You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
Interesting statistic in the first couple of minutes – all of the annual revenue in professional sport globally is less than the annual revenue made by a single pharmaceutical company, Johnson & Johnson.
Blew me away too, did that one @convert. 😀
EDIT: as did the one about total NFL being less than the revenue of some Painting & Decorating chain I’d never heard of.
Which of course (to me anyway), begs the question, why are Saudis, Qataris, Russians, etc. so keen to spend their money funding these events.
On another note, have you got to the bit about Thai restaurants in the U.S. yet? I had no idea! 😂
On another note, have you got to the bit about Thai restaurants in the U.S. yet? I had no idea!
Yes! I need to google though......felt a touch tinfoil hat to take as legit without a check!
Not quite as simple as the interviewee made out, but seems he wasn’t BSing.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vice.com/amp/en/article/paxadz/the-surprising-reason-that-there-are-so-many-thai-restaurants-in-america
I like golf. I pay less than £400 for my annual green fees (in Scotland). I probably play alone 75% of the time and it’s a few hours of glorious solitude away from work, house, kids etc. I enjoy the challenge of it, because it isn’t easy. I haven’t bought kit for some time now, and built my set up over a few years by taking advantage of discounted prices for last years models, but having just added it up it would cost about £3k to replace like for like, which I’m surprised at.
To answer the question....No! I love golf (sometimes!)and have been a member of my Club since 1976, but have been a footballer, runner, mtber,skier along the way too. There is definitely a resurgence in the sport around here (Surrey) probably due to all those people WFH, sneaking off early to play. (We have a big waiting list)
I do enjoy watching some golf on TV, but a lot of it just makes me fall asleep. I really can't see how they anticipate getting a decent return on their money...or any for that matter.
quick google tells me that a set is typically limited to 14 clubs, and they seem to top out at between 4-600 quid each, what the hell do you have for a “best bike”?
Not even close
1200 for all my irons
500 quid for a driver
250 for a putter
300 for a 3 wood
350 for 2 wedges
200 for a hybrid
My best bike is an sworks tarmac
How many top end mountain bikes can you get for £2800 quid?!
Not even close
1200 for all my irons
500 quid for a driver
250 for a putter
300 for a 3 wood
350 for 2 wedges
200 for a hybrid
Wow....this is what I paid for mine:
1000 for all my irons
190 quid for a driver
90 for a putter
80 for a 3 wood Ex demo
180 for 2 wedges
120 for a hybrid (over ten years ago)
Forgot I started this thread! Agree the overall cost to play might be one issue, but I was referring to the money in the pro game. $350 million just for two players to turn up, this being separate to the prize money. This makes even the top end of football wages look tiny. Presumably many other players being given appearance fees higher than the prize money. Rory McIlroy has also said he had taken appearance fees higher than the prize money for previous tournaments.
Even if some people like it and it gets on TV it’s hard to see how it would generate the amounts of money they’re paying people to play. Quite apart from the moral issues.
I don’t doubt that it requires skill, although the amount of middle aged overweight professionals out there makes me think that fitness is not necessarily required.
It's a lot of money for a hitty stick.
$350 million just for two players to turn up
This won’t be for just one tournament, it’ll be for a series of them. (Still crazy obviously!)
EDIT - I assume so anyway.
@andylc, the reality is that they will have assessed every penny being spent, Saudi are funding this via Greg Norman and that team, they will want a return, but also some legitimacy as usual.
The appearance fees are basically sponsorship deals, same as any other in sport
Yes I think it’s for the series. But even if you come last you get something like $150,000 in the first tournament!!
Dustin Johnson had the idiocy to say he is doing it because he doesn’t want to play golf forever, and this will allow him to do this.
You’ve already earnt $75 million in prize money alone. Please don’t pretend you actually NEED any more money!
Wow….this is what I paid for mine:
1000 for all my irons
190 quid for a driver
90 for a putter
80 for a 3 wood Ex demo
180 for 2 wedges
120 for a hybrid (over ten years ago)
I was lucky enough to have a mate (who plays off about 4) give me a set of irons and a driver - he's very well off so all the gear is very good but now about 20 years old!
My BIL gave me a good bag.
Within the last hour I've just paid £600 for a brand new set of [2019 old stock] irons (TM P790s for those that care).
The driver I was given is great and I've paid about £150 for some used Vokey wedges and a good putter.
So I'm into it for way under £1000 and the gear will last me many years. I pay about £300/year at my club which works on a points/round basis and I play almost every week with 3 friends.
Money well spent even though I'm really quite crap!!
Not even close
1200 for all my irons.....
1000 for all my irons
190 quid for a driver
The driver I was given is great and I’ve paid about £150 for some used Vokey wedges and a good putter.
I think that the point being made was that a top end set of clubs was significantly cheaper than a top end bike. The examples quoted are not top end, as a few moment's googling reveal.
You’ve got a bargain for those p790s, I paid double that when they came out. They are a phenomenal club, you won’t be disappointed
Tbh you can buy a set of irons from 20 years ago second hand for 200 quid that will provide 99% of the performance. Golf tech doesn’t become obsolete after 2 years, unlike bikes!
Golf tech doesn’t become obsolete after 2 years, unlike bikes!
Bikes don't become obsolete either.
Not even close
1200 for all my irons
500 quid for a driver
250 for a putter
300 for a 3 wood
350 for 2 wedges
200 for a hybridMy best bike is an sworks tarmac
Surely that's the golfing equivalent of saying 105 is "as good as you can get" because Dura Ace won't make you any better.
It's expensive, but you've not walked into a showroom and bought the equivalent of an S-works?
Indeed, for the record I play off 4, but its not the clubs that are stopping me from getting better....or worse for that matter.
Tbh you can buy a set of irons from 20 years ago second hand for 200 quid that will provide 99% of the performance. Golf tech doesn’t become obsolete after 2 years, unlike bikes!
Maybe 5-10 years old, 20 years ago you basically had blades or very early game improvements, the last decade it's been just tweaking GI irons with the tungsten placement, blades are still blades 😁
If i get the new hip later this year as expected then i'm probably going to start hitting balls again, thinking of getting a set of irons to just get back and working the swing and distances, but at the prices being mentioned i might just stick to crazy golf!
It’s expensive, but you’ve not walked into a showroom and bought the equivalent of an S-works?
I’m sorry but you clearly don’t know anything about golf if you don’t think you can get top end kit for the money I’ve quoted.
My driver is used by the number 7 golfer in the world. Rory Mclroy uses exactly the same putter. My wedges are the most commonly used on the pga tour and my irons cost exactly the same as the ones that all the Taylor made pros use.
It’s absolutely top end kit, used by the best players in the world. To say otherwise is nonsense
It’s a nice walk in the country interrupted by having to knock a ball down a hole with a stick.
I can go for a walk in the country with a stick and never have to worry about the ball. Or paying for the walk.
gave up golf when i started mountain biking and had less spare cash since.
clubs are getting on a bit now, not sure how old but the irons are ping G10, driver 3 wood and hybrid are callaway big bertha diablo and an odysey putter which where bought when fairly new out.
keep meaning to get a new charger for the powercaddy battery and going to see if i can still hit a ball ok.
i imagine the clubs will still perform for me just as well as a new set
Presumably the bonkers money is an investment expected to reap a return.
The wife and I started golf lessons last winter at the local driving range. Liked it, so bought some cheapie Decathlon clubs and ventured onto a PAYG course at Easter. At face value, it's actually great fun. Simple concept of getting the ball in the hole with the fewest strokes possible. The inordinately complex backswing, straight arm, wrist, hip and shoulder rotation combo to make the wee blade bit hit the ball in the desired direction is the tricky bit. It's a nice walk, enhanced by the challenge of not skelping the ball into ditches or trees. All the corporate social climbing and beemer in the vice captain's reserved parking space is totally irrelevant to us. Best to be enjoyed for what it is, not what some choose to make it.
So £8400 buys you the best of the best of the most expensive golf clubs?
You could, almost, get a nice steel hardtail for that.
It's a hobby like any other...
...see also fishing, cycling etc.
You don't need 2 grands worth of kit to catch a trout, same as you don't need a 2 grand bike to ride.
And why handicaps? Not many other amateur sports have them.
The money per player is bonkers but the real question is whether Giant bicycles will sue them for pinching their women's cycling brand name?
And why handicaps? Not many other amateur sports have them.
For making competitions more competitive, it’s quite an easy way of keeping it fun and fair
And why handicaps? Not many other amateur sports have them.
You don't have to have them. I played very amateur as stated before with a £100 set of clubs and pay as you go gold clubs with a few mates each time.
We still scored it but at no stage worried about handicaps.
My friend plays on our local Austrian course for free, all 14 holes.
He sneaks onto the 3rd hole and leaves after the 16th.
If it's the lack of morals of playing for big money in Saudi Arabia that's a problem, then do you also have a problem with people who head there to work in regular jobs for more money than the UK? Or people who take holidays there?
It seems to me that we Brits have been taking advantage of poorer countries with dodgy human rights issues for holidays since Franco's Spain.
It seems to me that we Brits have been taking advantage of poorer countries
…for about a thousand years? 😀
According to Iain poulter, it’s not about the cash it’s about the opportunity to grow the game…
🤔
And why handicaps? Not many other amateur sports have them.
To make it fairer to all who play.
In fact without handicaps golf would not be anything like as popular as it is. The new World Handicap System allows me to turn up at any course in the world and play on an equal footing with any other player regardless of skill level.
It works amazingly well. There's a handicap spread of about 10 points in the group I play with and after a little 3 day tour of Welsh courses this week there was just 3 stableford scoring system points between the 4 of us (91-94).
Anyway, the answer to the question appears to be that there is so much money in Saudi, they may as well spend some of it on something they like!
I ride past a golf course on my my to the local trails, every single time I see golfers I want to do the Klaxxon jackass scene and sing Bob Marley- One Glove!
I still shout an encouraging ‘fore’ when driving past the tee as you leave Glossop on the snake. Still amuses me after 20 odd years… the golfers evidently love it, always waving their golf bats as me as I go by…
My friend plays on our local Austrian course for free,
We used to play for free in the summer. When on night-shift we sometimes finished at 04:00 so went to golf course before it was open and played a round. COudl get round very quickly when having course to self, no old people hobbling round, no fours in front etc,.
So why don't other sports have a handicap system. Eg 10km running races?
So why don’t other sports have a handicap system. Eg 10km running races?
I agree it works well in golf
There is the vets standards in time trialing which is basically a handicap system in the uk and lets folks of all ages and genders compete on a level playing field (sort of)
So why don’t other sports have a handicap system. Eg 10km running races?
My local Fell Running club does a winter / nightime handicap series… works well and gives the whole field an impetus to give it beans from the off!
There are handicaps used in dinghy racing (well all sailing racing really)
If it’s the lack of morals of playing for big money in Saudi Arabia that’s a problem, then do you also have a problem with people who head there to work in regular jobs for more money than the UK? Or people who take holidays there?
I reserve the same level of disdain, yes.
That's their choice but it's not one I feel to be morally correct. I've had the chance of working out in those places, you couldn't pay me enough.
Any sport that is played in leagues is effectively handicapped.
I was thoroughly put off golf by endless years of my Dad wittering on about it (to be fair he was Scottish, albeit 2nd gen, but OMG he killed any interest I might ever have had in it). A lot in my family played, not all blokes either, my ancient Auntie was a terror on the links.
Their milieu definitely leant towards Gammon Central though, which didn't help.
Ironically though Mum hated Dad she too took up golf, as did her partner (a much happier relationship!). Yet again though there were always tales of bitchiness, cliques and skulduggery down their (much cheaper) club which put me right off.
The golf club next to the vets, though, opens their cafe to all, and the people we've seen come and go there (while we're indulging a hobby more expensive than either cycling or golf!!) seem like normal folk doing a sport. That (and the fact that a perfectly nice retired colleague does it) make me cautiously open to the concept that it's not the worst thing ever after all.
Ironically if you wanted to schmooze at my old firm, golf wouldn't have done it. Cycling and running! That's how you rubbed shoulders with the big higher ups! At one time the work branded-goods shop offered an £11k Pinarello (!)
Same with tennis, I just can't understand the appeal.
All the tennis clubs and golf clubs near me when I was growing up made it perfectly clear that people like me weren't welcome.
All the tennis clubs and golf clubs near me when I was growing up made it perfectly clear that people like me weren’t welcome.
Lol, I grew up in Troon, six golf courses from the municipals up to Royal which back onto three courses to the north and one to the south.
Like you it was made abundantly clear that folk like me were not welcome. Which was fine, they were much more fun to ride over anyway.
Let’s not over-egg it, there’s no posh places in Ayrshire 😂
Personally I grew up in Perth, you had the north inch as a council run club, Craigie hill as cheap play and the island, 3 places you could play pretty cheap, especially young and all pretty welcoming. Yes you had gleneagles nearby, but that’s built for the rich, not being welcome there is like me moaning I’m not allowed into the posh clubs or restaurants, you pay for exclusivity when you’re rich, and fair play if that’s what they want.
So why don’t other sports have a handicap system
Man UTD do this.
The only clubhouses I have seen the inside of seemed to be plastered with notices forbidding things. Due to being involved in construction in the noughties many a team meeting was held on a Saturday in clubhouses in Herts and Beds. An activity/pass time that requires so many pettifogging rules turned me off. When asked what my handicap was my reply of the bag of clubs was not taken well by some folk.
So why don’t other sports have a handicap system. Eg 10km running races?
Most trail races (at least here) have age group classifications - which is basically a handicap system.
Same with tennis, I just can’t understand the appeal.
Nor can you understand a thread title.
Handicaps are clearly a good thing if you want to play people at different levels but have a competitive game. They don't really work for something like a 10km run although you could apply some simple maths to the finishing times based on previous performance but not sure of the point of that and no point in handicap at the start, i.e. start off at different times based on handicap so you all cross the finish line at roughly the same time which would be a bit chaotic.
Yeah, the other benefit of handicaps is it is something that a player will focus on as well during the year, as for asking about handicaps, i don't think i've really been asked that much over the years (when i played), it's not something you ask unless you're filling in the card for a fourball or the likes to then work out the handicap for that round.
Anyway, it's all fun, i see DeChambeau has joined the LIV tour now as well, that's a bit loss for the PGA, he's also got his Majors exemption for the next few years so less of a worry for him i guess.
I like this guy.
Only seen that youtube clip and i'm not a fan, doing it for his own publicity.
Personally i think LIV is getting the bad press and Saudi stuff because the bigwigs at the PGA, R&A and so on are trying to get this nipped in the bud and kill off competition, same way as UEFA killed off the superleague stuff, there's no saints on either side, but it's all about business this stuff, same as F1 has been doing worse things for much longer, same as why we're watching a World Cup in Qatar this winter and so on.
LIV is getting the bad press and Saudi stuff because.....
Trump is supporting it.
Trumps supported the PGA stuff for decades, he's supporting the LIV stuff as he wants those tournaments at his venues and to do business with them.
Golf tournaments have always had controversy, look at the Masters over the years, the R&A not allowing women members until recently and so on.
I’ve seen Caddyshack and Happy Gilmore too many times. The real thing will never live up to that. To answer the OP, popular sports bring in lots of money from advertising and sponsorship. Golf is really popular.
My take on golf's attraction is that even a regular muppet can very occasionally look - and thus feel - as good as pro i.e. hit a perfect shot.
You can't say that about mtbing/road cycling/motorcycling/F1/rallying/football and so on. At no point in any of your rides did you you look as good or ride as well as Loic Bruni.
Theres a lot of money in general sloshing about in golf because theres a lot of people that play it, and yes, possibly the demographic also means they will pay a decent amount of money to purchase the same equipment as the pros.
The LIV stuff will never get a return of the investment though. Its not about getting their money back, its basically buying and appropriating an entire pro level sporting group in effect. They will just keeping spaffing all their oil money on players until they hold 99% of the cards.
And before poeple say, so what?, they'll just go onto the next sport and the next sport. Football, boxing (lets be fair cycling is going to be very low on that list). Might not be able to do it with the american based stuff like baseball and basketball but its coming for everything else.
And really, do we have to try so hard to trash other sports? Can we not accept different people might play different sports/hobbies? Especially in the next topic we're now saying we're a country of obesity and we need to get fitter etc, or need to look after our mental health etc.
Personally i think LIV is getting the bad press and Saudi stuff because the bigwigs at the PGA, R&A and so on are trying to get this nipped in the bud and kill off competition, same way as UEFA killed off the superleague stuff, there’s no saints on either side, but it’s all about business this stuff, same as F1 has been doing worse things for much longer, same as why we’re watching a World Cup in Qatar this winter and so on.
Well, I think they've got a kinda right to try and protect what they've built up over the years. Its like you spending a long time building up whatever business you're in and then Amazon setting shop up next door selling everything at a loss just to get the market because they can afford to.
I struggle with long sentences, but
Theres a pretty perfect inverse relationship between how keen on golf these people are and how well their companies perform. The keener the golfer the poorer the share performance and more bancruptcies they’ve presided over
Can we say ‘recent ex-US President’, children? I think we can… 🤣