[Closed] Behavioural insights

"Nudge" state tactics would involve building fear around city centre shopping whilst promoting out-of-town sotores and car use so no young women felt the need to go into town anymore.

Why just young women? I don't see evidence of this?

No one agreed with you on the thread

No-one agreed with me when I first disagreed with the iDave diet either.

My whole point about these "nudge" methods is that they are aimed at making lots of people think the same way so that they can be easily persuaded (or manipulated if you see it negatively)

Junkyard. Some impressive conclusion jumping in there.

It's just a hypothetical example Kryton though I might have inadvertantly hit the nail on the head as to the long-term government/corporate agenda on how we shop and how to change our habits.

Junkyard - I applaud your tenacity on this but, like TJ, I think Edukator is unlikely to be educated about the way his behaviour and online persona come across by anything posted on here by us.

Edukator i was making a subtle point. Like the linked thread, here in black and white you focused on "young women". They may have been inadvertent but its a common theme here. What you are doing as WWW perhaps suggests is making yourself a target because of your apparent targeting of minority or subjective issue in your responses.

Perhaps try being a bit more PC/generic on your responses and it might help?

Guys, stop attacking Edukator. We get the point. At least some people have attempted to discredit him by relating his behaviour to the thread, retaining some semblance of topic.

There are suburbs in the US that have no pavements. I think this is an oversight more than a 'nudge' born from collusion between developers and car manufacturers.

Is it never tiring being the only one who is right when an entire forum is wrong?
Thank god it does not shake your self confidence or make you think about it.

There one of those dominating on the "other channel", I find it quite tiresome.

It's not an entire forum, Junkyard, it's the few that can be bothered to post on that topic.

History has judged that whole nations of people have been wrong.

Is it never tiring being the only one who is right when an entire forum is wrong?
Thank god it does not shake your self confidence or make you think about it.

Edit: should I have lied and said our guest is a young man, Kryton? My advice would have been the same.

You're jumping to conclusions, thinking you know what I'm thinking and putting words in my mouth again.

Political correctness is mainly a good thing,

No, it isn't.

It's very often un'PC to tell the truth. Any time telling the truth is actively discouraged is never good.

I will never succumb to being PC. I try to be as un-PC as possible as often as possible, just because I can.

Do you think Americans could be nudged into thinking car-free suburbs such as those being experimented in Germany and France are a good idea, Scuzz?

The "nudge" originator, Richard Hawley is very keen on "nudge for good" but recognises the potential for negative use.

Edukator - Member
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Edit: should I have lied and said our guest is a young man, Kryton? My advice would have been the same.

You didn't refer to your guest, you said "young women". If you'd have said "for example the young woman that is currently our guest" it reads much differently.

They way you wrote it as I suggested, implies you've selected a minority to focus your context on. Anyway, I'm not having a pop at you I'm just trying to highlight why perhaps in some circumstances others see your posts as certain way aka not giving you the benefit of the doubt. I'll stop now.

My whole point about these "nudge" methods is that they are aimed at making lots of people think the same way so that they can be easily persuaded (or manipulated if you see it negatively)

Your whole point is a fairly pompous attempt to characterise people who disagree with you as stooges of the nanny-state, while you apparently bravely stand up for freedom and justice. Except where you obviously don't, as in the example of emsz thread.

No-one ever said you can't use the word chav if you want to - I just reserve the right to argue it's not a great idea, especially in certain contexts. You however are dressing up your opinion as some kind of noble crusade against the crushing weight of PC, which is patent nonsense.

Given that the most popular newspaper in this country still has tits on Page 3, and many of the others regularly rail against the flood of immigrants sweeping our country, in what way has PC gone mad exactly?

I will never succumb to being PC. I try to be as un-PC as possible as often as possible, just because I can.

Did you read the Stewart Lee quote earlier? Are you telling me you go around telling women to get back in the kitchen, and racially abusing people, 'because you can'? What do you mean exactly?

I most definitely did refer to my guest and only in the singular form:

We have an exchange student staying with us at present. Before she went into town yesterday I suggested she remove her waist pack and put her camera and cash loose in her pockets...

Plenty of people agree with you on the iDiet stuff Edukator. I suspect that your impression that you're ploughing some kind of furrow of truth is something you're convincing yourself of.

If I'm leading a crusade it's one of awareness. "Nudge" is the latest way you are being groomed/persuaded/manipulated by corporations, and governments left and right. Are these methods fair when used on unsuspecting populations or should we teach future voters about them in schools along such things as propaganda, totalitarianism and other things that people need to be aware when considering their political, consumer and behavioural choices.

I don't view you as a leader of anything. Sorry.

[img] [/img]

8)

If I'm leading a crusade it's one of awareness.

Maybe you should start with a little self-awareness. Perhaps with some awareness of how incredibly pompous you sound?

Seeing someone get flamed for using the word "Chav" yesterday and getting flamed myself for feeling threatened by people who hide their faces in public it occured to me that this nudging lark really works.

The trouble is you've completely misplaced the target of your point. Who are we being 'nudged' by to be politically correct exactly? Advertising? The (mostly right-wing) media? The (right-wing) government?

Are these methods fair when used on unsuspecting populations or should we teach future voters about them in schools along such things as propaganda, totalitarianism and other things that people need to be aware when considering their political, consumer and behavioural choices.

You might have had a reasonable point if you'd just said this in your OP, rather than claiming to be a lone voice for truth and justice in the face of the stifling power of 'the man'.

It's not an entire forum, Junkyard, it's the few that can be bothered to post on that topic.

History has judged that whole nations of people have been wrong.

Edukator is a bit like kaesae...

Americans will see car-less suburbs as a good idea when they have no need for a car. Likewise, we see stable-less towns as a good idea as we have no need for a horse.

Nudge seems to be about small behavioural changes for benefit where there are few (if any) detrimental effects. How does this link to corporate agenda and government coercion?

crikey - Member
Edukator is a bit like kaesae...

You could be on to something there.

Have I just been nudged? Hard to tell not being able to think for myself!

Edukator is a bit like kaesae...

without the humour...

I would say that he's like Boris-- a serious joke .

CBA

🙂

Got 99 problems but a glitch ain't one.

For the love all things nudge-like !.

Won't anyone think of the Mods, those poor MODS !.

[img] [/img]

It's about preparing the ground for introducing what without the preparation would be unacceptable measures. I'm thinking about things like pension reform.

It's about demonising those who hold perfectly reasonable alternative view points but years of nudging have marginalised and made easy targets.

Would this point be a good time to mention the age of consent in Spain or the naked rambler only being arrested when in the proximty of a school? Britain has gone paedophile mad thanks to government measures, education department directives and media hype to the point it's almost impossible to organise a proper school exchange with the UK and car sharing (taking other people's kids to school with your own) doesn't happen because of the formalities involved and people not wanting to be in contact with other people's children that could falsly acuse them of anything. A general air of suspension and fear of being wrongly accused after years of nudging.

France is pretty laid back compared with the UK but my British experience made me totally sexist when assigning teachers to give individual classes to minors. Illegal but pragmatic - nothing to fear about admitting this "les faits sont préscrits".

I've resisted the pressure to be PC and to keep 3 toilets in my house.
I've just removed one of them and everyone thinks I'm mad for doing so.

Honestly ?, I don't know how I'm going to make it, now that I'm down to just two toilets. I guess theres just a part of me that can't help but decide to live dangerously.

8)

Japanese don't have that issue, one hole for all !

Britain has gone paedophile mad thanks to government measures, education department directives and media hype

Almost entirely down to media created hysteria IMO - which is motivated by selling newspapers. I fail to see how that has anything to do with being 'nudged' to behave in a certain way - it's fairly basic fear-mongering to sell newspapers, and the government has pandered to it.

A general air of suspension and fear of being wrongly accused after years of nudging.

I agree about the air of suspicion and fear but what is it you think is the agenda of those you believe to be doing the nudging?

You're jumping to conclusions, thinking you know what I'm thinking and putting words in my mouth again.

This is an accurate insight into your own behaviour, John.

[i]We teach best that which we most need to learn.[/i]

The similarities between you and Kaesae are in that you both presume to know what goes on in the mind and actions of others and nearly always that others aren't seeing things as clearly as you.

If you see so much - and you have demonstrated a reasonably good awareness over the years I've read your posts - what have you done to make alterations to the injustices you see other than type this kind of thing on various forums...?

[i]on various forums[/i]

Is that what is meant by the phrase "[i]sharing the love[/i] " ?.

Edukator - Member
It's about preparing the ground for introducing what without the preparation would be unacceptable measures. I'm thinking about things like pension reform.

Like the theory Stateside that 29ers were only introduced to get he masses to accept a different wheel size but he end game has always been 650B?

Edited to avoid being 'nudged'.

A good friend of mine calls me n***er as a nickname - the only folk ever offended are white and, seemingly, middle-class.

Is that because the only folk you interact with (or dare say it around) are white and middle-class by any chance?