Automotive Engineering Master's?

I can't speak to specifics as different degrees and industries but it's not uncommon for a Masters to be a minimum requirement. Has he looked at specific careers / companies and what the entry requirements might be?

Is it because there is a lack of graduate level posts in the sector, or does it provide access to better, more highly-rewarded roles? The issue with going too specialist at this stage in a career could be that it limits options later-on.
I don’t know much about the current automotive and autosport sector, but having worked in one of the UK’s largest engineering employers in defence and aerospace, we were reluctant to push graduates into too specialist a role until 2 years post-graduate as it gave them a chance to gain a broader understanding of the business and develop their ‘people’ skills - the most successful graduates were those that developed their teamwork and leadership skills.

My brother is an automotive engineer. He did mech eng at Leeds then masters in automotive at Coventry. Even with that he had to start with aerospace repair before moving to a T1 supplier. Then got into a major OEM doing localisation. Now in his second EV design job.

Does he need a masters for Automotive? I worked in Automotive for 10 years and there was always a good mix of those with Beng and Meng in graduate intakes.

If he can get in the door and has a real passion, not having a masters won't hold him back.

Is it because there is a lack of graduate level posts in the sector, or does it provide access to better, more highly-rewarded roles?

A bit of both. He didn't put enough effort into applying for positions early enough and is concerned he might have missed the boat this year. Also influenced by some of this years Master's students who have recently picked up some tasty jobs (AMG, McLaren), although not clear whether MEng was a deciding factor.

As above, not necessarily needed but every little helps. Assuming by staying on he is looking at MEng rather than MSc? Many I work with have MEng but hardly any post-grad masters probably due to the specialism issue mentioned. If he can get on a grad scheme I would steer him towards that as that should be a good route to chartership if that's a driver for getting the masters?

I studied Automotive Engineering at Leeds, graduating in 2005. At that time I think only 4 year master's degrees were offered to all engineering students at sign up, but you could opt to graduate after 3 years and take a bachelor's degree.

Is that a similar scenario for your son now? Is a master's degree an extra year of study, or an extra 2 years?

Is there a difference in funding and costs? Back in my day a second degree or master's would have less funding supported, and was therefore a fair chunk more expensive. I know I might be showing my age by asking this question now we are firmly within the age of full tuition fees.

Does he want to actually become an engineer in the automotive sector, or even become an engineer at all? My gut feel was that a large proportion of my cohort who left with a bachelor's degree after 3 years wanted to go in to a different sector. And from the 20 or so who graduated with a master's in auto engineering, I bet only a handful actually went in to the automotive sector. That was partly because the UK automotive industry was on it's knees at that time, and maybe things are better now. But also don't think that there is only one career path with that qualification, or that there are many careers that are anything like formula student.

For what it's worth I ended up doing food and beverage engeering projects, and quite happy to not be in automotive.

It's a MEng not MSc.

Chartership not the main driver.

The course is one extra year.

Trying to establish the costs and available support. This has come out of the blue this weekend!

He is Interested in working in the Automotive industry but not a deal breaker.

I blame IMechE for the MEng thing - they changed the entry criteria and made it the "standard" route to getting Chartered (but there are other options). Since then I've read of at least one Prof saying it was a bad decision and just causes more debt and funnels more cash into Universities for little student benefit.

I'm in Automotive test and development and find very little real world difference between BEng and MEng graduates. The most useful grads are almost always the ones that did a year in industry between year 2 and 3 - I'd value that above MEng but unfortunately too late for your son. It really depends on the role - in our case it is a mix of practical and well applied basic Engineering theory. Therefore we also look for things like Formula Student, designing their own things, restoring cars, tractors, Landrovers, whatever - just do SOMETHING to stand out and show interest and ability 🙂

There are currently a lot of well funded EV startups in UK Automotive, with more demand than supply of experienced Engineers. No idea if there are any Graduate schemes amongst all that - there must be something in place to back-fill as everyone jumps between new and established firms. Getting on the ladder is the hard bit - some firms have rather automated recruitment processes that can be a bit of a brick wall if you haven't scored in the right boxes.

I don't think my colleagues with BEng seem to have been hindered compared to my MEng. In fact in the early days (7 years ago), it tended to be people with existing experience who progressed fastest. Chartership is not an important factor in automotive ime so they're one step ahead in the decision if they've written that off.

I don't feel I used much I learnt in masters year (mech eng not auto) in anger, but it did expose me to a systems module that made me realise how much I like control engineering so I guess I'm glad I knew that and was able to push my way into the right department during the grad scheme.

Ps I'd echo that the ev startups are sucking up loads of people but would caveat that they may not have the structure in place for a graduate to develop as well as an established company. Equally they may get really stuck in and learn loads!

mwab - not my specialist subject but, for the sake of one further year of study and being able to afford the fees, I would say...do it.
This is what I would say to any of my children if they were in the same situation.

For one extra year I'd also say just do it. Easier now than later. It might not be required immediately, but it might come in handy one day, especially if working abroad.

Thanks for all the responses, much appreciated.

Automotive engineering technical lead here, depends what level and type of work he wants to go into.

Most of my last team had either MSc/MEng or PhDs, but that was in an advanced strategy and tech field, working with software and systems integration (you won't see what they are working on *now* for another 2 or 3 years, at least). I was the oldest in the team by 10+ years at 45 when i moved on. And also the least qualified.

Current team (where i am not lead, but an SME) is not as highly qualified (no PhDs), but no one with less than ~10 years auto experience. Most (like me) are at least 15 or 20 years in and have worked in multiple disciplines.

The hardware teams i've worked in tend to have a mix that is much more biased towards BEng/BSc level, still with a nice mix though, having an Masters will not hurt as you go forward, it'll let you get into more senior and interesting/responsible roles much sooner, and open up some roles that would otherwise be closed (I've not technically had a job in the last 15 years that i meet the educational requirements for! Interviewing in a t-shirt/hiking trousers obviously pays off...)

As some of the above have said, Chartered status isn't really relevant in auto now (it was when i started). So i'd not sweat that one.

Massive shortage of engineers where we are. We're recruiting globally. Think the graduate program intake is back up to about 300 a year at the moment after the COVID years.

@mert - do you know if there are any graduate opportunities at the moment?

Just double checked and they switched ours round, it's now Masters only and only 50 guaranteed spots a year in Sweden 🙁 Used to just be "graduates" before COVID.

It's also closed for 2022. Should reopen around christmas for 23.

Also got to bear in mind he'd have to emigrate (not that far though!).