Car main dealer upsells...worth it?

No. Bank that money over 4 years and use it for any of the above - if needed.

Gap insurance is only of use when taking finance

Ask yourself why the dealer is offering these. Assuming that they aren’t a charity they are presumably making money (from you) out of them.

Wonders how small the small print is for tyre pothole damage…

– Autoglym lifeshine – protects paintwork against UV and contaminants, upholstery (which is leather) from marks and stains

So they wash it and wax it?

– Wheelseal – prevents brake dust sticking to the alloy wheels which probably causes some problem

What problems? First I've ever heard of that and I passed my test in 1990.

– GAP insurance

No idea about this but I don't doubt that it's something you could buy on its own if you needed it. Do you need it? I thought it was something to do with protecting against negative equity if you have to return a lease vehicle early.

I can get all this plus a product which looks like it pays for bodywork repairs so I dont have to claim for those on insurance, and this will set me back £1492 for 4 years

But you have insurance. That's an extra £500, how much is your excess?

And I can add to this tyre protection which pays for punctures and pothole damage for the princely fee of £1796 for 4 years

That's £300. How much are you planning on spending on puncture repairs in the next four years? Buy a spare if you don't have one. Tyre damage from potholes - when has that ever happened to anyone, that's surely vanishingly rare?

... ie, what Jimmy said.

There are no circumstances where the "additional services" offered by a dealer are either necessary or good value

You can buy a can of wheel seal for £13 and use it whenever you wash your wheels.

Gap insurance could be useful, but you can buy it much cheaper privately.

The other things are just a waste of time, and serve no purpose other than adding about £3.5k too the dealers profit margin on your purchase.

GAP insurance is for finance agreements, but there are types of it that basically top-up an insurance write off back to the original price paid. Check out ala.co.uk for an online supplier.

Gap is worth having, but only at the right price and a dealer will want 400-600 quid for it.

SMART repair cover? Are you likely to spend £1k sorting out scratches in the next 4 years?

Pothole damage? Ditto.

They are all forms of insurance, and insurance companies exist to make money.  Out of you.

Always look for third party options on insurances as the dealer won't be cheap! Likewise for stuff like car hire excess, you can usually get cover for under 30 quid for that by shopping around.

I had lifeshine or equivalent on a couple of cars. Not worth it IMO. Look at the list of exclusions to the guarantee (which include 'poor prep and application by the dealer') and basically you're stuffed (see also clauses that mean you're probably not covered if you get it washed at a local place):

-Neglect or lack of reasonable care or the use of cleaning procedures contrary to standards recommended

-Specific damage caused by use of products other than Autoglym products.

Wheelseal sounds like something that a good wash would sort out anyway. I just can't imagine any sort of treatment keeping wheels completely free of brake dust.

Gap insurance covers the shortfall between any outstanding finance and the insurance payout if the car is written off. No finance = no gap insurance needed.

No amount of wheel protection will permanently stop brake dust, unless you're massively anal and rinse off the wheels after every drive.

Depending on the terms of the Lifeshine, maybe. I got a deal with mine where some company comes and gives a valet and applies a ceramic coating every year for 4 years, cost me about £400 and considering the price of getting that done privately I thought it worthwhile. On the other hand £400 is a lot of mini-valets and premium washes at the local hand car wash/money laundering place

Tyre damage from potholes – when has that ever happened to anyone, that’s surely vanishingly rare?

You haven't done many miles around deepest darkest Fife then? Mrs has had two tyres ruined in the space of about 3 months on one road into our village. I think it may be down to the road repair department's policy of just pouring hot tarmac into water-filled potholes, patting it down with a shovel and calling it a day.

I wouldn't bother with any of that, maybe GAP insurance is worth looking at if your employment situation isn't too secure but even then they'll likely have a lot of clauses in it to avoid paying out.

Autoglym Lifeshine - appears to be a ceramic coating. They can be useful in protecting paint (more specifically the clear coat) as they are harder wearing than wax. If you don't want to ever wash and wax your car then maybe look at it - however to be done properly it needs to be done under controlled conditions by someone that knows what they're doing. I would get it done separately by a car detailer if I wanted it, not by a car dealer (although they may contract it out).

Wheelseal - sounds pointless to me. I use iron remover once a year to decontaminate (costs £10-20 for a bottle and just needs a few sprays after washing them and leaving 5-10 minutes) and just wash them between, I have tried wheel wax but wasn't too impressed.

Not a chance I'd be paying a grand+ on top of a £15k car for wheel sealant (get a thing of G3 ceramic sealant for £30 or something and do it yourself if you're bothered) and a polish & wax. Coverage for bodywork damage - I can't even start to imagine the caveats attached to that...

Thanks all. As expected, but wanted to check. I'll decline the upsells 🙂

– Wheelseal – prevents brake dust sticking to the alloy wheels which probably causes some problem

– Autoglym lifeshine – protects paintwork against UV and contaminants, upholstery (which is leather) from marks and stains

Not a problem if you clean your car.

GAP - up to you, but yes useful. But not from a dealer, they will rip you off.
It protects the difference between the value of the car and the amount you have on finance. Drive it out the showroom and write if off - your insurer will give you market value (say £15k), but you may owe £19k to the finance company. GAP covers the £4k difference so you aren't out of pocket.

If you want any of these products, get a local detailer to correct the paint first and then apply them properly.

That said...

Cougar
So they wash it and wax it?

It's not a wax. The exterior component is a ceramic sealant.

What problems? First I’ve ever heard of that and I passed my test in 1990.

It stains the wheel, I've got this on my car wheels and even fallout remover doesn't touch it. Not an issue apart from the wheels look permanently dirty.

<p style="text-align: right;">I took out GAP insurance for a non-financed used car. If the car is written off in the first 3 years the policy gives me the difference between the insurance payout and original purchase price. £110 for 3 years cover. Bought the policy from broker and not the Dealer.</p>

Like the Flying Ox, My wife and I have wrecked tyres (and wheels!) on local potholes. 4 tyres and three wheels in the last five years. Sounds like the roads on the (cheap) edge of the New Forest are similar to the ones in Fife

That said, I would still 'self insure'

I would echo that you're better off finding a good local car detailer to sort any paint issues

get the car to a "Good" detailer. that will set you back about 500 quid. It will look better and last longer than anything they will put on it.

Only you know if you need gap insurance.

If you bump someone youll be going through the insurance anyway. otherwise pay using the money youve saved.

– Autoglym lifeshine – protects paintwork against UV and contaminants, upholstery (which is leather) from marks and stains

Some sort of ceramic sealant, it's basically poncy long lasting car wax. And TBH I'd not trust a dealer to apply it properly as it requires the car to be absolutely clean. Washed, dried, clay bared, bug/tar remover, machine polished and then ceramic wax sort of clean. Not just passed to the apprentice, jet washed and the wax applied. If you really want it, either do some googling and DIY it or pay a detailer.

– Wheelseal – prevents brake dust sticking to the alloy wheels which probably causes some problem

It kinda works, I use a product on my MG's wheels, it doesn't last forever so unless you plan to keep up with it then it's not worth it. Just buy some decent alloy wheel cleaner. They still get covered in brake dust, but it doesn't get embedded in the surface like it normally does and wipes off with a wet cloth.

– GAP insurance

Probably worth it if you're on finance loan as as your "£15k" car is maybe worth ~£10k privately tomorrow, and if you crash then the finance company will want £15k but the insurance will only give you £10k.

I can get all this plus a product which looks like it pays for bodywork repairs so I dont have to claim for those on insurance, and this will set me back £1492 for 4 years

That's a lot of chips away. Seems pointless unless you plan to hand it back whilst still under fincance.

And I can add to this tyre protection which pays for punctures and pothole damage for the princely fee of £1796 for 4 years

£1800 to protect against a puncture? Unless it's something really exotic that's about the cost of a full set of alloy wheels and tyres!

I am 25yrs + in the motor industry and i purchased a car in similar circumstances to you recently.  Cash, 2yrs old and from a s****y main dealership (I had to go up a escalator to collect my car 🙂

Anyhow they sold me the car then asked if i would follow up with a meeting with the business manager.  That meeting lasted about 10 seconds when i told her i would not be taking finance, gap insurance or any paint protection.  I did take the leaflet for the 'night kit' they were advertising for £1500 as i planned to do that to the car.

Once i got the car home it was lanoguarded underneath which cost me £70.  I claybarred, polished, waxed etc which i already had all the stuff and it will be good for 12 months.  It got a puncture in a run flat which destroyed the tyre within a couple of weeks so that was painful for £180 but i still think im quids in.

Oh and the night kit i did myself for about £3-400 all in.

What's the "night kit"?

im intrigued as to what a night kit is

...headlights! 🙂

Or?...

[img] [/img]

Fundamentally the car isn't really the product: the finance and all the added crap is. The bulk of the sales guy's commission is based off the extras they can flog you.

Lifeshine is good stuff, in the right hands. It'll be applied in about 20 minutes by a monkey who won't understand the difference between a DA sander and a DA polisher though so avoid. I actually ask dealers not to wash my cars, under any circumstances. Take it to a detailer and get it properly done. It should take 2 to 3 days if correctly applied, the bulk of which on an 18month old car will be polishing the swirls out from the last owner's "care". The interior stain protection treatment is total snake oil.

They are all forms of insurance, and insurance companies exist to make money.  Out of you.

Fancy wax isn't insurance. But of course insurers are profit making companies. That doesn't mean insurance isn't worth buying.

Is someone going to enlighten us all as to what a 'night kit' is then?

Please tell me that "enlighten" was intentional there.

Lifeshine is actually pretty decent, but as others have said the dealer won't do a good job of applying it.

My car had LifeShine applied - the dealer gave me it "free" to close the deal. First time I washed the car I spent an hour correcting the paint with polish or a claybar on all the blemishes and little scratches they had just applied the LifeShine on top of.

The only thing worth getting from a dealer when you buy a car is a discounted service plan, if its offered. A lot of dealers will give you a pretty decent discount on servicing if you buy 3 years upfront with the car.

Please tell me that “enlighten” was intentional there.

😎

You can buy Lifeshine kits off ebay for £15 or so and you're likely to do a better job applying it.

Buy GAP insurance if you want it from elsewhere (I've used click4gap before), and spending the rest on a proper detail and ceramic coat from a proper detailer will get you very smooth shiny paint that dirt just falls off when you wash it.

How about a "knight kit" which is some scanning LEDs up-front, a talking computer called KITT, some armour plating and a bracket to hold a jousting lance.

I never take anything, although do think a return to invoice type GAP policy (bought online) can be a good shout if it's a higher risk car for theft.

My best mate, who loves a kerb, get's his money worth out of every single alloy wheel policy he buys for about £200...

To answer the question directly - no.

The only thing worth getting from a dealer when you buy a car is a discounted service plan, if its offered. A lot of dealers will give you a pretty decent discount on servicing if you buy 3 years upfront with the car.

This ^^^ is good advice.

The wheel seal thing, if you get the right product wont stop brake accumulating but will mean it doesn't bite into the top coat of your wheels and make it pretty difficult to remove. I've used G techniq on my wheels and they can get a good build up of dust but a jet wash and a clean off with soapy water will have them beading again and shining. without the need to iron removers or other such harsh products.  Key is in the application but I've had 2 years out of my last application and that did for 2 cars and was about £40. I would in no way be paying a dealer to do it because it will be massively over priced and probably the YTS kid will do it badly.  That goes for all the extras they offer. You will be able to get any of them cheaper independently if you really need them.

whats the Night kit!!!!!!!!!

Oi, @TheLittlestHobo, we need an answer!

I'm betting it's just a set of something dull* like LED bulbs.

Because if it's not something like this then it's a letdown.

*I'll get my coat.

I’ll get my coat.

Good idea, it gets chilly after sunset this time of year

Walkie talkie watch

Full perm Wig

Red LED light

Leather jacket

Chest wig

On a rather dull note its black trim all over the car to replace chrome highlights from factory 🙁  I rather wish it was the Knightrider kits tbh

is the night kit a sleepy bag and a cuddly toy?

And a self heating beaker of hot-chocolate?

I hope it is...

DrP

Ok, as a public service, I'll ask them to add night kit...I'll let you know what I get 🙂

If the car is 18 months old then more likely than not the paint work will be knackered anyway as most people seem to use a sponge and bucket or get the car destroyed at a drive through.

Only one might be worth considering is if your tyres are odd sizes as these can be silly money per corner.

Turned down LifeShine, they fiddled some numbers and gave it to me anyway as they needed to hit some target. Probably bumped my trade-in value to cover it. Well at least they did something and gave me the zip case with all the products.

Some sort of ceramic sealant, it’s basically poncy long lasting car wax. And TBH I’d not trust a dealer to apply it properly as it requires the car to be absolutely clean. Washed, dried, clay bared, bug/tar remover, machine polished and then ceramic wax sort of clean. Not just passed to the apprentice, jet washed and the wax applied. If you really want it, either do some googling and DIY it or pay a detailer.

Took them half an hour, so I doubt they did it properly. Idiots put it on the windscreen, first time I used the wipers it smeared terribly and I genuinely couldn't see anything, bloody dangerous this was at 50mph. Hard to get off and had to replace the wipers too.

If the car is 18 months old then more likely than not the paint work will be knackered anyway as most people seem to use a sponge and bucket or get the car destroyed at a drive through.

TBF, unless you are obsessed, people don’t really care - I like my cars but I still just wash them with a bucket and sponge - it’s a lump of metal, not your first-born.

Fundamentally the car isn’t really the product: the finance and all the added crap is. The bulk of the sales guy’s commission is based off the extras they can flog you.

I meant to comment on this earlier and forgot.

I used to do support for a largish mail-order computer retailer. To protect the guilty let's call them Crime Computers. This was absolutely my experience from talking to the Sales bods. They got bog all commission from selling PCs because fundamentally if the phone rang it was someone calling to buy a computer. They earned it from what was euphemistically called "value-added" sales (how common a term that is outside of Crime I don't know). Mouse mats; dozens and dozens of floppy disks to make "backups" which were basically reinstallation media for all the apps; keyboard dust cover; and on and on it went.

Once you knew about this, it became blatantly obvious in the likes of Currys/Dixons 'hard sell' days (remember when getting to the other end of the store was like playing Pac-Man, suddenly ducking down a side aisle as Blinky and Clyde were trying to pincer you?) "Would you like the extended warranty for [price]?" No thanks. "But what if it fails in 18 months?" You think it's likely to fail in 18 months? Oh, I've changed my mind then, I don't want it. "Oh, well, no, of course not!" Then what do I need a warranty for?

When I bought my first mobile phone in 1999 he really, really wanted to upsell a carry case and a bunch of other crap and I really, really didn't want to buy it. He was Old School Salesman pushy and wouldn't take no for an answer to a point where I went "you know what, **** it, if you're not going to listen to me then I don't want it." I stood up and made for the door. He came chasing after me begging me to reconsider. I said, "tell you what, throw in the case etc for free and you've got a deal." He got his commission, I got some free tat.

I have no time for it. I understand that they have little choice in having to offer it to you, but if they're going to play silly bastards after I've declined because they think I'm daft then hold my beer.

Oh yeah, the "Clearly Fresh Out Of Salesbastard Training" little snot at Mazda I dealt with not all that long ago.

I rang them enquiring about a car, stock and lead times. "Can we just take some details?" Ugh, whatever, 'block' is a thing, here's my email. Cougar, yes yes, I know, it wasn't hilarious in like 1989 when I created the address. We had a bit of a chat, I booked a test drive, went to the dealer.

I wanted to just go for a spin but he was on rails. Insisted on having a conversation first, he starts asking me about big cats and telling me what his favourite was, cat facts like which the biggest one was, and all sorts of other unrelated nonsense.

"Now, let me show you the car. Look at the sleek lines on the headlight" and all that baloney like a walking marketing brochure. Yes yes, I know what it looks like. I was getting increasingly impatient and sarcastic with him but there was no stopping him from giving me a full walkaround. I was practically going "give me the ****ing keys" by the time we finally got inside one.

I wasn't allowed to take my partner with me ("because Covid" despite it being fine at every other dealership) which rendered a test drive kinda useless as she was going to be the main driver. He had to come with me of course, and before we were allowed to move he just had to give me a guided tour of where all the controls were because I obviously haven't been driving since about ten years before he was born.

The drive was actually good, it put the car in the top two. So we get back, I ask him to run some figures. He comes back with some paperwork, starts rattling off numbers. I say "this is no good, let me read it." He hands me his stack of papers.

Schoolboy error (almost literally). On top is a couple of quotes with different options, below that is some glossy adverts, and below that... they'd profiled me. Every little snippet of info they could glean from initial contact ("likes big cats") had been duly written down so he could go do some legwork to create conversation inroads to butter me up. There was like an A4 page full of printed notes. I think he realised his error but it was too late. That was the final straw, I didn't buy a Mazda.

Hope you didn't buy a Jag instead 🙈

🤣👌😁

I've got to say from.my experiences... I absolutely can't abide main dealers and their BS.

Car  hyper market sort of place for me. No bollox, just a price in the window and that's that. Ask which ones to test and they get them out of the lot and off we go, me driving. And the part ex for the shed I'm ditching is from the book, which they're happy to show (they PX  was going to the auction, no doubt). High turnover, lower margin, no BS.

It's very simple, and doesn't just apply to car sales.

Anything offered after the main product is

a) largely irrelevent

b) massively overpriced. to recover margin

it started with shoe protecter for your Dunlop Green flash, and peaked with PPI. but it still lives and always will.

Puts me in mind of this.

I have always been very dubious of the paint protection stuff and would never pay for it to be done but it dies make a difference. The last car I bought obviously had had it done

This is the car that hasn’t been washed for 2 weeks and had been driven from one side of the country to another in a rain storm. It’s changed my mind, and it appears to stop black cars scratching so much.

as above though can get much cheaper 3rd party

Last second hand car I bought they tried to upsell all that stuff. I asked if the car had had any of those treatments before? As I wouldn't be needing to refresh the 5year treatment after only 18 months.

johndoh

TBF, unless you are obsessed, people don’t really care – I like my cars but I still just wash them with a bucket and sponge – it’s a lump of metal, not your first-born.

You don't need to be obsessed, to be honest. Just a few simple things can make quite a difference.

Get a half decent wash mitt rather than a sponge, & 2 buckets; one for fresh water & one for rinsing the mitt.
Rinse frequently, top up the mitt with fresh water (with whatever 'cleaner' stuff you want to use) and don't swipe a massive load of crud from the bottom edges of the car then proceed to rub it over the rest of the paintwork.
I try to work 'top down' as much as possible to try & reduce dirt & grit being smeared all over the car.

It helps if one bucket is light (clean water) and one is dark (dirty water). Well, it does for me anyway - to help prevent me dunking into the wrong bucket. It's quite an eye opener how dirty the water in the dirty bucket gets compared to how clean it remains in the clean bucket.
Sounds a bit lame/geeky, but takes no more effort really than just using one bucket.

Yeah, you can get special buckets with grit filters/separators etc. but I feel just by using 2 buckets you are already 90% there. And a wash mitt doesn't seem to hang onto dirt the same way a sponge does & holds onto the water better so it doesn't just pour out like it does with a sponge.

My Wife has a metallic black Ibiza - 12 plate, so 11 years old now & it has virtually no swirls or signs of that fine scratching you commonly see in black paint when the sun hits it.
It's not perfect, but the paint definitely doesn't look 11 years old.

Sorry - just realised this is massively off-topic.

TBF, unless you are obsessed, people don’t really care – I like my cars but I still just wash them with a bucket and sponge – it’s a lump of metal, not your first-born.

You don’t need to be obsessed, to be honest. Just a few simple things can make quite a difference.

Depends on my mood. My cars swing from washed, polished and the interior getting obsessively cleaned if I'm going to be spending hour after hour on the motorway.

At the other end of the spectrum I've had to remove soil from the boot/back seats with a shovel after a cold/wet winter of using it to take bikes to night rides a few times a week in between weekend tip runs. I cleaned it when the grass started to grow!

But importantly I've found there's not much that can't be resolved with elbow grease and some products. I bought Benoit the Battered Berlingo with 3 days MOT left, an interior that was both moldy from a water leak and smoke/nicotine stained (I'm imagining Galouise) and every panel had some sort of scratch or dent on it. After quite a bit of effort (and an MOT to make sure it was worthwhile bothering) he was an entirely passable work-van, and covid compliant because he had a soft top 😁.

Basically if you want to spend a fortune on products and 2 buckets then all power to you, but unless you're using a 99p yellow sponge, alkaline cleaner and not hosing the dirt off first then pretty much anything is solvable or can be hidden under a couple of coats of wax.