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Our 17 month Springer / Cocker cross caught and ate a live pigeon on Monday morning. She's always chased birds but never caught them. This one didn't try to fly off - it was either already injured or busy doing something else - the dog got lucky. She gnawed it up and then proceeded to eat the entire thing and refused to come back to me / kept running off. She's done the same thing with a squirrel.
Some internet pages suggest it could escalate, however a couple of people I know say its just a dog thing, someone's has eaten 4 pigeon's already this year.
We've put a muzzle on her for her off-lead walks but is this OTT? Should we go to a dog behaviourist or is it pointless as its such a strong instinct? We'll keep an eye on her to see if her behaviour changes / escalates, but she's always been soft as softiness around people / children.
If nothing else we're going to start re-inforcing the recall / come commands.
More training would be good but you can't knock the diet. Cheaper than the raw we feed our dog.
Que’?
Springers are fetch and return dogs..
Have you been missing it’s feed time 🤣
It is taking the raw diet to the extreme!
I do walk her first thing in the morning on an empty stomach.....
I read it wasn't good to feed them immediately before / after exercise
I think expecting a bit of reinforcing recall might be overly optimistic.Our Vizsla keeps chasing foxes - it's like a switch has gone in his head and he's focused on nothing else - I'm more worried about him actually catching one than the I would be th occasion pigeon, tbh.
Unless there's a danger of the dog getting a disease from eating one is it anything to worry about?
Springers ‘tend to be fetch/carry and soft grip.. its like they were designed for the task... oh wait.. they were 🤪
I had two springers, S1 was bonkers and would chase anything down if it even farted in a field a mile away, S2 would sit dribbling over my wellies whilst watching S1 run himself to sleep.
Beautiful animals, totally compelling and awesomely addictive.
Enjoy, suspect some training may be in order 🤣
Good luck with that 👍👍👍
I doubt you'll get your dog to return once it's got sight of prey. We had a dog trainer in (who specialises in spaniels, keeping and breeding her own) and even she admitted it's pretty difficult to get them to come when they have the scent.
Our female Westie does this.
So far we've had two pigeons, and 1 Squirrel this year.
Our Male Westie?
Well, he sits alongside next doors cat, and just lets the world drift by..
A Gundog trainer would be a good start. And if using a muzzle on the dog try to make sure it doesn’t see the muzzle as a punishment.
Dog chases bird catches one kills it and eats it. Not really an issue is it. Mine tried to give me a live rat once the ****ing idiot hound...its what dogs do.
Our 1yr old Sprocker will chase anything with wings. Even after it takes off and circles around she's still chasing it. Sometimes Spaniels aren't the most intelligent of animals.
She chases birds, rabbits, squirrels, her own tail. Yet to catch any of them, don't think she;d know what to do with it if she did. We also have a 6 yr old Sprocker who has a tennis ball obsession. 1yr old will chase the ball and get to it first just to prove a point that she is younger and quicker but has no interest in actually picking it up.
Our last dog used to catch and kill rats. No training or encouragement. Current two like running after things but so far it's all got away.
Dogs, prey drive, its sort of kinda what lots of them are bred for... good luck changing that. Think the best you can hope for is a well trained recall you can get in before the dog gets proper gone and the rabbit gets proper f'ed.
Mine came out of the woods with a pheasant in her mouth the other day. Proud as punch she was, high stepping, chest puffed out... Carried it to a safe place then took her fill - about half of it - and left the rest for another hungry creature.
She has also eaten a couple of pigeons and once brought me a dead rat which she didn't try to eat.
No problem for me, it just means I give her less for tea.
One of the biggest myths about working breeds is that the strong prey drive is impossible to overcome.
My Jack Russel comes deer stalking with me at heel off the lead. One day, a squirrel crossed our path. She has caught and killed them before but she knew we were stalking not squirrelling 🤣
She looked at me and I ushered her to go with my head. She chased the squirrel to the nearest tree where it escaped. With one point at my heel she came back feeling a bit inadequate and we resumed stalking 🤷🏻♂️
I never really trained any of that but we have a good bond and she knows I’m the boss.
Get a good relationship with your dog, train the basics thoroughly and then you can decide which pigeons live or die 🤣🤣
Recall is pretty impossible once they’ve locked on. Train a ‘STOP!’ (Sit/lie or at least stop moving) command. You can teach them to sit to movement (tennis ball etc being thrown) really easily which soon translates to ‘sit to flush’ which means before long, the animal itself becomes a command not to chase it.
Parks with ducks or pigeons are great for training once you get far enough along 👍🏻
Pigeons are vermin anyway - it's not like they're endangered.
And this time of year round here there always seem to be a few pigeons that I can only assume have gone and stuffed themselves on alcohol-laden rotting fruit. They just sit around in the road waiting to be hit by a car.
Our springer now knows roughly what to do with a rabbit (chase, kill, eat) but only the slow stupid ones ever get caught. She's Darwin's little helper.
Trying to think of a downside...
Nope, still trying; look at what you’re saving in dog food, plus having something to cull the local flying rats without needing to shoot the bastards has got to be good for the environment, hasn’t it?
I always thought springers were flushers, not retrievers, springing action to get good views......?
My 7 year old male springer only flushes (unless daft pheasant gets caught up in thick hedges then its blood and feathers), not even a number of flashing white rabbit tails only 20 meters away takes his interest......he's not stupid, there is only one winner there, why waste energy! Spanish water dog used to chase, and often catch, anything that moved, never ate the prey. At 14 years old now though her hunting days are getting less and less but she does still have fun taking a long run up in the house to leap out the back door to chase birds in the back garden......unsuccessfully.
The one and only time the springer chased an animal was when they both chased a badger........more out of curiousity I think as they definitely kept their distance, thank god!
Nature innit, just start worrying if its the local cats that are getting chased, killed and eaten by your dog
The problem is if this behaviour keeps going on unchecked, taking your dog out for a walk gets out of hand. Chasing after and eating ground nesting birds in the wider countryside won't earn you any thanks from any land managers, and chasing and eating pheasants from someones shoot doesn't go down well either, whatever you think of shooting.
It can be a real problem in the wider countryside (think public access land) managing the disturbance to vulnerable native ground nesting birds (such as lapwing, curlew, woodlark etc) whose numbers are generally in decline (due to a range of things, not just recreation and not just dogs) but it's not helping if your dog is chasing, disturbing birds on the nest and eating birds.
Even if the birds are "only" are pigeons (and although they are present in large numbers and an agricultural pest killing them is only allowed under a general licence, so not strictly always legal) it's still not good to let these habits develop.
When we first had our cocker someone said to me that you need to imagine that they are on an elastic band if they're off the lead. You need to assume that if you don't interact with them and keep talking/ engaging with them mentally, basically making your interaction fun, the elastic band will break and they'll go "self employed" which basically means they'll chase anything they get interested in, that's a slippery slope.
It's prob not the best model of "responsible dog ownership" to just let it go unchecked....
I'm not preaching, we sort of went through the same thing with our dog chasing pigeons but got it in check. Dog walks etc were easier after that. The advice above ref going for a walk with your dog, not just going for a walk and not noticing/ interacting with the dog is important. Spaniels need mental exercise as much as a long walk.
When we first had our cocker someone said to me that you need to imagine that they are on an elastic band if they’re off the lead. You need to assume that if you don’t interact with them and keep talking/ engaging with them mentally, basically making your interaction fun, the elastic band will break and they’ll go “self employed” which basically means they’ll chase anything they get interested in, that’s a slippery slope.
This +100%. Their tendency to "self-employ" goes way beyond walks too, we had to be on top of our cocker the whole time otherwise he guarded the house and the kids, and had the potential to get stroppy towards anyone or anything that he perceived as a threat.
I've got a 4 year old springer we had from a pup. At 17 months you're in the danger zone - it's dog teenage years, found independence and what they can get up to, very happy to ignore owner. Coupled with prey drive it can get a bit embarrassing.
At 18months old my springer took off after the scent of 2 large deer we spotted in the Forest of Dean. 20 minutes until she reappeared. Bit of a wake up call.
We spent a lot more time developing recall and solidifying it in different situations. Playing games on walks with her, (hiding balls, hiding from her, plus stays etc). I've had a number of situations since where she has sprung something, a badger was the latest, and started chasing and with one firm LEAVE IT! she's stopped and come back to me. She will still happily flush pheasants and chase the odd fox or muntjac scent, but I know when and how to stop it. She's not perfect by any stretch and you can never stop working on these things, but it's important that you do. Whilst we don't care about pigeons, if she does it in a wildlife area or managed moorland a game keeper may shoot her.
On a side note - on the soft mouth thing, at about 9 months old our springer managed to get through a gap in our chicken run. She grabbed one of our chickens, quick shake and dropped dead at our feet with a proud look on her face. Not a mark on the chicken.
EDIT, dog thread useless without a pic:
[url= https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1722/28665897668_0ff71728a4_k.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1722/28665897668_0ff71728a4_k.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/KF7dEY ]IMG_20180528_161937[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/evilgoat/ ]Evil Goat[/url], on Flickr
you gotta love spaniels though. great dogs. bless.
Some interet pages suggest it could escalate
It could eat a baby next time. Or other dogs. Or a school teacher.
...or a baby Robin's face.
Mine (the famous deer hunter, for those with long memories 😉 ) pulled the head off a pheasant once. Quite unpleasant to watch. She always dropped things and came back to me when I issued the commands though. Apart from that time she had a fox round the neck...
Pah. My collie used to chase anyone on a bike. Soon solved that though
I took the bike off her.
IWGMC
I've never tried to chase a dog ..they are way to quick and I've never eaten a pigeon but I'm willing to try if anyone has a good recipe ..
Walking up through the local woods on Saturday night our Vizsla virtually tripped over a fox and they both shot off. He was wearing a collar light so we could track him heading off at mach 2.
Stopped about 200m away and barked continuously in his 'come and look at this' voice'.
I ran up and he's stood there with the fox stood beside him and they're both looking at me like : "What now?"
Got the lead on the dog and my wife caught up so I took our dog away. she crouches down to check fox, it sniffs her finger and lets her stroke it then trots off.
We were amazed at how passive the fox was - either it was very tame or just completely resigned to it's fate.
Our dog had a bit of a self satisfied strut thing going on for the rest of the walk - he's been chasing rabbits, squirrels and foxes for years and never got close to catching one before.
Funny that wwaswas - I always thought vizslas and pointers would have the same instinct! My pointer is the most passive dog, but becomes a proper fiend with foxes. The fights I've heard but not seen... then she comes trotting out of the undergrowth covered in thorns and proud as punch of herself. Evil bitch 😆
I thought there'd be a fight, tbh and that he'd get injured as he's great at the hunt/point/retrieve thing but a complete wimp when it actually comes to any sort of confrontation with anything showing any aggression.
He desperately tries to get at any cats we see when he's on the lead but the only one that's ever let him get close he just wanted to sniff it's bum and lick it's ears.
Yeah, very different! I think I prefer your dog's attitude 🙂
<p>Walking up through the local woods on Saturday night our Vizsla virtually tripped over a fox and they both shot off. He was wearing a collar light so we could track him heading off at mach 2.</p><p>Stopped about 200m away and barked continuously in his ‘come and look at this’ voice’.</p><p>I ran up and he’s stood there with the fox stood beside him and they’re both looking at me like : “What now?”</p>
<p>My folks Shepherd/Retriever cross did this with a rabbit once, was too busy trying to play with it. Had us all fooled until she got caught and ate a small bird in long grass this summer.</p>