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My dad's looking for a car, the usual Golf/Focus/Civic category. I don't mind what he gets particularly, lots of good cars around in that price range, about £10k
However, he's insisting that it's better to buy a 1 year old car than a 3 year old one. I reckon you'll get more car for your money if you buy slightly older, and it's a false economy to buy a 1 year old one.
The amount you'd save by buying an older car would easily pay for the biggest repair bill you'd have, and it's pretty unlikely you'll face it so you're highly likely to come out way ahead.
I can't think of anything that's more likley to happen to a 3yo car than a 1yo..?
Hang on. Is this going to be one of your threads where people might not agree with you, and as a result you go off in a strop?
It would have 3x as much mucus, saliva, pubic hair and poo in it than a one year old car.
Hang on. Is this going to be one of your threads where people might not agree with you, and as a result you go off in a strop
I won't go off in a strop if people don't agree with me. I might however go off in a strop if people decide I'm stupid, arrogant and insensitive and all sorts of other things I abhor based on a completely mis-understanding of the situation, and fail to give any explanation 🙂
I think it depends where you get it from. A 1 year old car (or pre-registered) from a Car supermarket type place might be pretty good value when compared to new.
But most main dealers seem to have 1 year old cars priced suspiciously close to (or higher than) the list price of the new car (at least that's what I noticed when I bought my car). I guess it's done deliberately to encourage people to buy new.
Just saw a 56 plate Passat at my local dealer with the 170bhp diesel engine, leather, and climate control for the same price as I paid for my lesser car. Bugger!
I won't go off in a strop if people don't agree with me.
Well, i don't want to see you go off in a strop, so... You're wrong and i disagree with you.
I agree with your Dad. If you pick one thats been used, abused and thrashed (which is always a risk when you are buying second hand) I'd rather they had only been doing it for 1 year, not 3. On average, you are much more likely to need to spend money on a 3 year old car than a year old car. Also depends on how long your Dad intends to keep it.
The greatest percentage depreciation is over the first year, so your dad is right in financial terms. There is a large premium associated with a new car, 1 year old lets someone else take that hit
It depends on whether your dad has the money to buy a 1 year old car, and is happy to take the additional depreciation hit?
also - no MOT for the first 2 years. OK that's only £100 over that period, but the MOT can flag up things that routine servicing may have missed. And they still have the bulk of the manufacturer's warranty (ok, so some now have 5 year warranties)
Expensive things like suspension bushings, exhaust pipes, etc. A 1 year old car is less likely than a 3 year old car to have problems in these areas, although even on a 3 year old car I guess they'd be rare.
Unless it's a 96 P-plate Alfa 146 on its third birthday...
although [i]I don't mind what he gets particularly [/i] does come across badly 😉
It depends on whether your dad has the money to buy a 1 year old car, and is happy to take the additional depreciation hit?
Depreciation rate stays fairly constant after the first year.
Perhaps you should check the residual values of the 3 usual suspects you suggest. Experience says the Ford will drop the fastest with the Honda and VW holding their value better.
I think that it also depends on what your dad wants to do. Maybe he just wants a 1 year old car rather than a 3 year old car. Isn't that OK?
I write this from the perspective of always being told off by my gf for telling my Dad off for doing things he wants to do, but which I think may be mistakes...
Always buy 3-5 year old cars and buy one with a decent spec.
A bottom of the range one year old Ford Focus will have always had a hard life. A 3-5 year old car from a good brand (Audi, Volvo, BMW, Skoda?) that has had a list of optional extras added to it will have been owned by someone who cherished it a bit more (typically).
For the same reason, I always buy privately so I can assess the cut of the jib of the previous owner.
I think your dad's just saying that to annoy you. If you agree with him that a one-year-old car is the way to go, he'll almost certainly go for the three-year-old one. If you were my son, I'd disagree with you too. I should imagine that if you inherited your easy-going, non-argumentative, non-dummy spitting, reasonable demeanour from your dad, the quiet discussion over a pint - what pint? - at your local will soon escalate into a major international incident followed by dissolution of the government, a military coup and a international show trial. Good luck.
ps: yes I know, you only argue with people who disagree with you.
We are looking at cars about the same age and the same type focus/golf/civic.
There are some good deals on 1-2yr old cars and 3 years is where the depreciation starts to slow for golfs/civics. Although for peace of mind having a fair chunck of warranty + no MOT's for a while and if you are going to keep the car for a while (typically +5yrs for us) then the 1-2yr old car looks appealing.
A bottom of the range one year old Ford Focus will have always had a hard life
Winner of the biggest load of bollocks on STW today.
I would get an almost 3yr old car
2 3/4 year old Honda Civic 2.2ctdi ES for sale if interested?
price?
email me if seriously interested.
B
I should imagine that if you inherited your easy-going, non-argumentative, non-dummy spitting, reasonable demeanour from your dad, the quiet discussion over a pint - what pint? - at your local will soon escalate into a major international incident followed by dissolution of the government, a military coup and a international show trial. Good luck.
I see Sir went with both barrels this time. Excellent choice if I may say so.
Why do people get rid of 1 year old cars?
I'd want to buy a car that has been looked after by 1 owner. What incentive does someone have to look after a car that they know they'll only have for a year? Or why buy an ex-hire car/demonstrator/unloved vehicle etc. e.g. the sort of car moved on after a year.
Buy at three to five years old is what I do. Only rich people and mugs buy before the lions share of depreciation has occurred. After all, cars are only a way of moving about outdoors kit 😀
A bottom of the range one year old Ford Focus will have always had a hard life
Winner of the biggest load of bollocks on STW today.
Agreed, total rubbish.
Let me defend that assertion then, or at least clarify.
By bottom of the range, I mean cars that have likely been used for hire cars, learner drivers or company pool cars (the fastest car in the carpark!). You have to ask, why would anyone get rid of a one year old car? Typically one year old basic spec cars have either been company cars, demonstrators, traded in because the owner didn't like them or are repossessed.
I accept thats a generalisation, but I see car buying as about playing the odds. Certain car types (typically) get bought by certain types of user. Its not foolproof, and I am sure there are plenty of nice spec cars out there that have been ragged, but I think you are less likely to get a lemon.
If you think thats rubbish, then thats fine by me. It means that we won't be shopping for the same cars!
Why do you need to ask? Surf-Mat is gone so the authority on all car things is with you.
Personally I'd let my Dad do whatever he wants as he allowed me similar freedom when I became an adult....
Even better than a 1-3 year old car - why not buy a 3-5 year old car and for the same money get something really properly nice?
For 10k nearly new car wise then you're looking at something really basic (and fairly dull) for your cash. For 10k on a 3-5 year old car then you could get something a lot more desireable and a lot more fun to drive. The world is your oyster basically!
Sure a nicer car may cost a little more to insure, fuel and maintain, but if you choose and buy right then depreciation on a 3-5 year old car will be an awful lot less than a newer 'two a penny' run of the mill car.
Put it this way, when you compare it to bikes - what would you rather ride around on, a nearly new Halfords Special, or a 5 years old top of the range Orange/Santa Cruz/Yeti etc, etc. Similar with cars really.
CHB - I admire your perseverance, but seriously, thats far too much of a (vague, tenuous) generalisation to be of any value whatsoever! I suggest you spot digging 🙂 🙂
Angeldust, lets agree to differ then. Northern Star above sounds like he is on my wavelength, ie much better off with a 3-5 year old nice spec car.
Will leave you with your 1.6 navy blue focus 😉
Look at the difference. If you buy wisely and haggle hard on a 1yr old car you may get it at only say 30% difference to a 3yr old.
Plus you still get 2yrs peace of mind. I'm assuming thats your Dads main criteria? The warranty left remaining ontop of 'just/nearly new'?
a
Fair enough CHB! While I stand by my comment that your original statement was utter rubbish, I actually only ever buy brand new high spec cars, so you could argue I know NOTHING about buying second hand 😀
Slightly off topic but, simply I like to have a brand new car, and I'd rather loose the depreciation than take a risk (no matter how small) on something used. Ultimately you cannot be 100% sure of the history of any used car. I agree that you can make sensible informed generalisations, but I don't agree with yours 8)
A bottom of the range one year old Ford Focus will have always had a hard life
Hold on a minute.
Focus's tend to come from AA/driving schools, Entreprise/Hertz...
I learnt to left foot brake, ride speed bumps fast, hand brake turns, cold-fast starts in such cars...
Just to clear a few things up: My dad is much more averse to confrontation than me, that's why my folks have been married for so long. And of course I can't stop him doing anything, so it's not a case of 'letting' him do something. He's not that old yet 🙂
He is favouring a Focus at the moment, 1.6 diesel, which isn't a bad choice let's be fair. Although they are thinking of towing a small caravan at some point, so I think they'd be better with something a bit larger but then again my Mum won't like that.. but whatever. They will probably keep it until it dies.
I only posted it up as a general discussion point with regards car buying in general. Personally I'd go for a 3yo car because of the cost savings. I think cars only start to get expensive as you approach the end of life for stuff like suspension bushings, turbos, injectors and whatnot, and the point where sundry bits start to give up like electric windows and whatnot.
CHB has a good point - why would anyone get rid of a 1yo car?
Their current car btw is an old shape Fiesta which was what, 9.5k at 6 months old and 4k miles. I thought that was expensive at the time, and now it's just a pretty basic 7 year old plastic and tin box that still cos them ten grand. And it has a problem with misfiring.
In that case I'd look at Caravan reviews etc as it'd be a PITA towing a caravan (surely) with an underpowered or low-tow weight car?
http://www.caravantrekker.nl/whattowcar/review.php?typeauto=6&merk_x=Skoda&serie=Octavia
http://www.whatcar.com/car-news/what-car-guide-to-towing/232209
Angeldust
I actually only ever buy brand new high spec cars
I can see that you don't like risk, but buying new high spec cars must cost you an absolute fortune in depreciation surely?
A good friend bought a BMW 335Ci two years ago. When he traded it 18 months later he got 15K less than he paid for it new. That works out at a staggering £833 per month or £192 a week just in depreciation.
With that in mind the risk of buying say a 5yr old Alfa and having to fix a few things on it during it's lifetime pale into complete insignificance compared with the costs of buying new. Hell for 15k you could have changed the engine in the Alfa 3 times over!
Still I do appreciate that someone has to buy new cars. Without someone else taking the hit on depreciation then there would be fewer second hand bargains out there for the rest of us.
He's been reading reviews including towing ones for years 🙂 Golfs and Civics come out well on those (in that category) but he says Golfs are too expensive...
Consider a Skoda Octavia Estate TDi if he wants to tow a caravan and still wants something that's not too big.
Despite the badge I have only heard good things about the build quality, value for money and reliability.
Our company now uses them now as pool cars and they have had far fewer problems with these than anything that went before. I think the lifetime servicing costs have pretty much halved since the Octavia's arrived.
The Golfs are nice.
As above, Octavia. How does he feel about the badge? Unlike us he'll remember the full-whack of the old Skoda brand wont he?
NorthernStar - Yep, you just have to accept the depreciation for what you get in return. It's a balance. I think it's worth it to have something new and eliminate the second hand risk. Not just the costs, also the hassle, which I don't have time for.
I understand why people go second hand and might change my mind if money was a little tighter....
To be honest I don't think there's much more risk with a 3yo car than a new one. If anything, there's MORE risk with new because there could be manufacturing faults etc that will have already been sorted out in a 3yo.
If I were super rich I'd buy new, probably.
Will suggest the Octy to the old man, how could I have forgotten? 🙂 Although I'm not so keen, I think they're ugly inside and out - but he won't care.
Fair enough Angeldust, understand where you're coming from.
For me personally because I used to work in the industry then I know a bit about cars and how to properly check out a second hand motor to make sure it's sound.
I also like to buy privately because you can meet the owner and know pretty much instantly whether the car has been looked after or not.
The problem with buying from many second hand car dealers is that you often can't work out the true history. They buy most of their stock at auction - often just traded in cars from private individuals or fleet purchases. And cars frequently get traded in for a newer model because of problems. It takes a lot more front to sell a problem car face to face in a private sale than it does to trade it in at a dealer.
In other words at a dealer you get exactly the same cars you would buy from a private seller but with a couple of grand added to the screen price, and often lots of the history has gone missing too (e.g. old receipts, sales invoices etc).
True about dealers, but personally I loathe shopping for cars privately. I want to go in to a place with lots of cars, sit in some, drive some, and then conduct a decent business transaction with at least some comeback. Good dealers are rare but worth it for me. Sinclar VW in Cardiff also give you a 1 year warranty on their used cars - no idea how good it is mind, didn't have to claim on it. Although, I did get two free new rear tyres cos the old ones were making funny noises, and they also checked out the iffy automatic handbrake for free.
Incidentally, since I wanted finance, VW were offering way way better rates than banks were, so at the time I actually saved a ton of money by going to the dealer vs private.
Angeldust: PLEASE ACCEPT MY SINCERE APPOLOGIES.
I didn't realise that you were the one buying these high spec cars that I then pick up for 25-35% of new price after a few years use.
I owe you a debt. Without you (and others like you ie wealthy and too busy to bother with any repairs)then me and Northern Star would have to pay a lot more for our cars.
Sir, I salute you!
CHB, you are most welcome 😀
if they are gonna keep it for a long time i'd lean towards a 1yo than a 3yo. cars do seem to have a definate life.
that said if the options were 1yo pov spec and 3yo with fancy trim i'd know whered i'd be.
a friend of mine buys large, high milage, high spec cars about 8yo runs them till the first repair and gets shot. in the last couple of years she's had an audi a6 and a grand cherokee. much nicer than the fiestas/ etc you can buy around the £800-£1k mark.
that said if the options were 1yo pov spec and 3yo with fancy trim i'd know whered i'd be.
Well that's exactly it, innit. At a given price point then that is your choice.
my new van has window winders - what a ballache!