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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-27043910
If he was marking the cards I can see it as cheating but not sure the Casino will win this.
Also says a Casino in London with held his winnings. That would irk you a bit 😕
Interesting - I assumed that he was manipulating the cards in some way. When I read he was just studying them, it got odder.
I guess it's the same as card counting.
On the whole though, I thought gabling debts were all a bit outside the law. Depended on trust.
The Borgata alleges that Mr Ivey and an accomplice gave directions to the dealer to flip the cars in a specific manner, citing superstition. The casino accommodated Mr Ivey's request, it says.
This is presumably what the casino is basing its argument on.
But, the dealer/house controls the dealing of the cards, they did not have to accommodate his request. Ivey had no control in this regard, save for a simple request. The only reason they would accommodate such a request is because Ivey is a huge spender (and therefore huge occasional loser) at their casino.
It is the same as card counting IMO. Not illegal but against house rules. What does make card counting illegal is the use of some other device to help with the counting. It's a very very loose argument, but I wonder whether the casino is going down the route of suggesting that his "manipulation" of the dealing of the cards was to assist his counting of the cards. I still think the casino could have taken proper precautions, i.e. not having a player dictate how the cards should be dealt!
(fwiw, I think Ivey is a legend. Always liked him as a player)
Gambling debts are now enforceable in England & Wales IIRC (I think this has been discussed on here before) and presumably they also are in the US. But I don't think this is an action for the recovery of a debt anyway.
Apparently there is some sort of gambling code in New Jersey that has some force...
The whole casino thing sort of stinks with them very heavy on card counting
But if you just accept casinos are a means of loosing money then all will be fine
So, the original question "could you cheat at poker like this?": Yes you could if you knew which edges corresponded to which cards.
Hang on, so the player [i]looked[/i] at the back/edge of the cards (didn't mark them himself or have someone do it for him) spotted some imperfections he could use to ID them and the house is claiming he broke the rules? FRO! your cards, your screw up, tough shit.
Seems that way to me- house's cards, house's dealer, house's problem.
I can't see what he's done wrong either. 😕
The house always wins doesn't it? Except when it doesn't because of its own ****-up in which case it'll take you to court to make sure it wins. Bizarre. (Although, I imagine most folk would be coming at this from a biased standpoint [i]against[/i] the casino anyway, me included.)
Bizarre.
I've never fully understood the objection to "card counting" either (provided it is done in your head of course).
Surely that isn't cheating - it's just using your brain to understand the odds a little better.
It's like they are saying [i]"No, no, just play the game. You're not allowed to think! That's cheating"[/i]
That's basically it. Some games have a fairly low level of randomness and a high level of visibility which gives the players options for play which the casinos don't like. IIRC card counting is actually legally protected in some US states.