Broken Car, is this...
 

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[Closed] Broken Car, is this warranty issue?

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Mrs S has a Land Rover Discovery Sport, it is 16 months old. When she bought it they gave her a fancypants box with Land Rover logo tyre valve caps.  I went to top up tyre pressures today and the fancy pants end cap was stuck on to the valve, it appears salt ingress has corroded the valve and when I tried to unscrew it the valve snapped clean off. One very flat tyre.

No spare tyre, no get home tyre and major ball ache.

Do you think this is a warranty claim for Land Rover to sort out? There are still another three valve caps on which will need sorting as well as the broken valve.

If I need to sort it myself what sort of ££ am I looking at for a new (pressure sensing) valve?

Ta


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 7:33 pm
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Yes.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 7:35 pm
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It's a bit shit

however

when did she last check pressures ?


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 7:39 pm
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No spare tyre.? Really!


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 7:42 pm
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Automatic tyre pressure monitors so car tells you the pressure. The caps have never been off as the tyre haven't needed inflating before.

A quick google suggests the valve snapping is a common issue, but usually if you use metal end caps. The LR supplied ones were plastic.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 7:48 pm
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Nope, not even a wheel jack. The all over adventure car that will drive you across continents, so long you dont get a puncture.....


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 7:49 pm
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Its a Land Rover. They break.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:08 pm
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Yep, I accept that they break. I'm just curious to know if this is likely to be at their expense or mine!


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:09 pm
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isnt a spare a legal requirement?


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:10 pm
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lots of cars don't have spares. Just a plug in pump and a bottle of tyre jizz.  My s-max didn't have spare.

I tried swapping the wheel with the spare from my car. Same tyre size, same number of bolts, all just a fraction too far apart. Apparently no such thing as standards......


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:13 pm
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I think tyre pressures are your responsibility as is checking the valve caps aren't corroded. Would you take your bike back because the valve cap got stuck and you broke the valve? It's probably salt from car wash products that have welded the caps on anyway.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:13 pm
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isnt a spare a legal requirement?

No.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:14 pm
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*isnt a spare a legal requirement?*

Nope.

Hell there are even some nutters that believe an AA cover is adequate substitute

And some company cars have had spares/foam.etc  removed thanks to health and safety Nd insist on breakdown call out. .


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:15 pm
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I" tried swapping the wheel with the spare from my car. Same tyre size, same number of bolts, all just a fraction too far apart. Apparently no such thing as standards……"

Probably good it didn't fit as unless it's a very big car it would have been rather drastically under rated for your discovery and you'd likely have been replacing a tire and a valve.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:16 pm
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No. Both the Galaxy and Touran had no spare.

But we did have gel and pump.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:19 pm
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My car is a Santa Fe, identical tyre size.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:20 pm
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It's the wheel specs that need to be the same, offset,  hole spacing etc that you need to check, not the tyre size.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:26 pm
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it didn't fit anyway so no issue.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:46 pm
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Land Rover Discovery Sport

🤣🤷‍♂️🥊💄


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 8:51 pm
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This is quite common with the metal fancy dust caps. They provided them and need to sort it out.


 
Posted : 09/09/2018 10:48 pm
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I made a big mistake with my previous car, buying fancy metal valve caps. Being in the 'check tyre pressures annually rather than before each journey' camp the next time I went to check them I couldn't unscrew the caps. I got lucky and managed to mangle and deform them enough with pliers to eventually pull them off without breaking the valve - only ever used plastic ones since though. I can't see it's a warranty issue myself although I guess borderline if they supply the caps (assuming they don't also supply advice about checking them regularly or greasing threads etc.).


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 8:13 am
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Being in the ‘check tyre pressures annually rather than before each journey’ camp

With sensors in the wheels I imagine few people check the pressure very often.

i thought tyres and wheels were not covered by warranty. Much like bumper to bumper does not include the bumpers in the small (but should be said in the sales paper work in writing and orally repeatedly) print


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 8:26 am
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If I need to sort it myself what sort of ££ am I looking at for a new (pressure sensing) valve?

I had to have the metal valve stems replaced in two of my wheels as they had corroded and leaked where they sit in the rim. £90 just for the new stems & fitting from a mobile fitter. When the next two failed I found the parts spec from the fitter's invoice and bought them online for £20, local tyre shop fitted for £20.

With sensors in the wheels I imagine few people check the pressure very often

True, but may be a mistake. AFAIK the car doesn't check the pressures against a nominal value, as pressure changes significantly depending on tyre temperature. All it does is check that no single wheel is seriously low compared to the others. Several stories of hire cars where all the tyres were soft but the TPMS didn't flag.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 11:48 am
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Some cars still have individual transmitters in the valve stems. Tyre pressure monitoring from the ABS sensors has come on the last 5 years, most newer systems can detect under inflation in all 4 tyres through unpleasantly complicated linear algebra.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 12:01 pm
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Sounds like it lacks fitness for purpose. Give it a go. Probably the cheapest land rover warranty claim ever (standard valve & balance must be all of £10?). I'd expect the engine to lunch itself on the way back from the garage.

Pirelli used to do sensing valve caps. They were utterly, utterly crap. Mine constantly said everything was under-inflated & would only turn green if I jammed about 50psi in each.

Next round of homologation regs will require TPMS to be standard on all vehicles (afaik to also include SOS auto call and radar/front assist). Cheapest way to do that is to use the ABS sensors & work out the speed differentials between wheels. American DOT regs are more stringent and require piezo-electric pressure sensors/transducers  in the wheels themselves. But then they're expecting mr or mrs extremely stupid at the wheel.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 12:37 pm
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From my experiences they will probably reject the claim, warranties generally don't cover what you'd expect them to.

You'll probably get some kind of goodwill gesture instead, especially if it's a known issue.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 12:58 pm
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"Next round of homologation regs will require TPMS to be standard on all vehicles"

this happened in 2014......


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 1:19 pm
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Tyre pressure monitoring from the ABS sensors has come on the last 5 years, most newer systems can detect under inflation in all 4 tyres through unpleasantly complicated linear algebra.

My ancient system compares wheel revs vs expected road speed for those revs, based on what it "learned" as OK when you set it. Works when any or all fall below spec. I'm sure that doesn't qualify as unpleasantly complicated though!

I still check my pressures regularly though, I'm told the tyres have to lose 30% of pressure before the car decides you may have a problem so it's a bit too crude to rely on it detecting anything but fairly serious puncture. By design no spare, pump or goo anywhere on board.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 1:41 pm
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My car would fire up the alert when the pressure in any tyre gets to 26 psi. The recommended pressure is 32psi.

slightly posher cars show the pressure in each tyre.

as a lazy person I also buy run flats to give me a bit of an extra buffer


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 1:56 pm
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Land Rover collected the car today and are replacing all valves under warranty. Car won't be ready until tomorrow so they are offering a courtesy car. Hopefully it will be like the last one, a top spec Disco 4.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 3:05 pm
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good result .

i am surprised pleasantly .  Land rover are usually quite good though when it comes to warrenty i guess they are used to it 😀


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 3:31 pm
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My wife has just ordered a discovery sport. You can have a spare wheel, you just need to spec it.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 10:01 pm
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<div class="bbp-reply-author">trail_rat
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“Next round of homologation regs will require TPMS to be standard on all vehicles”

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this happened in 2014……

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Friend had a sensor go on his Citreon Picasso, pretty average car, nothing fancy. Luckily it was within warrenty as the dealer said it was £1,200 worth of work to replace the sensor!

My £3.99 gauge does the same job.

With them now being compulsary due to some stupid EU regulation I can see myself in 10-15yrs time when I'm buying stuff which has to have them scrapping an otherwise perfectly good car because the pressure sensor doesn't work, a £1k bill on the current one would be it's death knell (Having one and it not working is an MOT issue).  They claim that correct pressures reduces carbon dioxide emmissions (which it does a bit) but I expect that this is more than offset by scrapping a perfectly functional car and building another...

Also means you have to go to a dealer and have the sensors reprogrammed every time you change wheels, twice a year in my case as I swap summer/winter tyres around, turning a 60 minute job into a major ball-ache.

.

Progress?


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 11:09 pm
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With them now being compulsary due to some stupid EU regulation I can see myself in 10-15yrs time when I’m buying stuff which has to have them scrapping an otherwise perfectly good car because the pressure sensor doesn’t work

That's not what's happened. The homologation regs will simply state that the vehicle just needs some method of warning the driver when a tyre has started to deflate. The vehicle manufacturer has several ways to do this. Either with a transducer in the rim (which, incidentally now cost peanuts) or by using the ABS sensors to work out when a wheel is averaging a significantly higher rotational speed than the others (indicating a loss of rolling radius through deflation). As all the sensors are already there as all cars have to have ABS and I think ASR, (though its a while since I read a recent bosch automotive handbook), this is purely a software implementation.

Your £3.99 gauge wont work at 70mph on a motorway, in realtime. That's the scenario they're working against - alert the driver, while they're on the move that there's a problem which could impact the immediate safety of the car.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 11:19 pm
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The homologation regs will simply state that the vehicle just needs some method of warning the driver when a tyre has started to deflate.

Mine has that- it starts driving like shit.

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Posted : 10/09/2018 11:27 pm
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With them now being compulsary due to some stupid EU regulation I can see myself in 10-15yrs time when I’m buying stuff which has to have them scrapping an otherwise perfectly good car because the pressure sensor doesn’t work, a £1k bill on the current one would be it’s death knell (Having one and it not working is an MOT issue).

The fail is for a warning light displaying.  its likely the warning light can be disabled, which even if the TPMS is faulty would not be a fail.   I'm sure those who work to keep bangernomics cars on the road will find a way!

Also means you have to go to a dealer and have the sensors reprogrammed every time you change wheels, twice a year in my case as I swap summer/winter tyres around, turning a 60 minute job into a major ball-ache.

I may be wrong - but I believe I can do mine myself, just with LOTS of button presses through the least friendly menu system in the world (I've not done it - but the manual implies that is what that setting does).  I'd be surprised if you can't do it with a decent diagnostics box that all garages would have - if its not available via the dash.


 
Posted : 10/09/2018 11:38 pm
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Luckily it was within warrenty as the dealer said it was £1,200 worth of work to replace the sensor!

Your mate or the dealer is chatting horse manure


 
Posted : 11/09/2018 4:12 am
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Also they were made compulsory due to the popularisation of run flats.

Many folks assessment of is it broke or not revolves round well it still drives doesn't ir.

Be for the sake of 300 quids worth of sensors I just let the light shine all winter long


 
Posted : 11/09/2018 4:15 am
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I may be wrong – but I believe I can do mine myself, just with LOTS of button presses through the least friendly menu system in the world (I’ve not done it – but the manual implies that is what that setting does).

I had a BMW M135i and the in-wheel sensors were £400/set. I didn't pay that for a spare set, which means I had a constant warning light all winter (well, November to March) making the system completely useless for 5 months every year.

My current, but older, BMW e91 has a different system that you can reset via the trip computer.


 
Posted : 11/09/2018 4:24 am
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The systems useless anyway seeing how long it takes to notice how long the sensors are missing completely. ....

I have the technology to turn it off. What puts me off is that it's one of those light that should light up during self test at mot. And I don't think it would if I disable Tpms.


 
Posted : 11/09/2018 4:27 am
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Last time I had my tyres changed it added about 120 for valves and sensors. On top of the 650 for the tyres. Non of the companies would replace a tyre without changing the valve but I could cut about 80 off for not changing the sensors.

on the plus side repairs were done for free and they replaced cave a sensor for free even if you didn’t buy the tyres from them.

I can imagine if the unit in the car goes wrong that would be expensive


 
Posted : 11/09/2018 7:13 am

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