[Closed] Disillusioned with corporate life...

[url= http://www.amazon.co.uk/What-You-are-Discovering-Personality/dp/0316880655 ]This book[/url] is pretty helpful but if you want to save on the reading, google some Myers-Briggs test, do a couple to see where you come out (IFTJ or whatever) then google "IFTJ jobs" (or whatever) and you'll find the same sort of info. You may well find that you get different results from different tests though.

I recomend a book . Who moved my cheese - Spencer. J

You need to have a chat with your manager about how to speed up the sales 6 months isn't that long. We've all been there and it is disheartening but once they start coming in it's amazing how quickly your mood improves.

.

Do it, u must have some good ideas from working as a bus development manager and seeing how not to do it.

I think there's a market for a cycling friendly cafe on Bath Road, thought about that? 😉

Seriously though, if you're not happy, do something else. Plus, MrsBushwacked had her 'go' at starting a business, why shouldn't you?

Me, once the f&*(kers let me out of here, I'm off to be the last of the Great White Hunters

Very similar - years of sales for various corporations. Success (which I had a fair bit of from the start sales wise) was "rewarded" by higher targets, a poor month was seriously frowned upon. Every month it was back to zero again and lots of stress. Also seemed to find that certain managers got a bit jealous (I think) if I did well and made life hard for me.

So a spell of some awful jobs (temping, site work, etc) then joined wife's PR firm and we now co-run it and it's doing well. The sales side is limited, I don't have some tw4t to answer to and our clients really like what we do for them. It's also flexible time wise which is ideal for looking after our little one.

I was in limbo for ages though - sales is one of those skills that doesn't (to me) feel like a "useful" job even though it is. Considered retraining, buying a company and all sorts of options. It was pretty disheartening at times but has worked out well.

You have good sales skills - essential to any business. That's a major hurdle to get over. Either stick to your industry (if possible) or do something you like. Be ruthless with overheads. Don't panic. Enjoy!

I recomend a book . Who moved my cheese

😯

I had to read that book before going on a management course. I think it must have been written for the American market, or someplace else where folks need a real simple message...

Best summed up by these two reviews on amazon.co.uk...

[b]Insult to intelligence[/b] Thank goodness this book is short, because it is an insult to the intelligence of everyone either on or above Oprah Winfrey wisdom level. I was looking forward to reading this metaphor, but even the authors of fairy tales do not think it necessary to repeat-repeat-repeat their message, which is this case actually fits on one very short page, over and over again. This book could be subtitled: How to Make Lots of Money Writing Very Little, Again and Again

[b]An Execrable Piece of Tosh[/b] Please, if you're going to read this - and I don't recommend that you part with money to do so - read "The Spirit Level" by Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett first. In a world where we blame the poor for their poverty and the weak for their weakness, this self-righteous, smug bucket of steaming ordure serves to allow us all to feel happy with the injustices of a society where the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Because that's why some folk are poor, isn't it? They're too lazy or too pampered to look for fresh cheese.

This book is not for people who need help in dealing with "harsh economic realities like losing your job" - you know, the kind that wealthy people have to face. It is a self-serving tome to anaesthetise the comfortably-off from the pain of those at the bottom of the pile. It is Smiles's "Self Help" for the Me Generation. It is wilfully naive and unforgivably simplistic. That the author can put "Dr" in front of his name is the worst condemnation of the educational system I can imagine.

I've had to give this one star. I begrudge it.

I just did that myer test thing.

http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes3.asp

People I am like are Franklin D. Roosevelt, Margaret Thatcher, John P. Morgan, Norman Vincent Peale.

I think I might go and shoot myself

You're right to feel disillusioned with corporate life, because sooner or later, we all wake up and realise we've been sold a pup. Even if they are educated and 'professional', Its not for the free-thinking, who value their life outside of work.

It took some time off due to redundancy for me to realise that. We're poorer and WAAAYYYYYY happier now, although I still don't know what I want to do.

😳

Srangely its always the ones in jobs, that are unhappy ,doing what they do, and then moan like mad when theyre sacked, made redundant ,or the company goes bust,all possibly due to the original poster not giving his attention to the work he is paid to do.

Bored ,dont like your job resign, and let somebody elsse have a chance,theres a lot of very talented people out there looking for a job.

IMO business development is a tarted up name for bog standard crappy sales. you could try treating the role as the name suggests. how can the business be developed? if you owned it what would you do differently? Best thing would be to do that for your own business though. Look for a couple of niches where there might be a cross-over. look at the obscure magazines in WH Smith - what do odd hobbyists/travellers etc buy/sell/need that you could supply better/cheaper? can you scale the work so that you get paid for results rather than time?

Bog standard crappy sales can pay. I placed a bog standard crappy sales guy this week who will in all likelyhood earn 250k this year.

Do that for a few years, get out and do what the hell you want.

Sales is not some poor relation to other more worthy work and it boils my piss to hear it described as such.

It is stressful and hard but that's what you get paid for.

Yes and I'm sure that sales guy must be some kind of demi god to those in corporate sales but to many of us who have been there, it's not for everyone; regardless of whether they "cut it" or not.

Sales is essential to almost any job - from actually selling stuff to selling ideas to a team/client/whoever. But corporate sales is pretty ruthless - you always get a tiny cut of what you sell and sure enough, your targets just go up and up and up the more you sell. IMO, that's not much fun.

It depends on the company you work for. I guess I'm lucky in that regard as I work on behalf of some great companies.

jools - I know, that's what I'm doing at the minute, 2-3 years then over and out.

It depends on the company you work for. I guess I'm lucky in that regard as I work on behalf of some great companies.

So did I. Orange, big banks, big utilities companies, etc. Enjoyed it for a while, made decent money, got hacked off with it eventually. Far happier and earning better (we see almost all of what the company earns too) here in "backwards" Cornwall not answering to some jumped up brown nosing manager.

rkk01 - just worked out who you are 😆

IME, You can only last so long in sales, I was a cocky young thing in sales & marketing for a good few years making good cash and full of myslef, then I became a dead weight scarred to go to work as my targets went higher and my productivity dropped. Got really unhappy.

Now I'm in the public sector where I feel I really make a difference.

Quit. That's what I did in my early thirties when I became disillusioned with sales. Now in the final year of a civil engineering degree. God knows where that'll take me.

I had quite a career in Business Development. Many of my friends are still doing the same thing, and I have had colleagues who have built their own mobile and gaming companies and sold them on to huge conglomerates, making vast amounts of money.

But my own spiritual life was more important, and although I was very professional and good at what I did, I lacked that final ambition to get myself out of middle management and into that mode where you live, eat and sleep work maybe 24 x 7 for 3 or 4 years to accomplish all that.

Last year I started a one year MSc in the areas of ecology and economics, and am now realising that in Brazil it is possible to really make use of my previous business experience but in a much more rewarding sector.

It sounds as if you may not be able to fund an MSC, as it is expensive, but maybe there are evening courses or something you could look at to enhance your existing skill base?

Oh, this was my second attempt. I sold my house and went off to India to learn yoga in 2004, but that all went belly up. It helps to have a very big dream or vision, as things may not always run smoothly, as they did not for me in many different ways, but with the right amount of oomph and get up and go you can achieve amazing things with you life.

Cheers for the pointers and info.

At present I'm good at my job, I have the ability to shape what I do and design the strategy for the business (rather like as if it was my own business) but I just feel very unfulfilled in sales and have no ambition to drive up the ranks into management positions within my company.

BTW - I'm not really bored by my work or coasting in my role but looking forward I can't see me doing this forever. So where should I focus my efforts??

Bit like riding a bike if you keep looking at the ground going under your wheels you're not going to know where you are going let alone get there.

Bascially I want to put a goal in place and then aim at achieving it and I don't see corporate life being part of that.

I like the idea of retraining to then start something I can be the master of - I've always fancied being a plumber strangely enough

Simonralli2 - thats it - I'm just not living eating and sleeping work at the moment and can't see it happening

Ha,like what you did there Simon........ 😀

I sold my house and went off to India to learn yoga in 2004, but that all went belly up.

[img] [/img]

Surf Mat do you not work for a BMW driving know it all these days?

Have you considered working for charities? I work in fundraising and marketing for a charity which is basically exactly the same as BD (in fact there's a fair amount involved) but instead of making some git at the top richer you're making a difference to other people's lives. Sounds sanctimonius I know but it is a good option for sales folk who wnat something different out of life. There are lots of different fundraising 'disciplines' too so you can work out which suits your sales skills best. I do a lot of B2B work for example. In other wwrds setting up mutually beneficial relationships between companies and the charity I work for. The pay is also not as bad as people think.

Having said all that after 7 years of doing it I'm looking to go back into the private sector as I'm after a bit of a change. Job swap?!

apparently I'm similar to Ronald Reagan, Pope John Paul II, Nick Nolte, Tony Blair, Katharine Graham 😯

and I have the profile of a teacher / psychologist

joolsburger - Member
Bog standard crappy sales can pay. I placed a bog standard crappy sales guy this week who will in all likelyhood earn 250k this year.

I sold my house and went off to India to learn yoga in 2004, but that all went belly up.

It quite literally did. My liver started to expand in a reaction to the malaria tablets I was taking. I was misdiagnosed as having yellow fever, kept on taking the tablets and it got to a really dangerous and extremely painful state before we all realised what the problem was. Horrible horrible days!

Oh, and there is another bit. I spoke to a Peruvian shaman in his twenties, a very special young chap called Puma and asked if I should do my MSc. He said yes, and not to worry about what would happen afterwards career wise, since I would not be able to handle the vision if the universe were to reveal to me at that point what was going to happen.

In the end, this chap turned out to be the adopted son of one of the lecturers on my course, which I had not known, and also I met my girlfriend on the course, and getting ready to emigrate to Brazil to live and work with her 😀

But I am not saying the OP should go and have a coca leaf divination reading with a shaman, that's just for loons like myself really.

Bushwacked - Member

Simonralli2 - thats it - I'm just not living eating and sleeping work at the moment and can't see it happening

That's the problem I have.

I've merely endured work so far in my life & I can't ever imagine liking it that much. I've never had a focus or aim. The pay has always felt like [b]compensation[/b] for serving time at the office rather than a reward for good work.

I don't want to look back at retirement age and have such a negative view of the decades of my work.

I'm hoping for a change of direction that will allow me to feel that I'm contributing, making a difference and actually enjoying it.

[i]Oh, and there is another bit. I spoke to a Peruvian shaman in his twenties, a very special young chap called Puma and asked if I should do my MSc. He said yes, and not to worry about what would happen afterwards career wise, since I would not be able to handle the vision if the universe were to reveal to me at that point what was going to happen.[/i]

Ooooo-kaaaay 😕

Simon, are you in Macae, or further north?

Bushwacked...

I hear you, totally fed up with sales as well. If you figure out the answer let me know!

I stand corrected. It's true - Corporate sales is like sucking the devils cheesey bits. Frankly I'd rather be a paramedic but I can't afford the pay cut.

I've often fancied running a patisserie as well however I'd most likely eat the profits.

have kids, change your priorities ?

....but not you richmtb ! 😆

iainc - Member
rkk01 - just worked out who you are

HAA - Found out through my dislike of cheese. 😀

HAA - Found out through my dislike of cheese

I can't remember which of the characters you came out as !!!

Me neither - was there an awkward one?

rkk - LOL. Probably !

For a little while now I’ve been feeling really disillusioned by corporate life. I work as a business development manager and have experienced some good success during my career but I no longer feel sales is for me. I’m now at a crossroads where I can’t see myself doing this for another 30 years and want to do something else, hopefully something that I will enjoy.

Cough *mid life crisis* cough

😉

At present I'm good at my job, I have the ability to shape what I do and design the strategy for the business (rather like as if it was my own business) but I just feel very unfulfilled in sales and have no ambition to drive up the ranks into management positions within my company.

BTW - I'm not really bored by my work or coasting in my role but looking forward I can't see me doing this forever. So where should I focus my efforts??

If you're good at it, and have the ability to shape it, focus all your efforts on doing that for now... If you're really fussed about where you want to go, you'll put the effort and the time in to developing the business and the role... If you truly do have enough freedom that is.

Bascially I want to put a goal in place and then aim at achieving it and I don't see corporate life being part of that.

I like the idea of retraining to then start something I can be the master of - I've always fancied being a plumber strangely enough

Whatever you want to do, hurry up and put the goal in place, otherwise you'll just meander about aimlessly for quite some time. My problem is that most of my goals I put in place (and failed to hit I might add, but then I do set my sights very high) were centred around "things to achieve by the time I'm 30"... And as I was 30 a couple of weeks ago, I've got a lot of new goals to make before I start to wander aimlessly too...

If you're going to retrain to do something, do it ASAP. Procrastination is the enemy of making any kind of improvement (either at work, or in your personal life, or anywhere to be quite honest), so hurry up and decide. Oddly enough, I know a couple of plumbers that do very well for themselves, but then it would take you a number of years to get to the stage they're at, and you'd probably have to work as an apprentice for a while until you were skilled enough, which would mean minimum wage quite probably for some time.

Personally, what I would do if I were in your position mate, would be to REALLY get on the ball with shaping your business, and your own skills within the business. You have the perfect opportunity to assess for yourself and skills you will need, and any courses you will need to go on (and get the company to pay for) in order to get to where you need. Do your research, look at things you fancy doing (and how you could hopefully apply it to your business in order to get them to pay for it), get yourself on some courses and get the skills and qualifications... And preferably, don't just go on sales ones.

If you REALLY want to start looking at Business Development properly, and when I say it I mean "Business Development" quite literally (not just "increase sales" as it usually means), then we should have a chat down the pub sometime. I could/should be able to at least point you in the right direction, if not actually be able to train you up myself (the course I teach is government funded and there's a waiting list at the moment), but also point you in the direction of where to go after...

Also look to see if they'd put you through a Masters degree, would require some effort on your part, but as you're home based currently, you could fit all the coursework in around client visits and the like quite easily I'm sure. A Masters degree, and lots of other skills and qualifications, and the world would quite literally be your oyster. That way, by the time you're in your mid 40's, you're at the point where everyone in their right mind is queuing up to offer you a job, and pay you the kind of money you'd like to earn, so you can then squirrel lots away every year, so you then have a nice fund to start your own business a few years later down the line...

Just a few thoughts anyway... 😉

Bushwacked
I was in a similar place - 'account management' role, did not like the job, or management, or moving goalposts re: targets / bonus - one going up, the other down... I was well paid for what I did, final salary pension scheme and all that but, I just hated it.

Long story short - started to look to do the odd training course, looking to perhaps, 'do something' with my photography hobby.
Once such course was bolted onto the end of a long weekend away with the Mrs. It ended up we extended the holiday as it came up that the guy doing the training was launching a mentoring scheme. We worked out MrsMM salary could cover all the bills so, we (I) went for it - resigned the following Monday...
At the end of this month it'll be two years since I finished 'the day job' and started as a full time photographer...
It's not easy, and we've never been quite so skint (hope to at least break even this year though...) but, i've never been so happy...
HTH..

mboy - Member

Cough *mid life crisis* cough

Just you wait till your my age young 'un!

😉

Also look to see if they'd put you through a Masters degree,

Wouldn't I need to get my A-levels first before getting a Masters?

Cheers for the offer Mboy - I think a visit to the pub might be in order even if to just explore how to get the most from what I am doing and add some focus

iDave

I am back in Dumfries but will be in Belo Horizonte when I go back. I am currently looking for work so may end up in Sao Paulo for a short while who knows.

I was having a mid-life crisis by lunchtime on my first day of my first job. I thought 'f*ck me, 40 more years of this shit!' and got pretty depressed.

Self employed now as a contractor - working towards the point where I have capital, and can take time off work often.

Still the same sh*t every day but at least they are steps along MY journey instead of some big company's.

another busdevman here, know exactly how you feel mate!

Go and work for a big charity. Good ones pay good money for good people. I did it and loved it. They need all skills.

I love how all the contractors think they are a free spirits. All the ones I know work longer hours, take less holiday and have to take contracts at different locations which means time on the road or in travel taverns.

Still you keep telling yourself this!

Much rather be on the books myself

Back in 2003 I went to NZ. At Wanaka aerodrome, I went for a 15,000ft tandem skydive.

On the ground beforehand, I was introduced to my partner, who held his shaking hand out for a greeting. When I commented on this, he said not to worry, it was just adrenaline from spending six days a week doing five jumps a day.

After I had recovered from the shock and adrenaline after my own single jump, I asked him if this was his full-time job. He said yeah, he wouldn't want to do ANYTHING ELSE.

I asked how long he'd been doing it.

He said "seven years".

I asked him what he did before.

He said.... "Accountant". 😉

Pooch - it's all in the head.

You could look at it another way, and say why do the same job as I do now for the same bloody company year in year out, for a third the money and less holiday?

Inside two years time I intend to be on a 6 month paid holiday. You'll have to wait til you're in your 60s for that 🙂

Wouldn't I need to get my A-levels first before getting a Masters?

Not necessarily mate. These days "on the job" experience counts for a hell of a lot. If it was a totally different subject area, then yes possibly you'd need to do A Levels, or some other form of higher education first, but it's a lot easier for an adult to do these part time than it is for a 16-18 year old full time at school... TRUST me there... All sorts of ways and means to further your education, and preferably getting your employer to pay for it.

Wouldn't I need to get my A-levels first before getting a Masters?

No, you just need to have loads of money to pay for it.

😆

I've cleaned grease traps, i've run a resort, i was a ski patroller and a ski instructor. I've setup and sold an IT business, i'm onto my second one now (in due dilgence stage).Its likely i'll end up working for someone for a couple of years. I still don;t know what i want to do. I hate the stress, i hate the long hours when they happen which is not often but more often than not just now. I'm learning to just go with the flow and see what happens. What i do know is you make your own luck and striking out on your own or making a serious departure from 'what is normal' feels scary when you do it, i don't care who you are, and you'll question it but bash on and use your gut instinct. Anyone who gives me a hard time gets short shrift - i have been criticised 'for selling out', which interested me because i was the one with my cock on the block and my house on the line to get it off the ground.

Don't settle for mediocrity, step out of the shadows and do something you believe in.

And FFS don't read those Stephen ****n Covey books or any self help sh1te, honestly.

I'm a bit stressed can you tell 😆 Oh and always ALWAYS make time to ride a bike - i had a 3 hour meeting last wednesday afternoon which was with my bike and some hills. I felt better after that.

Wondered if anyone here has ever quit their job to do the same job, only freelance. Don't mind the work so much, but am so bored of office politics etc.

i was in a similer position, allthough not in corperate life, i was an hgv driver for nearly 20 yrs and spending my life on the m25 and working 60+ hours a week was soul destroying, so i gave it up and spent some time retraining to be a visiting support worker for a large charity helping peaple with learning disabilitys and older peaple with health problems and or dementia, now when i go to work peaple are happy to see me and i know im making a difference to their quality of life, i take them out doing all sorts of different things and every day is different, i wish i did it years ago tbh its a different life and i dont mind getting up in the mornings now rather than that sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach that i used to get when i woke up,
sometimes you have to move on and im glad i did, more to life than chaseing the god of money

Wondered if anyone here has ever quit their job to do the same job, only freelance

Well I quit for contracting - not quite the same thing but a bit similar. I think most freelancers were permie once though - it's how you get your experience.

I just wanted to sound a cautionary note here.

I became very disillusioned with private sector work having been made redundant and then working for an employer with a high staff turnover.

I went to the public sector and lasted a month. I absolutely hated it. I was bored sensleless and was actually embarassed when trying to explain to people what I acutally did. My former employer kept ringing me and I finally decided to go back to my last place of work, in a slightly different role.

OMG, i remember "Who moved my cheese"

I used to work at a large company and they brought in loads of pointless changes, made loads of people redundant and outsourced loads of IT development work.

To 'help us' this they arranged a meeting and handed out free copies of "who moved my cheese" to everyone! what a bunch of c**ts.

6 months later many of the people who were made redundant were reemployed as contractors because, suprise suprise, asking people who work in HR to suddenly write software specifications for developers in India who can barely spoke english didn't work very well.

Who Moved my Cheese is a good book, it just needs to be taken in context. The context in which to use it is when you come up against people who just refuse to change for whatever reason.

The book is about embracing change (in case you didn't know), but the problem it often breeds is when people who are too used to doing things the same way all the time, suddenly become massive proponents of change, so they begin to change everything!

Change is good... As long as it is for the right reasons...

I go into business' where no change has happened in 30 years. I also go into business' where 30 changes have been made in the last month, but the performance is as bad as the one that hasn't made any changes...

The key is making the RIGHT changes, and you can only do this by carefully analysing the problems, and getting to (and eliminating) the root cause of the problems. Unless people see how a change works for them, and makes their life/job better, they're generally not going to embrace it. And making lots of poor changes just for the sake of it, is as bad, if not worse, than doing nothing!