[Closed] Autism and Blue Badges.

I might get a flaming here but hey ho...

We should convert all parent and child spaces to disabled spaces.
That way, people like you and your good lady wife would be able to park conveniently and at the same we'll remove some of the misplaced sense of entitlement that most parents seem to have
Win-win!

I’ve often thought that parent and child spaces shouldnt be near the front door of the store like disabled spaces. When they fill up, people seem to overspill into the disabled spaces, and idle people will park in them anyway. Move the parent and child spaces to the far end of the car park where nobody ever parks I reckon, that keeps idle people out of them. You have children and need space so you don’t ding other people’s cars, not a disability, so you can walk another 50 yards or so.

I totally get why someone with a child with autism or similar would need to use a disabled space though.

I also think (from experience) that there should be temporary disabled badges available. I’ve broken an ankle twice and that leaves you as much in need of a decent space near the door as someone with a permenant mobility problem. I’m also due to have surgery on my feet, probably both at the same time, which will put me in a wheelchair for a few weeks...... hopefully we’ll get away with using the parent and child spaces but I see no reason why I shouldn’t be allowed to use disabled spaces until I can walk again.
Just a thought.... 🙂

If they also give the blue badges out to Tourettess suffers it will certainly stop the number of people being challenged over their badges for fear of a tirade of foul-mouthed abuse coming back at them...

said sbob to the most antagonistic and disagreeable of mods.

I'll take that as a win, thanks!

I’ve often thought that parent and child spaces shouldnt be near the front door of the store like disabled spaces.

Me too.

The argument is that walking across the car park is "dangerous." My counter argument is a) design the car park with walkways so that it isn't, and b) if a kid can't be trusted in a car park with a parent supervising then it probably shouldn't be out of the house.

Has some "most obnoxious poster" competition got under way? I missed the announcement.

There must be some sort of spectrum for someone who'd post such an unenlightened view of autism on STW and not expect to be attacked from all sides.

I'll take that as a win, thanks!

I disagree.

if a kid can't be trusted in a car park with a parent supervising then it probably shouldn't be out of the house.

Just collected my remaining not ill child from school and had to stop in the road after a small child (with parent supervising) ran into the road right in front of me (she got an almighty bollocking LOL). Kids are like this - this is why supermarkets plan for them and their parents.

slowoldman - Member

Has some "most obnoxious poster" competition got under way? I missed the announcement.

Me me me me - or do I have to try harder?

My son is autistic, you wouldn't think it really unless you spent some time with him as he can come across quite 'neurotypical' at times.

But he's got no common sense, he doesn't learn from situations - he's the living embodiment of the 'doing the same thing and expecting a different result' thing (its got a proper name but I can't remember it now) and he get's easily and totally distracted. He doesn't have meltdowns very often any more, unless I tried to make him eat something with sauce on, which is a big plus, but the stress of just trying to keep him safe is exhausting.

Luckily for us he's at the very high functioning end of autism, normal school, pretty much fully communicative now, but we used to take him to group swimming lessons and there were some much more severely disabled kids that would have needed a blue badge. Can't talk, wheelchair bound most of the time limited vision.

Saying that no one with Autism deserves a blue badge is retarded in the extreme, one kid in the swimming group was far more disabled than a young person with one limb missing.

johndoh - Member

Just collected my remaining not ill child from school and had to stop in the road

Why were you walking in the road? 🙂

You don't have kids do you?

Just collected my remaining not ill child from school and had to stop in the road after a small child (with parent supervising) ran into the road right in front of me (she got an almighty bollocking LOL). Kids are like this - this is why supermarkets plan for them and their parents.

I do - does that make my opinion more valid in your eyes?

FWIW, I agree that parent and child spaces should be further away from the supermarket, preferably with appropriate walkways to be able to get to the supermarket. There's nothing stopping a child from running away from the parking space next to the supermarket into the carpark, so why is this safer than a parking space further away? In fact, those further away may be less dangerous as there's likely to be less traffic trying to park there. Parent parking spaces are (IMO) more about having enough room to manoeuvre your kids in and out of the car, and (if you have more than one child) having a relatively safe space for them to stand / sit in a trolley while dealing with the other children. Moving the spaces away from the shop would prevent the huge number of lazy gits without kids from using them for convenience.

As for the original topic: I'm 100% in favour of the issuing of blue badges to people with autism should there be a need for it. It's a broad spectrum and not all sufferers will require a blue badge, and I'm sure the issuing criteria will be imperfect and there will be people that should be issued one that aren't, and vice versa. However, if it goes a little way to making life easier for people that really struggle in day to day life then I'm more than happy to accept that a tiny minority of people might take advantage of it.

mattsccm - Member
I have taught more than a few autistic kids over the years and I can see some virtues for the very severe . However I see why people object. But equally I object to some use of normal badges. In many places parking is banned for quite sensible reason eg sharp bend, busy town, narrow streets, lots of traffic. It bemuses me and proves the stupidity of the system when the only people able to park there are those less able to deal with the hazards. Often infirm or elderly and not very fast thinking. A well meant but badly thought through system. As to child parking spaces, well, if its private land then its up to the owner but I personally would like to see the spaces given to the elderly instead who whilst not able to get a blue badge still struggle to walk across a large car park with loaded bags. If parents cannot keep their kids under control the little gits should be left at home. [b]No different to dogs.[/b]

POSTED 2 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST

Crikey, I never knew autistic driving dogs could get blue badges! 😯

so why is this safer than a parking space further away?

@prawny, intersting as our def. high functioning autism elder child is very food texture sensitive, soup and sauces bit no no, give him the right food and he'll demolish it with seconds to follow...

Even a "simple" trip to get him clothing is a military operation.

Surely you mean it's "literally a military operation".

Moving the spaces away from the shop would prevent the huge number of lazy gits without kids from using them for convenience.

I don't think non parents use them out of laziness.... I think its because they are wider and their car is less likely to get dinged isn't it?

trailwagger - Member

I don't think non parents use them out of laziness.... I think its because they are wider and their car is less likely to get dinged isn't it?

It's laziness at my local supermarket, otherwise they'd use the empty half of the car park.

Nah, ours hates food in all forms, wouldn't eat at all if he didn't have to.

It's a bleeding nightmare because he gets distracted it takes him ages to eat when the TV is on, but we tried having the TV off and he focuses on the food too much and starts gagging.

We're obviously just lazy parents though, autism is made up as an excuse innit. So lazy that Mrs P has to do 3 different dinners almost every night.

zippykona - Member
Smudge.No , feel free to enlighten me.
I still think the spaces should be for people who have reduced mobility.

Wow three pages. Think that’s enough enlightenment. Spotted your update on page 2 so,fair enough.

I have a perfectly able looking friend with a bowel condition that can make it really painful to walk, but you wouldn’t know it to look at them. The blue badge folk took account of this when giving her one. I park in the blue spots when she’s with me and has her badge. Get some funny looks occasionally.

johndoh - Member

Because the exposure to risk is [s]minimised[/s]

Lessened old chap.
To minimise we'd all walk. 🙂

Not sure if it's been mentioned but maybe it's time for a rethink of the symbol for disabled spaces, toilets etc. As has been pointed out not all disabilities are physical but i personally think the current symbol enforces a misconception that these are for wheelchair users.

Some toilets show this sign now but I can see that as an instantly recogniseable symbol the blue badge is good.

It just needs more education as to why badges are issues. As the OP shows.

[img] [/img]

trailwagger - Member
I have an Autistic son (and a daughter with Tourette's /adhd) shopping or going anywhere with them is extremely stressful and just plain hard work.

We don't have a blue badge as he is at the bottom end of the spectrum but I can fully understand people getting blue badges for children higher up the spectrum.

I thought being or not being autistic was binary and the 'spectrum' referred to an array of symptoms and behaviours. Your post above sounds more like the 'spectrum' refers to the extent of someone's autism, which I thought was a common misunderstanding. Happy to be told I'm wrong, you sound like you should know more than me after all!

Why aren't all these people with disability/illness using there E-bikes to get around?

Zippykona didn't mean to post the op on here. It was supposed to be part of his application to be a Work Capability Assessor with ATOS

My sister had a blue badge for terminal melanoma. Some days she was fine, others she could barely walk (and at the end she was not allowed to drive). One day she parked in a disabled spot, and the inevitable looks from the "she doesn't look disabled enough" brigade. So my other sister decides to challenge the scornful onlooker. Let's just say if he could have shrivelled up into the pavement it would have been a mercy!

She hasn't needed it for two years 🙁 , but when we had it, it was an absolute godsend.

i personally think the current symbol enforces a misconception that these are for wheelchair users.

Yup I’m not sure what spacehoppers have to do with disabilities.

TiRed - Member
She hasn't needed it for two years

Was sorry to read this, T-

Our lad who has learning difficulties had a blue badge up until a couple of years ago, when we were asked whether he could walk more than a certain distance, so he lost it.
He's not as bad as he was regarding being unsteady on his feet but he will still wander away unless you are next to him. Not always easy with three other kids getting out of the car. Plus the wife. 🙂
He's 12 now and try as I might he couldn't get the hang of riding a bike until he turned 11. Imagine that. 😯

I have a feeling that this is a publicity piece, I don't think we need to worry about disabled people getting away with too much yet.

gordimhor - Member
Zippykona didn't mean to post the op on here. It was supposed to be part of his application to be a Work Capability Assessor with ATOS

[img] [/img]

This was being discussed on the radio when I went out at lunchtime. The short section I heard consisted of disabled badge holders calling in to say "my disability is more deserving than your disability"

I switched it off as soon as I heard Jeremy Vine announce it.

He later had a piece on the menace of bell-ringing injuries to our teenagers.

I don't usually listen, is it always that Partridge-esque?

You don't have kids do you?
Just collected my remaining not ill child from school and had to stop in the road after a small child (with parent supervising) ran into the road right in front of me

Do these supervisors and their children not have hands?

When I was of an age to run into traffic my folks had me wearing reins. Couldn't run into the road even if I'd wanted to.

I'm still not sure how someone having a blue badge would affect the OP or indeed anyone else. Surely the only affect would be to other people with blue badges as slightly higher chance of their not being a designated space, so in general rule #1 all the way.

Do these supervisors and their children not have hands?

No. I didn't want the responsibility so chose not to reproduce.

I was replying to the "running in the road" comment rather than talking about supermarkets. However: Small kids in trolley, bigger kids "helping to push"? Secure kids in car, then worry about shopping? Reins, like I said in the other half of my post?

Anyway, as I said in the first place, the solution is better infrastructure. It'd be a piece of piss to fence off a walkway to a safe area away from the entrance, and it'd stop P&C spaces being attractive to the self-entitled in 4x4s who have lost the functionality of their knees.

the solution is better infrastructure.

No, the problem has already been solved - parent and child spaces aren't going away (and they're mostly used as intended anyway).

The outrage you feel when you see some **** without kids in a Range Rover use them is regrettable, but not really causing the supermarkets any problem.

I was replying to the "running in the road" comment rather than talking about supermarkets. However: Small kids in trolley, bigger kids "helping to push"? Secure kids in car, then worry about shopping? Reins, like I said in the other half of my post?

All doable, certainly, but all it takes is a tiny moment of inattention. Young children don't really appreciate risk, often don't want to hold your hand, and good luck trying to get a four year old to use reins.

ranso - reins are something imposed by the parents not a childs choice. My nephew was not allowed out of the house without them as he would run into traffic.

Interesting thread. When I first heard the news driving up M40 yesterday, I was initially against the idea and in favour of restricting to physical difficulties. However my mind has been changed by thoughtful and well argued points here. But having said that and given limited supply of parking places there will always be some form of hierarchy of needs applied l

ranso - reins are something imposed by the parents not a childs choice.

Gosh, you learn something every day.

Number18 — autism is now known as Autistic Spectrum Disorder which I guess answers your question?

I think that there's others on here who can answer better than me as to what that means for individuals who are affected.

Cougar - Moderator
When I was of an age to run into traffic my folks had me wearing reins.

If you were autistic that means you could be well into your teens maybe forever. Not sure that society is ready for adults on leads out during the day, save it for the bedroom.

My wife is 5ft tall and weighs 8stone, our son 6'2" and 14 stone- if he was autistic and wanted to 'go' having her tethered to him would barely slow him down.

I was replying to the "running in the road" comment rather than talking about supermarkets. However: Small kids in trolley, bigger kids "helping to push"? Secure kids in car, then worry about shopping? Reins, like I said in the other half of my post?

That's not really what parent and child spaces are for though, is it. You're into the realms of disabled spaces.

Hold the front page kids - I'm here! And it's almost like I was born for this thread!

Assistant Headteacher in an ASD Residential School - tick.
Got cancer in my heart, which resulted in open heart surgery - tick.
Used to work for NHS as a Cardiac Rehab specialist - tick.

Zippy - I'VE GOT ALL THE GODDAMN ANSWERS BABY!!!

ranso - reins are something imposed by the parents not a childs choice. My nephew was not allowed out of the house without them as he would run into traffic.

If you used reins nowadays you'd probably be arrested for denying the child its human rights or some other cack like that.

My son is on the autistic spectrum. He's very high functioning though and I could never envision a need for a blue badge for him. Saying that I wouldn't begrudge one for anyone with an autistic child if they thought they needed it.

I imagine the criteria for them are the same as for things like DLA, you get asked loads of questions on their abilities and you are deemed in need of one or not. Shopping can be a nightmare with my son but parking a bit closer to the entrance isn't going to help much at all.

I have considered getting a pass to cut out queues at Disneyworld and places like Alton Towers before as he's not very good at coping in those situations. I didn't in the end because again I thought we didn't need it and admittedly thought we'd be judged as his condition isn't very visible.

And for a bit of a light hearted take on the subject who else but Half Man Half Biscuit

If you used reins nowadays you'd probably be arrested for denying the child its human rights or some other cack like that.

Don't talk wet.

After my 1st 3 weeks of driving a minibus for the local council, taking people with all manner of disabilities to various places, I now know why a lot of people with autism/aspergers etc should be allowed a blue badge!

I have considered getting a pass to cut out queues at Disneyworld and places like Alton Towers before as he's not very good at coping in those situations. I didn't in the end because again I thought we didn't need it and admittedly thought we'd be judged as his condition isn't very visible.

Can't comment on AT, but Disney are [i]exceptionally[/i] on the ball with this sort of thing. You wouldn't have been judged by any of the staff at least. You might have got a few grumpy tourists I suppose but, who cares, let 'em be grumpy.

I'VE GOT ALL THE GODDAMN ANSWERS BABY!!!

Give them us baby!!! 😯

Disney are exceptionally on the ball with this sort of thing.

Yes, it's the other tourists that I was thinking about. Saying that we're pretty used to judgemental adults, seven years at primary school without being invited to parties, play dates, sleepovers etc has given us thick skins.

I think you're missing something with Parent & Child spots too - liability on the shop. If the parking area were further away, even with a safe walkway (I have never ever even seen an attempt to do this, though it does make sense - wouldn't be popular mind) sooner or later there would be an incident and the distance would be used against them I expect.

I have 3 boys and unbelievably every now and then I let something slip. Difficult to believe I'm not perfect I know. Have seen them do things like step back in to the path of a car (usually driving too fast) and I've dropped bags and grabbed them back out of harms way (and usually get an earful from said driver who gets my compliments on his driving skill by return). There are studies that showed how narrow kids visual attention - they have poorer peripheral detection until surprisingly late - that explains an awful lot of what looks to the grumpies like 'mucking around' or 'bad parenting' - they simply don't see the danger.

If you used reins nowadays you'd probably be arrested for denying the child its human rights or some other cack like that.

I find if you attach the reins to an extendable dog lead, you can get round this....... 😈

reins are something imposed by the parents not a childs choice. My nephew was not allowed out of the house without them as he would run into traffic.

My wife had all kinds of fun with our twins when they were on reins.

It was like the scene from Empire Strikes Back where they bring down the At-At, only in Morrison's car park in Barnard Castle rather than the ice world of Hoth.

johndoh - Member
Disney are exceptionally on the ball with this sort of thing.

Agreed - our autistic friend's family get queue jump passes there and I can see why – she couldn't stand still long enough to queue so it's the only way the family can go and enjoy it. They go quite regularly too (Euro Disney) as they find it so much easier than at any of the UK attractions.

The Merlin parks are good on the whole too, we have always had ride accesses passes as there really wouldn't be a point going otherwise. On the busier rides you get given a time when you can go on your next busy ride so you don't go on any more rides, you can just wait in a more open space, and not in somewhere horribly overstimulating like a theme park queue. There's no way my eldest would be able to cope with the queue for Thirteen at Alton Towers for example, but he enjoyed the ride fine.

ASD isn't like not having a limb. Or being paraplegic. Or weighing 400lbs.

Except it kind of is. The way my students have explained it to me is this. Imagine the worst feeling on Earth; fear, terror, extreme physical pain, high pitched noise, whatever. Multiply the brain stimulus and subsequent response to all of these fight/flight responses by ten. And then try to explain it to a cat. In Swahili.

For each of us, there is something that gets your goat, so to speak. For me it's spiders; I have an uncontrollable flight response to them. That isn't altered by everyone I meet, telling me (and later shouting in frustration) that spiders are great - regardless of how credible those individuals are. I just ****ing hate spiders, and anyone standing in my way will be levelled as I exit via the door, roof, wall etc. Irrational, but that's how it is.

Everything is amplified when you have a SOCCOM diagnosis, purely because you cannot explain how you feel to others. Even when you do, via C & I interventions, task boards, etc, people still don't understand the urgency or pain around a situation/issue. So then the labels come out - poor behaviour, disruptive, lazy - and a myth begins. Don't get me wrong, behaviour is part of it. But even as a former professional Rugby player, I'm telling you that trying to get a young person with ASD from a car into a shop when something has affected them is harder than putting your arm up a cats arse.

And quickly on the other two points; blue badge for open heart surgery? I don't even have on for chemotherapy; I'd be embarrassed! And previous guidelines back in the day for cardiac patients was to get off their arses and move about as quickly as possible if they didn't want to die !

Really well put Bullheart - I have plenty of years experience working in Autism too, and would wholehearted concur with your explanation.

Hopefully rather than flaming people who don't know about Autism, threads like these can be used to inform people what it's like, and what a difference simple things like being able to park close to things makes for someone with ASD and their carers/family.

Would be interesting to know if Zippy is still reading this and would stand by some of the earlier statements. Not after a flame-job, more interested if opinion has changed or not after reading this thread.

I have family members at various points on the spectrum, including a neice with learning difficuties through it. She's awesome, but i can see how hard it is for my sister, BIL and her twin brother to live with it

It was supposed to be part of his application to be a Work Capability Assessor with ATOS

morphio - Member

But honest question, wouldn't that mean no longer driving?

We're getting me a blue badge, for my mum with COPD and my blind dad. Neither drives but they get driven. Though I think I'll not often use it in practice, it's usually practical to drop them at the entrance then park.

Disclaimer: I have no problem giving blue badges to ASD folk.

NSFW 😀

Help me out here as someone who has neither an opinion or clue.

- I've read on here it can be a nightmare getting ASD kids out of the house
- I've read that it can be a nightmare getting them out of a car and across a car park
- I'm not sure that I've read on here what does or does happen once inside the place the car park serves (shop, restaurant, museum, park) except that queuing (as per Merlin/Disney posts) can be challenging

Is this a 'marginal gains' thing where a every small amount of benefit helps or is this so controversial because as British people we like to get wound up by car parking. It seems to me that if you have an ASD child, then on a daily basis car parking might be low down on your list of things to care about. Or is there really a strong correlation between the structure, nature and schema of car parks that rattles ASD people?

I'm no expert but from what I've observed with my son is that people with ASD get very anxious very quickly about things that other people don't. In a way we'd see it as irrational, and before my son was diagnosed I used to get very frustrated when he'd refused to do things that seem to me to be for no rational reason, this wasn't crossing a busy car park but very well could have been. So no, it's not the car park per se, but more what a car park may trigger.

If by marginal gains you mean, and pardon the terrible supermarket based punnery, 'every little helps' then you're right. I approach things in a pick your battles way. Some I know I will not win so avoid, if it's unavoidable then I would seek help, and if that meant asking for a blue badge because parking was a constant battle then I would.

ASD isn't like not having a limb. Or being paraplegic. Or weighing 400lbs.

Except it kind of is.

I'm nowhere near that bad, but yes, that's very well put. It's one of the problems with spectrum disorders, on a scale of 0 to 10 some people are at 1 and others are at 37. There's a joke of sorts, "if you've met one person with ASD, then you've met one person with ASD."

Is this a 'marginal gains' thing where a every small amount of benefit helps or is this so controversial because as British people we like to get wound up by car parking. It seems to me that if you have an ASD child, then on a daily basis car parking might be low down on your list of things to care about.

I'd hazard that all three of those things are true, in context with my previous post.