiculous enough on their own!
I'll remember this next time TJ has a rant about not wanting to be approached by other peoples friendly dogs for example. I really cant see how people not liking vape fumes in public spaces is that hard to understand.
You ok Hun? XX
I don’t see any need to relax the rules on vaping, although it really doesn’t bother me. Smokers and vapers have adapted to the current restrictions without any major issues.
I really agree with this post - let the current smokers and vapers get on with what they are doing right now. Let's not relax regulations and certainly let's not start allowing advertising vape products - I really do not see one single positive in doing that.
This is a complicated subject.
I drink a lot of alcohol, not a lot of spirits but lots of beer and wine.
I drink way to excess when I’m home but as I work offshore and onboard dry ships, for 4 to 6 mths of the year, I just stop once I’m there. According to some, from the quantity I can typically drink, I should not just stop as it will make me ill. It doesn’t. I just stop. This is normally around 4 weeks but frequently it’s 7 or 8 weeks.
I definitely feel better for not drinking for a few weeks. However, I don’t crave alcohol when I’m working but the first thing I do when I get to the airport on the way home is to have a beer.
Some people would say this makes me alcohol dependent and hence an alcoholic. Others say if you don’t “need” a drink everyday then you are not an alcoholic.
Personally, I enjoy a drink but know it’s not good for you and will probably reduce my intake when I’m at home in the future.
I’m quite typical of people in my industry and I know plenty who drink a lot more than I do when home and then never touch drop for weeks at a time.
Addiction is a complicated thing.
Sounds to me like you're like me with alcohol.. though I barely drink now as my lifestyle changed but I wasn't ever drinking aftershave offshore. I also have known a few people that do the same with smoking but different people.
I've been a heavy drinker numerous times but largely from social aspects and presently have a nearly 9yr old and I was drinking 8+ pints most nights before he came along.
One of the things about rotation though is you feel it's time to catch up.... your beer at the airport becomes more of a defining thing... and most of the people you socialise with tend to also be on rotation...
I switched that though... now when I'm flying home I start checking for uplift availability etc.
I don’t see any need to relax the rules on vaping, although it really doesn’t bother me. Smokers and vapers have adapted to the current restrictions without any major issues.
I really agree with this post – let the current smokers and vapers get on with what they are doing right now. Let’s not relax regulations and certainly let’s not start allowing advertising vape products – I really do not see one single positive in doing that.
Same here except I dont like the vape fumes, mind you I have the same problem in some peoples houses with those plug in air fresheners...make me gag.
5 years ago I smoked 20 bensons a day. Now I dont.
This has made my life infinitely better in lots of ways. I’d imagine it’s made other people’s life infinitely better too.
So I frankly couldn’t give a flying * about the petty, sanctimonious bleating of those getting their whiney, snippy, middle-class petticoats all ruffled about getting the odd waft of my menthol vapour as I walk down the street. It’s not like I’m sat in your *ing front room doing it!
So you've gone from smelly, unhealthy and selfish to slightly less smelly, unhealthy and selfish? Wow! Still at least you've the 2018 award for the most inappropriate use of the word "infinitely" to look forward to.
We were sat at a table in an outdoor bar at the Fringe last week. Couple of "vapers" sat down next to us with that disgusting stuff blowing in our faces. Asked them politely to stop or move. Total refusal. Selfish sods.
Apologies if that all sounds like a rant but I have asthma which doctors say is most likely the result of lots of smokers smoking when near me when I was young so maybe you can understand why I have little sympathy for any of them.
Lets ban air fresheners! 😆 While we are at it, i don't like your family, lets ban your family! 😆
Let’s not relax regulations and certainly let’s not start allowing advertising vape products – I really do not see one single positive in doing that.
the garage nearest to me has an advertising board, 2 flags and a massive display of them. Branded to look cool and appeal to younger people. The advertising has already started and it's going to keep going, they now have a nice blank space in front of the ciggs to put the adverts on
I wouldn’t fancy being the ad agency tasked with the brief of making vaping look ‘cool’
i wish you lot would make your minds up. One minute we look like nob-heads (fellating C3PO etc etc), the next it ‘looks cool’
Well, it’s either one or the other?
Which?
Lets ban air fresheners!
While we are at it, i don’t like your family, lets ban your family!
Comprehension is not a strength of yours is it!! Life must be tough for you all I can offer is my sympathy.
Well, it’s either one or the other?
Not sure why you think that has to be the case, I think sliders and socks is beyond stupid, others dont.
I wouldn’t fancy being the ad agency tasked with the brief of making vaping look ‘cool’
i wish you lot would make your minds up. One minute we look like nob-heads (fellating C3PO etc etc), the next it ‘looks cool’
They need to make the concept look cool, like drinking alcopops back in the day. I assume you have seen some of the branding and advertising, whats your professional onions on that?
So you’ve gone from smelly, unhealthy and selfish to slightly less smelly, unhealthy and selfish? Wow! Still at least you’ve the 2018 award for the most inappropriate use of the word “infinitely” to look forward to.
We were sat at a table in an outdoor bar at the Fringe last week. Couple of “vapers” sat down next to us with that disgusting stuff blowing in our faces. Asked them politely to stop or move. Total refusal. Selfish sods.
Apologies if that all sounds like a rant but I have asthma which doctors say is most likely the result of lots of smokers smoking when near me when I was young so maybe you can understand why I have little sympathy for any of them.
In reverse order ...
If they had vaping bad then it's pretty likely you wouldn't have developed the asthma ....
It's really hardly more disgusting than man perfumes/deodorants and less harmful than many deodorants!
The unspoken rule I follow ... if someone is there first then that's completely different.
I was sat outside in the smoking area of the airport (Palma) the other day... specifically designated smoking... and had some germans sit next to me then ask me to stop.... there were lots and lots of seats...
Had I gone into the smoking area and instead I'd sat next to them I'd have looked for someone already smoking or vaping... even though this was a designated smoking area.
From my perspective I understand your distaste but in reality its some perfumed vapour.. I hesitate to mention but one of the really disgusting odours I find is Red Bull... the smell really turns my stomach.... possibly only rivalled by Jaegermaester... and I've left places before because of this but I'm not axing for them to be banned (even with possible health risks)
Dunno about cool, but isn't "pluming"a thing? (As in some ecigs/formulae make more vape.) Spec with the cyberpunk crowd, with their little chimneys? Whatever, it looks a bit daft and frankly as a very ex smoker I prefer the smell of tobacco, but jesus ****ing christ, we're talking less lung cancer here, fewer orphaned kids. And people object to the occasional waft of air freshener? Why won't you think of the children!
(Hitting the right tone for this discussion?)
From my perspective I understand your distaste but in reality its some perfumed vapour.. I hesitate to mention but one of the really disgusting odours I find is Red Bull… the smell really turns my stomach…. possibly only rivalled by Jaegermaester… and I’ve left places before because of this but I’m not axing for them to be banned (even with possible health risks)
and if they were vaporising this and spraying it around I'd be concerned. Which places did you have to leave because of the smell?
Comprehension is not a strength of yours is it!! Life must be tough for you all I can offer is my sympathy.
No need to get your knickers in a twist about me. I'm doing fine laughing at the silliness of all this! 😆
I’ve left places before because of this but I’m not axing for them to be banned
Not sure anyone is here, just saying rules dont need to be relaxed.
I’m doing fine laughing at the silliness of all this!
I expect that happens a lot with you, cute!
I would keep regulations on Smoking in public places as they are right now.
However, I have nothing against the lifting of certain rules that do seem bit silly to me. Limiting a vape tank to 2ml has no effect what so ever - it just causes people to fill up more often!
Same here except I dont like the vape fumes.
I don't like the fumes either but I find their allowed use just about on the tolerable scale. Sitting in a train carriage with people vaping in it during my commute certainly wouldn't be tolerable.
I expect that happens a lot with you, cute!
The world is full of silly people that get upset at all manner of trivialities.
Stevextc, just noticed your comments about Baku on the other thread. Without any knowledge about you and just putting it out there, my brother used to drink like you talk about going dry when on rigs etc and he died in Baku due to the drinking. Glad to here your ways have changed.
The world is full of silly people.
Obviously
Does it really come down to much more than tobacco money pulling the strings in the background? The battle may be lost for them cigarette wise, but the war of rinsing people for money regardless of any moral cost is far from over. It's a bright new future of addiction! It reminds me of Yes Prime Minister.
Rinsing people for money? Jesus! What planet do you live on?
My ‘habit’ costs me approximately a fiver a week. I can usually spend more per week on crisps.
The 20 Bensons I used to smoke every day are now over a tenner a pop.
My ‘habit’ costs me approximately a fiver a week. I can usually spend more per week on crisps.
The 20 Bensons I used to smoke every day are now over a tenner a pop.
Most of the tenner is tax and yet tobacco companies make money so your point might not be valid.
Stevextc, just noticed your comments about Baku on the other thread. Without any knowledge about you and just putting it out there, my brother used to drink like you talk about going dry when on rigs etc and he died in Baku due to the drinking. Glad to here your ways have changed.
Thanks... I don't see me ever going back to that amount of drinking unless I'm ready to die.
Sorry to hear about your brother though. There is a lot of pressure in certain industries be it drinking or snorting coke.... and the pressure is both tangible and implied.
A lot of it came down to boredom.... on rotation... most of your mates are working and the people you know that aren't are drinking along with camps etc. where the pastime is making alcohol. I know quite a few of my ex-colleagues who have passed away prematurely and I suspect drink has been a big factor for many.
I don't think this was that different in the old day's of DH with Warner and Peaty and Co....
However specific to Baku I was invited out with some Russians for a meal... I got pressure from my big manager to go and had no intention of drinking as much as the Russians were going to drink... so I just told him I was on antibiotics... but mostly now I just don't have the lifestyle I had.
My manager was ill for 2 days....
Reducing my costs from seventy dabs a week to five, while improving my health and general well-being isn’t exactly leaving me feeling like I’m being ruthlessly exploited by an evil capitalist conspiracy, to be honest. 😂
😆
Reducing my costs from seventy dabs a week to five, while improving my health and general well-being isn’t exactly leaving me feeling like I’m being ruthlessly exploited by an evil capitalist conspiracy, to be honest.
Which has exactly nothing to do with what the poster was talking about.
I suppose it cost me more if I could vape in the office and on public transport - I may get up to over a tenner a week - my present weekly sausage roll budget.
So maybe it is a ploy by evil parasitic corporate lobbyists after all?
The bastards!!
We were sat at a table in an outdoor bar at the Fringe last week. Couple of “vapers” sat down next to us with that disgusting stuff blowing in our faces. Asked them politely to stop or move. Total refusal. Selfish sods.
No more selfish than expecting them to move.
My ‘habit’ costs me approximately a fiver a week. I can usually spend more per week on crisps.
The 20 Bensons I used to smoke every day are now over a tenner a pop.
Think of it the other way around though, about 82% of cigaret price is tax (according to some TMA bumf on google)
£5 a week is £4 of product and £1 of VAT (or maybe £3 of product and some corporation tax, business rates etc, I've no idea what the tobaco companies included in their 82%).
Anyway the point is, the vaping companies would REALLY like their products to be viewed as an aid to quitting smoking to avoid their £3/week product becoming a £15/week product, or a £10/day product if it were taxed in line with other "expensive things we wish you'd use a bit less of" by the government like petrol and beer.
Reducing my costs from seventy dabs a week to five, while improving my health and general well-being isn’t exactly leaving me feeling like I’m being ruthlessly exploited by an evil capitalist conspiracy, to be honest
Which has exactly nothing to do with what the poster was talking about.
Imo it has everything to do with the op. There is a gap in revenue due to cig sales/taxes dropping, so mps are looking for another cash crop. Encourage vaping get more people hooked then jack the tax. The next stage is to propose an over the counter drug that will not be supplied by nhs to combat this addiction...follow the money...
the current rules are fine for the most part and do not need to be relaxed.
There is a gap in revenue due to cig sales/taxes dropping, so mps are looking for another cash crop.
Goes against all strategic health advice. This is one where the industry has outpaced the regulations.and they are playing catch up. The long term impact of tobacco will be haunting the tax payer for years to come
Does it really come down to much more than tobacco money pulling the strings in the background?
Probably not but then does it REALLY matter for those who are still smoking anyway?
mikewsmith: Goes against all strategic health advice.
Not really, I mean it would be good to ban fast food and stuff ... a bit demolition man and salt.
Or they can try and reduce people's dependence on tobacco or the harm it does.
The long term impact of tobacco will be haunting the tax payer for years to come
Not to mention their widows, widowers, children etc. but a far healthier alternative is possible, even quite easy if people .. the last of a dying breed as it were do want to swap for vaping without creating a whole black market of smuggled or home made tobacco.
Some people are taking this discussion a bit off piste with tit for tat about whether it smells bad or not.
I thought it was meant to be about whether it is irresponsible of the government to recommend that vaping should be more aggressively marketed and encouraged given the current lack of long-term health data?
No one is disagreeing that it’s significantly less harmful than smoking, and unlike passive smoking, there are probably no health issues for “passive vapers”. Nevertheless, I think the government should be more cautious until there are more data.
Me and my mates all used to smoke. Now none of us does. We’ve all packed in using e-cigs. So my own anecdotal evidence is that it’s a massive aid to packing in smoking. We’d all tried and failed repeatedly before
And to those of you complaining about people smoking or vaping in pub beer gardens, I’d just like to remind you that we earned that right, man!
You weren’t sat in that beer garden in January when it was -6! You weren’t huddled on that picnic bench in horizontal sleet in March! You were inside, dry and warm enjoying your smoke free pint!
So to quote Morrisey....
You just haven’t earned it yet, baby!
😛
I thought it was meant to be about whether it is irresponsible of the government to recommend that vaping should be more aggressively marketed
The answer to that should always be no. A government should never encourage people to get addicted to something. Whether it is moving from one addictive thing to another doesn't make it better.
I don’t think they’re talking about handing them out in schools. They’re talking about promoting it to smokers, through the NHS, as a means to pack in, thus saving squillions of pounds in treating the damage done further down the line.
Makes perfect sense to me. We could set up support groups in pub beer gardens
I don’t think they’re talking about handing them out in schools. They’re talking about promoting it to smokers, through the NHS, as a means to pack in, thus saving squillions of pounds in treating the damage done further down the line.
And letting people use them in more places.... Seems like you like to suggest something worse then tell us it's not that bad.
Happy to promote them to smokers, nice brown packet, simple lettering, no need for flags, billboards and commercial operations all over the place. If it's a medical device then go with that.
Have you somehow missed the principles at the heart of an advanced capitalist society? 😉
if it’s legal, and so far not proved to be damaging, you can market it how you like, within the regulations.
If we start going down the road you’re advocating then before long the drug gangs in Laaaahndan will be killing each other in the street to control the Haribo supply.
A few of us have pointed out repeatedly that just because you don’t like something, that doesn’t mean the government has some moral duty to do something to stop it
A few of us have pointed out repeatedly that just because you don’t like something, that doesn’t mean the government has some moral duty to do something to stop it
The government regulates many drugs and addictive substances. For control and for financial gain, It's nothing new and uncommon. It also has restrictions on advertising on things like alcohol and gambling.
You have your nicotine addiction already, want to give that gift to more people?
Have you somehow missed the principles at the heart of an advanced capitalist society?
An advanced capitalist society regulates and protects people
No one is saying that Vaping should be banned, but i believe it should not be promoted with messages like “it’s 95% safer than smoking” because that’s not been proven, and can’t be proven without a heck of a lot more data.
The article that I read did not suggest that the government propose to promote it “only to smokers, via the NHS”. If that’s the case then fine, but I’m not sure that is their intent.
It’s not the Wild West! The EU put strict regulation on e-cigs a few years back, meaning that the shop I get my liquids from had to skip half their stock as the health warnings weren’t prominent enough
Its the main reason I voted for Brexit 😛
Strikes me that there's a big difference between "using e-cigarettes to stop smoking" and "switching from fags to e-cigarettes"
According to the department of health, e-cigarettes contribute to 20000 "quits" every year, which is great. But there's almost 3 million vapers. So it's barely even a connection, statistically. I've no doubt that swapping 1 smoker for 1 vaper is likely to be a net health benefit but we're swapping 1 smoker for 50 vapers at this point.
And besides, smoking rates have been crashing for years- vaping can't be the lead factor in that, it pre-dates it.
So basically, should stopping people from smoking be an important part of the argument here? Seems like it should just be "is vaping OK or not" since the number of users is measured in millions and the number of stopped smokers is measured in thousands.
Got a link to those stats Northwind? Because ‘swapping 1 smoker for 50 vapers’ sounds more than a little bit dubious, to say the least.
binners, you need to find a better pub to drink in, no sitting outside in the cold for me, i can use my e-cig in the pub.
if its packed(very rare) or someone is sat close to me eating because the eating room is full i don't but otherwise i will do.
Bigfoot - I use my e-cig in my local, with no issues. I’m sure that to some that will make us the worst human beings on the planet.
I was just making the point that smokers and ex-smokers (who now vape instead) have suffered the frost-bite that entitles them to indulge on the 2 sunny days we get a year 😉
Flat roofs?
You know what else would be a key weapon in helping people to quit? A ****ing tazer.
A quick zap every time they reach for a bine or their fruit-flavoured mouth dildo. If I wanted to walk through a cloud of fruit flavoured poor choices and spittle at the pub, I'd go to a ****ing LUSH store with a pint in hand when it's rammed with single mums. Peace. 😉
No... micropub. The flat roofed places still have ashtrays, like the smoking ban never happened..
Got a link to those stats Northwind? Because ‘swapping 1 smoker for 50 vapers’ sounds more than a little bit dubious, to say the least.
It is not a good comparison probably due to data collection. The 2.9 million figure comes from an ASH survey, it found 1.5 million of vapers are ex smokers and another 1.3 million are part smokers and part vapers, the remaining 100,000 is probably rounding and adopters who haven't smoked.
Has stats for growth in vaping and links the Public Health England "20000 per year" which is how I derived the 50 new vapers for every quitter.
The 2.9 actually didn't come from the ASH survey as Mefty says, but from the ONS's Opinions and Lifestyle Survey- though it's not surprising that they came to the same result.
(maybe worth noting that the ASH survey records only "ex smokers", rather than people who've switched from fags to vaping. Anyone who's ever smoked before, and stopped, and then started vaping will be in that stat too)
No more selfish than expecting them to move.
so if I came and sat upwind from you in a beer garden and lit up some foul-smelling joss sticks so all the fumes went your way, then you would be OK with that ?
Strikes me that there’s a big difference between “using e-cigarettes to stop smoking” and “switching from fags to e-cigarettes”
According to the department of health, e-cigarettes contribute to 20000 “quits” every year, which is great. But there’s almost 3 million vapers. So it’s barely even a connection, statistically. I’ve no doubt that swapping 1 smoker for 1 vaper is likely to be a net health benefit but we’re swapping 1 smoker for 50 vapers at this point.
And besides, smoking rates have been crashing for years- vaping can’t be the lead factor in that, it pre-dates it.
So basically, should stopping people from smoking be an important part of the argument here? Seems like it should just be “is vaping OK or not” since the number of users is measured in millions and the number of stopped smokers is measured in thousands.
As binders said, that looks extremely dubious
(maybe worth noting that the ASH survey records only “ex smokers”, rather than people who’ve switched from fags to vaping. Anyone who’s ever smoked before, and stopped, and then started vaping will be in that stat too)
ASH is ASH ... it's a political lobby with its own agenda and in conflict with many quit smoking organisations.
I know many people who vape... I don't know a single one who started who wasn't already a smoker. That's not to say they don't exist but I don't know any.
I know lots of smokers who quit without vape or e-cigs or any other aid ... well done!
I know some who used champix or similar ... great but for some (and I have reason to believe it's the group ho find it hardest to quit) the side effects are terrible.
Some used vape and/or e-cigs ...and that's what wokred for them
some Vape but still smoke 1-2 a day.. or when they can't get the liquid
Some of all of them started again !
Some started vaping and still do and others then gave that up...nicotine is much less addictive than tobacco smoke.
All of these are successes, even if someone stops for a year or 5 years its better than not.
If someone goes from 20-30/d to 1-2/d it's still a success though ASH wouldn't treat it as such.
As binders said, that looks extremely dubious
OK, I get your well argued case there
I know many people who vape… I don’t know a single one who started who wasn’t already a smoker. That’s not to say they don’t exist but I don’t know any.
Your extensive research is admirable, it really sells the case. What is the name of your research organisation?
I think those ‘stats’ are just proof of the phrase about lies, damn lies and statistics.
They look like absolute cobblers to me.
As stated above, I know loads of people who vape. All have done so after using them to pack in the fags.
I’ve never met a single person who’s just got up one day and thought “that vaping lark looks great! I’ve never smoked but I reckon I need nicotine in my life, so I’ll give that a go!”
Has anyone else? Considering there are apparently millions of them out there....
I think those ‘stats’ are just proof of the phrase about lies, damn lies and statistics.
They look like absolute cobblers to me.
The best way to prove that is with some better stats or research though.
You could conduct your own Mike.
Next time you’re asking people to move away from you, or to stop vaping altogether, just tag on a question about why they started their filthy disgusting habit in the first place?
and some classic lines in this ad piece
https://veppocig.com/non-smoker-vaping/
These guys are certainly interested in growing their market share
https://aspenvalleyvapes.com/bad-idea-non-smokers-start-vaping/
From 2017 -
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39523857
The Royal Society for Public Health (RSPH) said 87% of shops were knowingly or unwittingly prepared to sell e-cigarettes to people who have never smoked or vaped.
Just under half of the stores did not check whether the customers had smoked before, and three-quarters of those that did still encouraged non-smokers to start vaping, the RSPH claimed...
Footage from their investigation showed one retailer recommending a customer, who told him she did not smoke, choose a vaping liquid with 6mg nicotine content rather than 0mg.
He told her: "The nicotine does affect how much of like a hit you get at the back of your throat, so if you want a bit of that, I'd say go for a six."
Millions of people made the decision to start smoking in the past, perhaps encouraged by advertising and widespread smoking in public places. Why wouldn’t the same happen with vaping if it was aggressively marketed and allowed in public places?