[Closed] Does my LBS want my business?

I don't understand the issue with charging brochure price for stuff?

If that's a true representation of the conversation, I doubt they will be around for long!

Shops name wouldnt happen to rhyme with bikes would it ?

as I have been in the trade for far top long...customers have to understand why would we carry all sizes ...small sizes don't sell as often as med/large so the need to have them in stock is low, and I only buy small sizes when they are discounted...or a deposit has been left.
you sound like you'd try it out then buy on the net...hence her unwillingness to help you...hats off to her !
stock is low over the winter months due to new year stuff coming out...

Lol @ unfitgeezer. That was a joke right?

you sound like you'd try it out then buy on the net...hence her unwillingness to help you...hats off to her !

We used to carry all sizes of the bikes we sold but large and small in base spec bikes for sizing.

Woody - Member

Lol @ unfitgeezer. That was a joke right?

which bit ? I might add I don't deal in Mountain bikes at all...

A good business person would have taken the opportunity to make a sale.

If it is the shop tr is intimating, then the lady in question did a very good job of nearly selling me a 13" Hardrock (for the lad) in the summer. Unfortunately for her, it was a Sunday, and whilst the hire shop was open, the one that did the selling wasn't. 😕

Maybe they should lure druidh out of retirement to show them how it should be done.

I don't understand the issue with charging brochure price for stuff?

Geoff and TR - if it is that shop, they wouldn't sell me a SFN in the summer as they would have to 'get one out of the store'. And the other bike shop in the same place didn't have any 🙁

you sound like you'd try it out then buy on the net...hence her unwillingness to help you...hats off to her

But is that not the point when a good business person would step up to the challenge and try to secure a sale anyway. Web don't offer 6 weeks servicing, 'trading up' offers, packages if you need to buy new kit at the same time, try before you buy etc.

Such a serious lack of initiate and effort.

@trail_rat 😉

"maybe she was having a bad day"
then dont be in a trade where you need to deal with the public every day.
The web doesnt have a bad day.

"you sound like you'd try it out then buy on the net"
then dont open a shop thats 40% more than the net, and thats a big presumption. We were quite willing to purchase local - but that ship has sailed now, i'll take our own measurements and order online and have it at my door, rather than physically make the effort to go to her shop and enjoy her "bad day" all over again.

The Manufacturers store model is a much better concept for selling bikes....big range of models to try out and doesn't really matter if the customer buys off the web..as it's still a sale for the manufacturer.

Hence Sony shops.

Hence [s]Sony[/s] shops.

Apple Stores 😉

which bit ? I might add I don't deal in Mountain bikes at all...

As the OP posted, not only did the co-owner fail to give the customer what he wanted, she failed entirely on every possible sales and customer service opportunity, in this instance and for any potential future business from the OP.

And I don't see the issue with asking whether or not a discount or other deal can be done.

Asking is indeed fine, but [i][b]assuming[/b][/i] you'll get one or deserve one isn't. After all, would you also ask for a deal on a pint of milk at the corner shop? Of course you wouldn't. Bike shop is no different. They're not a charity.

*Disclosure - My beloved LBS almost always gives me some sort of discount, but I've never asked for it. They choose to do so as a reward, I think, given the amount I spend with them! 🙂

Oh i beg to differ.

The web has bad days.

Not defending the shop in question though.

My LBS is the only place for me, they sell coffee and cake as well as bikes it heaven.

If I go for a chat/advice or after something they are always helpful, no pressure and extremely helpful, they way a LBS should be run

so, OP, where is the shop ? clues ? 😛

I truly am glad for those that have good LBS' and LBS experiences and I wish i had the same...

Asking is indeed fine, but assuming you'll get one or deserve one isn't. After all, would you also ask for a deal on a pint of milk at the corner shop? Of course you wouldn't. Bike shop is no different. They're not a charity.

Same for us - if I do a small job for a client, I wouldn't discount it, if they came to us wanting to spend thousands, I would be more willing to consider discounting to get the business.

i After all, would you also ask for a deal on a pint of milk at the corner shop? Of course you wouldn't. Bike shop is no different.

Can't agree with that. As a more realistic comparison price wise eg. cheap second hand car, I think many/most people would haggle or expect 'something' on any item costing a few hundred or thousand £,

Problem is, she didn't even try to interest the potential customer or find out anything about his needs or wants.

How do you know that a local bike club, who are all very small, hadn't just been in and negotiated to buy all of her stock of small bikes at a very good discount?

Can totally understand why they don't have a small in to try, as above they just don't sell. Which in my case was a bonus last year as I bought two xs treks for the kids from an lbs, they were a year old and nearly half price as I bought two.

I don;t disagree Woody but I can't see the OP making any attempt to haggle a discount or free accessories in what was reported.

Just 'How much is it?' and 'That's retail price?' ?

I think there would be an opportunity for haggling.

Like with a secondhand car dealer. You don;t stand lookign at it with the dealer as you walk round and start the conversation with 'well I'd be looking for money off that price to start with'. It's part of a process.

Why does nearly everyone expect a discount in a bike shop?

Did you haggle on price for your mac you're reading this on? No!

Never mind, you can always go into Halfords...

Like with a secondhand car dealer. You don;t stand lookign at it with the dealer as you walk round and start the conversation with 'well I'd be looking for money off that price to start with'. It's part of a process.

So, why does that process not extend to the corner shop and the pint of milk?

Reductio ad absurdum, perhaps, but I think it's a valid point. Why is it assumed that you can rub your chin and ask for a discount on one item but not the other? If it's cost based, where's the threshold?

Did you haggle on price for your mac you're reading this on? No!

In this case theres two options:

Option 1:

Look through electronic catalogue in comfort of own home.
Cant try for size/fit/feel, so take a risk.
purchase at a discount from rrp.
return goods if not right

Option 2:
Goto someones premises and look through catalogue
Cant try for size/fit/feel, so take a risk
purchase at rrp
interesting returns process.

So in this case, why wouldnt anyone take option 1?

So lets get this right you couldn't try it out so are going to buy on the internet where you can't try it out?!!! Makes perfect sense.

If they can't get one in for a while, then that's honest. A lot of bike companies seem to have limited stock in the UK or long lead times in my experience.

So, why does that process not extend to the corner shop and the pint of milk?

[i]Reductio ad absurdum, perhaps, but I think it's a valid point.[/i]

you're right.

there's a time and a place to haggle.

[img] [/img]

in the uk we tend to not haggle on fruit and veg but do on consumer durables bought at non-chain shops.

Why is it assumed that you can rub your chin and ask for a discount on one item but not the other?

Generally speaking I buy "last years" models. I expect a discount as the technology does evolve slowly. If I was buying at the time of year when the new stock was due I would expect a discount as other retailers, some on line would be discounting their stock. The retailer is quite within their rights to explain what added value they can add over others if you buy from them.

Besides the price tag is an "invitation to treat", you can make any offer you want and retailer can decide if he accepts or not.

It's very unlikely that anyone would take you seriously on small ticket items if you asked for a discount. If there is only 5p profit in a pint of milk then there's not much room to discount and not much of a loss if you lose a sale.

And to answer your original question I think No. Probably couldn't be bothered to deal with a fussy, needy, overbiked, short arse who wants discount on everything. 😀

By the sound of it they provided you with factual answers just not the ones you wanted. As for chasing every sale a good salesman/business owner knows the ones to leave alone.
You knew what you wanted, wanted to confirm the size but would probably buy online.

My LBS is excellent but like anywhere has limited time for tyre kickers

back2basics - Member
I truly am glad for those that have good LBS' and LBS experiences and I wish i had the same...

What about the other shop?
..although being negative about that is tantamount to heresy to some folk on here

Lightly used race course trail map anyone?

For those being deliberately hard of understanding the reason that people don't haggle on foodstuffs is the low value, high availability, don't like the price then there's probably 5-6 other places you can go relatively easily to get the same item, and the lack of differential between products, sainsburys milk is like Tescos is like asda etc, so there is no compromise.

Things that are commonly haggled over are things with a high value making a discount meaningful, low availability making it feel like a mini monopoly (most bike and car companies have one retailer per town/city) and are a composite of parts that means that you often have to make compromises in a decision based on an overall package. Therefore you look for a discount to offset the compromises or additional things to 'persuade' you to take that product over a similar but different product from a different retailer. LBS also have to deal with internet which does hold stock, will get it to me tomorrow not when the next delivery might be coming in and due to DSR means I can try something for size at low risk, it's not going to go away and LBS need to come up with a USP to encourage people. Food retailers do haggle too, but it's a mature market and they understand the competition and they dictate the terms which is why you get loyalty cards, price check, bogof, special prices, etc, but because they accept the prevailing market conditions and don't just sulk that their customers might take value they are able to actively market it to their advantage.

mikewsmith - Member
By the sound of it they provided you with factual answers just not the ones you wanted. As for chasing every sale a good salesman/business owner knows the ones to leave alone.
You knew what you wanted, wanted to confirm the size but [b] would probably buy online.
[/b]
My LBS is excellent but like anywhere has limited time for tyre kickers

How do you get to that assumption?

geoffj - I had a bad bad experience with a bodged job in the other shop, not for sharing on here, but suffice to say I won't be back in it (not that they will miss me, but was always handy 🙁 )

@geoffj by the way most threads go on here, don't know the shop in question which is being talked about but not named so maybe it's them being really crap.

I should probably have added would probably buy online as it's cheaper if they didn't want to budge on price.

Maybe I'm just cynical.

No.I do the same to everyone who smells yeasty.

OP stated that he wanted to buy locally, there was no mention of him going to buy online after sizing up what he wanted..

I wouldn't buy from a shop if I can get it cheaper on-line. Simple as that, I work for my money, and in all honesty, the cash ain't flowing from my wallet trying to find places to go... So I like to save what I can.
I do feel bad, as there is a very good bike shop here (I do often go in to pick bits up, but rarely, and small purchases) but I just can't justify spending more money on exactly the same product.

If on the other hand, the shop was willing to price match everything (which by the sounds of it, no one who works in LBS will) then I would only shop there, but I know that small shops are unable to do this, as there profits would be too low. Catch 22

Is it so hard for bike shops to do what my UK LBS does - offers the chance of test rides, for which you have to pay ( can't remember how much, it has been a while ) and if you buy a bike from them the cost of the test ride is deducted from the sticker price of the bike ?

If as a bike store you don't have a small size in stock, how hard is it to get a loaner from the manufacturer/distributor ?

Well I own a bike shop its a lbs and I don't find in general the Internet sellers all that cheap for current stuff
You can always find a deal somewhere but we have no problem competing on price with xrc etc
Often you find the part you want isn't as cheap as the advertised 60% off as that price relates to an obscure size
But the sales woman sounds shit in the original post

I have some sympathy with the OP here. Part of the reason I would buy a bike from an LBS is so I can sit on it and see if it fits. I can also so I can see the bike in person, look at the frame, at the components, generally make sure I like it. I acknowledge there is a price to pay for this above the internet price, I’m comfortable with that and will pay it, though I will ask for a discount as I do with anything costing more than about £100. The challenge for the OP (and the LBS) in this case is that if I can’t see the bike I would like to buy, if I can’t sit on it to make sure it fits then a big part of the added value an LBS offers is gone so I am more likely to buy online. I pretty much always need XL/20” frames, if I’m buying a bike I want to sit on one, if the LBS can’t provide me with one I can sit on I will go to another LBS, and if I run out of LBS’s to visit I’ll buy online.

Went to an LBS on a Monday a few weeks ago.

Looked at a few saddles, including sitting on a couple of bikes. One of the shop guys said "try this one", so I sat on it. "Yeah, that's OEM only so you can't buy that saddle anywhere". 🙄

Get back to the saddle display, pick an expensive (black) one as they didn't have the mid-range (black) metal railed one (still £60) I wanted so I decided to treat myself to the (black) carbon version.

Get to the till and someone points out that the carbon rails might not work with a normal seatpost. So I ask if they can order in the saddle I originally wanted?

"Yes, no problem, we'll call you when it's here".

The weekend arrives and I've heard nothing so give them a call.
me: "Hi, I came in at the start of the week after a saddle, you were going to order it in for me"
Shop Assistant 1: "I'll just go and see if it's here yet"
*Click* as the phone goes onto hold.
Then straight away *click* as it comes off hold again.

In the background I hear
SA1:"Is the saddle for[i]bails[/i] here?
SA2: "No, I haven't done it, I'll order it next week"

*click*
...
...
*click*
SA1: "Hello?"
Me: "Hi"
SA1: "Hi, we ordered it but it hasn't arrived yet, it should be here at the start of next week"
Me: "right...."
SA1: "But you don't need to phone us, we'll phone you when it's here"

The end of 'next week' arrives. So I phone them again

me: "You said you'd phone when the saddle arrived, is it there yet?"
SA: "Yes, I think it turned up yesterday"
Me: "Ah cool, I'll come and pick it up then"
SA: "Okay, it's the white one right?"
Me: "Er, no... I didn't know you could get that saddle in white. I looked at black ones, I even tried to buy a black one. You took the product code off a black one and said you'd order the same one but in a different size"
SA: "Well do you want it?"
me: "You can probably put it out on the shelf, I might come in on my way home from work to collect it..."

I didn't.

I went to an LBS recently with serious intentions of spending 3k on a bike. I would have pulled the trigger there and then if I hadn't had a bad experience. The sales guy asked me what sort of riding I did, showed me a few bikes in brochures, despite me kinda knowing what I wanted, then tried to push me towards an outgoing model, which didn't really suit my riding.
I perservered and asked if I could sit on or test ride the bike I wanted, they didn't have any in stock in my size, and acted like getting one in for me to have a look at/test ride/sit on was going to be a pain and a long process. I left with 3k still in my pocket.

Support Good Business Not Local Business.

Simples

I had the same problem buying a road bike for my wife. She is 4'11" so needs the smallest that a manufacturer makes. No-one stocks them. At all. I was quite happy to pay RRP but every shop said I'd have to buy it if I ordered one in the right size for her..... but if it didn't fit I couldn't get a refund. Errrr not doing that then! I know they don't do sale or return with their suppliers and that must lose them a few sales.
Bought in the end from Evans, where it is delivered to the store and my wife could try it for size and we could get a refund if it wasn't ok. Since then I've used Evans a lot for this sort of thing and been very pleased - never anything ultra cheap but great facility for customers being able to order online and pick up from a shop.

Conversely we did our best to help a customer get a road bike for his son we now have two very small road bikes we haven't been able to sell yet and he bought something else online once he had figured out the size he wanted

Bought in the end from Evans, where it is delivered to the store and my wife could try it for size and we could get a refund if it wasn't ok. Since then I've used Evans a lot for this sort of thing and been very pleased - never anything ultra cheap but great facility for customers being able to order online and pick up from a shop.

and that's exactly what puts local independent out of business

every shop said I'd have to buy it if I ordered one in the right size for her..... but if it didn't fit I couldn't get a refund. Errrr not doing that then!

so go to Evans try it out and then order from LBS !

Sancho - there are good shops (yours sounds like one) and poor shops. A few folks on this thread perhaps know the shop the OP is referring to and have had poor experiences in it too.....

so go to Evans try it out and then order from LBS !

So, the shop that actually helped, you put no money in their pocket?

and that's exactly what puts local independent out of business

So I should buy something risking that it won't fit, and when I found out it doesn't and it's useless just shrug and say "well at least I'm keeping my LBS in business, I disn't need that £1000 anyway"????

Idiot.

so go to Evans try it out and then order from LBS !

I don't like Evans but that seems as wrong as going to a LBS to try something on and then buying from CRC.

My LBS charge like wounded buffalo and I don't use them for much.

Last thing I got was a chain wear gauge:

"Hi - Do you have a chain wear gauge please?"
"Err - No. I think we have one in our workshop but not for sale."
"Oh. Ok then." As I was walking to the door another bloke sticks head out of back area and asks his mate what I wanted. Then calls me back to sell me a gauge that hey do have in stock.

Now I got what I wanted in the end but didn't exactly inspire confidence.

Support Good Business Not Local Business.

Simples

Well said.

Winston - I like that about LBS, staff with a passion for bikes or at least an interest. It may not be slick or even efficient but it is a little bit of the human touch that you don't get on the interwebs. But maybe I am lucky to have a good LBS that always give discounts!

At least the original shop owner was honest. I'd much rather be told "sorry, we haven't got one" than "Yeah, yes, of course, we'll get one in" etc for about a month before it becomes blatantly clear to both parties that what was promised is unlike to be made reality!