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To use trail centres....surely the discriminatory charging is not legal your honour.
Yours sincerely the incensed on your behalf.
Which trail centres charge?
Do they provide a plug for you?
Which trail centres charge?
Often those that rely on uplift fees for their income.
Maybe all rider/bike combos should be weighed and the charges based on their combined mass. So a skinny bloke on an e-bike pays less than a big bloke on a standard one?
Why not? More servicing, more resources and apparently more more and tear...
If it’s their land, they can charge what they like.
Personally, I would charge charge double for singlespeeds...
I dunno I flicked past the bogtime reading sensationalised news feed heading as I don't have an ebike
But
Looks like Bike park Wales and NOW......bmcc
Once tpeople realise it's a rich tax they will go back to golf
Do you manage to ride the trails twice with your Motocross assisted pedalling bike?
I did hear they were way more fun so time to pay for those extra smiles 😉
I thought BPW was free and the uplift was what cost?
E-bikes on an uplift???? that makes No sense?
I thought BPW was free and the uplift was what cost?
Park entry is £10 to BPW, £15 for E-bikes.
E-bikes on an uplift???? that makes No sense?
No, it doesn’t. But they aren’t paying for the uplift, hence they are being charged more to use the park.
Also, it’s not ‘trail centres’, it’s uplifted bike parks, but let’s not let facts get in the way of a click bait thread designed to get a reaction...
Who lifts the ebikes onto the uplift rack?
Geoff Capes*
*one for the older forum members 😀
Do you manage to ride the trails twice with your assisted pedalling bike?
According to my mate who owns one, yes, you do. He reckons he gets double the amount of runs on his eBike as he does on a normal bike.
He was a big budgie breeder you know?
Jon Pall Sigmarsson?
I'm not a fan of trail centres anyway, but having ridden Gisburn in the summer, the experience was rendered even less enjoyable than before, due to having to constantly get out of the way, on the singletrack climbs, to let e-bikes come bombing past.
I can see a point where they end up as places exclusively used by e-bikes.
i really dont get this whole ebike thing, if the engine was combustion they would be a moped and not allowed on footpaths trails etc so just because they are electric what is the difference?
i personally would not get out the way of one on a climb.
i really dont get this whole ebike thing, if the engine was combustion they would be a moped and not allowed on footpaths trails
As long as they fulfilled the criteria, they would (pedal assist, not throttle. 250w power, cut out at 15.5mph) but it’s difficult to make a combustion engine do that so manufacturers don’t.
Oh, and normal bikes aren’t allowed on footpaths either, obvs.
i personally would not get out the way of one on a climb.
How would you know it's not just a faster rider?
^^
I just ting my bell and scream "race leader".
At all times.
Yours,
DrP
Yes, I've heard you DrP. Very annoying 😆
Due to the fat belly of the ebike rider on my helmet mounted Google glasses with front and rear facing cameras.
Yup they've doubled the price of the licence at Cannock for the hateful things.
Oh good, another ebike thread!
i personally would not get out the way of one on a climb.
How would you know it’s not just a faster rider?
Because someone putting out 250W more than average on a climb looks like Gerraint Thomas. E'bikers generally dont look like TdF riders. Except when they get range anxiety and start looking at their stem like Chris Froome.
I'm all in favour of e-bikes. More commuters on bikes, more older/unfit people on bikes, more delivery companies using bikes.
There's just one small downside I've noted on randos and even just out on trails. Any male under about the age of 40 on one is likely to be the MTB equivalent of a BMW or white Audi driver. And any male over 60 on one will probably crash it shortly so avoid being part of that crash.
ebikerists could always ride on free/natural trails or do the same levels of laziness extend to route planning 😉
S'obvious innit that they increase wear and tear - more power, more distance so an obvious and simple solution in a pay to play environment. If I was a bike park / trail centre hound regularly driving an hour to get there I'd probably get one just to increase the miles.
Who lifts the ebikes onto the uplift rack?
An eCrane
Oh good, another ebike thread!
Really on a loosely related to cycling bike forum ...what did you expect a thread on leaving the EU
Seeing that this relates to pay to play venues with uplift being park of the main offering/business sounds spot on, you are getting access more trails than the ride up users, paying less than the uplift users etc. Sounds win win for the ebike rider there. If it helps the place build and maintain the trails and employ people then it's a good thing.
Because someone putting out 250W more than average on a climb looks like Gerraint Thomas. E’bikers generally dont look like TdF riders.
1. You usually can't see that much detail when someone is behind you
2. How do you know it would take a tdf rider to overtake Gav?
3. Not many MTB riders look like tdf riders
4. I'm bored so could think of more of these all day
Does BPW have a turnstile or something? Haven't been since way before it exited (Gethin Forest pk).So I'm wondering what's to stop me just eebing in and riding the trails? (some of which, if thy're still there I helped build)
you get a doo dah for your bars... i assume a 'ranger' could stop you if he doesn't see one on your bars.
Who lifts the ebikes onto the uplift rack?
An eCrane
'e Man.
Got an ebike, no issue with being charged more, seems fair enough to be honest. Next time I go to BPW I'll probably look to buy a few single uplift tickets at the end of the day when my battery is toast and some people have had enough and gone home.
Perhaps they should have an audible warning like electric cars.
I was riding up a climb with the usual three climbers, reached a junction and stopped to wait for the rest of the group. Hadn't realised a club member who would normally have been way behind was sat on my wheel on his new e-bike. He braked and swerved but thinks he must have also given a push on the pedal. Anyhow, he went over the edge of the trail, tried to put a foot down in fresh air and tumbled down a steep thorny bank, eventually stopping upside down under 23kg of e-bike. A torn achilles tendon and various cuts and bruises. Sorry, J-L. 🙁
Isn't it annoying how so many emojis just show a blank squares on this site? Cos Edukator's story made me properly laugh, but I can't tell if he put a happy or a sad face at the end! 😀 <- (a grin)
I'm not sure that not paying attention is exclusive to e-bike riders. Although we are all very fat so don't stop easily.
A torn achilles tendon and various cuts and bruises
made me properly laugh,
You're a monster. 🙂
The charge is so they can build berms on all the climbs so the e-bikers don't power off the edge.
No need to get e-rate 😉
annoying how so many emojis just show a blank squares on this site
they work for me. It was a sad face. Although an enigmatic black square sounds good too.
It's a sad face, I felt really guilty about it. J-L is one the good guys on this planet and spent a couple of months hobbling around because I hadn't looked over my shoulder before stopping. It's funny to read but none of us laughed as it happened, one of those falls when you know the outcome isn't going to be good.
Hmm... thanks Weeksy. I guess it's no longer owned by forstry anymore then? So fair enough they charge whatever they want.
Discrimination against the disabled isn't cool though 😉
Edukator’s story made me properly laugh
Really? Don't go and see live comedy or search youtube for "fail compilation" you'll probably have a siezure
Or I might laugh eh?
I'd feel bad about J-L's injuries, but I don't know him.
but I don’t know him.
Exactly, if it helps he's French too. 😉 The Russian drivers' shouts and curses as they wait for the inevitable impact are some of my favourite Youtube moments. I realise this makes me a very bad person.
There are bridleways throughout Gethin woods from the back of the visitor centre. Free to ebikes.
There, I've said it now.
All scottish trail centres are free to use. You pay for car parking.
Does BPW have a turnstile or something? Haven’t been since way before it exited (Gethin Forest pk).So I’m wondering what’s to stop me just eebing in and riding the trails? (some of which, if thy’re still there I helped build)
Not really no, you need to put a little plasic band on your bars, but it's not actively enforced you wouldn't be able to get on the uplift without one, even if you wanted to pay-per-lift.
I will admit in the past to riding without one, they used to start the kids club at 9, but not open the ticket office till 09:30 (and there's always a big queue) so to get a lap or 2 in whilst Jnr was in kids club I used to sneak up at 9. (kids club comes with a 'free' day pass for adults anyway).
All scottish trail centres are free to use. You pay for car parking.
Seem to remember it being per bike up at Golspie.
Discrimination against the disabled isn’t cool though 😉
not all e-bikers are disabled though.
Maybe showing a certificate of disablement should exempt you from the extra fee, and maybe showing a cert of disablement should also entitle you to some sort of tax break when buying the bike ?
Having someone go past me on a hill on an E-Bike doesnt bother me, its pedaling up a hill and people pushing up not getting out the way that is more annoying.
Maybe if I get an ebike I could actually run them over...
All scottish trail centres are free to use.
The vast majority of all the UK ones are. it's just the DH/park ones that run an uplift as part of their business model that charge. (other than parking etc)
Who lifts the ebikes onto the uplift rack?
An eCrane
‘e Man.
Does 'e have the power? 😆
All scottish trail centres are free to use. You pay for car parking.
My local trail centre is £25 a year, parking is free.
No0beer - where is that? Its basically illegal to charge for access to land in Scotland - my guess is thats a parking fee not a pay to ride.
"illegal to charge for access to land in Scotland"
That'll be handy next time Scotland are playing at Murrayfield or I fancy a quick spin around Knockhill or a round at St Andrews.
"Got an ebike, no issue with being charged more, seems fair enough to be honest."
Ditto. I'm not sure what I'll do next time I go to BPW. Either take the e-bike or strap 10lbs of lead to the downtube of my normal bike to make the suspension work as well as the e-bike's...
I have walked and ridden around st andrews golf course - access rights apply. Obviously not at murryfield or knockhill as that is not land where access rights apply nor is it paying to access the land
"not land where access rights apply"
The point I was trying to make is that neither is a trail centre. Land Reform Act (Scotland) 2003 6 (1) (e).
No0beer – where is that? Its basically illegal to charge for access to land in Scotland – my guess is thats a parking fee not a pay to ride.
Kelburn estate. Parking is free, always has been. We pay 25 quid a year, they built and maintain the trails. Sure we could all just ignore them, ride it anyway, then they'd stop the work and we'd all suffer.
It must be odd to live in your world, where everything is black or white, legal or illegal.
ajaj - actually (most) trail centres are land where access laws apply. NO trail centre in scotland has been shown to be "land set aside for a particular purpose". Even if they were then access rights still apply like they do on golf courses.All the seven stanes are open access land
No beer - so a voluntary contribution to trail building then? seems reasonable. Its not a charge to access the land. It cannot be by my understanding of the law. Where is scotroutes - he knows this stuff better than me 😉
Past tense there Nobeer, did you not see that post last year? Obviously wasn't making enough money.
I don't care if ebikes overtake me on the uphills, what does annoy me is arseholes battering their way through without as much as a warning.
Aye, circumstances have changed SK, Nick that did most of the building is gone, but I just like to challenge Tj and his know everything statements.
People pay to go cycling? and the Gym? and Play 5 aside?
Weird.
It's actually free.
People pay to go cycling? and the Gym? and Play 5 aside?
Weird.
You are free to go cycling where ever you want to, if however you want to go and ride a bike on some top man made trails that require a lot of effort to build you are entirely free to exchange cash for that, you could even try a truffle shuffle in front of the ticket queue if you want, or see how much that chip on your shoulder is worth.
Yeah I know, was kinda hoping you were going to tell me I was misinformed and there was a change of plan.
"You are free to go cycling where ever you want to, if however you want to go and ride a bike on some top man made trails that require a lot of effort to build you are entirely free to exchange cash for that, you could even try a truffle shuffle in front of the ticket queue if you want, or see how much that chip on your shoulder is worth."
Whoosh
hahah
C'mon NoBeer that's hardly a challenge now is it?
😀
😂 @ geex
Unfortunately not Squirrelking, I think they have realised there's no money in MTB and will go back to focusing on the horsey set, drunk pheasant shooting set and the manky looking glampistas. 😊
Ah well, back to Dougie Park it is. Wonder if anyone would notice a run down the hydro pipeline?
Dougie Park is a blast from the past!
Let's be fair, you could easily ride bpw without paying a penny.
Let’s be fair, you could easily ride bpw without paying a penny.
Add Inners uplift to that too...
Hydro pipeline SK? Tbh, the trails at Kelburn won't disappear, We'll probably do a bit of work on them, as will the Fairlie lads, and there will be no closing for winter as there was before as per the estate rules.
I only ever use it as a couple of last runs after coming off the moor anyway, it's not big enough to justify a whole ride there, shame really, as it had the potential to be much bigger if they'd followed through on their initial plans to go right up beyond the tree line.
Yeah the buried pipeline from Bellsdale up to the dam at the Gretas. The track is an absolute shocker with zero drainage so nobody walks up there, it's passable in summer but otherwise a mudfest. Put in a bit of drainage though and you could probably sculpt something out of it albeit in a straight line...
Dunno about keeping trails going, I know people were wanting to build in there for years with no joy, I imagine they wouldn't be above wrecking everything to keep folk away. As you say it's a shame as the land doesn't particularly lend itself to trails despite the elevation. Lots of gravel though.
I may email the estate just to see what nonsense they come up with! 🙂