[Closed] Dad wants a new boat.

How about a good old Laser? They have been around for such a long time, the second-hand market must be bouyant (boom! boom!).

Lasers are just about the most fun you can have on the water and there's a massive community and, depending on how old your dad is there's a thriving Masters/Grand Masters circuit all over Europe

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^^ GREAT Grand Master 😀

Lasers are just about the most fun you can have on the water

Agreed!

Simple, fun and fast.

laser

+1

There are better boats, but probably not a better class.

I had one as a 15 yr old, cost me £500 and had a new-ish sail.

Really want another one, maybe it can be my treat if I get back under my target weight.

That's what he's coming from. He's had it for about 25 years, it's truly knackered now though, and I think he fancies a change. He doesn't do much racing, only the local club stuff on a Sunday every now and then. Will be sailed at the small local reservoir and at Salcombe for 3 weeks every summer. He's 56 and about 10 stone FWIW, keen fell runner so no excess weight around anywhere. Cheers for the help all.
EDIT: The deck moulding came away from the hull, then either someone sat on the boat whilst it was on the trolley or the weight of us putting beach stuff on it whilst we used the other boat caused the supports on the trolley to punch through the hull, which when it's windy, causes the boat to fill with water.

Tell him to stop messing about with toys and get a decent yacht.

http://www.dehler.com/new-38/exterieur/article/1262/from-the-sea.html?cHash=510d15a813

Not quite sure the budget stretches that far Steve, but I'll suggest it to him.

I used to make an RS300 go quite quickly (won a few open meetings & regattas in mine).

Absolutely fabulous boat - went like the clappers upwind, ridiculous boatspeed in anything from Force1-2 up to about 5-6. However it should be noted that it is a tricky thing to master - it is 25% lighter than a Laser, has 30% more sail, a much more powerful rig and the water line is only about 18 inches wide at the widest point.

It's a really really tippy, sensitive boat. If he gets one, I guarantee that unless he's really really good, he'll spend the first month swimming after it or sh!tting himself about the next capsize.

Great class association, with a really friendly bunch of guys who will help him get on with the boat and find one.

RS100 looks great fun and easier to sail.

How about a Vareo?

Bathtub with a crap rig and big kite. RS100 is considerably better.

Anyone who says lasers are the most fun you can have on the water are deluded! Its a bit like saying Carrera are the best bikes as there are loads of them.

RS300 is a great little boat, but at 10 stone you'd probably need the little sail.

The RS100 is still quite new and you'd pick up one now for around £4k, but I suspect to get the most out of it at that weight you'd need the smallest 7.4m sq rig and they are still quite rare.

What about a Solo, perhaps not quite as fast as a laser, but more a boat than and ironing board. I'd dare say possible an even stronger class for anyone over 25yrs of age.

Personally i'll be sticking with my Musto Skiff for a little longer yet 😉

Bathtub with a crap rig and big kite. RS100 is considerably better.

Noted! Never tried one, just looked like an interesting option.

RE Lasers - They're just a really nice, simple boat. That's what makes them so much fun. Like singlespeeds. Or something. 😉

Cant see that anyone has mentioned them yet but the Supernova is a fantastic little dinghy,... very similar to a laser but with more leg room for them older knees and a rapidly growing following.

RS300 - pretty twitchy but loads of fun
RS100 - marginally over-rated, fall over more than you'd expect and once over are not the easiest to get back into as they float pretty high and they drift fast in a breeze when capsized due to floating high. Mate had an early one that had an issue with the mast being worn away by the mast-gate - design fault that I think is still there but I may be wrong.
At 10 stone your dad would be fine in a Laser - not the most fun in the world but you're pretty much guaranteed class racing if that's what he's after.

Musto - nicest boat I've owned in a number of ways (especially in light airs), shame I didn't have the time it needs to sail it well.

Solo - perfect for your dad (even though the owners all seem to be a bunch of miserable b'stards)

Supernova - hmmm

What about [i]a ship called Dignity? [/i]

(you'd be tooo young to get that reference Sambob!)

"cough"

Option 1) RS300 for what it's worth, light, not simple/easy to sail as they are a bit tippy (old Moth design) good build quality, bit old fashioned now so spares/sails are reasonably cheap. Will sprint around any course but can be a handfull in a blow, so pick your sail size carefully.. if in doubt have a chat with Rooster Sailing. Bit tight on the handicap but if sailed well can be up there in a mixed fleet.

Option 2) Lasers are great, no doubt (had many) excellent racing and club level banter, light, fun, have to be reasonably fit to make them go fast but plentiful and cheap. Good'ish handicap, spoiled by all the Olyimpic rock stars that sail them in club races but can be up there in a mixed fleet but you'll have to work at it.

Then theres the rest:
Vario, good club boat, decent build, good kit, bit expensive S/H, comes with a small main and kite, so good upwind without putting much effort in then pop the kite downwind and it'll glide very well. Handicaps rubbish for what it is.
Supernova, bad build quality, cheap kit (that has probably been replaced many times before) slow upwind but a giggle down.. No idea what the handicap is as last time I rated one it was back in 2005.
MXRay, look out for this, it's a little pocket rocket, not many made, big giggle factor but pants on any Handicap racing.

Sooo.. I'd go for a Laser (despite my options above) but the Bloke likes the look of an RS100 so try the Vario for a year then sell it and buy a Laser or cut the years loss out and buy a Laser.

Note: The RS300 could be hard to come by S/H for a decent one now..(expect to spend about £2-3k) Look out for cracked mast extensions and joins and head (the mast splits in two) centerboard casings (as some people ram them up the beach) the transom pins on the rudder too as sometimes the halyard for the rudder jams in the cleat and you can't disloge it before ramming up the beach. Then look at the sail, the head is under a lot of pressure when rigged (like a windsurf sail) but it's made of crappy dacron and may need repair, so to the batten pockets, certainly the top one.. then the sail luff because the boat almost always feels powered up even when coasting along if the luff isn't trimmed correctly it'll flap along the mast and wear. Also look out for the transom bungs, they get nicked and the seal around them is pants.. also look out for deck to hull seals around the nose (bow) of the boat again all down to ramming things, toestraps and fittings for them should all be tip top condition as it's the only thing keeping you in the boat, then the boom, it has a hard life and look out for the tansom end of it for the outhaul cleat, check for splitting and wear. Also, both mast and boom are carbon and laquered which means it'll crack and split and discolor don't worry too much but do make sure it's just the laquer and not either mast/boom that has surface cracks in it. (edit) also the kicker(vang) it's the only thing putting tension in the sail and bends both mast and boom to shape the sail, it too has a very hard life so look out for cracks/splits around rivets on both boom and mast base and finally.. sand in the mast base, make sure it hasn't rubbed through the deck (but this is an issue with Lasers too)

HTH

What about a Blaze.Pretty quick and parity between light/heavy weights with the adjustable wings.Not overly technical to sail either. My dad has just called time on sailing....... At the age of 79! The last 10 sailing a Blaze! His boat is up for sale now and although its an older boat (modern X rig) it is pretty much mint.Not ever sailed in +15knots 😀
One of my jobs this week is list it in the for sale adds for him 😐

There's absolutely nothing wrong with a Vareo, as long as you're racing other Vareo's or somehow the RO lays a course that suits

Edit: 10st? No, forget it. You need another bloke on the side to hike it, especially going quite close with the kite up!

Blaze.Pretty quick and parity between light/heavy weights with the adjustable wings.

They ditched that years ago. Everyone sails with the wings at maximum beam, you'll need to be ready to hike it hard at 70 odd kg though.

All the quick Vareo sailors are around 85kg+ for a reason - its the only way to get any sort of performance out upwind.

If he's done with the laser then what about something like a Streaker?

I'd still go with the solo though, just get one with the right mast sail combination to go with your dads weight

A fair few solos & streakers for sale at my local club (There's actually a mint solo and a streaker for sail, both used less than four times)..

I really liked the simplicity of my old streaker (although I just lost it in the recent floods 🙁 and am still trying to get the insurance claim sorted)

As I said above.. A lot of fellas seem to be going for supernovas at my local for some reason.

Elzorillo where are you based?

Supernovas where becoming popular at the club I use to sail at. Sort of like a Laser but a bit better sorted. But there were tails of poor build quality, apparently early ones were better

10 stone is quite light. The only other thing that comes to mind is a Europa moth.

Is he looking for something different or different and harder to sail?

He's a sailing instructor part time and had plenty of experience sailing his laser in all weathers, so he's pretty good. Trapeze boats are too small for our club, you'd be going across the deck more than you'd be hanging off the side. He wants something a bit more challenging, hence the 100/300 decision. Blaze is a possibility.

If he knows what he's doing then a 300 is the best bet. When I was racing them, the class was competitive for sailors from 45kgs (A rig and I think Mark is still sailing his) right up to 110kg. The Sweet spot was 75-80kg on B rig.

The rig design is far from new but very efficient and easy to depower. I clocked just under 25 knots in mine at Looe 🙂 Loved it.

One thing to watch for is that there was a batch of boats where the mast pot was put in at the wrong angle - 500-505 I think.

Steve Bolland continues to beat everyone in 411, Tim Keen is bloody quick in 328 as well - the condition of the boat is more important than the age.

sambob - Member
He's interested in the RS100, but due to them not being very old, they're still expensive. RS300 is also on the cards, much cheaper but maybe not quite as fun. Anyone sailed either of these, or could recommend an exciting non-trapeze single hander?

Tell him not to bother, unless he sails at a club where there are others, or they do windward leeward courses, they're a bit of a flash in the pan, don't go upwind worth a damn and the kite is difficult to carry round the cans. I had one for a while then got rid of it, interesting the guy i sold it to has also now sold it on.

I'm sailing a lovely little find at the moment, an EPS, not that many of them about and not a lot of 'class racing and their handicap is probably a bit enthusiastic. So I'd say go for a Blaze, I had one of those for a while and regret selling it to buy the 100.

The 100 has other issues, bloody difficult to get back into if you do ever fall out if it's windy because of the volume in the wings.

Pass I can recommend you a Mountain Bikes 😕

Elzorillo where are you based?

N.Notts/S.Yorks. Dont know about the build quality of supernovas in general, but all the ones at our club are first generation and none have any problems that I know of. In fact the opposite is the case, as more try them more are getting them.

re the solo/streaker.. both are absolutely as new. Both bought last year. One owned by a guy who immediately fell ill and couldnt sail (nothing terminal hehhe) the other was bought by a disabled guy who refused to accept he was disabled (he's now coming to terms with it).

Cheers. I'll let him know about the 300 + the Blaze.

Ok so coincedence that your club was getting into them

If I were lighter and after a fun boat I'd be looking very hard at a Farr 3.7 - google it.
Problem is you need to build your own or ship one in from NZ 🙁

[url= http://ukfarr37.blogspot.co.uk/ ]More Farr 3.7 info here[/url]

There was a guy rocking a Supernova at the Brass Monkey, it's had a bit of a rework his company Hartley laminates are building it.

That Farr 3.7 hasn't got going here yet but Butler Boats have just announced they are going to build them.

I still think your best bet is a Blaze unless you can find a Laser EPS, which is my current favourite for sheer joy and ease.

You could try asking [url= http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=12&title=choosing-a-boat ]Here[/url] they'll probably all suggest Solo or Streaker because they're mostly brain dead or undead, but there are a few live ones that can tell you more about the Blaze and Supernova..

Hey Graeham - if the OP's dad was heavier I could always suggest a real boat:
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[Finn]

laser EPS looks good, I'll let him know.

You are all wide of the mark..... RS 600. the best single handed boat put on this watery planet!!
END OF!!
And you can pick them up cheap, they are all but indistructable, and not half as hard to sail as people imagine!

Sniff.

I like the Laser EPS- again, not many around like the RS100 but really nice, light, fast boats.

RS300s are rather love hate- very sensitive and unstable, which you could find involving or frustrating depending on what view you have of it.

I think if he's getting on a bit then a Streaker or Solo would be the best bet (the EPS takes a bit of getting used to) and now they come in plastic are low maintenance. Solos in particular are booming just now.

And you can pick them up cheap, they are all but indistructable, and not half as hard to sail as people imagine!

Solos in particular are boring just now.

He's 56 in a couple of weeks, and a fell runner, so the age thing isn't really of any significance. He says he's not as keen on the EPS as a 100, but they're SO much cheaper.