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Thinking of buying a do-er up-er. Structurally, it's all there but, by (oh my days) does it need some work.
It's pretty-much a time capsule from the 1960s. But it's 3-bed house in a perfect location and my wife's got her heart set on it. There's no central heating, and no hot water upstairs. So it needs a combi boiler and rads throughout. It also needs a new bathroom, a new kitchen and re-wiring throughout.
Worst of all (for me) everything's sticky, brown or yellow: it's had a dog-owning chainsmoker who's lived off fried food living there for 50 years - the house is rank. It absolutely reeks. To the point where it made me feel ill looking around the place. Is that smell ever going to come out? Or will it need replastering throughout?
So, walk away and find something else? Or snap it up for a song and get the sugar soap and elbow-grease out?
Thoughts? (other than 'happy wife, happy life').
My last house was a repo and was fumigated however
The smell only went once all the wallpaper came off and a load of plastering was done.
Sometimes its better buying a project as you know theres no hidden horrors...
Do you have somewhere else to live while all the work is going on?
Living in a building site for months is the thing that breaks most people.
We had the sicky yellow smelly nonsense.
We have done a full gut. Removed all the woodwork and replastered in the end was the only way we could get rid of it. We tried sugar soap scrub , removed all the wall paper which was vile and painted .
Until we replastered it was always in the air. Even worse after a few days of unoccupied house.
If your rewiring you'll probably need to plaster anyway
Do you have somewhere else to live while all the work is going on?
Not really. I reckon if it's stripped of all soft furnishings and cleaned thoroughly it might be just about habitable. We can probably live in one room while the work's going on around us.
Did it with an early 20th century place which was utterly rank when we took it on. Took us 6 weeks to strip right back to the bare essentials and re-work it to be able to move in. Deeply unpleasant process at times but if you have the stomach for it, it is mostly likely to be just hard work to get what you want.
Bear in mind you pay VAT on house restorations but zero VAT on new builds. Have you factored living in a caravan through winter? To get an older house up to modern standards for insulation, electrical and plumbing you are probably looking at keeping just the brick walls and roof and replacing everything else.
Chances are depending on construction if you are going to do a full re-wire you'll be chasing the cables in the walls, thus re-plastering through out anyway.
We can probably live in one room while the work’s going on around us.
Unless it's the kitchen and you're pissing in the sink then you'll need at least four rooms. One to live in, one to cook in, one to pee in and a hallway to connect them.
Been there done it twice.
The thing is, at least you start off knowing *everything* needs doing. You budget the time and cost of doing so, you do it to your standard.
Having also bought houses that are 'done', you soon discover cheaped out plumbing and dodgy wiring behind new plaster and a lick of paint.
(Our first house was bomb damaged still from WW2 in Sheffield. By the end of week 1 you could open front door and see cellar below (no floor, due to rot), look up and see the structural work being done, and look right up and see no roof on the place.... We lived 2 months in a single room with a microwave and bathroom across the hall while the builders gutted the place - we event covered the door with a curtain to keep the dust out our room...)
Sometimes its better buying a project as you know theres no hidden horrors…
This. We've built our own place and done a big refurb. On the refurb the stuff that wasn't ripped out and redone was always a compromise. the electrics weren't bad enough to need a rewire but they'd been done 20 years before, cheaply. The same with the heating.
Go for it. Do it properly, insulate it well.
If you can get it gutted, re wired and re plastered before you go in it'll be much easier. Appreciate this isn;t always possible but it really is much better than living in shit for months. I knwo this, as I'm doing it now and it's getting on my tits now!
You can fit bathrooms and kitchens while you're in and redecorting is easy, but get the big shitty stuff out of the way first if you can.
To add: the second one we did had bakerlite switches on the wall, three layers of carpet everywhere and a 1950's/60's feel to everything, the owner had moved in when she was married in 1930's as the second owner. We bought it in 2006 as she moved into the care home aged 97!
The finest day of all the effort was inviting her and her family (all of whom had grown up in the place) back to see what we had done. A dusty day...
Did it with a friend when we were in our mid 20s. Previous occupants were chain smokers, coal back boiler, unchanged since the 50s.
Carpets came out on the first day, walls sugar soaped repeatedly over the coming weeks then painted over when clean. Central heating tool about a year for us to get around to fitting.
For 2 blokes in their 20s it was a laugh, older with a family I'd either not do it or line up all the trades and live in a holiday let whilst it's done.
My new next door neighbour has just done something similar (but without the smoking). The house was unoccupied. He negotiated with the vendor to allow him to do the work in the month before completion. Plasterboard was replaced with insulated board, new central heating including boiler, new bathroom and shower. He's only got to do the kitchen now that he's moved in. Helps that he manages commercial builds and refurbs so had good trades that he could trust. Not sure how he protected himself contract wise but I suspect it was something along the lines of the vendor agrees to pay for the renovation unless the sale goes through.
I think if you have the time and money for it then could be a good project. I think where these things can go wrong is the "opportunity cost" side of it, i.e. what else could you use the time for and it is that more important?
Our previous house needed loads of work, which realistically we could never do with changing family circumstances. I would have had to spend every evening and weekend at it and that would have meant missing loads and loads of stuff with the kids.
If your budget buys that house in that location I'd go for it at the right price.
The right price for me would have to leave enough for the work to be done quickly with a healthy surplus for when something goes over budget.
My wife has refused to consider several houses in a less bad state because of the disruption. They have all gone up in value by a third after someone has done them.
If you can get the trades in a decent time frame or at the same time you could be done the disruptive stuff in a month or two.
Rewire and replumb 2 weeks
Replaster all the rooms you aren't in 2 weeks
Pause for the plaster to dry/ Kitchen+ bathroom 1 week.
Repaint 1 week.
Pause for the paint to dry
Carpets a few days.
Two months disruption compared to the length of time you live there.
I'd be doing the above if I could persuade my wife of this. I've almost got her to agree to go and stay at her folks for a couple of weeks while the rewire, plumbing and replaster get done, now I can't find the right property!
For 2 blokes in their 20s it was a laugh, older with a family I’d either not do it or line up all the trades and live in a holiday let whilst it’s done.
It's just me and the missus. We're downsizing after all four kids have all flown the nest.
I think if you have the time and money for it then could be a good project.
I don't mind doing the donkey-work myself, but unfortunately, I work for myself and am phennnnnnnnnnomenally busy right now. And will be for the foreseeable. Have also discovered it's very hard to find good tradesmen round these parts. They're booked out 6 months in advance.
Can't help but think it's a bad idea.
See my contribution to london property thread. Ate off electric rings and takeaways for a month. But was young, don't remember it being too bad and got us ahead of the game. Did it again with a place on the coast, not living there (see 'ahead of the game') but still did a lot of the work myself. Christ knows why, it's knackering. Never doing it again.
We did the same.
Early 70's house originally built from Cornflake packets and apathy.
Had a great builder, we lived in one little room and then moved upstairs when that was done.
New interior walls, wiring, windows, heating, floors, roof.
Pretty much everything. We did what we could.
Cost about £50k in total, took six months and my nerves were shot.
Worth it though, considering the asking price.
Wouldn't do it again, mind.
I have done it. a 1920s semi that had had no work done on it since the 50s. we bought in the late 80s and did not just a refurb but a restoration. Full wiring , plumbing, kitchen, damp proofing, restoring all the stained glass and woodwork
It took all my spare time for 2 years. 40 hrs a week at work, 40 hrs a week on the house. Highlights include a christmas with no kitchen. I actually worked myself into exhaustion i did most things myself only using pros for checks and gas fitting.
Everything will take twice as long as you think and cost twice as much
would I do it again? Yes if i was in my 20s again. Not now
me and MrsRNP totally gutted a two bed victorian cottage. You could see sky and clouds from the ground floor at one point. Took me 5 years mainly because we moved in with the parent in laws and they made us too welcome!
Wouldn't do it again
I have just seen one on rightmove a bit similar, what puts me off is the lead time for trades. I m getting a roof done on a relatives house and we were quoted 6 months, now a further 2 so just getting good trades in will be a nightmare.
I d be tempted if priced appropriately, I d put a static in the garden as it will take twice as long and cost twice as much.
If you can get it gutted, re wired and re plastered before you go in it’ll be much easier.
and those jobs will likely cost a bit less if the trades can have free reign at it without you and your stuff in the place (as it will save them time).
2 months might be enough - price up 2 months in an Air BnB (plus storage for your possessions - removal companies can normally do it) or even 6 months in a cheap rental flat nearby and look at it as part of the total cost of the renovations.
Done it twice - the first had been empty (apart from being used as a winter home for sheep) for almost 100 years, the next was a new build in 1985 and still had the original interior from then (we bought it in 2014). It’s fun if you don’t mind the hassle - and you get to make it how you want it.
Yep, been there, done that.
8 years ago we turned a 2-Bed bungalow (which hadn't been touched since the 60's) into a 3/4 bed house, so dorma loft conversion and 3m deep full width rear extension.
I think only 2 exterior walls and 2-3 interior walls remained.
As long as you're not living in it at the time its quicker/easier than you think.
I suggest re-plastering is going to be needed anyway if you're doing re-plumbing/re-wiring.
I think the hardest/dirtiest job will be the rip out - chasing plaster off the walls is a horrid job, but once its done, new plaster/etc goes on pretty quick especially if you're lining with plaster board and skimming.
You can also make it exactly as you want - lighting/outside sockets/network cabling/alarm cabling/etc
Would i do it again? Yes, as at least i know where every pipe and wire goes, there are no hidden horrors, and we know/can plan for things needing doing again.
We took several years to do ours with 3 young kids; completely gutted a 60's wreck, knocked down extension [and rebuilt], dodged around making rooms habitable. Kitchen and bathroom both outside for a while. The thought of running into the garden for a lukewarm shower in Oct/ Nov still makes me smile. Wife and I slept on kitchen floor for a few months.
We were fine throughout, have the house we wanted now. No meltdowns, family breakups etc we just got on with it. My wife project managed and was great. Trying to negotiate Corona would have been painful so I'm pleased we did not have to deal with that.
Did it, lived in it got the mortgage paid off in an area I shouldn't be able to afford to live in.
Get a big cheap tent your bed fits in so you can have a nice clean dust free space to sleep in and crack on.
We did it 25 yeas ago in this house.
One family from new, they were here 40 years. At the end, just the old lady was left. We found out she was incontinent. You dont notice these things when you view the property!
We stripped everything out in the first 2 weeks, then gradually refurb'd it over the next couple of years. Ended up with just what we wanted.
Once it is stripped out, and cleaned, it gets better.