cars and fatigue interesting update

What I take from that is once you blocked out Mrs D you  were less stressed 😉

EV drivers often comment on a more relaxed driving experience once they get over the range anxiety.

It's perfectly possible that it's down to the reduced noise level.

I find that commuting my HR goes up along with my stress level. 

 On the railway they are pretty switched onto fatigue. A commute is weighted more than a shift. 

You've got to love STW 😊

What I take from that is once you blocked out Mrs D you were less stressed

😅
They are actually good enough plugs that I can still hold a conversation!

EV drivers often comment on a more relaxed driving experience once they get over the range anxiety. It’s perfectly possible that it’s down to the reduced noise level

Does the reduced noise level still hold at 70mph though? EVs are sadly not really an option for my current living arrangement and budget. But I was under the impression that on motorways, most of the noise is tyres and wind?

Its not just noise but vibration. Out little EV is very smooth. Plus its auto and with the regeneration I can do whole journeys never touching the brake. Its just a way simpler experience. Plus I find (due to the range thing) you tend to drive a bit slower.

Oh and fully understand they do not currently suit everyone. Lucky to be able to run 2 vehicles so we have a EV for 80% and diesel van for 20%.

Yep, at higher speeds, there's not much difference but they do still feel like calmer places to be.

Maybe that's because most people drive a bit slower and a bit smoother to try and maximise range.

Also hopefully interesting for other CFS sufferers out there.

Noise and busy environments really knock me for six, hearing issues only add to that.

I find it really hard to drive in new places/busy traffic now, and in the dark is getting near impossible with just too much going on with streetlights/headlights/dashboard and taking it all in.

My wife drives any long distance drives or nighttime stuff. I used to be able to do 5/6 hour drives and function fine afterwards, not anymore.

I'm not sure a newer/fancier/quieter car would make any (or enough) difference to me as it's the neural load from the attention, alertness and observations needed.

Noticeable difference in driving home from cambridge last night (A14 / M1) between my old galaxy and my 10y old Merc E class - the e class was a lot less stressful. Difficult to tell if that was because it's quieter / more refined / better handling / more powerful. I never liked driving the galaxy down the a14 at night - too twisty / unlit roads

I have successfully changed the front control arms on my CLS. The difference is not obvious as you drive off but the effect on driving 4hrs yesterday was dramatic. On the way home (in the dark) my wife asked me if I was ok driving, and I realised I was really enjoying it.

NVH is a funny thing. There are three or four different noises you're hearing at any given time when driving. The tyre noise has not changed much but the loose bushings were creating a low rumble that wasn't always obvious if you weren't listening to it. It's like listening to a band and picking out the different instruments. You can focus on one or the other but the overall effect of all the noises is cumulative.

And of course with an EV one of the noise sources is entirely absent. EV manufacturers seem to put more effort into controlling the other noise sources, apparently.

I had a perfectly functional 55 plate diesel Focus, it got louder and louder as it aged.  I took it to 175k miles before selling it a few years ago when it was ~15 years old. There was nothing completely broken (no blowing exhaust or collapsed bearings), just worn/perished/tired.  I hired a 'premium SUV' for a long drive and it was such an "untiring" (if that's a word) thing to travel in compared to the Focus. I finished a mountain marathon and then shared the 10 hour drive home with my race partner. I drove from Strathcarron to Glasgow, we swapped and he did Glasgow to Tebay, then I got us back to the Midlands from there without stopping. I felt ridiculously fresh given the 2 days of running around hills, night in a tiny tent and long drive. It was probably a combination of better seats, fresher bushes, engine mounts, springs etc, more sound insulation, better seating position, lower revs while cruising due to more power and more gears and just being newer.

So I can definitely believe that taking away the noise of an older car (rather than turning up the stereo) would help with fatigue, interesting to see just how much of a difference it made though.

The effects of background noise are fairly well documented, not just for driving but for work and living environments too.

But it's still sadly one of those 'invisible' (inaudible!) issues that doesn't get the attention it deserves, especially in terms of the impact on physical and mental health in urban areas.

@doris5000 interesting results what type/brand of mouldable earplugs do you use? There's a bewildering choice out there (to someone who never uses earplugs) when I googled.  Not so much for the car for me but I'm wondering about other environments.  

Thanks

Our current Merc e class is the quietest car I’ve ever had on motorways, more so than the electric car it replaced

The fact it’s so quiet and drives itself can make it difficult to stay alert enough on some journeys.

Luckily it will also tell you if it doesn’t think you are paying enough attention

If it thinks you are falling asleep it will tell you to take a break

The effects of background noise are fairly well documented, not just for driving but for work and living environments too.

When the a/c fails or is turned off at work I notice that I and others involuntarily sigh with relief. The constant drone of the system is almost like being a passenger in an aeroplane.

Departing from where to go where?

If you were leaving West London to head out west it would hardly be surprising that the stress levels decrease.

If you were leaving West London to head out west it would hardly be surprising that the stress levels decrease.

I have heard life is peaceful there.

Driving to Junction 2 on the M4 is pretty easy, it's the M4 itself which is stressful. Why does everyone seemingly turn into an arsehole as soon as they get onto a motorway?

A few years back I was discussing this with Scotroutes about driving the A9.  I used to go 10 mph over the speed limit and be constantly looking for overtakes.  He suggested I just drive at the speed limit and thus rarely need to overtake.  I tried it and was an instant convert.  Took around 10 or 15 mins longer to Inverness, stress and tiredness just dropped away.  No need to worry about others being arseholes, no need to strive.  Just a nice chilled drive

How do the earplugs work with traffic noises that can have a safety element e.g. sirens on emergency vehicles?
Ive never quite felt comfortable seeing folk driving with headphones on as it feels to me, maybe incorrectly, that they are missing out on an important sensory element.
Obviously  folk drive with music volume ramped up and/or get engrossed in conversations which may also impair hearing, but is purposefully blocking out sound whilst driving  a sensible thing to do?

I noticed it straight away switching from my vivaro to a nice EV, the fatigue on longish journeys (4-5h, that's all I ever do really) was so much less.

It's still a bit noiser than I'd like at motorway speeds but even though the vivaro was easy to drive, the EV is next-level easy!

How do the earplugs work with traffic noises that can have a safety element e.g. sirens on emergency vehicles?

I always use earplugs on the motorcycle, even the little Honda c90, they’re perfectly fine to hear sirens etc with. Tbh most motorists can’t see flashing lights and blues so hearing a siren is well beyond their skill set.

I’m interested to know if the EV experience is also about Torque.   It’s well known that on ICE cars having a lot of torque available is much less strain on the driving experience, especially in an auto.    I find my 320d not tiring, but I also find our Sportage hybrid the same - both auto - with the Sportage flicking between EV and ICE itself but also filling in the gap in torque demand with the electric motor seamlessly when needed

If you were leaving West London to head out west it would hardly be surprising that the stress levels decrease.

It takes a lot longer than an hour to exit the busy zone!

I’m interested to know if the EV experience is also about Torque. It’s well known that on ICE cars having a lot of torque available is much less strain on the driving experience, especially in an auto. 

I don't think this is true at all, especially not on a motorway. You just drive, torque has nothing to do with it. In a manual car, on a windy road you do shift gears a bit less often, but that is nothing compared to the real mental load which should be keeping your car on the road and away from the other cars and obstacles you're sharing it with.

EVs are easy to drive, for sure, but that's because there are no gears,  not because you can pull away really quickly. Torque doesn't matter at all because you just don't need to know about it. Press one pedal it goes faster, press the other it goes slower.

For me (eTron) it's just the smooth comfortable ride that comes from the high profile tyres on big wheels, the acoustic damping in the interior and the fact there is no ICE lump thumping under the bonnet. I guess you need to counter that with range anxiety for some folk though.

EVs are easy to drive, for sure, but that’s because there are no gears,  not because you can pull away really quickly. Torque doesn’t matter at all because you just don’t need to know about it.

This depends on your preferred driving style. If you're happy place is beating folk off the line at the lights, then a high torque fast starting EV is going to make you happier / less stressed than someone who prefers to pootle.

#surfmat

If you’re happy place is beating folk off the line at the lights

I think this is about as far from the OPs post as it's possible to get!

what type/brand of mouldable earplugs do you use? There’s a bewildering choice out there

I use ACS with the 15db filters. They're pricey but worth it for me - I got them for performing as a DJ in clubs, and cheaper ones were lacking the quality I needed.

How do the earplugs work with traffic noises that can have a safety element e.g. sirens on emergency vehicles?

Pretty well. Mine are designed to lower all frequencies equally, like turning the volume down. I can still hold a conversation with them in. The limiting factor of whether you can hear a siren is whether it's louder than your tyres/engine/etc - if it's not drowned out by them, it'll be clearly audible with the plugs in (NB this might not be true for cheap foam plugs! Mine are posh ones aimed to retain detail).

I've tried noise cancelling earbuds and that's a different story. Even without music on. I could still hear higher pitched stuff, even the indicators ticking, but I felt very dissociated - I could feel the rumble coming up through the car, but couldn't hear it. It was very distracting! So I didn't do that again.

I think this is about as far from the OPs post as it’s possible to get!

True, but the point is still valid.

If you were leaving West London to head out west it would hardly be surprising that the stress levels decrease

Sadly it was the opposite. Set coordinates for the Hangar Lane Gyratory, and watch the stress levels rise 😅

The only time my stress levels drive these days is when I’m on old concrete sections of motorway. The noise from the tyres makes it sound like they are going flat

True, but the point is still valid.

If failing to beat people off the line at traffic lights is a cause of genuine physical stress I think you need some kind of therapy, no?

The point is that you claim that:
Torque doesn’t matter at all because you just don’t need to know about it.

You dismiss it as an irrelevance and it may not be for some people.