You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
some of you may remember from a couple of weeks ago we've been given a 46" tv that was originally bought in thailand. freeview is a no-no, so we're just in the process of acquiring a freeview box to plug in via hdmi. should be sorted by end of the week.
however, now we come to the audio. our uk tv has red/white plugs into the back of the tv from the amp, and then onto the speakers, so anything from the tv can be played with a good beefy sound.
just tried plugging them into the back of the thai tv and nothing. i think i may know why, but im not 100% certain. this is the back of the uk tv.....
the red and white plugs go into the RH side sockets.
i dont have as many sockets on the thai tv, so red and white plugs went into the only red/white sockets available, which lead to a big fat nothing....
now im guessing that those sockets are maybe just 'input' sockets, so a camcorder and suchlike can plug into it and play its footage through the tv. and the uk tv sockets are 'output', so the tv goes to the amp, and then onto the speakers. that right?
so...... is my only option for playing tv through speakers on the thai tv, to use the optical plug? ive seen them on things before but always assumed 'optical' is somethings to do with video, but maybe not. pretty sure the amp will have an optical too, so do i just need to get an optical to optical lead? is that as good quality as the red/white jacks?
if not i may just forget about the tv altogether, its proving a right faff to get it set up 😀
thanks
Get a 3.5mm to phono cable and plug in to the headphone socket.
If your amp has a digital input get a Toslink and connect to the Optical. That will also give you the best quality. Much better than your old red and white phone connection.
now im guessing that those sockets are maybe just ‘input’ sockets, so a camcorder and suchlike can plug into it and play its footage through the tv. and the uk tv sockets are ‘output’, so the tv goes to the amp, and then onto the speakers. that right?
Yup.
is my only option for playing tv through speakers on the thai tv, to use the optical plug? ive seen them on things before but always assumed ‘optical’ is somethings to do with video, but maybe not. pretty sure the amp will have an optical too, so do i just need to get an optical to optical lead?
It's "optical" as it's a fibre-optic cable, it carries sound. Also known as a TOSLINK cable.
is that as good quality as the red/white jacks?
I had to 😆 at this! The phono jacks are about as bottom-feeder as it gets. The optical is considerably better quality.
Simple option is to use the headphone out with a mini-jack to twin phono cable or an adapter.
Get a 3.5mm to phono cable and plug in to the headphone socket.
Don't do this.
If your amp has a digital input get a Toslink and connect to the Optical. That will also give you the best quality.
Do do this.
What Cougar said above. If your amp has an optical input use that as it will be the easiest and highest quality solution.
You might even find that the freeview box has an optical line out on it which would be even easier.
thank you very much, ive ordered the one from the link above.
a mate has said we can have their old sky box, so hoping thatll cater for our freeview needs using our old satellite dish.
thanks again
If using the optical make sure you are using good quality optical cable as the cheap stuff is rubbish and causes a large amount of error correction
bloody idiot, should have checked first. i was sure my amp would have an optical as its a pretty newish one, but a quick google suggests it hasnt. (bit of a faff to ease it out of the cabinet to have a look in the flesh)
so....... now ive ordered the optical cable, whats my best connection on the back of the amp for the best sound?
thanks
I'd perhaps be looking at phono out from the Sky box to the phono inputs on the amp, cut the TV out of the equation. Just looked at my Sky HD box and there's a SCART block on it, you can get a SCART to phono adaptor (note these are directional, you need OUT not IN). Fingers crossed you won't run into lipsynch issues.
Looks like AUX2 on the amp is a 3.5mm jack, you could possibly run this to the headphone jack on the TV in a pinch, though thinking about that makes my teeth itch.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/VTOP-SCART-Adapter-Component-Switchable-Black/dp/B01CV4MN7K
Better yet, HDMI with audio breakout. HDMI goes in, HDMI and phono goes out. This is what I'd do I think (in lieu of buying a proper AV receiver amp!)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Neoteck-Extractor-Optical-Converter-Splitter-DAC-1080P/dp/B01GH4MEYC
firstly i assume phono is the red/white jacks. secondly for a new amp, if we're taklking about red and white jacks which you say are the bottom feeders of the sound world, have i got a crap amp then? no option for a decent sound?
ive got a red/white to scart adaptor, but not sure if its the right direction, i use it into the tv from a camcorder. is that the right way for what i need?
thanks, as you can see, i know nowt about audio 🙂
EDIT: both typing at same time..... could you spoon feed me please? assuming a skybox freeview in the system, what plugs into what, and with what connectors?
thanks 🙂
have i got a crap amp then? no option for a decent sound?
Well, yes and no. You've got a decent amp in so far as it's a 2-channel analogue audio-only amplifier so you don't really need anything beyond phonos. In the AV world you need to carry more channels and higher fidelity signals - this is far more important with video.
ive got a red/white to scart adaptor, but not sure if its the right direction, i use it into the tv from a camcorder. is that the right way for what i need?
Is there a switch on it? If not then it might not work. Audio in and audio out are different pins in the SCART block.
Is there a switch on it?
no. it also says xbox 360 on it, and as i said, i use it into the tv from a camcorder. does that narrow it down?
assuming a skybox freeview in the system, what plugs into what, and with what connectors?
Assuming a Sky HD box, I'd go HDMI OUT on the Sky box > HDMI IN on the breakout box I linked to above. HDMI OUT on the box to HDMI IN on the TV. Phono on the breakout to phono on the amp.
You'll also need a Freeview card from Sky for the Sky box.
NB I'm assuming that the Sky box is your only source. If you're likely to be adding others (eg the TV's internal tuner) then that complicates matters.
You’ll also need a Freeview card from Sky for the Sky box.
whaaat? oh no 😀 i dont need a sub with them do i? how do i go about getting a card for nowt?
thanks
EDIT:
NB I’m assuming that the Sky box is your only source. If you’re likely to be adding others (eg the TV’s internal tuner) then that complicates matters.
no, the tv doesnt have an internal tuner, thats what started all this kerfuffle 😀
You need a viewing card for the box to work. You don't need a subscription for freeview (technically Freesat).
Your Thai TV has 2 HDMI inputs - so I would connect the Sky box to one of those - you then have a spare in case you need to plug another unit in (PS4, for example). If you need more, HDMI switchers are cheap and reliable.
I would then connect the optical out to one of these:
And then phono cables from this into the back of your amp.
The sound from "normal" TV will also get routed to the amp.
I'd start by just getting a 3.5mm to 3.5mm cable and use the headphone out in to Aux 2.
If you're not happy with the sound then start faffing about with optical/HDMI converters. But you might have sync issues due to the delay.
The simple solution will likely give you more than acceptable sound.
My TV goes in to my decent amp using the headphone out, it does the job perfectly well. The Optical input has my Sonos plugged in to it so not available for the TV.
Yes, I just come out the TV headphone socket (3.5mm) to RCAs (red/white) into a hifi amp. As stated, you could just go 3.5mm to 3.5mm. Never noticed any sync issues here...
You can just run the audio from the freesat box to the amp.
Buy one with phono audio out, but most do I think.
The other option is a scart to phono audio out, but it won’t be as good as it’s less direct.
@zzjabzz sync issues I meant can happen when using an external DAC, the time it takes to decode the signal can leave audio noticeably behind the picture. I had an old TV that had an adjustment to fix the issue, using the analog out you won't get the issue.
You can just run the audio from the freesat box to the amp.
Problem with this is that any other devices (dvd player etc) wouldn't go through the amp.
ah yes, thats a good point. i have a bluray player with all the apps we use (we watch a lot of netflix) which is connected to tv by hdmi.
thanks
firstly i assume phono is the red/white jacks. secondly for a new amp, if we’re taklking about red and white jacks which you say are the bottom feeders of the sound world, have i got a crap amp then? no option for a decent sound?
Phono cables are still the standard (unbalanced) interconnect for transporting high quality analogue sound. The use of phono's doesn't determine the sound quality.
What you can't do with them, is get multi channel audio down a single set, but as you have a stereo amp only, this doesn't matter.
Where you may be limited in terms of sound quality is that the TV will be doing the digital to analogue conversion, something which your amp would likely be better at.
right, some progress. after reading the above ive trawled through my 'spare leads' box and got a red/white to 3.5 jack and plugged red/white in amp (aux 1) to headphone in the tv. it works, i now have tv sound through my speakers. may not be optimal but a whole lot better than tv only sound.
now, firstly, is aux 1 on my amp (red/white) better, worse or the same as aux 2 (3.5 jack)? i could probably choose between red/white to 3.5, or 3.5 to 3.5 if it makes any difference.
i see the slight issue at the moment is no tv sound only for quick watching, or wife kids wanting to watch tv and thinking "whats going on, no sound from the tv!" and not realising whilst theres a 3.5 jack in the headphone socket then it wont play sound. only a quick demo of how the amp works i spose but id still prefer something better, which may happen when i get a sky/freeview/freesat box and can possibly go hdmi from that box to hdmi on tv. that sound right?
Assuming a Sky HD box, I’d go HDMI OUT on the Sky box > HDMI IN on the breakout box I linked to above. HDMI OUT on the box to HDMI IN on the TV. Phono on the breakout to phono on the amp.
so am i right in thinking aerial/dish goes to my freeview/sky box, then hdmi from sky to hdmi on cougarbox, then hdmi out of cougarbox to tv? and a separate red/white goes from cougarbox to red/white on amp? that right?
do i now have an extra problem because......
Your Thai TV has 2 HDMI inputs – so I would connect the Sky box to one of those – you then have a spare in case you need to plug another unit in (PS4, for example). If you need more, HDMI switchers are cheap and reliable.
im a bit confused by the hdmi inputs, i think i have 3. theres defo a labelled hdmi 3 on the tv, but when i go to source on the screen, my options just seem to be HDMI2 (blank), HDMI3 (blank), HDMI-CEC (my chromecast) and HDMI-CEC (bluray player).
the back of the tv defo has 3 HDMIs but theyre labelled HDMI input with 2 together, 2(ARC) (chromecast is in that) and 1(DVI) (nothing in it), then just a separate HDMI 3 over on the other side (bluray in that).
bluddy confusing for me let alone what it must be for you trying to make sense of what im trying to explain 😀
thanks for staying with me.
Having something plugged into the TV's headphone socket is muting the speakers so you'll need to unplug if not using the amp. I don't think there will be anything difference how you connect i.e. 3.5 to 3.5 or 3.5 to phono.
While the cougarbox will work, in that instance you will only get sound from the Sky box. If you look at my previous post about the optical converter - that will allow you to plug in of your devices into your TV - the sound is then fed into that box from the optical out on your TV.
Nearly all generations of Sky plus have a pair of Phono line level outputs on the back. Sorted.
If you're connecting other stuff to your TV then use the optical out from the TV through the £13 box someones recommended above.
It's really surprising how little connectivity modern amps have - given that yamaha has all sorts of digital trickery in it (CD, USB and FM / DAB radio to the latest versions of Wi-Fi, MusicCast, AirPlay® and Bluetooth®) I'm surprised there is no optical audio input, nor any form of output (optical or line level). All keeps the price down I suppose.
If you look at my previous post about the optical converter – that will allow you to plug in of your devices into your TV – the sound is then fed into that box from the optical out on your TV.
which is what i want, so thank you, ill order it. so, as a repeat of my 'cougarbox' post, i now assume then that id go aerial/dish to sky/freeview box. then that box to my tv via hdmi. then am i right in thinking its optical on tv to opticl on the new 'quagbox', then red/white on quagbox to red/white on amp. have i got that right?
and the good thing about this is that it doesnt matter what my freeview vehicle is, could be skybox, freeview or freesat, that just goes to tv any way possible, and the sound is completely separate as its tv to quag to amp, yep?
t’s really surprising how little connectivity modern amps have – given that yamaha has all sorts of digital trickery in it (CD, USB and FM / DAB radio to the latest versions of Wi-Fi, MusicCast, AirPlay® and Bluetooth®) I’m surprised there is no optical audio input, nor any form of output (optical or line level). All keeps the price down I suppose.
which is what fooled me into ordering that optical cable on the spur of the moment, i was sure the amp would have one. altho it looks like i can use it with my quagbox now.
thanks
It's not really designed as an amp though, more an all in one / hifi system. A modern stereo amp will (almost) certainly have optical in.
It's designed to provide people with all the sources they already want built in CD, radio, Bluetooth & streaming.
which is what i want, so thank you, ill order it. so, as a repeat of my ‘cougarbox’ post, i now assume then that id go aerial/dish to sky/freeview box. then that box to my tv via hdmi. then am i right in thinking its optical on tv to opticl on the new ‘quagbox’, then red/white on quagbox to red/white on amp. have i got that right?
and the good thing about this is that it doesnt matter what my freeview vehicle is, could be skybox, freeview or freesat, that just goes to tv any way possible, and the sound is completely separate as its tv to quag to amp, yep?
Yep, that is correct!
Is a £13 unbranded DAC really going to sound noticeably better than the TVs built in DAC?
can't help thinking this is fixing a problem that's not there......?
Nearly all generations of Sky plus have a pair of Phono line level outputs on the back. Sorted.
I have a Sky+ HD box, I checked earlier and it doesn't. HDMI, SCART and optical but no phonos.
Is a £13 unbranded DAC really going to sound noticeably better than the TVs built in DAC?
I very much doubt it TBH. We're not really in navel-gazing audiophile territory here.
So how come we've gone down the route of external DACs when all he needs is the cable that is already plugged in between the TV & AMP? And the potential for sync issues that might follow.
If using the headphone output on the TV, the TV is muted which might confuse the rest of the family!
Then because the TV doesn't support analogue output and the stereo doesn't support digital input so in order to get all TV sources output through the stereo there needs to be an external DAC.
So how come we’ve gone down the route of external DACs when all he needs is the cable that is already plugged in between the TV & AMP?
(-: Who knows!
Given that we've now got a previously undisclosed BD player and Chromecast in the mix, I can see two options.
1) Ghetto solution, stick with the headphone jack. All TV audio goes direct to the amp. Just watch the headphone volume levels from the TV, set it at a level where you're getting a normal volume level out of the amp and use the amp to control the volume rather than the TV. There's nothing inherently wrong with this per se, but you seem concerned about getting the best quality so...
2) Spendy solution, invest in an AV receiver and sack off all the analogue bodges. Option to add more devices (the cheapest receiver on Richer is a £180 Denon which has five HDMI inputs) and surround sound speakers. This dodges the problem of no audio from the TV with the headset jack connected - sound will automatically mute when the amp is on and kick back in with it off. Also, CEC means that you should be able to use one remote control, volume is volume regardless of which device it's coming from.
I guess it depends on your budget and whether you've any interest in adding more devices.
im a bit confused by the hdmi inputs
I'd guess that the missing HDMI input that isn't displaying onscreen is simply because there's nothing connected to it. HDMI is clevar.
If using the headphone output on the TV, the TV is muted which might confuse the rest of the family!
My non tech savvy mum came to stay a while ago, it took all of 30 seconds to explain she needs to turn the amp on too to get sound. 🤷♂️
Given that we’ve now got a previously undisclosed BD player and Chromecast in the mix,
sorry, i spose to start with i just didnt see it as relevant, i just wanted whatever the telly was displaying to play through my speakers.
2) Spendy solution,
nah, we may even change tv's again soon, this was given to us so we're trying to make it work as cheaply as possible for now.
im thinking i have two options for this then, the headphone jack (and family are shown what to do with the amp), or the quagbox 🙂
thanks
Yeah, on reflection I think the 'quagbox' is probably your best option then. I overlooked that earlier, sorry.
If nothing else, this way you're using a device which is designed to to exactly what you're doing, rather than jury-rigging a (probably low quality) headphone output into a line-level input. The 3.5mm to phono will work and there's no showstopper problem with it, but it makes my teeth itch just thinking about it.