British apples

I grow my own, sadly it’s only produced two this year. 🙁 The tree is a Cox’s, though, and it does produce very nice apples. I’m letting the two mature, while the weather’s still sunny. 😁

Apples have changed a lot since I was a kid - and for the better.

I grew up in Kent in a village called Loose (in a house called Bramleys). There was a Bramley orchard behind the house and a pear orchard in front (neither ours). Across the main road was a cherry orchard. All big, traditional trees. The trouble was that the business model of using east end factory workers on summer shutdown to do the picking for their summer holidays didn't work in the 80s.

A few miles away was the East Malling research station. They developed trees that didn't need ladders to pick the fruit and that developed more consistent fruit. These took over in the 90s. Flavour wasn't so good but it was competitive with the French and tastes as good as the imported French varieties.

The cherry tree orchard was grubbed out as picking from ladders was no longer economic or safe. The replacement cherries were grown on dwarf stock in tunnels which also meant no need for bird scarers / shotgun parties.

Fruit used to be stored in barns and by Christmas it was going soft. Chilled warehouses came in and then chilled inert atmosphere which meant year round apples of reasonable quality.

Traditional varieties will never compete in the mass market. Modern varieties on dwarf stock now taste good and are cheaper. The price to farmers still needs to go up but grubbing out orchards and replacing them with new stock is the right thing to do for the business. After all, that was exactly what the Victorians did when they planted the first modern orchards.

Mine have been terrible this year and same for the local community orchard.

Thought this was going to be about Waitrose:

Have two trees in my garden, they taste superb and have done fantastically this year. Partly the weather but also a concerted effort to look after them through the season.

Last year we juiced most but this year we picked out maybe 40 percent in the summer and the remaining fruit has increased massively in size. Also as fruit is not touching fruit, the apples are in super condition.

Currently devouring a divine apple, blackberry and blackcurrant crumble, all fruit from the garden!

That’s a good reminder to get out and eat all the apples.

New varieties chosen for how well they store taste pretty bland, despite what Murray says. They certainly don’t travel well (same varieties, just stored badly). So it’s the time to eat all the weird and wonderful apples you can find.

<span style="color: #000000; font-family: Roboto, 'Helvetica Neue', Arial, 'Noto Sans', sans-serif, -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol', 'Noto Color Emoji';">" Flavour wasn’t so good but it was competitive with the French and tastes as good as the imported French varieties."</span>

You can **** right off!

The Cox's Orange Pippin is the best apple in the world!

I agree! But said by a 3 star froggie chef....

Miss our old apple tree since we moved. Used to give great apples, some of the best I've ever tasted.

This thing about supermarkets saying customers only want standard or uniform fruit (or veg or whatever) is self fulfilling isn't it. Because if I mostly shop in a supermarket and they won't sell odd shaped fruit, well I can't buy any can I?

That aside buying British makes sense not just for our farmers but also minimising food miles, as the OP mentioned. Many alternatives in Tesco are from SA and NZ.

If you are anywhere near Evesham on the weekend of 6th-8th October visit The Fleece in Bretforton for the Apple festival. Morris dancing too on the Sunday (I shall be there).

This thing about supermarkets saying customers only want standard or uniform fruit (or beg or whatever) is self fulfilling isn’t it

Yes and it's bollocks as proven by supermarkets on the continent. Better still though, go to a market stall or greengrocers.

Long term, chemically enabled storage of any food before it hits the shelves is an abomination.

Modern varieties of apples are cheaper than traditional varieties - but that's the only 'benefit'; they certainly don't offer a better taste.

This ties into the/my wider concern about only eating what is seasonally available which includes considerations of food/air miles.

Wot - no strawberries at Christmas? Disgrace that is.

Brogdale Farm in Favesham, Kent, has over 2000 varieties of apple! (As well as cherries, pears, plums, quince, medlars).

Friend's farm that I used to work on in Kent, grubbed out the entire orchard, and now it's arable.
Mostly apples, but also plums and pears too.
Discovery, Worcester Pearmain (who wouldn't want a strawberry flavour apple?), Laxton's Fortune (so juicy it'd be running up your arm as you eat the apple), as well as Cox and Bramley and Howgate's all grubbed out.
The Czar and Victoria plums were briefly replaced by something the market wanted (Fuji apples rings a bell), but they didn't last. The local scout group had free rein to take as much of that grubbed out apple wood for their BBQ and camp fires. And the Comice/Conference pears went the same way (each of which I recall had a Williams pear branch grafted on).

All gone now. Would kill for one of those classic British apples that are no more.

The cold store was purely for Cox's, which get picked far too early I think, mainly for logistical reasons, cos the school holidays finish September, which was the end of availability of local fruit pickers, and somehow Cox's were marketed as the apple to have at Christmas. Would be much better if picked later, and eaten fresh.

Arable certainly reduces the faff and expense of getting seasonal workers. And the heritage varieties are kept going in a farm elsewhere in Kent.

Love British apples.

This is the type of story that needs the wider UK audience to know about. I'm sure if it was publicized there would be a bit of a fulore.

Its not just the eating of the fruit, it's fame is from converting it to its alcoholic variant.

Somebody tell the Daily Mail that British apples are dying out because we're importing them from the EU. They'd be all over that.

We have 2 wee trees in the garden.
A James Grieve (Edinburgh variety) been in 3 years now and we got about 100 off it. Various sizes. Quite sharp but juicy and refreshing.

A Bramley which only produced 8 this year (it's floowering season just catches the end of the James Grieve) but the largest was 445g.

I want to get a variety that can fertilise the Bramley with a similar flowering time and graft it on.

<p style="text-align: left;">There's a community orchard just down the road from me, a local variety which nearly died out dominates, (Warham Russet) but also some Hazel Pear trees that are also local.

We've got a young one of the apple trees in our garden, but it's still too spindley to support much fruit.</p>
The larger tree which was some cheap variety from Wilko years ago taste nice, but it's grown towards the fence so I really could do with taking it out and replacing,  but then I back to waiting a few years for a halfway decent crop. 🤷‍♂️

My dog steals all our apples. Dwarf stock. And the birds take the cherries.

Somebody tell the Daily Mail that British apples are dying out because we’re importing them from the EU. They’d be all over that.

That aside buying British makes sense not just for our farmers but also minimising food miles, as the OP mentioned. Many alternatives in Tesco are from SA and NZ.

From the Brexit day celebrations: British Brexit apple.

In Buxton every year there's an autumn fair with the 'apple man' (I haven't been for a few years). He sells about 30 varieties of apples, all British, all shapes and sizes and all delicious (bakers too). The supermarkets just want big shiny fruit that looks good on the shelves. The chap will let you sample and advise on storing.
As mentioned above some apples this year were looking ready too early but had 'white pips', meaning they hadn't got the sugars needed. Our own tree has only produced a few but they've been sweet with 'brown pips'.

A few years ago there was a bit of a strawberry rebellion, where supermarkets only sold the 'El Santa' variety. These were huge strawberries with no flavour, which bounced if dropped on the floor. Finally consumers realised and searched for better, sweeter, smaller varieties and supermarkets started selling them.

We need to reduce food miles, fight for decent home grown food, but, this might mean paying a decent price. I'd rather buy two teeny apples from a farm shop with flavour, than one huge watery perfectly round specimen from a supermarket.

@Murray you say the modern varieties taste good, is that a polite way of saying they don't taste nice or of anything interesting?

We planted, Egremont Russet, Worcester Pearmain, Cox and James Grieve in our garden, because it is so hard to buy good apples in a supermarket anymore.

There's a heritage variety that grows in a few gardens in our South Aberdeenshire Village,  no idea what it is but it has incredible flavour and a most unusual shape, heavily ribbed almost like a starfruit!

British apples (there are over 2,500 varieties) are some of the best in the world. If we the consumer don’t buy them and pay the correct price then we end up with ‘fluffy’ dried fruit from countries miles away.

Do we really need x2500 varieties!?

If you choose to produce a niche product don't expect the supermarkets to take it on. Produce what people want to buy and make some money, or sit and moan that no-one is buying your artisan Tudor variety that tastes like vinegar.

we've got a small coxs orange pippin, usually not ripe till the end of october... you couldn't even give them away as they look appalling misshapen, pale skin with small dark spot and rough "burghs". Taste amazing with fabulous texture once you've peeled them 🙂

Do we really need x2500 varieties!?

Do we want only a handful of varieties in the shops? Especially if they are pretty bland?

Think of breweries… they can all produce to the same taste and strength profiles, or we can have endless varieties.

Eschew the homogenisation of taste. It’s bad for small producers and for us as consumers. Let’s not make life monotonous and boring in pursuit of supermarket profits.

If you choose to produce a niche product don’t expect the supermarkets to take it on.

That's fine, there are other outlets available for "premium" products.

That’s fine, there are other outlets available for “premium” products.

So the growers should be making some money then. So all good.

Let’s not make life monotonous and boring in pursuit of supermarket profits.

Mass production involves the supermarkets - I'm not defending their way of business. But if you want to supply them they very much dictate the rules.

Think of breweries… they can all produce to the same taste and strength profiles, or we can have endless varieties.

The basic ingredients and process of brewing are the same though, and can be scaled or adjusted easily to suit the market. Beer A not selling, we'll not brew that again and try Beer B. If you've got an orchard of a specific apple varieties you are stuck with them.

We used to have an apple pie tree, it's now just an apple tree. We had that many, my neighbour used to come over and pick them, and in return we had a supply of apple pies, magic. She's unfortunately passed away, and, strangely, the tree hasn't fruited as well. We've got quite a few that we'll turn into crumble though.

Mine have been terrible this year and same for the local community orchard.

Same here - we bought the tree as a sapling and the first few fruiting years were very good, getting a fair few quality eating apples each year but last year, and more so this year, the fruit is rubbish and half the tree looks like it is dying. Maybe or maybe not related, but my chillies have steadfastly refused to fruit this year too – they have grown loads but still no sign of any tasty jalapenos. My tomato plants haven't done that much better either - again, gown loads but no bloody tomatoes.

We've got a small tree that produces crazy amounts of fruit every year. This year especially. No idea what variety they are, but they're very nice.

Problem we have is keeping the wasps away. half of them just get munched and then end up in the compost.

Any tips?

Great, I can now add to my list of worries whether Booths are going to stock russets this year...

I have put together a free food map of our village and surrounds

We have had over the 8 years I have been here
Greengages - only one year
plums - 3 years
Apples - every year but very good the last 2 years
Pears last 3 years
Blackberries of course
Some cherry variety im not familiar with but very nice
Black cherry bushes on the entrance corner of our local tesco
Hazelnuts
Sweet Chesnuts
Beechnuts

Almost nothing is harvested by locals so easy to make a season out of it

My Mrs who likes apples and pears and the like flat out refuses to eat anything because its 'not natural' - frankly staggering

I think its how you were brought up. My Dad would take us on rambling walks for miles to sample whatever 'free' food he'd found or been told about.

I've also just found his old Just William books which I must read again

Problem we have is keeping the wasps away. half of them just get munched and then end up in the compost.

Any tips?

When I was a kid we had an apple tree and a plum tree - we used to have a jam jar, partially filled with jam, a small wasp-sized hole in the lid, hanging from a branch. I believe things like meat and vinegar are good alternatives to go in the jar.

It's more of a modern apple but my local farm shop had locally grown Spartan apples that I used to absolutely love but I can't touch apples nowadays.

Maybe or maybe not related, but my chillies have steadfastly refused to fruit this year too – they have grown loads but still no sign of any tasty jalapenos.

Ditto! Planted loads and sod all fruit. Even "Basket of Fire" which is normally prolific has been very poor this year. I can only put it down to the prolonged grey damp weather through July and August. Oh, well try again next year.

Do we really need 2,500 varieties?

No, however many of these are for cider, or cooking. But, how lovely to have that much choice, yet the big named supermarkets tend to sell the same old 3 or 4 types.

The Cox’s Orange Pippin is the best apple in the world!

Fresh Egremont Russet or Worcester Pearmain are as good if not better if that's where your taste lies.

2,500 varieties means that the fruiting season is extended, they will all ripen at different times (see also strawberry and raspberry varieties that go through to October in some cases). Not niche but an environmentally friendly way of getting apples throughout the year with minimal storage faffing.

Golden Delicious, Royal Gala and Pink Lady have a lot to answer for the parlous state of our native growers.

Do we really need 2,500 varieties?

Yes we definitely do!

Different fruit have different tastes, ripen at different times, different growing habits and prefer different soils and climate.
Some are great to eat, some for cooking, cider or just crab apples.
We need the genetic diversity maintaining to ensure we can keep breeding and adapting apples to suit the local environment and changes to come.
For mass market apples we probably don't need all those varieties but they are more than just academic interest.
Local varieties are also worth seeking out as what grows well in Kent may not in West Cumbria or Cornwall.
We're lucky to have a few old trees in the garden. Our russets (probably not Egremont but could be an Acklam) look great, aren't great eating but are much better when dried than other apples. Find what niche you want and there is an apple for it!

Fruit is weird. Like, for years the most popular apple in the states was the red delicious, which has more in common with wax fruit than with anything you want to eat. Every part of the breeding was done to make it easy to grow, nice to look at, easy to transport without bruising, and to have a long shelf life. They taste like someone painted a turnip red.

But when all the apples you sell taste like turnips, that's what people are used to and what they buy. And even better, if most of the apples you sell taste like turnips, you can sell the minority that taste like apples for way more- even if they still taste like really bad apples.

Even in the not so sunny west of Scotland, apples are really easy to grow.

I've got three trees all different varieties. "Katy" which is a Swedish variety, "Spartan" which is a Canadian variety, and a traditional Cox. All give us lots of fruit, with Katy and Spartan being the most reliable.

They are pretty low maintenance, prune the tree in late Autumn and then thin some of the buds in spring so we don't have so much fruit that it pulls the tree down!

All the varieties are nice to eat and also great for cooking into a crumble. It's really rewarding seeing the tree blossom and the fruit grow through the spring and summer. I'd encourage anyone who has a bit of garden space to get a couple of trees.

Looked in Tesco yesterday - not a single apple from the UK (multipacks anyway - didn't check the loose ones). And that's a big Extra not a Tesco Local or whatever they are called...

For locals or visitors to the area, I can highly recommend Tenbury applefest at Tenbury Wells a week tomorrow, October 7th.  It's a small event with a really chilled, friendly vibe. Live music and some great cider. They usually have a display of hundreds of traditional apple varieties and you can take your own apples to be identified or juiced. Mrs Bloke has a stall there selling her art and I'll probably be helping or wandering around sampling cider. Say hi if you do go 👍

We’ve got some British apples from Aldi, grown in Kent and called “Zari”. They are delicious!

On this morning's ride we passed a huge house with their own orchard. A sign outside said 'free apples, help yourself', so we did :o)
I've just eaten a 'Laxbury', it was scrumptious.

On my ride yesterday, I came across a “wild” apple tree laden with lovely red apples. As it would have been rude not to, I filled all pocket space in my jersey. No idea what variety but delicious all the same. I will definitely be going back!

@blokeuptheroad mum has a tree in her memory in Tenbury Millennium orchard 🙂

A colleague has too many apples on his trees this year, so we volunteered bravely to help out...

We got very small crops of our dozen or so trees this year. I would reckon its a bee issue - whether it is weather related or thanks to our government's continued allowing of nicotinoids, there seems to have been less bees. I would think most trees would have been on their way to growing the apples before the really bad weather set in, but we didnt get a failed crop, just no crop.

Will be planting an orchard of my own soon.  Various heritage varieties of apples, pears, damsons, quince, cherry etc.

Supermarkets suck.   Frankly, if Spain can grow oranges and lemons at the side of the road in enough volume that locals can just pick what they want on the way home, we should be doing it with our native fruit.

egremont russets and Stilton, perfect sandwich

Supermarkets suck

Had lovely Victoria plums & green gages in my old garden, supermarket produce never gets close, tried to grow here but they haven't flourished 😕 would love to have a small orchard.

Even if there isn't room to have an orchard, most people can grow some sort of a fruit tree. Possible against a fence (in a sunny position). The tree doesn't have to be big, but it's best to go to a proper nursery who can advise.

I love spotting rogue apple trees in hedgerows on journeys. I always say I’m going to log each one and go back and pick some but never get round to it.

Stopped many a time in France at roadside rest stops mainly in Normandy (think service station without Greggs, Costa and a shop selling overpriced sweets and million candlepower torches) where for shade they have planted mini orchards around their picnic benches with apple, pear, cherry and plum trees that we’ve filled the campervan up with for our travels.

I grew up with a few egremont russet trees in the garden and a lovely red/ green apple a bit like one posted earlier in the thread. We loved eating them and would also be found round the village scrumping at times!

the evolution of the apple is fascinating if I remember they evolved along the Silk Road trading route from the east and got bigger sweeter and juicier as they came west. Think I read about it in a Roger Deakin book iirc.