I've been looking at 1-2 year old cars on autotrader. Most are from dealers of course, but I've seen a few from private sellers, usually a bit cheaper. Instinctively I've shied away from these as it just seems risky giving large amounts of money to a private individual. But I wonder what the risk really is.
If the car is under warranty then you'd go back to the main dealer with any issues anyway (especially if you were buying it from somebody a bit further away).
Obviously you wouldn't part with any money until you'd seen/tested the car and checked the V5 matched the car.
I guess it would make sense to avoid anything with outstanding finance as there would be a risk of the seller not paying this off and the finance company coming after you.
Other than that, I'm not sure what the risk is, but it still feels wrong. So just checking if my instincts are right on this one.
It's how we used to do it back in the 80s, car off the classifieds in the back of the local newspaper!
If things went wrong, we fixed em.
There's a few ways to look at it - someone will sell a vehicle privately, if they want more for it than a dealer (or webuyany type) will give them for it. A dealer will knock off a good grand or 2 off the resale price for obvious reasons. I'm sure there are many private sales that are fine and you'd be doing someone a favour.
However, dealers will usually, not only give you a warranty, but check the vehicle for faults, MOT it and make it ready to drive away. (Decent dealers anyway).
A good example of the risk from buying privately - My son recently bought a VW Golf from a local dealer (we know the owner) - he's had a few niggles from the car - aircon not working; a brake caliper seized and he had to get the RAC out last weekend - the warranty meant the car just went back to the dealer and these were sorted FOC. That would be a pain from a private seller, you'd have no comeback and have to pay out to get things sorted.
I'm on the hunt for a new car, and though I would like to buy privately and save a few quid, help someone out... I'm not prepared to risk "Sold as seen" on a car these days.
100% Dealer for me on a car that age.
A good example of the risk from buying privately - My son recently bought a VW Golf from a local dealer (we know the owner) - he's had a few niggles from the car - aircon not working; a brake caliper seized and he had to get the RAC out last weekend - the warranty meant the car just went back to the dealer and these were sorted FOC.
Was that a car that was still under warranty though? Personally I wouldn't buy an older car from a private seller as I can see that's a minefield. But something that still has over a year (and maybe a lot more) of manufacturer's warranty seems to be less of a risk.
100% Dealer for me on a car that age.
That's my instinct too, but I can't really put my finger on why.
Was that a car that was still under warranty though?
Not the manufacturer's warranty no, the dealer's.
If newer cars get the manufacturers warranty transferred via private sales, then its not so risky obvs. (I wouldn't know, cars a year or 2 old would be a waste of money for me.)
I spent a fair wedge on a 3 year old 'people carrier van'. Paid a bit more for the dealer priced van, and also added £700 for two year warranty and servicing/MOT - well worth it considering the van price. Might be different if paying £10k. Had the van six months and nothing has gone faulty, but it's piece of mind when spending a fair amount.
I looked at a car ad a few years ago, private sale not far from home and was thinking of going for a proper look, checked autotrader again and no sign of it so obviously sold. The same car appeared again a week later, 240 miles away in a garage for around £4k more than it had been as a private sale, even using the exact photos from the original seller, no warranty was gonna justify paying the garages price
To be clear, I'm talking specifically about cars that have at least a couple of years of manufacturer's warranty left. Obviously, with a car that is out of warranty, there is the risk of buying a car from a private seller and being stuck with repair bills. But if you have a manufacturer's warranty, what is the risk?
I think I've put my finger on what worries me though. Although there doesn't seem to be much of a risk for the buyer, there is a big risk for the seller, who is probably inundated with scammers. So, I'm left wondering why they would do it and that makes me suspicious.
I saw one recently that said something like "selling on behalf of a deceased family member" and I thought, "why on earth would you do that?". You've just lost a family member and you are going to spend the next few weeks trying to filter out all of the scammers. And for what? To make a few grand extra on a car that you have just unexpectedly inherited anyway. Must be a scam, even if I can't work out what it is.
More importantly, are you looking at buying a car from a city beginning with the letter 'B'? That's a big - huge - epic - 'NO!' if it is.
FWIW, a friend of ours is selling his BMW 330e (or something like that). He leased it for 2 years, bought it at the end of the lease, and is asking for 4k more than he bought it for. It's been babied and well looked after. So that sort of thing would generally be ok, but some of the other excuses less so.
I've bought cars up to £22k privately. I prefer privately as I like to assess/buy the owner. I prefer to buy an 'expensive' car privately where their home is pristine with other pristine cars on their drive, rather than from a dealer, which could have any history and dealers are notorious for being bad at supporting when things go wrong.
HPI check and buy the seller. Selling on behalf of deceased would not be a red flag. You'd want to do the best for the family who would have zero bargaining power at any dealership.
Not done it but it would not worry me. I bought a few years old Golf years ago. Turned up at a lovely large house, seller said it was his wife's old one and he'd bought her another which had just been delivered. Gave me the keys and said go and drive it. So we did. We bought it and saved a couple of thousand on dealer prices. What's not to like?
If the car is under warranty then you'd go back to the main dealer with any issues anyway
Was that a car that was still under warranty though? Personally I wouldn't buy an older car from a private seller as I can see that's a minefield. But something that still has over a year (and maybe a lot more) of manufacturer's warranty seems to be less of a risk.
Forget warranties (unless it's a brand which has an unusually long manufacturer's warranty).
Buying a used car from a dealer you have the same rights as when buying new. Ie, goods have to be fit for purpose; as described; and of satisfactory quality, and you can make claim under CRA up to six years from receiving the goods. Any manufacturer / retailer / third-party warranty offered is in addition to this, not instead of it.
Buying privately it's a case of caveat emptor (buyer beware), but you do still have some legal rights. It has to be "as described" and it must be roadworthy. A back-street dealer pretending to be a private seller is committing a criminal offence, if I were to respond to a "FOR SALE" sign in a car window then I'd phone to ask them about "the car," if they answer "which one?" then walk away.
A car for sale at just two years old I'd expect it either to be an ex fleet / lease vehicle, for its previous owner to have died, or for it to be bought-back and repaired following an insurance write-off. I suppose newcaritis is plausible but is surely unlikely, that's an expensive way of motoring.
if you have a manufacturer's warranty, what is the risk?
My first question here would be "is the warranty transferrable to a new owner?" (I've no idea whether this is commonplace or not, but I've seen non-transferrable manufacturer warranties on things like small electricals.)
The manufacturer warranty is always with the vehicle, not the owner.
I would and have done this in the past. Just carefully inspect the vehicle for crash damage that’s not recorded and make sure the SH shows that it’s been maintained to the right standards, preferably by a dealer, but not usually required.
I wouldn't tolerate the increased risk but you could use a website such as car vertical to improve the odds.
I wouldn't tolerate the increased risk
I instinctively agree with you, but increased risk of what?
Some of the highest risk cars are sold at dealerships. They can be damaged but repaired outside of category write off so there is no record. Someone might be trading in a newer made on a Friday lemon that's had many warranty issues. I've had to help a friend with small claims for a dealer refusing to pay for a £5k repair. Dealers aren't your friend.
Car dealers are certainly not your friend, and I totally agree that lemons or vehicles of questionable history are more likely to be sold at auction, and thus end up with a dealer.
As you suggested, sussing out the owner is vital and can give a lot of confidence. But for a nearly new car it's still a lot of money and ultimately you will be taking a gamble either way, to some extent.
Private - no consumer rights, but you can trust your instinct better
Dealer - notional consumer rights, but slippery and less transparent
Either way, law of averages says you'll probably be fine. But what's your attitude to risk?
I'm looking for a new-to-me van at the mo, and I'm leaning towards dealers TBH. Partly because private sellers seem to think they can ask dealer money anyway.
I've only ever bought 1 car from a dealer. I actively avoid it if at all possible. I don't see what value they add to the process other than holding stock and painting the tyres (which I hate) for a massive mark up.
The 2 most expensive cars I've ever bought were both off eBay and both less than 2 years old, each with less than 5000 miles on them and I saved somewhere in the order of £5k on each. That buys a lot of peace of mind. Even when one of them was a Lots of Trouble Usually Serious.
Why are people so risk averse?
By the owner.
Even when one of them was a Lots of Trouble Usually Serious.
Whoah, you are definitely a gambling man 😀
Why are people so risk averse?
Because its one of the largest purchases people make, and a bad decision could (literally) go up in smoke.
100% Dealer not sure why you would even look at private, way to risky.
Interesting. I was selling my car about nine years ago wasn't new but still had a manufacturer warranty and was coming up to 3 years old. Nice photos, advert in Auto trader. Wanted 20k for it which was about 2k cheaper than anything else out there. Car was in good nick etc etc.
I had maybe 3 proper enquiries about it but no bugger came to see it.
I think at that price people were worried about handing over 20k and having very little comeback. In the end I got a price from WBAC as a reference and part-exed it when buying a cheaper car from a dealer. Got 19k so I was happy but it was a bit odd the dealer transferring 9k into my bank account 😀
100% Dealer not sure why you would even look at private, way to risky.
Risk of what though?
I don't necessarily disagree but so far nobody has been able to say what the actual risk is. In what way can a private seller scan you on autotrader?
If you don't transfer any money until you have seen the car and checked the V5 then there is no risk of not getting the car.
If you use one of the history checking sites that should rule out any outstanding finance or it having been written off
Yes, it could be a lemon but that's true from a dealer too (possibly even more likely as they will probably have got it from an auction). If it has a decent amount of manufacturer's warranty left and you are buying from somewhere that is further away than your nearest dealer then you would get any issues sorted out at your local dealer anyway.
Risk of what though?
Poor quality repairs might be an example. As you have little or no rights or comeback from a private seller, but CRA rights against a dealer.
Risk of what though?
Poor quality repairs might be an example. As you have little or no rights or comeback from a private seller, but CRA rights against a dealer.
I've rarely heard of a good story of someone getting big repairs done by a dealer without a big stressful fight. Last car I bought privately was £5k less than a dealer, which would cover most reasonable big failures. Personally I've only had faults from a dealer sourced car
What I'm talking about is previous repairs that may have been fixed on the cheap. Caveat emptor for private sellers, but if you can prove they were like that before, you absolutely have rights against a dealer.
Same might apply to previous poorly done/missing services. Bought privately, engine goes boom, no comeback. Dealer, under CRA, there's a chance you can prove the problem was already there...
I'm contemplating buying a new (for me) car, and think I'd just use somewhere like Motorpoint. The prices seem quite good and at least you have the option return if not happy/complain like crazy/etc...
I don't necessarily disagree but so far nobody has been able to say what the actual risk is. In what way can a private seller scan you on autotrader?
If you don't transfer any money until you have seen the car and checked the V5 then there is no risk of not getting the car.
If you use one of the history checking sites that should rule out any outstanding finance or it having been written off
i've got one for you. mate of mine has recently (today) had a repo man turn up to take his van after he's had it 8 years. apparently the previous owner never settled the finance. he HPI'd it before he bought it, but it seems the 'owner' hadn't defaulted at that point. it's no longer HPI clear...
Car Vertical or similar type services should tell you if there is any outstanding finance on a vehicle though.
OK, I guess there is a risk that the car was damaged, repaired in a way you can't spot but still badly. I would have thought there was more of a risk of that from a dealer though as they have all the kit to cover up damage.
I found the one I was looking at earlier with the deceased family member.
i've got one for you. mate of mine has recently (today) had a repo man turn up to take his van after he's had it 8 years. apparently the previous owner never settled the finance. he HPI'd it before he bought it, but it seems the 'owner' hadn't defaulted at that point. it's no longer HPI clear...
Assuming he told them to jog on?
I found the one I was looking at earlier with the deceased family member.
How does the price compare to a dealer equivalent? Oh and watch the VED if it was a £40k+ vehicle. If it's subject to the extra lump (which it may pre-date) that really stings.
I found the one I was looking at earlier with the deceased family member.
Not sure why but I'm getting private trader vibes off that advert. Photos seem a bit too professional (like showing all four wheels).
How does the price compare to a dealer equivalent? Oh and watch the VED if it was a £40k+ vehicle. If it's subject to the extra lump (which it may pre-date) that really stings.
It's about £2k below the cheapest price from a dealer. Also mentions "open to offers". Not sure why, but that bugs me too. Who sets a price and immediately says they will accept less.
The increased VED only comes into effect for cars registered after the 1st of April, so this wouldn't be affected.
Not sure why but I'm getting private trader vibes off that advert. Photos seem a bit too professional (like showing all four wheels).
Yes, lovely house, nice driveway but quite a few cars, which look a bit older than I would expect for such a nice looking house. Could be legit though. Plenty of wealthy people don't like to spend too much on cars. That's why they are wealthy 😀
That's why they are wealthy 😀
They also tend to lease them, not buy them outright (especially new ones). That £35k could be working for them not tied up in a depreciating asset.
...but I've said I'd go dealer, especially at that sort of money. 😀
No real additional risk as long as you run a CarVertical report for outstanding finance and accident repair. I’ll caveat I’d want it to have at least 6 months manufacturer warranty so probably around 2 1/2 years.
Also always ask why they are selling and whether it’s been modified (especially something high performance), damaged and repaired and note this on invoice. If anything comes up you’ve got misrepresentation to fall back on.
New cars are pretty bomb proof these days and if anything had gone wrong the seller would have gone to the dealer anyway.
What I'm talking about is previous repairs that may have been fixed on the cheap. Caveat emptor for private sellers, but if you can prove they were like that before, you absolutely have rights against a dealer.
Same might apply to previous poorly done/missing services.
this doesn't seem a risk on a private sale of a car that's only a few years old. It will barely have had any services and shouldn't have had anything fixed. The service on modern cars is a bit of a joke anyway, this is for a VW Golf
Every 10,000 miles or 12 months (whichever comes first):
Oil and filter change
Tyre rotation
Brake system check
Every 20,000 miles:
Air filter replacement
Spark plug check (replace if needed)
Every 40,000 miles:
Fuel filter replacement
Transmission fluid check
Every 60,000 miles:
Timing belt replacement
It's even more comic for EVs. Change pollen filter, check a few things, that will be £100 please 😀 But if you want them to honour that warranty you better make sure you do them all on time.
Last car I bought privately was £5k less than a dealer, which would cover most reasonable big failures.
... is a very good point. If the engine munches itself and costs £3k to fix, you're still £2k up.
mate of mine has recently (today) had a repo man turn up to take his van after he's had it 8 years. apparently the previous owner never settled the finance. he HPI'd it before he bought it, but it seems the 'owner' hadn't defaulted at that point. it's no longer HPI clear...
I don't know specifically about HPI which may be different, but typically unpaid debts are statute barred after 6 years.
this doesn't seem a risk on a private sale of a car that's only a few years old.
Really? Try some YouTube channels like The Car Edition Ltd and see what you think about the lack of servicing even on newer car, oil filters, wet belts etc.
... is a very good point. If the engine munches itself and costs £3k to fix, you're still £2k up.
Good luck getting a new engine fitted for £3k! 😀
but typically unpaid debts are statute barred after 6 years
I thought it was after 6 years of no chasing? Ie a debt that first arose in 2010 can still be valid if a chaser is sent every year. If the last chasing letter for it was in 2018 then it can deemed void in 2025?
As I understand it:
It is unlawful to pursue a debt which is in question. If they're sending "a chaser every year" for a disputed debt then this is considered harassment.
If on the other hand you confess to owing the money, the 6-year clock is reset at that point. Which is (one reason) why it's usually a bad idea to talk to them on the phone, it's easy to incriminate yourself and - surprise! - your calls will suddenly be recorded "for training purposes" when it's in their best interests.
If a debt collection agency is claiming that you own them money then they need to evidence that in writing, or gwan **** themselves.
If a debt collection agency is claiming that you own them money then they need to evidence that in writing, or gwan **** themselves.
By all accounts, they aren't. The debt is secured on the van and the previous owner owes the money. The finance company may have title on the van. Awful situation.
Point stands.
"You owe us money."
"No I don't. Someone else might, but that's your problem."
No?
