[Closed] Birmingham pub bombings 40 years on .

The West Midlands Chief Constable seems to think so :

[i]West Midlands Police Chief Constable Dave Thompson said he welcomed the coroner's decision.

"West Midlands Police not only failed to catch those responsible but caused a miscarriage of justice," he said.

"I have said, and reiterate again, it is the most serious failing in this force's history.

"I understand families of those who lost their lives are frustrated, disappointed and angry.

"West Midlands Police will support this inquiry as we have done through the recent hearings by the coroner which determined whether the inquest should reopen. I hope the new inquest provides answers to families."[/i]

Strangely the BBC report has a relative of one the victims saying the police don't want the truth out and the report also says the police tried to argue the coroner didn't have jurisdiction. Hopefully the inquest will give some comfort or closure to the relatives and survivors even if prosecutions are unlikely

I can't see why the cops framed innocent (of this crime) people. That means they know that the guilty went free.
Something stinks.

I may be misunderstanding something here.

My understanding is that a coroner decides how the victims died, not who may have been responsible - in this case, unlawful killing. There can presumably be no doubt on that one.

Surely it's the job of the Police to actually identify and collect the evidence against the killers? I'm not sure why a coroners case is needed to pursue an unsolved mass murder?

zippykona - Member
I can't see why the cops framed innocent (of this crime) people

I can't see why the cops framed innocent (of this crime) people.

That was probably the notorious West Midlands Serious Crime Squad who framed people for pretty much all their major investigations and were disbanded as a result.

I can't see why the cops framed innocent (of this crime) people.

Because of public reaction at that time to IRA outrages in mainland Britain. This was an extremely serious escalation of The Troubles.

The public wanted, and demanded, speedy arrests and prosecutions. The police dutifully obliged, despite not having a clue who the individuals responsible were.

At best it can be justified by claiming that it helped to maintain public morale at a very critical time.

Although of course I'm not justifying it.

EDIT : Btw although West Midlands Serious Crime Squad was undoubtedly corrupt to the core they weren't the only ones involved - Special Branch and Birmingham CID were also involved. And in the case of the Guildford Four, another case of miscarriage of justice, the Met Police were involved.

"miscarriage of justice " - why do we call it this when the police beat confessions out of the innocent and then framed them for it? it was a crime not an error.

How would you like to describe the crime then? Most crimes have a name.

Is any good likely to come from having a new inquest after such a long time ?

The victims families want to know why the Police didn't open a new investigation, that's a fair question

Perfectly understandable, but to go back to my previous question, why does that need a coroners inquest?

[quote=ernie_lynch ]How would you like to describe the crime then? Most crimes have a name.

How about travesty of justice as they were stitched up and the decision an insult to justice

Miscarriage to me suggests the process worked well but unfortunately an innocent person was found guilty - inevitable in any justice system for some cases

This was not about that it was folk deliberately getting people incarcerated,

Miscarriage to me suggests the process worked well but unfortunately ......

Well it doesn't to me. I associate "miscarriage of justice" with a very substantial and extremely serious failure.

'The process worked well' doesn't seem to enter my head when I see references to miscarriages of justice.

I guess I could have said "And in the case of the Guildford Four, another case of travesty of justice, the Met Police were involved". However sometimes I like to temper my tub-thumping emotive rhetoric.

jambalaya - Member

Is any good likely to come from having a new inquest after such a long time ?

The victims families want to know why the Police didn't open a new investigation, that's a fair question.

I thought there had been a subsequent investigation and the police and cps felt there was no realistic likelyhood of anyone being convicted - fairly sure that would be outside the remit of an inquest in any case. The original inquest was opened and not completed, perhaps the relatives want some closure

According to somebody on radio 4 today the authorities know who really did it but unless they walked into a West Midlands Police Station and said " I did it " there is no chance of them ever being convicted .

Pretty sure that would have been Kieran Conway, former director of intelligence for the Provisional IRA, and now a criminal solicitor (or perhaps barrister, can't remember) in Dublin. IIRC he has said that you could look on Wiki and find out who did it. Although, since the Good Friday Agreement and subsequent peace process, it's highly unlikely they'll be convicted of it.

However, the victims' families deserve to have this re-opened to examine what the (then) corrupt West Midlands constabulary did wrong. Those responsible for the framing of the Birmingham Six, and those prison officers who beat the living daylights out of them while they were on remand still await justice. Questions about how much advance warning of the bombings the WMC had still have to be answered.