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Got upcoming work on the house and have been provided a screengrab of some insurance details, including policy number. So for peace of mind I called to confirm the policy was valid.
Odd conversation which began with a confused response when I mentioned the name of the insurance company, got put on hold, then asked for policy number, and was told yeah that's a valid policy number. This and the manner of the conversation didn't exactly fill me with confidence.
I asked if they would confirm the name of the company and was met with computer says no - GDPR etc. The people I spoke to weren't the insurance company themselves which is based in Gibraltar, but was the UK contact number I could find (underwriters). They suggested getting in touch with the broker my contractor used.
So, is this fair enough? All I wanted some was minor detail to reassure me, rather than a 'yeah that's ok' from what came across as not the most trustworthy outfit (caveat, I realise I'm probably overdoing the checks).
I've now emailed the insurance company direct, but just got me wondering if the GDPR line is fair enough and a 'yeah that's a valid policy number' is all I'm entitled to for reassurance?
Is the company on checkatrade or something like that? Could check there
If they don’t or won’t give basic information like that to your satisfaction I hear the alarm bells from here and a new thread ‘ my contractor…’ we at work now as a main contractor would expect insurance details plus a boatload of other details from a subcontractor Could you say your home insurer wants the info?
A word of caution here. Lots of public liability policies are not worth the paper they're written on. There's a reason why Direct Line were knocking out tradesmen policies for £70. Tradies buy them as a 'ticket' to get onsite to big contracting site.
So you may be able to check the policy is valid, but unless you can see what it covers then it's possibly going to be a bit pointless.
The cheap policies don't cover heat/height/depth work, for example.
In any event, you don't claim off that policy. You sue the builder. Their policy kicks in to pay the damages, plus costs. IF it's covered.
Start with recommendations and maybe a look at the company itself.
Insurance company may not deal with you directly but your builder can easily get a Confirmation of Insurance letter from their insurer to give to you.
My wife deals with commercial insurance and dishes these out all the time - they usually include loads of other detailed information though other than 'yeah, he's insured'. And as jag61 says any sub-contractors also need their own insurance.
It's a minefield and my wife is constantly battling with companies to get proper cover in place - they just see it as her trying to flog them something they don't need.
I asked if they would confirm the name of the company and was met with computer says no - GDPR etc. The people I spoke to weren't the insurance company themselves which is based in Gibraltar, but was the UK contact number I could find (underwriters). They suggested getting in touch with the broker my contractor used.
Seems an odd set-up for a small UK builder. What's the name of the insurance company?
Personally I'd want to see a Certificate of Insurance and details of what's covered.
Surprised you even got through to underwriters - they don't like to be spoken too and hide in their offices in fear of facing a real-life customer!
(I am not an insurance expert - I just get my ear-bent ever night by the wife complaining about her day! 😀 )
Are you normally this paranoid or did something make your spidey senses tingle? I've never asked anyone doing work on the house to provide insurance details (but I'd only once done five figures work which was with an established well known company) - had they quickly produced some details without any umming and ahhing I'd have taken it at face value. So either I'm too laid back, you are very cautious or something is making you feel uncertain about these guys. If I was feeling uncertain then even if I had the full policy I'm not sure I'd want them to do the work.
Thanks all. Sounds like an official Certificate of Insurance is what I need.
I do have a screengrab of information from the contractor (showing policy number, their company name, address, period of insurance, limits of liability) but it's not on headed paper, nor does it feature any of the insurer's details. Sounds like a proper Certificate of Insurance would rectify this?
I'll see if the insurer comes back to me on email, and whether I can get the certificate from them directly (Google seems to think I should be able to).
Are you normally this paranoid or did something make your spidey senses tingle?
Is it OTT to check the insurance is legit? I've never had work done on the house before that equates to a five figure sum, so I'm kinda reading up a lot and asking what I think I should.
Nothing has made me feel wrong about the contractor - quite the opposite given I've got to this stage having rejected other quotes. It was the awkward conversation I had with the underwriter which sparked my post. All I wanted was them to confirm who the policy was for, not that it was simply a valid policy number. They couldn't/wouldn't do that. Probably my mistake for phoning the UK contact, and not dealing with the insurance company direct.
So either I'm too laid back, you are very cautious or something is making you feel uncertain about these guys.
The problem with building work is it often invalidates parts of your home insurance while the work is being done. So you need to make sure the contractor has proper cover.
Although I don't bother checking my plumbers insurance when the boiler is service - and he could blow the house up! 🤣💥
I used to carry mine. The schedule tells you what's covered.
Anything to do with water, excess height and "hot work" is expensive.
I didn't do gas, chemicals, radio activity, etc. so no idea on that
I could use a ladder, but over so many metres it needed a premium increase
That's the sort of detail that you need
Back when I did a bit of house wrangling, I carried insurance document with me.
Not unreasonable imo, that said we didn't check our builder's insurance too carefully...did check our own buildings insurance which resulted in this thread:
Is it OTT to check the insurance is legit? I've never had work done on the house before that equates to a five figure sum, so I'm kinda reading up a lot and asking what I think I should.
did check our own buildings insurance which resulted in this thread:
Indeed - thats the insurer that matters - your own insurer - they need to be notified that the work is going on, they'll tell you. want you need to get from the contractor to satisfy them. If something goes wrong it'll be them that persue the contractor and their insurer. So what they'll want to know is what kind of work it is, how long its going to take, whether you'll be vacating the house during the work, what it costs - and they'll want to know if the contractor is insured. That might mean you simply confirming that they have, some insurers will want to see the policy document.
Myself and neighbour are both getting work done by the same contractor at the moment - my neighbours insurer wanted to be sent a copy of the contractors insurance certificate- and becuase the policy would likely expire during contract asked that they also be sent the renewed policy when that happened. My own insurer simply asked me 'do they have insurance?' and I said 'yes'. And that was suffice for them.
Sometimes it's enough to have simply informed your insurer and they'll say 'thanks for telling us'. For some work there may be an increased premium. In some instances they'll actually decline to insure you during the work and you'll have to find a new insurer
Not OTT to check insurance. There's some interesting client liabilities hidden in full view in the H&S Regs. Failure to do your part can get you a visit to HM Courts and some unpaid work, a fine or some unscheduled holiday camp time. Don't be the client that gets used as an example of what can happen if you don't do something that consultants love when advising their clients.
Contractors, you in America?
Are you normally this paranoid or did something make your spidey senses tingle?
Is it OTT to check the insurance is legit? I've never had work done on the house before that equates to a five figure sum, so I'm kinda reading up a lot and asking what I think I should.
Nothing has made me feel wrong about the contractor - quite the opposite given I've got to this stage having rejected other quotes. It was the awkward conversation I had with the underwriter which sparked my post. All I wanted was them to confirm who the policy was for, not that it was simply a valid policy number. They couldn't/wouldn't do that. Probably my mistake for phoning the UK contact, and not dealing with the insurance company direct.
We have various suppliers at work who are sometimes required to provide insurance proof along with other documents. Low risk ones are just asked to confirm a checklist which they sign. High risk ones have to provide copies. Likewise we sometimes have to provide our policy to our clients. We’ve never followed up on a policy to check it was real/still active and as far as I know neither have our clients. I’m not saying you are paranoid - it just surprised me that your preferred bidder was someone you didn’t take at face value.
@poly You probably have much more experience with these kind of matters. Perhaps I am a bit paranoid, and I have no problem with that really. You hear enough about rogue traders, jobs unfinished, going wrong etc so maybe I've read too much into things and am after too much clarification. But it's my time, and I'm not doing anyone else any harm by doing so.
I guess if everyone just took everyone else at face value, things like certificates of insurance wouldn't be needed. The fact they do exist...
Anyway, some good tips from people - thanks. Particularly focusing on and getting in touch with my own insurance!
You hear enough about rogue traders, jobs unfinished, going wrong etc
...but the cover provided by the contractor's policy won't provide cover for most of those things. It is - mostly - irrelevant. The fact that they have a policy may mean they're slightly more organised than another company, but not much more than that.
As you've said, find out about your own cover. But check out the company background and recommendations.
Fair enough Rich. I'm happy with the person I've got to do the work, but it appears checking their insurance is valid is an unnecessary step.
Are you normally this paranoid or did something make your spidey senses tingle?
Is it OTT to check the insurance is legit? I've never had work done on the house before that equates to a five figure sum, so I'm kinda reading up a lot and asking what I think I should.
Nothing has made me feel wrong about the contractor - quite the opposite given I've got to this stage having rejected other quotes. It was the awkward conversation I had with the underwriter which sparked my post. All I wanted was them to confirm who the policy was for, not that it was simply a valid policy number. They couldn't/wouldn't do that. Probably my mistake for phoning the UK contact, and not dealing with the insurance company direct.
No it’s not and you appear to have done that and been assured it’s a legitimate policy. I think the point being made is you seem to be going well beyond that because of some perceived awkward conversation with an underwriter.
Just to worry the OP more there is no certainty the builders insurance will pay out anyway. Direct Line voided it in this case because the builder hadn't declared a couple of county court judgements relating to parking offences. Result £250k bill for family after builder collapses house.
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2021/mar/13/family-bill-insurer-claim-house-loft-renovation
Jolsa, you might well be just being sensibly cautious. It sounds like you are. It simply raised a flag for me that if someone felt it necessary to dig that deep and keep digging that they had a bad feeling. Remember - his insurance is there (if it is) to save his skin not yours. It might just mean you actually get compensated for your loss but it’s not like car insurance where as the “victim” you might expect compensation - someone has to prove negligence first, then hope it’s in the scope of his cover or he has enough assets to liquidate to compensate you. It won’t cover for bad workmanship etc. If he knocks down the wrong wall it’s probably covered, if the whole house falls down as a result it’s probably covered. If he builds something shonky and building control won’t sign it off then don’t be surprised if he disappears and his insurer aren’t interested. If he gets 3/4 way through then demands more money - insurance won’t help. If he takes your deposit and doesn’t turn up - insurance won’t help.
Hello,
Building company owner for 30 years.
Poly is 100% spot on.
Always ask to see public liability and employers liability insurance details before commencement of works, we provide it at point of tender. Any builder/ contractor should be happy to supply you with a certificate of insurance, minimum of 5 million is common for a general builder, ours is 10 as we carry out basement and piling works.
A few things I would recommend before employing a contractor/ builder.
1/ Speak to previous clients of chosen contractor
2/ Always ask for copy of insurance details.
3/ Use a contract, many decent ones on line.
4 Always get a valuation, list of work completed, alongside an invoice.
5/ Avoid paying cash, causes no end of grief for builder and client.
Hope this helps.
Ed.
A lesson from a Contractor I know. 15 years or so ago, re-felting a flat garage roof, attached to the house. Used torch on felt etc. Finished the job, lovely finish all round. Actually went straight to the pub afterwards for Friday drinks with us. Got a call a hour later, you’d better get back here to look at this garage roof.
Got there to see the fire brigade hosing down the house and pulling off what remained of the garage roof. He’d left something under the roof smouldering away, and it eventually broke through, gutted the garage, and almost got through to the house.
No problem he said, I’m insured, so will contact them ASAP. They came out, took statements, and quite soon told him he wasnt covered. No fireboard and alarm in the work area, no one there for the requisite 2 hours after the heat had been turned off, no entry in his log book of when and where the heat was being used, no fire extinguisher on the job or in his van, and a few other non-compliances.
He had to re-mortgage his house to pay the bill, with the householders Insurers threatening him with all sorts of threats if he didnt pay up immediately. So they may well have insurance, but unless they follow the Insurance Statement and conditions, there’s no saying when, or if, you’ll get compensation if they mess up.
Is the company on checkatrade or something like that? Could check there
I had a mate who was checkatrade certified lol he would go and get coked off his box all weekend then wire up a house