[Closed] Cyclist "cut up" by an ambulance (one for Drac 😉 )

He got it worng.

cyclist 100% in the wrong IMO. a car in front of the bike had already pulled over and the cyclist should have stopped behind it - instead he overtook the slowing car putting himself in a very dangerous position. the driver of the ambulance was a bit over eager perhaps

Can't see what the ambulance driver did that the cyclist thought was endangering him. Also not sure the cyclist did enough to get out of the way though to be fair from just this angle it's hard to know what options were availabe to them aside from ducking in behind the car he overtook which looks a pretty reasonably plan.

the driver of the ambulance was a bit over eager perhaps

To do what? Get home for a chippy tea?

Wrongity-wrong.

He pulled out to pass another car, cutting into what was then the middle lane. He's lucky the ambulance didn't collect him at that point.

I wonder if he was riding with headphones on?

Ambulances I have seen usually would slow down more at the junction even with blues and twos going but the cyclist should have stopped behind the slowing car.

Even if you look over your shoulder and see the ambulance a hundred yards from the roundabout in the outside lane - you have to be a knob to go "well, I'll be all right on the inside going straight over, then". Ambulance on blues and twos = get outta the way.

Doesn’t look like he was in any danger and the air horn appeared to be used as an extra warning as the cyclist didn’t appear to acknowledge he was there. Footage from the vehicle will be interesting.

yep cyclist was an idiot

I wonder if he was riding with headphones on?

I wondered that as well. sirens I find actually painful when on my bike they are that loud

Cyclist should have stopped. He didn't, we can all make mistakes. But to then go onto social media and have a go at the driver and drum up some publicity outs him as a dobber.

He’s a dick

As someone said,I bet he was wearing headphones?

Which I think is mental in itself on the roads.

Well that's a relief - you all seem to agree with my thoughts on it. Plenty of opportunity for him to get out of the way, and whatever he claims and thinks it's perfectly normal for an ambulance to use the right lane to pass other traffic before turning left (in the reasonable expectation that everybody else will stop until it's gone).

Any time I am riding in traffic and there's an emergency vehicle I make myself scarce so the drivers can pull out of the way. I'll hop onto a pavement or into a driveway and stop.

Well that's a relief - you all seem to agree with my thoughts on it.

Wait until the morning.

Bike riding idiot.

Cyclists actions not ideal. However... I drive along that road regularly. For periods of years I have driven it twice a day. Some people in cars treat cyclists with incredible aggression on that road and having seen a cyclist trapped against the railings on the near side of the road - I’d be extremely cautious to pull over there. However, just sent this to a West Midlands Ambo mate (20 years service) and he thinks the driver of the ambulance is not driving to an appropriate standard. Make of that what you will.

Any time I am riding in traffic and there's an emergency vehicle I make myself scarce so the drivers can pull out of the way. I'll hop onto a pavement or into a driveway and stop

This is a wise move: I've been hit by someone who shat themselves and pulled straight into the kerb, not realising I was there.
Even though they were in the process of overtaking me 🙄

Wait until the morning.

I'll do the contratian view now. We don't know what happens before the start of the video but it looks to me like the bike is already in the middle lane at the start of the video. Without seeing the road markings that's a road position I'd tend to use when going straight on if the left lane is going left, although I'd probably try to dominate the lane a bit more.

Now the ambulance rocks up. We don't know how much notice there was beforehand but the siren isn't audible right at the start. I make it three seconds from when the siren becomes audible to the junction, and the bike's view is obstructed by the other vehicles. That's not enough time to look over your shoulder, find a safe gap and pull over; and the bike can't vanish into thin air.

Now the bike could have stopped at the junction, which would seem sensible but it's not that unreasonable to carry on and anyone on blues should have expected it. Turning left from the rightmost lane without indicating is a fairly risky manoeuvre and would fail you your driving test, so is careless driving. Blues don't stop you having to drive with due care and attention. It wouldn't have hurt the ambulance to back off for a second just to make the whole thing much safer and the horn was, in my view, an unnecessary expression of frustration that tells you about the ambulance driver's mental state.

If the bike had been an articulated lorry you can bet the ambulance driver wouldn't have attempted to intimidate in the same way.

I guess it depends on whether you think the cyclist deliberately pulled out in front of the ambulance or not. To me the video is inconclusive.

[quote=ajaj ]It wouldn't have hurt the ambulance to back off for a second

The driver did back off for a second, hence why there was actually quite a decent gap between the back wheel of the bike and the ambulance - whatever the cyclist might think or claim, that didn't look at all dangerous to me (and I've had my fair share of people driving dangerously when I'm cycling, I know what it looks like, that wouldn't bother me at all if it happened to me - apart from wondering if I'd been a dick that is).

Cyclist is a **** who should have had his organs harvested.
He's a loser that will do anything for attention.
Not getting hit by an ambulance?
I haven't been hit by an ambulance all week, no need to shout about it.
This will result in a social media hate campaign, he won't like the attention then, bedwetting ****.

I don't think I've ever before watched a video from a cyclist's onboard camera and thought they were definitively in the wrong.

Congratulations on finally acknowledging your prejudice though aracer.
🙂

ETA: WRT my first post, it's not rude if it's true. 😀

As a rule you can hear sirens way before the cars and have plenty of time to get out the way. Its the same on a motorbike. I've gad no end of grief from tin box steering wheel attenders when I have slowed to let an ambulance by.

This assumes the ambulance had his sirens on well in advance.

Seems a fuss over nothing. Ambo was driving a bit aggressily perhaps, but didn’t really do much wrong. Cyclist could have given way more gracefull but I can sort of understand how they came to be in that position. No one got hit or close to it. What’s the big deal?

The cyclist could have pulled over no problem imo- behind the last car they overtook that was already attempting to pull over themselves.

I can't see what's wrong with what the ambulance has done - I'd want them to hurry to pick me up as well if I was seriously ill.

Incidentally, the ambulance didn't do anything that close to knocking said cyclist off - he cut behind him.

If he was aware there was an ambulance coming he should have slowed and pulled in. Looks to me like he was accelerating to get onto & through the roundabout.
He probably underestimated how quickly it would get to him.
Bit of a tattiepot to go online and twine about it though.
A part of my cycle commute is on a route to local A&E - I often do what molgrips says to let blues through.I even do the slowing down hand signal and everything! 🙂

Was it a slow news day for the metro?

Hard to see what the fuss is about

What’s the big deal?

I’m going to say entitlement. The video appears to show somebody on a bicycle who considers their own progress more important than that of, oh, let’s say for the sake of argument, a dying child*. Of course, as had already been pointed out, the rider may have headphones in or be totally deaf; but if awareness of the ambulance’s approach is assumed, then the one on the bike would probably be wise to question their sense of importance/entitlement. We do not know, however, if the rider was also on their way to tend a dying child**

*other emergencies are available.
** other emergencies are available.

Turning left from the rightmost lane without indicating is a fairly risky manoeuvre and would fail you your driving test, so is careless driving.

How exactly was it careless?

Loads of people driving cars react poorly when an ambulance is behind. Many don't notice it, others seem to go into a blind panic and stop dead in the road causing more of a problem that if they had continued and slowly bulled pulled to the left.

The difference is they don't video it and then report it as the ambulance drivers fault.

Should maybe post videos of the idiots I encounter when pressing my neeee naaaaw buttons

Cyclist in the wrong.

Ambulance driver then doing the usual "there's a cyclist ahead, I can and must overtake him" and also in the wrong - looked reasonably clear that the cyclist was not turning left. Had his maneuver worked he'd have saved about 1 second?

However he didn't really endanger cyclist.

It's the drivers unthinking overtake I'd question - happens to me all the time - drivers with sirens on should do more thinking.

teamhurtmore - Member
Was it a slow news day for the metro?

Hard to see what the fuss is about

Potential for cyclist hate clicks.

Cyclist can be knobs too shocker

Drac - Moderator
Turning left from the rightmost lane without indicating is a fairly risky manoeuvre and would fail you your driving test, so is careless driving.
How exactly was it careless?

We're taught to do that, I assume you are too?

Cyclists can be judgmental arseholes too.
There is absolutely no way from those few seconds of video that you can tell what is right and wrong. We're seeing a rear view, the cyclist hasn't got eyes in the back of his head. Yeah, he heard the sirens. Where are they?
Second or 2 to decide what to do, he went straight on, didn't get hit, ambulance delayed by a split second maybe?
Unless you're there, in that situation you don't know what you would've done.

No-one seems to have commented on the white van pulling out as it’s being overtaken and almost crashing with the ambulance. At least one party there was worse than the cyclist...

How exactly was it careless?

Not "careless", "careless driving". The offense of "careless driving" has nothing to do with being careless or not.

Taking your hand off the wheel to make hand gestures is also careless driving and there have been convictions, including where it's resulted in cyclist injuries. I wouldn't trust the witnesses or Metro reporting to say whether that happened or not in this case.

Using the horn to intimidate other road users is also naughty.

Technically the cyclist did nothing wrong (I don't think anything he did can be construed as obstruction), but the ambulance driver did bend a few rules. Technically; and the whole dying baby thing means we ignore the technicalities.

That's why I find the Ambulance service statement a bit disturbing. On the one hand it's great to see the management defending their employee / third party contractor providing services to the NHS but on the other they didn't exactly cover themselves in glory.

So not a great example of professionalism or tolerance, but like others have said a bit of a click-bait article to stir up a flame war by the Metro. I suspect, but have no proof, that there may be some selective quoting going on.

Struggling to see what the ambulance has done wrong.

Approaches roundabout in outside lane as that has the least traffic. Anticipates / hopes / expects other traffic will allow him to turn left from the "wrong" lane. Cyclist doesn't react as the ambulance driver would have hoped but is aware of the cyclist and is able to brake and make the turn behind the cyclist. Seems pretty much perfect from the ambulance driver to me.

It wouldn't be that uncommon for a "normal" driver to pull a manouver like that if they'd made a mistake and got in the wrong lane but be far less aware of the cyclist.

The ambulance was behind him at all times, so as your thread title implies he wasn't "cut up" at all. Wonder if the cyclist has some kind of hearing impairment, or just a cognitive one (as evidenced by complaint).

On a tangent, I was actually close passed and cut up by a mountain rescue team member "making progress" through a village a few weeks ago. The driver was on the way to an incident in the local country park.

How do I know? I saw a MRT sticker on the back of the car and spotted it parked next to the MRT Land Rover by the time I'd got up the hill and round the corner.

Do we think it's fair to give cyclists less respect than normal when there might be an old dear who's turned an ankle while walking her dog in the woods?

On a tangent, I was actually close passed and cut up by a mountain rescue team member "making progress" through a village a few weeks ago. The driver was on the way to an incident in the local country park.

Do we think it's fair to give cyclists less respect than normal when there might be an old dear who's turned an ankle while walking her dog in the woods?

No excuse for a dangerous pass from any emergency vehicle. Even if you're being a prize tit and not moving over for them. And MR vehicles certainly have zero extra status and driving privileges when attending incidents.

I wonder how much training the MRT members get to drive like that?

(I know the answer to that for the two busiest ones in Scotland but cannot assume it's the same everywhere).

We're taught to do that, I assume you are too?

I was taught under the police advanced driving regulations.

Technically the cyclist did nothing wrong (I don't think anything he did can be construed as obstruction),

Looked at it again this morning. The car he was following pulled over for the ambulance and instead of staying in line and pulling over too he elected to pull out to get around it and continue on his way. He had the opportunity to not obstruct the ambulance whilst remaining safe and did not take it. Does this count as 'did nothing wrong' in a lagal sense- maybe. Do it consistitute did nothing wrong in a moral sense - he absolutly did.

From my perspective from that point on you have to regard everything else he says as the words of a knob and of little value. And I'm more than happy for a knob acting selfishly to get the full horn treatment from a member of the emergency services.

ambulance got that all wrong

ambulance got that all wrong

Love you explain why (in your opinon) if you are able to.

[s]Do you people actually ride bikes?[/s]

Actually forget it. I get it now - being a judgmental **** is far more fun than admitting that you don't know.
I sometimes forget that's how The Internet works. It's me age, you know.

How come the cyclist makes the news, with the world judging him and ambulance driver?

Really, we ought to have thousands of 'idiot in a Fiesta didn't pull over far enough' headlines every day...

Once more for me it is a 'cyclists bad' narrative in the press - even compare the Metro headline with the 'now you decide who is wrong' buttons.

I am also not sure from that few seconds of video what happened - the cyclist has to look right behind, guess ambulance route, decide whether to stop or carry on, judge other traffic, work out their route, be alert for other cars coming round roundabout, balance bike/brake/steer/pedal etc. That video is a few seconds. Not enough time for driver or rider to really react, let alone the pitchforks to be sharpened.

Really, we ought to have thousands of 'idiot in a Fiesta didn't pull over far enough' headlines every day...

I guess if you elect to upload a video slagging off the ambulance driver your own actions are going to be called into question.

Let us not forget about who owns the metro and what other news paper they are affiliated with.
Drumroll...

My view is the cyclist had plenty of time and space to tuck in behind the car already slowing to let the ambulance past. It does not take a few seconds to react.

Why didn’t the cyclist just wait at the junction ?

amby driver trained for this type of situation, amby driver has the better view of the traffic ahead, amby driver already aware that traffic not reacting exactly as he would hope, amby driver coming in way too hot for his hard left, amby driver has a terrible road position for his hard left, amby driver honking his horn in anger like an oaf
cyclist and other road users made assumptions and some got it wrong, amby driver trained to expect this in traffic.

Cyclist should have been more aware, but also it was unsafe for the ambulance to overtake the bike, which in fairness they didn't.. no point turning one emergency into two.

I'd say 50/50.

but also it was unsafe for the ambulance to overtake

Not sure where you are seeing the ambulance overtake the bike, or even trying to.

Not sure where you are seeing the ambulance overtake the bike, or even trying to.

Yeh I've edited my post.. The ambulance was positioning for the overtake though imo, and decided there was no room at the last minute and tucked back in.

To be honest it's a bit of a non incident really.

My view is the cyclist could have pulled over before, and therefore should have. Whether he proceeded as he did because he 'was assured he was correct in the eyes of the highway code' or panicked and proceeded, I can't say for certain.

I've certainly made my share of poor decisions whilst riding, so usually I'm not one to make comment. At at the end of the day, this was hardly a major incident. But given his behaviour following he certainly looks like a massive bellend who believes he can't be wrong. I can't believe he's not already a member on here.

Cyclist was a tit, ambulance driver also a tit - for the extra air horn rather than the driving. The air horn wasn't a warning to the rider it was a "get out of my way, can't you see how important I am" blast.

Unnecessary from the driver but in no way did he endanger the cyclsit.

The most disturbing thing was the video that followed that one - group of ned teenagers kicking the bejesus out of a girl on her own, head stamps the lot. Absolute scum...

Just had a quick look at the guys twitter account, he’s a serial complainer.

[quote=DezB ]Cyclists can be judgmental arseholes too.

Indeed - here we have one complaining about an ambulance driver nearly colliding with him when he didn't. Which is how those articles and this thread came about.

[quote=ajaj ]Not "careless", "careless driving". The offense of "careless driving" has nothing to do with being careless or not.

Of course - and that driving falls way, way short of the what is required to prove careless driving (ie below the standard expected of a competent driver).

Taking your hand off the wheel to make hand gestures is also careless driving and there have been convictions, including where it's resulted in cyclist injuries. I wouldn't trust the witnesses or Metro reporting to say whether that happened or not in this case.

So you're speculating about it? 🙄

Technically the cyclist did nothing wrong

Well apart from ignoring HC rule 219 that is.

the ambulance driver did bend a few rules. Technically; and the whole dying baby thing means we ignore the technicalities.

Indeed it does, and it is expected and accepted that emergency vehicles will bend the rules which apply to other road users. Hence HC rule 219. My walk to school is along a road often used by emergency vehicles and I see them often "bending" the rules - one this morning went through a red light!!! 😯
😯 😯 Though interestingly several of the cars it overtook also pulled into a mandatory bike lane.

Having been on the receiving end, lying in bits at the side of the road waiting for an ambulance to arrive.

GET OUT OF THE WAY !

I wonder if he was riding with headphones on

It doesn't render you completely deaf (not that deaf people can't ride safely on the road anyway).

I [i]am [/i]partially deaf, I often use headphones, not only can I still hear sirens I can also still hear car engines, and people next to me talking, and at times I[i] can't [/i]hear my music because the wind noise is too high. Sure it's possible to use noise cancelling headphones and whack the volume up to crazy levels, but that's not the only mode of operation.

Headphones doesn't necessarily mean an inability to hear, just like no headphones doesn't necessarily mean you can...

Indeed - here we have one complaining about an ambulance driver nearly colliding with him when he didn't.

Ah yeah, cos [i]everyone[/i] read that before commenting on the video!

ignoring HC rule 219 that is.

Who's speculating?

The most disturbing thing was the video that followed that one

Aye 😯

Agreed total scum!! Certainly makes you realise we have bigger problems than some throbber on his bike.

neither party perfect, both could have done better. Nob for making an issue of it though.

My additional observation would be that when car drivers hear a siren, frequently it inspires them to ridiculous feats, diving into the kerb in front of other traffic and so on. It seems almost as if they get transfixed by the emergency vehicle and everything around them disappears. So i agree, when i hear one my impulse when on a bike is to get some space around me, onto a pavement or suchlike because when they're all panicking looking to pull in I don't want them forgetting my presence. We weren't there and while it's easy to say he could have gone in behind the car, at that instant with chaos starting to unfold behind, he might have decided to aim for an empty stretch of road instead of creating another obstruction right on the r/bout.

But he did than make a fuss of it, so he's still a nob.

convert - Member

Really, we ought to have thousands of 'idiot in a Fiesta didn't pull over far enough' headlines every day...

I guess if you elect to upload a video slagging off the ambulance driver your own actions are going to be called into question.

Indeed. Youtube is full of idiot driver / road rage / car cam films. Not one makes the newspapers.

convert - Member

The car he was following pulled over for the ambulance and instead of staying in line and pulling over too he elected to pull out to get around it and continue on his way.

tjagain - Member

the cyclist had plenty of time and space to tuck in behind the car already slowing to let the ambulance past.

When I first looked at the video I thought that the car (a Toyota?) had indeed pulled in to allow the ambulance to pass. If that were the case it would suggest that the ambulance had used its siren earlier (or that the driver was very diligent in checking his rear view mirror) and that the cyclist should have likewise been aware of the ambulance well before he reached the roundabout, and pulled in.

However, I am not so sure that the Toyota was not stationary and positioned where it was because it was/had been simply giving way to a car already on the roundabout, and was just waiting for the opportunity to enter the roundabout and take the first exit. If so, the cyclist was simply getting in the correct position (to take the second exit) when he moved out and 'overtook' the Toyota. In the video, the siren starts immediately before the cyclist enters the roundabout: by that point he is already committed. If so, for the ambulance driver to then sound the horn seems possibly to be bad practice: the cyclist has already been surprised by the ambulance siren, sounding the horn might only result in uncertainty in the cyclist's mind about what to do, and might cause him to panic and brake, blocking the ambulance's path for longer.

Cyclist should have pulled over but doesn't have to. Makes him a bit of a knob.

Ambulance driver should know the above.

Ambulance driver did a decent job of making progress and avoiding the cyclist.

Its amazing how crap people are at letting blue lights through. People who stop when they should go; people go when they should stop.

It’s hard to tell due to wind noise when the siren started, it’s also seems fairly deliberately edited so you can’t see anything leading up to it. The footage from the ambulance would make it more interesting but I place good money on it they had the siren on long before reaching the roundabout, the other vehicles behaviour suggests so.