[Closed] Car battery roulette - stick or twist?

I have never had a lead acid die over night unless the light were left on or similar.

Check the voltage each weekend if you are worried but my newest petrol car is 2007 and the other two are from 1997 and all on original batteries I believe. One went flat over lock down through not being used for 6 months and there was some small parasitic drain but recharged and it has been fine ever since.

I wouldn't worry too much. Stick a voltage check to see that it is over 13V once in a while perhaps

My last one gave me a few warning shots across the bonnet - first frosty morning it started to get reluctant, then a couple of cold days when I bump started but otherwise fine on warmer days. Final nail was lockdown and lack of use. This was on a 12 year old battery. In the end I popped in my local motor factor and saved about 40 quid on what I was expecting, so wasn't too painful in the end

Buy some cheap jump leads and put them in the boot - If you get caught out someone will probably give you a jump. Good man points, innit 😀

I don't think I'd buy a new battery as preventarive maintenence.

The battery in my car showed a few signs of weakness, then needed weekly charging and finally daily charging. That was the final straw and I bought a new battery. Original battery, 11 years old.

I've had a battery die with no warning, drove it to a restaurant, completely dead so got a taxi home and a new battery fitted in the morning.

If anything, just pop into your local garage and have it tested. Will only take a few minutes and will show the batteries health and state of charge.

Buy some cheap jump leads and put them in the boot

Mine is 7.5 years old with stop start. Lockdown over last winter and it suffered and for very reluctant but never failed. Once the weather warmed up it was fine. Maybe it's me imagining it but since the temps dropped at the weekend I think it's more reluctant again. The car is garaged over night so I intend to get a new stop start compatible charger and plug it in whenever it's in the garage. Anybody suggest a charger and where to buy? I think cytek is usually the recommendation.

I'd not bother.

I'd buy jump leads you could also just take the mini battery off and leave it at home as a just incase to jump from.

"The car is garaged over night so I intend to get a new stop start compatible charger and plug it in whenever it’s in the garage"

Why ...... Your just going to get let down at the worst time.

Unlike the op. Who's battery shows no sign of failing. Yours is failing.

The op- if your going to start changing parts out of fear.....do you change your ball joints and wheel bearings when they show no sign of failing ? Your radiator ?

"Stick a voltage check to see that it is over 13V once in a while perhaps"

Measures 12.7v after standing for an hour and the full 14.4v with the engine running.

"If anything, just pop into your local garage and have it tested. Will only take a few minutes and will show the batteries health and state of charge."

Those testers are near-useless. Used to work for Halfords and the amount of times we'd test a battery for a customer (part of their 'Free Winter Check bollocks'), have it come back fine only to fail a week later and the customer complain means I don't trust them!

"I’d buy jump leads you could also just take the mini battery off and leave it at home as a just incase to jump from."

The Mini's 40 miles away, sod lugging it back and fore all the time! It's also older than this one.

"The op- if your going to start changing parts out of fear…..do you change your ball joints and wheel bearings when they show no sign of failing ? Your radiator ?"

No, not on this car, but they all give you a warning and rarely just fail. If the battery goes it's game over until you replace it.

"Better still get a battery booster and stick it in the glove box. Can be used for a number of things and are frankly brilliant.
Once you’ve got one you can guarantee that your battery will last forever!
😁"

Aren't they usually a LiPo? Don't fancy leaving one of those in the car fully charged as they can fail if not properly stored.

"No, not on this car, but they all give you a warning and rarely just fail. If the battery goes it’s game over until you replace it."

Maybes aye maybes no.

Never had a battery fail terminally without signs that only the truely ignorant would miss.

I have had a ball joint fail terminally without any signs.

Swings and round abouts.

It’s done it’s time. Replacements are not expensive. Change it and relax.

Also don’t buy jump leads with a username like that 😀

“Buy some cheap jump leads“, no buy decent HD leads. I had a Fiesta with a temperamental eclectical problem.

Cheap leads didn’t work on it, but a decent set did.

My last one died without warning. Had loads of duff batteries before and spent many, many times pushing cars, or messing around with jump leads, but I always knew they were knackered. This one went from fine one day, to not attempting to start the next. In fact the central locking wouldn't even open.

If you plan on keeping the car a number of years, then a new battery is going to be required at some point, and 9 years is well past the average shelf life. It's a consumable item, like tyres and brake pads. Some people just plod on until tyres are bald and pads down to the metal. Others change while still good life yet to minimise any exposure to risk. Battery is not much different really. Just depends where you are on the scale of sensibility and whether you're bothered about getting caught out.

The one on the Berlingo crapped out last year because I left the sidelights on overnight. That was 10yr old and showed no signs of reluctance to start. Helped out by the fact that it has an eco mode thing so shuts things like radio off after 15mins or so, just not the bastard sidelights.

I recently bought one of the those 12v extender leads for work and it has a built in digital voltage readout. Maybe that is the cheap option (although I think you are over stressing this; buy a battery or green flag cover from home if you are worried)

@neilnevill noco genius are also very good chargers. I also have a Halfords smart charger plus (I think it’s called) and that’s been pretty good too..

Thanks timbog

@trailrat because:
- I could do with a charger anyway
- I don't intend to keep the car long term and there's a good chance it'll be fine for the summer if it makes it through the winter
- I don't rely on the car, the wife's car is the back up
- chances of a failure away from home are slim, I've jump leads in the boot and breakdown cover.
- a smart charger, maintainer and conditioner like the noco1 is £33 and might actually repair some of the aging damage...I say might as I've no idea how effective they are on AGM batteries, or exactly why mine is failing
-but mainly since the car's engine management needs updating to tell it off a new battery replacing the battery is 'kin costly I believe. If this is not the case then brilliant! I might just get a new battery when this one fails

I don’t intend to keep the car long term and there’s a good chance it’ll be fine for the summer if it makes it through the winter

Im sure the next owner will appreciate that.

Of course I'm sure the advert will read.

"Careful owner never raced or rallyed. Will need new battery very soon"

I had a battery drain issue which flattened the nearly new battery. After fixing that I nursed the battery for ages. But when I finally gave up and replaced it it was great having a new battery that reliably worked even after weeks parked up. Worth it.

If you plan on keeping the car a number of years, then a new battery is going to be required at some point, and 9 years is well past the average shelf life. It’s a consumable item, like tyres and brake pads. Some people just plod on until tyres are bald and pads down to the metal. Others change while still good life yet to minimise any exposure to risk. Battery is not much different really. Just depends where you are on the scale of sensibility and whether you’re bothered about getting caught out.

I plan to keep it until it dies, done 130k so far and had no issues at all so the plan is to get past 200k at least. Tyres are changed at 3mm with only decent ones fitted, brakes are the same and all the servicing is kept on top of religiously.

It’s done it’s time. Replacements are not expensive. Change it and relax.

Think I'm going to go that route. The bonus is the original battery will fit the Mini so it can live on in that and enjoy just summer use.

Also don’t buy jump leads with a username like that 😀

Is it the left or right nipple that the positive? 🤪

I'll fulfill all my legal duties on sale of the vehicle and wont expect to be paid for anymore.

If a do fit a new battery any private sale advert I might do would state 'new battery recently fitted' but doubt I'd get more for the vehicle and if its part-exed I know I won't. I'm also honest so if asked by a potential buyer I'd say it's on the original battery. Buyer has the choice to walk away or offer appropriately and if it's bought the choice of better they want to fit.

I bought my daughter one from tayna it didn't start and wasn't sure if battery was just flat or genuinely done. Car is 9 years old and if bought online we got a 5 year warranty Varta for the same price as halfords own battery (much less powerful and only 3 year warranty) and I am a miserable sod.

Buy some cheap jump leads and put them in the boot –

I know it's been said but do not buy cheap jump leads. Spindly cables with badly crimped ends may not be up to the job or get a little warm in your hands.

Aren’t they usually a LiPo? Don’t fancy leaving one of those in the car fully charged as they can fail if not properly stored.

Dunno but mine has been sat for about 4 or 5 months and still showing lots of charge.
{Used it the other day for the built in charge..... Oh and used it in September to charge a guys phone when we were out on a road trip}

Eurocarparts have 365 day return policy. Buy a battery, stick it in the garage, if you don't use it before April then just take it back

If you’re going to put the old one in the mini, do you have a cut off on the terminal. I have lots of old vehicles, and even without any fancy electronics batteries last a lot better if they are disconnected. I generally just pull the +ve terminal off mine now. Even the cheapest lead acid battery will last a couple of years fully charged if not connected.

mine was dead on my van on monday morning, had to find a neighbour with jump leads and got a new one fitted at a mates garage at lunchtime. apparently 4 years is about how long the originals last on transit customs and mines getting close to that now.

it was a hard frost on monday plus the van hadn't move all weekend and i had been in and out of it a lot for tools, it wont help that everytime you open a door it puts sidelights on for a short time and you can also hear other electrical things starting up.

i did remember that last winter if i had been in and out of the van a lot through the day i was getting a message on the dash about battery saving mode so guess that should have been my warning even though it never struggled to crank the engine over or start untill monday.

If you do get jump leads and use them, make sure you have the negative lead connected to an earth point on the chassis -often there is a post near the battery- rather than the negative post on the battery. If you don’t you can cause significant damage to some electronic systems on modern vehicles.

I generally just pull the +ve terminal off mine now

Not recommended on many modern vehicles-can cause all sorts of coding issues

mainly since the car’s engine management needs updating to tell it off a new battery replacing the battery is ‘kin costly I believe. If this is not the case then brilliant! I might just get a new battery when this one fails

@neilnevill I replaced mine at 134k and nearly 9 years old about 32 months ago. AGM battery, and like yours, apparently the "smart" charging system would adjust charge rate to compensate for the aging battery but mysteriously wouldn't be smart enough to spot a brand new one without me paying a dealer. I didn't bother getting it recoded and it's been fine so far. Mine's not stop-start but if yours is and the car hasn't disabled that feature I'd think your battery's OK.

make sure you have the negative lead connected to an earth point on the chassis -often there is a post near the battery- rather than the negative post on the battery

The battery earths to the chassis so there's continuity between the -ve post and the "earth point". I'm genuinely curious about how it can make any difference to the car electronics which you connect to?

Ground is ground, if it wasn't then it wouldn't be ground. No?

Using a non-battery earth point is to avoid sparks near the battery when hooking up the final connection, far as I knew.

Using a non-battery earth point is to avoid sparks near the battery when hooking up the final connection, far as I knew

Yeah, that always used to be the story, and a distressed battery might be off gassing more than a healthy one. But the "one earth is better than another electronically" thing? I'd like to know the reasoning.

The black jump lead should never be connected to the negative terminal (–) on the 12-volt vehicle battery. Connecting the lead to the negative terminal can cause incorrect condition evaluation of the 12-volt vehicle battery in the vehicle electronics.

From my Golf’s user manual. Perhaps I should have explained that it is the ‘donor’ vehicle that can suffer the damage, even if the engine is running. I was told by a vehicle tech that it can potentially permanently damage some systems. On older cars probably not so important, but I still wouldn’t take a chance

Our Volvo branded battery in our V70 lasted 17years and 190k miles cranking a 5cylinder 2.4litre engine, presumed original as we've owned it 12years and never changed it up until a few months ago. Plenty of warning it was on its way out.
Probably overbuilt like the rest of the car.

Better still get a battery booster and stick it in the glove box. Can be used for a number of things and are frankly brilliant.

This.

Stolen from elsewhere but makes sense to me, if you're using the leads to jump start it rather than just charge the battery..

During jump-starting, we connect the boosting battery to ground rather than to the dead battery's - terminal for the simple reason that this provides a more direct return path to the good battery which is powering the dead car: the return current does not have to travel through the dead battery's minus terminal hookup cable and then to the jumper cable, but can go directly from the chassis ground to the jumper cable.

A more direct return path allows for better current flow and less voltage drop, like plugging a big appliance directly into an outlet, rather than via an extension cord.

Johnners, exactly, that's why I know it struggled a bit last winter. Until then, and all this summer, stop start would stop the engine first time I came to a stop within minutes of setting off (slightly longer in winter as it checks engine temperature). last winter I noticed it cranking slightly slower and although still starting quickly it took a second or two, not the usual instant start, and the car would disable stop start for a while, on one occasion when the car had sat unused for maybe a couple of months (lockdown) I'd driven 25 to 30 miles before it re-engaged so I think the battery was fairly low on charge. Low on charge in such circumstances doesn't mean it was goosed, but I think it's past it's best.
Good to know you've not had trouble after your battery change. The need for a recode does feel a little suspicious!

I’d probably just replace it. Preventative maintenance. Less than the price of an oil change and if you buy online and fit yourself probably cheaper still and good for another 7-10years.

I’ve had a battery die with no warning, drove it to a restaurant,

Crikey, some people really do spoil their batteries.

During jump-starting, we connect the boosting battery to ground rather than to the dead battery’s – terminal for the simple reason that this provides a more direct return path to the good battery

There's a major safety reason for this. If the battery is venting hydrogen, it can explode when if the cable sparks when you connect it or disconnect it. I've seen this happen twice, it blows the top off the battery and sprays acid everywhere. Connecting the jumper cable to the chassis to complete or break the circuit keeps sparks away from the battery.

Our Volvo branded battery in our V70 lasted 17years and 190k miles cranking a 5cylinder 2.4litre engine, presumed original as we’ve owned it 12years and never changed it up until a few months ago. Plenty of warning it was on its way out.

Probably overbuilt like the rest of the car

Ours on MK3 only did 125k and 8 years, I feel short-changed.

Given that the battery is working fine with no signs of issues then i'd leave it alone.

To make sure you're feeling safe I'd buy a good quality jump Start Batteyr pack device that would be insurance against a random failure of a battery. It'll get you going again with no need for external help or another car being about and you can take it with you to your next car. Insurance against a flat battery for life!

Eurocarparts have 365 day return policy. Buy a battery, stick it in the garage, if you don’t use it before April then just take it back.

I could carry it around in the boot with the right socket to replace it if it does I suppose.

If you’re going to put the old one in the mini, do you have a cut off on the terminal.

Disconnect the negative terminal every time I park it, partly for safety but also as a basic security feature. I also take the coil lead off.

You can all carry on about how to use jump leads now, by vote goes to earth to engine block or jumper terminal.

Good to know you’ve not had trouble after your battery change. The need for a recode does feel a little suspicious!

I would add here that I think the dealer recode probably does something, but I'm also pretty sure a smart battery management system should be able to recognise the change to a new battery without a dealer picking your pocket. Also, I replaced my battery with the exact same spec by the same manufacturer - I'd be more inclined to get a recode if I changed anything significant in the spec, such as AGM to flooded lead acid.

Replaced my van battery this March, it had been going for 14 years.

The new one is playing up already, had gone flat this week for no apparent reason.

It's been suggested to me that this is because the budget Lion battery is a POS, so I'm looking into the warranty terms now.

Better still get a battery booster and stick it in the glove box. Can be used for a number of things and are frankly brilliant.

What else do they do? And how much for a decent one?

I agree johnners, is get the same capacity, same construction and peak current.

You can get a higher spec battery, within reason (ones with really high amps tend to be very expensive anyway) it doesn't need to be exactly the same, as long as it's not less powerfull than stock, and will physically fit into your battery cradle.

Depends how many extra electricals you have... back in the day I was into silly sound systems with multiple amplifiers and speakers..it was quite standard to run a battery with much higher amps than standard spec so the sound system didn't trash the battery.

Just noticed something. The thread title says roulette but stick or twist is from blackjack.

I have 2 battery horror stories
1. An 05 plate passat, the battery died once down in the lakes and got it replaced at Kendal Halfords. The money that fitted it, cracked part of one of the drain vents and from then on used to leak water into the passenger footwell. Never got to the route cause, but ended up selling the car.
2. A 15 plate Zoe. For some weird reason, the 12v battery behaves as if it's connected to an alternator - only charges from the main traction battery while driving. There's a short somewhere which drains the battery over 10 days if the car isn't used. The error message reporting the failing 12v battery is quite alarming!

What else do they do? And how much for a decent one?

Well not a lot but they can have USB ports to charge stuff and possibly a torch also.

My old C-max used to kill batteries, they'd always die just outside the warrenty too!

Just get a jump starter. Doesn't even need to be a fancy lithium one, I've got a lead acid one, it's basically a motorbike battery with jump leads in a plastic box with a split charger (it charges via the cigaret lighter).

Hook it up, leave it for 5 minutes to put a bit of power into the cars battery and it gets you going. A lithium one would be a lot smaller and lighter though.

More rudimentary, I've got the c-max's last (nearly new) battery that I took out before it was scrapped. I'll probably take that with me when I go up North for a few months in the new year, just because I know at some point I'll do something daft like leave an interior light on after a night shift.

quite standard to run a battery with much higher amps than standard spec so the sound system didn’t trash the battery.

Almost forgot, and also to prevent your headlights dimming in time to the bass line hahaha :0

My old C-max used to kill batteries

I wonder if some cars standard spec batteries are slightly lower spec than they ought to be, especially with newer cars having more equipment that requires electricity, and plus peripherals plugged into the aux/cig lighter socket, phones, tablets etc.