Claiming chairs/tables in pubs cafes, acceptable?

I'm with you on this, drives me nuts !

Grrrrrrrrr

See also standing in the queue with your kids, having checked there will be somewhere to sit and a singleton in the queue takes the last 4 seat table.

Should people on their own be entitled to take up a table for four?

Edit - beaten to it!

Should people on their own be entitled to take up a table for four?

May I suggest a fluid table system? Where people move when a more suitable table become available. Yes, the solo diner gets the first table even if it’s a 6 seater as they are first in line, but they are moved to a small table as soon as one becomes available.

Problem solved.

The three remaining tables get taken by people who are part of groups

You think the whole group should queue for their drinks?

If solo I just put my bag/hat etc on the chair and claim it while in the queue. Just play the same game

Stick your jacket/bag on the table when you arrive.

Perhaps go more upmarket to an establishment with table service?

Not as annoying as the person on a busy train who tries to claim a double seat to themselves by sticking their briefcase/handbag on the seat next them.

Though most annoying of all was the person who was most irritated when I politely showed him my ticket and pointed out he was sitting in my first class train seat. "You mean you want me to move?"

It might be wrong if you as a singleton left a bag or coat to claim a table and then joined the queue. But if you arrive with more than one person then one queues to order and the others sit at a table.

Not as annoying as the person on a busy train who tries to claim a double seat to themselves by sticking their briefcase/handbag on the seat next them.

When I get on a busy train, I always choose the seat where someone has tried to claim it for their bag. **** 'em.

Tbh not doing so would be odd. How do you know who in the queues standing for take away and who wants a seat.

Most. Places I frequent will assign you a table then ask you to place your order at the counter.

Bags on seats on a train can get lost though that's just ignorant and like john ill challenge it

How do you know who in the queues standing for take away and who wants a seat.

You don’t. So you wait until you’ve ordered to get a seat. Easy.

You don’t. So you wait until you’ve ordered to get a seat. Easy.

Think that through a bit longer you'll see the issue

10 folk in the queue 7 tables 6 of the 10 people are wanting take away but you don't know that . Do you bother standing in the queue for a table. Drink ?

Your policy doesn't sound great for business

Though most annoying of all was the person who was most irritated when I politely showed him my ticket and pointed out he was sitting in my first class train seat. “You mean you want me to move?”

I see more and more of this attitude on trains.
It's not like booking a seat costs anything on a train - or sticking to that booking.

Does seem the wrong way round to me. Walk into the cafe, see if there is space, claim it (with child, partner, bag, coat, etc), join queue and order.

Went into a cafe that had this system formalised. You grabbed a marker, put it on a table to say it had been claimed, then went up and ordered.

I've been to many food places that say "find a table before ordering", I don't recall ever going to one saying the opposite.

Take a spare seat on their table?

Take a spare seat on their table?

Just ask them to bunk up and share a seat.. 😉

Unless it's a wait to be seated place we'll always find a table then go up to order. Makes sense. I don't want to order and then find we've no where to sit.

On trains (I always reserve a seat) and buses I will put my bag next to me , but always prepared to move it for someone.

I/we are obviously social parias 🤣

No, I don't think it's acceptable but, as most people do it, so do I - unless the café is quiet in which case there's no need.

Take a spare seat on their table?

Velocity Cafe in Inverness has pretty much that. Massive community table with only a handful of twin tables.

It's like the old student days of any old seat in the union.

Doesn't one simply use ones shooting stick?

I did a wee solo biking camping trip a few years ago.

Went for a pint in Kippford and sat at a table in the beer garden with my pint. I went inside for a second pint and to order some food. As I was on my own, in order to keep my table I left a quarter of a pint sitting there, along with my hat and the magazine I was reading.

Was inside for a matter of 2-3 minutes and came out to find a family had taken my table and thrown my stuff on the ground. When I politely explained I was sitting there and I'd ordered food to be delivered to that table, apparently I was the arsehole...

On trains (I always reserve a seat) and buses I will put my bag next to me , but always prepared to move it for someone.

Unacceptable IMO. No-one should have to ask you for permission to use a seat that you haven't paid for.

On trains (I always reserve a seat) and buses I will put my bag next to me , but always prepared to move it for someone.

Unacceptable IMO. No-one should have to ask you for permission to use a seat that you haven’t paid for

Not actually what I said. I said I'm prepared to move it for someone. If it's getting busy and someone is obviously looking for somewhere to sit I'll move it. I'm not ignoring people until they have e to ask.

Booking seats every day doesn't work if you are a commuter...I'll sit anywhere I can, even reserved, although I'll happily move or stand for someone who does have a reserved seat and I'm sat in it.

Following thought.... What about when you've 'paid for a seat' but have to stand anyway as there are no seats on our wonderful public transport systems at times?

Or, you've 'paid for' and got 'your seat', who do you give it up for?

On trains (I always reserve a seat) and buses I will put my bag next to me , but always prepared to move it for someone.

Fair enough, at least that's something. I still think it's rather entitled.

Not so long ago I left my small table to visit the pub facilities. I'd placed my half-finished pint on top of my half-finished book on the small table, to indicate I had been sitting there and fully intended to resume doing so. I returned to find three people sitting at "my" table, one of whom was reading my book. There were several other empty tables nearby. I pulled my sawn-off shotgun from its holster...

Entitled?

So you sit there on the bus or the train hugging your bag at all times to make sure there's no encroachment on an empty seat. Each to their own I guess.

You don’t. So you wait until you’ve ordered to get a seat. Easy.

Except that it's not uncommon for cafés to have a sign advising punters to find a seat before ordering.

Otherwise you walk away from the till with a bowl of soup and a crusty roll and stand there like an idiot, or...

You try to place your order and they ask for your table number...

What is annoying is how we don't tend to ask/offer to share a table... unless it's desperate and your arm is going dead/soup going cold!

Velocity Cafe in Inverness has pretty much that. Massive community table with only a handful of twin tables.

Ryvoan cafe in Aviemore has the same setup. I've been in a couple excellent Indian restaurants with the same. Seems to work well.

I'm not sure what the OP expects folk to do. A group of four to queue and order and then hang about waiting for a table to be freed up? Seems like a recipe for chaos in the usual compact cafes and so on. How are staff to start serving tables if the place is full of folk standing and waiting? What happens when their order is ready?

Cafes should just have some "Billy no mates" signs ready for you to pop on the table whilst you que. Only snag would be if you left it there when you left, screwing up the system.

But yes, solo you need to be prepared to move to a smaller table when the place if getting full for if nothing else the benefit of the cafe's ability to keep afloat and make money when they are able.

Entitled?

So you sit there on the bus or the train hugging your bag at all times to make sure there’s no encroachment on an empty seat. Each to their own I guess.

Now that's not what I said is it. Do you hug your bag when you have to move it for someone? The way you volunteered that you put your bag on the seat next to you suggests it is a choice with a motive to avoid having people sit next to you until you deem it busy enough for it to be moved (to you hugging it apparently, even though I very rarely see anyone doing that , there are several places to put a bag, but no doubt you always travel with too much stuff that you need immediate access to for any of those to work for you)

We're going to disagree on this one, so you continue to put your bag next to you and I'll continue to select people like you to sit next to.

Doesn’t one simply use ones shooting stick?

Good lord, doesn't one just get one's footman to queue for one's order?

On trains (I always reserve a seat) and buses I will put my bag next to me , but always prepared to move it for someone.

Unacceptable IMO. No-one should have to ask you for permission to use a seat that you haven’t paid

I use to think this and deliberately get people to move their bag. But changed after conversation with my daughter. She sometimes suffers from social anxiety and finds travelling by train particularly stressful. She therefore really prefers to sit alone as having a stranger next to her feels quite intrusive. Of course she does move her bag when asked but admits she does use it as an obstacle to try and protect her space.

Not sure if that counts as “entitled”? But it certainly reminded me to remember you never know what someone else is going through so pays to be kind when you can.

You go to a coffee shop to drink in, on your own?

Not sure if that counts as “entitled”? But it certainly reminded me to remember you never know what someone else is going through so pays to be kind when you can.

Buy two tickets?

Being a Carer is a thing, back when I was looking a disabled partner we got a lot of two-for-one tickets for concerts and suchlike. (It sounds like a sweet deal but I got dragged to all manner of shit that I'd never have paid money to attend.) It might be worth asking if the train company has such a policy.

If you want to keep the seat next to you free, just tap it with your hand and wink at any approaching passengers.

You go to a coffee shop to drink in, on your own?

Of course, why wouldn't you? one of the pleasures of being out riding a bike, walking etc is stopping for a coffee and snack.

"On trains (I always reserve a seat) and buses I will put my bag next to me , but always prepared to move it for someone.

Fair enough, at least that’s something. I still think it’s rather entitled."

More than that: It's arseholic!

Sitting down before you order is clearly inefficient in terms of table space. But as the first question when you get to be served is normally “where are you sitting?” I’ve now accepted that inefficient is normal and expected

Of course, why wouldn’t you? one of the pleasures of being out riding a bike, walking etc is stopping for a coffee and snack.

In a room full of people you don't know? Sounds horrendous.

Very happy on a solo cafe stop here

In a room full of people you don’t know? Sounds horrendous.

I mean, by that token takeout is surely even worse? There's a whole wide world of people you don't know out there!

Cafes should just have some “Billy no mates” signs ready for you to pop on the table

Probably just need to carry a printed 'Reserved' page in a tatty folder protector sheet. Job jobbed. If you're flush get a little engraved 'Reserved' sign. While I'm joking I would not be surprised to find that someone already does this.

My annoying version of this is when ski race teams/families abandoned their bags on tables all over the lodge and leave one person to overwatch the tables while they're out racing and skiing. Basically, taking up all the tables and not letting anyone else sit there when they are outside. One of my pleasures in life is pointing out that they've tried to claim tables already reserved for ski school.

What a strange way to do it.

Either claim a seat by asking those you came in with to sit there or place something on the table area.

Unless it’s quiet then take a gamble.

Depends - most cafes have two and four seat tables, if they’re not too busy I’ll queue, get my order then find a table somewhere, sometimes if I’ve got bags of shopping I’ll dump them, along with my own bag and jacket wherever’s convenient, then queue, because I’ve only got two hands, and I’ll try to grab a table for two, just because there’s often small groups of people, so it’s churlish to take a table for four when there’s only me.

Same with a pub, especially if I’m going to eat, because the person serving me will want to know where the food is going to.

Really depends on the venue. If it's a Starbucks or similar style coffee shop then queue up, order and grab food then find a table.

If it's a pub and I'm going for a pint then go to the bar, grab a pint and a packet of nuts then get a table. Unless I'm stopping mid-ride on the bike in which case I'll be in the beer garden and will lean the bike up against a free table then go and get a beer/snack.

If it's an eating pub then I'll usually get a table first, as they want to know the table number when ordering at the bar. Sometimes have to eat on my own like billy no mates when away for work.

We had a scenario at a country house place a few years ago, Castle Howard in fact. There's a big outdoor play area and a hut selling pizzas. Big queue for the pizza place so we queue up order pizza then grab it. All outdoor seating and no spare seats apart from a set of 4 that had a load of jackets on them. As they were unoccupied and we had food we sat there. The people who came back weren't very happy with us. They had no food with them, so I assume they just wante to have a sit down. I asked if they'd like us and my disabled father in-law to move, and they skulked off.

People who decide to use a bag as a buffer to avoid people sitting next to them on a busy train can do one. Sorry but it's just selfish. I make a point of asking them to move it so I can sit there. Act like a dick and so will I.

Even on an empty train I'll pop my bag in overhead storage.

Quite a few cafes have a bar with high stools that work well for solo visitors. I quite often go on my own, for various reasons, but more often than not to pass some time whilst one of my children is doing an activity, or grabbing a bite to eat after a mid-week ride. It can be a nice way of getting a change of scene to clear the head. Sometimes I'll even read this forum whilst having a coffee...

At work last Wednesday in the office someone took my chair! I'd gone upstairs for breakfast, laptop on desk open and connected to monitor, mouse and glass of water, bike helmet and gloves on desk and bag under desk. Was fuming as the rest of the floor was pretty empty so loads of spare chairs exactly the same as mine. Some people!

When I get on a busy train, I always choose the seat where someone has tried to claim it for their bag. **** ’em.

+1

Any "risk" that it's protecting the space around someone with anxiety is offset by not forcing someone else with anxiety to have to engage in conversation with a different selfish traveler about whether anyone is sat there.

In fact if we assume the distribution of people with anxiety is even between those sat down and those boarding, then :

x in y people sat down MIGHT be impacted by my decision.
Whereas x in y people boarding are definitely impacted otherwise.

So you sit there on the bus or the train hugging your bag at all times to make sure there’s no encroachment on an empty seat. Each to their own I guess.

No I put it in the rack at the front / overhead shelf like a sane person.

When I get on a busy train, I always choose the seat where someone has tried to claim it for their bag. **** ’em.

In other words, if you see someone you think is acting like a dick you act like a dick purely to make a point and somehow think this makes the world a better place?
Just take an empty seat 🙄

Edit:

I'll sometimes put the bag on the seat next to me, unless the train is busy.

The reason for this is I prefer a window seat and wan to have my bag with me for easy access to the stuff I'll use while travelling. Having it in the overhead rack is a pain, likewise stuffing it under my seat so I can't move my legs comfortably. As stated if it's busy I won't do this, but if there were empty seats and someone made a point of moving my bag to sit down I might suspect they were the entitled one.

Just take an empty seat 🙄

It is empty, there's no one sat in it.

It is empty, there’s no one sat in it.

Yep. Good for you.

So instead of two happy people sitting near each other, you have two mildly annoyed people sitting right up against each other subtly fighting over the armrest and trying not to peer at each other's screens/books/whatever.

So instead of two happy people sitting near each other, you have two mildly annoyed people sitting right up against each other subtly fighting over the armrest and trying not to peer at each other’s screens/books/whatever.

No, the trains 'busy', i.e. there are no empty double seats.

And as for people trying to use the armrest as an arm rest rather than treating at some sort of social DMZ ..........

thisisnotaspoon . Just wanted to say you have my full support here.

This thread is a masterclass in "I'm correct and everyone else is wrong."

In a quiet train I'll leave my bag on an adjacent seat. I see no issue with this, the space is there to be used and anyone boarding and choosing to sit next to me rather than the many other empty seats would be just odd. A bit like urinal etiquette. As it fills up I'll shift my crap out of the way, under the seat or overhead.

I am, of course, correct and everyone else is wrong.

When I commuted by train the layout was blocks of 2 seats on one side of the aisle and 3 on the other. I noticed that the last seat to be taken was almost always the middle of the 3, so if I got on while it was empty (leaving London) I'd sit in the middle of the 3 straight away and see how long it took for the seats either side to fill up.

No, the trains ‘busy’, i.e. there are no empty double seats.

If we're only talking about busy trains, then I suspect a lot of us are saying the same thing in different ways.

... The only difference being that some of us pick a seat at random or for convenience and some of us pick a seat specifically to annoy people who annoy us.... It just strikes me as a bit petty, is all.

And as for people trying to use the armrest as an arm rest rather than treating at some sort of social DMZ ……….

I just find it kind of amusing when you're sitting there using the armrest and the person next to you is slowly inching their elbow further onto it bit by bit... I just let them have the thing and leave them to it. "Fighting" was not literal.

This thread is a masterclass in “I’m correct and everyone else is wrong.”

What, just this one? 😂

If I want to have food that needs the cafe to cook it then I am getting a table before I order.

The cafe will ask where I am sitting, and frankly if my food is going to come on a plate then I'm claiming a table before I commit to ordering it.

Plus half the time they put the menu on the table as well as the boards. I need time to peruse the menu and putting one on a table is inviting customers to take a seat before ordering.

The inside armrests on a 3 in a row economy aircraft seat is a masterclass in social engineering. Alpha/beta/entitled/pleasers/gender/age/size - it's all in there.

As someone of broader shoulder my arm literally dangles over the armrest - it's a contortion not to use it.

In a quiet train I’ll leave my bag on an adjacent seat.

Do what you want on a quiet train - I would do the same myself if the train was genuinely quiet. But I get a commuter train which is always busy so I always use the overhead racks (after, that's what they are there for).

This thread  forum is a masterclass in “I’m correct and everyone else is wrong.”

You were wrong - I have corrected it for you x

This thread helps to explain why I always stand in the corridors on trains and get coffee to go.

If it's a cafe/pub which requires a table number to order then yes I'll find a table and then go and order while someone sits at the table. However, if it doesn't work that way then under no circumstances will I grab a table before ordering nor will I allow anyone else who is with me to sit first, once I've ordered and am probably then carrying my food and drink I will quite loudly point out when there is then nowhere to sit and will happily stare at people who have sat down and don't have any food nor drinks in front of them. Whether I'm right or wrong, it infuriates the beeeeeeejesus out of me that other people feel more entitled to bagsie tables like we're people with towels and flippin' deck chairs!

Carry a bag and wear a coat, just plonk these down on your chosen table/chair before joining the queue.

My pet hate is the solo person in the queue that then let's their large number of friends join them. It's mostly them pointy elbowed silver tops, bloody boomers. Isn't it enough for you to buy your house for threepence and retire on a final salary pension at 55, without pushing into a queue when I'm trying to buy my lunch in my 30 minutes lunch break.

Are we Brits the most passive aggressive of all nationalities?

And just how load can one tut?

How about sitting in a pub and a a group of 4 sit at the adjacent table then ask you to move so their group of 8 can all sit together.  I was happy to move. Then had to suffer tutting from the next 4 as they arrived as the seat I had moved to narrowed the aisle somewhat and they thought I should have stood up and moved out the way to let them past rather than them turning sideways to get past. Actually is wasn't just tutting it was a couple of comments like "how rude".

Claiming chairs/tables in pubs cafes, acceptable?

Yes

Are we Brits the most passive aggressive of all nationalities?

I thought that, until I lived in the Czech Rep for a while...