[Closed] Are we going to have much of a high street left after all this?

http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/the-demise-of-the-high-street

😀

I'll tell you once I've sat down in my local artisan-roasted coffee house.

I mentioned a strategy on the other thread of a small town high st converting its shops into craft workshop/showrooms.

But actually, having spent a fair bit of time back in St Helens recently, they have a better strategy - the town centre now contains:

Pound Shops
Pie Shops
Two-Pies-for-a-Pound Shops

Yeah course we will, lots of retailers are acquiring still. It's just they are different retailers to the ones shutting up shop!

I thought Blockbuster went a long time ago! They were living on borrowed time.

One thing I've noticed around where I live, aside from half the shops having been boarded up for quite some time, is that 90% of the shoppers are well into pension age.

it seems the end is nigh for people like myself (no credit card) 🙁 when it's only gambling dens/pie shops pound shops left.man how depressing 🙁

Councils need to start allowing the conversion of disused shops for residential uses....just accept that films, music etc is all purchased online these day and let the big (cheap) retailers like PCWorld, Halfords, Tescos etc get on with day to day solid goods....let the High-ST become a social area with bars, food, coffee shops etc, selling services will i think be more profitable than goods at the moment.

If only there were somewhere a man could go to put a bet on nowadays. Possibly while supping an overpriced coffee, and sporting an orange tan?

Even our local porn shop has closed down!

maccruiskeen - Member
Two-Pies-for-a-Pound Shops

Directions to that if you will

footflaps - Member
Even our local porn shop has closed down!

As opposed to the pawn shops that are only outdone by the number of Polski Skleps/International shops.

If only there were somewhere a man could go to put a bet on nowadays. Possibly while supping an overpriced coffee, and sporting an orange tan?

Brighton right, you're talking about Brigton?

How long do we think WH Smiths has got?

Directions to that if you will

Go to St Helens - follow your nose, theres possibly no place on earth where pies are more freely available and readily dispensed. Hotpot pies. Woof!!!!.

Whats nice is how many of them are local businesses / bakeries rather than ubiquitous Greggs.

The town is actually looking pretty bonny, surprising absence of empty shopfronts compared to similar sized town centres.

maccruiskeen I know what you mean. I'm in Newton-Le-Willows and avoid St. Helens like the plague. There is only one solution for it and we all know the only way to be sure...

#edit This was written after your first comment. After reading your second I am somewhat amazed. Last time I was there it was a shit hole.

go on - have a pie. You know you want one.

People come to Hexham specifically for the charity shops - we've got loads of 'em.

🙁

Local council refuses to allow free parking anywhere and has recently employed more traffic wardens to chase this up (I doubt the revenue from parking charges pays all their wages).
Only free car-park in town is Tesco, and they've now set a 2-hour limit. So before, people would do their Tesco shop, then pop up to town to the little shops, now there won't be time for that.

If they'd pull their fingers out and provide alternative arrangements, like better,cheaper public transport, safe cycle routes etc, then I''d let them off, but for a rural market town, the car is king.
Head 2 miles down the valley to Corbridge however, which has ample free parking and its full of expensive boutiquey shops. Its turning into a real divide.

I'm guessing Waterstones will last a while yet and I know some people will always prefer a physical book (I'm one of them) but with the uptake of ereaders I wonder what their strategy going forward will be.

To be fair, of the recent collapses, only jessops would actually locate on your high street - the others had mostly moved to bigger out of town locations.
Chester has a couple of empty shops in the centre but are usually taken up by startups... and yes there's a Two-Pies-for-a-Pound shop 🙂
If the council got their act sorted and made it easier/cheaper for people to park in town then it would be an improvement. But no, they put the prices up instead of down.

There are plenty of zombie companies (hanging in there thanks to ultra low rates), so expect a lot more of this.

Extraordinary to think that BB lasted his long. I can't remember seeing one recently.

It's not just the internet that's killing the High Street, it's the greedy councils charging extortionate business rates while removing free parking and constantly putting up car park charges. Also retail unit freeholders expecting ludicrous amounts of rent from struggling businesses.

I'll bet a lot of businesses that are going to the wall are tied into long term leases on their premises that were negotiated in the heady days of 2005-2007.

What the high street needs to rejuvinate it is a shop, that sells pies and cakes, tea and coffee,mobile phones, books, cameras, computers, magazines and food.

All in the same building ,with free parking.

Ive just invented Tesco.

How long do we think WH Smiths has got?

Always amazes me that WH Smiths is one of the busiest shops around.

Always rammed in there, and the boots next door is always busy too. Both seem to be doing well ?

Unless everyone is just reading magazines full of adverts, and then popping next door to try out the testers of all the products ?

Some stats:

In 2011 ebook sales in the UK went up by 366%.

Ebook sales in the UK over 10 months to last October - 16% increase.

patriotpro....

[img] [/img]

For those moments where Greggs would seem a bit indulgent. Poncey even

The Blockbusters in Chippenham is in a small retail park away from the actual centre, near the station, with a very large car park. I walked past it a week or two ago, and I honestly thought it had shut, until I saw someone walk out.
What with the likes of Netflicks, Lovefilm, Sky, etc, I can't understand how Bb has managed to keep going this long.
I actually joined when they first opened. I've never borrowed film since.

"Meat and potato pies" - Have we come full circle? Are we back to the horse burger thread from this morning?

Drac - Moderator
> http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/the-demise-of-the-high-street br />

Oops sorry, I did scan the front page - my bad..

Er carry on, I'm reading both now - agree about councils and parking fees

Jessops
Blockbuster
HMV

All killed by the same sword

Digital.

Everything they relied on has gone 100010111010010010101011 and we can just download it.

What with the likes of Netflicks, Lovefilm, Sky, etc, I can't understand how Bb has managed to keep going this long.

Not everyone is online (or has good online provision - the broadband to my house couldn't sustain a streaming movie) or has the hardware. A sky subscription also costs a fair bit more than renting a few DVDs. It is inevitable that places like Blockbusters would go, but theres going to be a gap between them going and the digital alternatives being genuinely available to all.

Anyone know City Electrical Factors? I popped in one today and the guys said "nah, ain't got that, tried the Internet have you, find anything you want there you can"

I walked out and logged on.

PeterPoddy - Member
Jessops
Blockbuster
HMV

All killed by the same sword

Digital.

Everything they relied on has gone 100010111010010010101011 and we can just download it.

Don't believe everything you read in the Daily Mail or see on the tele.....

Mate of mine is store manager of a branch well known electrical component shop and he tells any one who will listen that while the internet shopping has had an impact on a the likes of HMV etc the main reason for them struggling is the large supermarkets ( Tesco, Asda etc ) undercutting them on just about everything

Most of those shops went bust due to being shit, selling things people could get much more cheaply elsewhere or selling things people no longer wanted.

Didn't Argos post really shit figures recently as well?. prestwick, Where I live is probably about the only proper town centre left in Ayrshire, and Troon as well. Strangely, the rates in these two are considerably lower than Ayr, Which used to be a pretty busy big town with decent shops, but is now kerphucked.

Council had the bright idea of a large town centre mall in Ayr, all outdoor with nice cobbles n stuff. It's not full, and never will be, and it has killed the rest of the town. Next step is that they are putting a roof on it. Jesus wept.

Town planners and councillors have a lot to answer for.

Argos is also silly nowadays. Why they bother with a high st presence I have no idea.

My money would be on W H Smith to go next

The continued existence of BHS mystifies me.

Is it such a bad thing that all the crummy chains are going under? Opportunity for some thing better? I always hated that every high st was pretty much the same... Monopolized by the big guys.

I know the culture here is different but in Spain most of the high st is cafe's and small restaurants. Very social places. Very few chains except supermarkets and mobile phone shops, any other shops are indi's.

I wasgoing to say most places i have been in europe the main town's/cities are social with the odd shops, and then major retain buildings just outside them.

I find them much more plesent places to be.

However I feel if this thread was about a LBS being closed due to the likes of Chain reaction every one of us would be saying how sad it was and to support your local store. I Know that the companies mentioned are big chains but there the ones that hit the head lines your local shop whether its music or bikes suffer too.

Well, I've got a fair few LBS. Some are great, I shop at those. Others are rubbish, I don't shop there and I wouldn't mind if they went under. The better shops can take their staff and their business.

Isn't that how it's meant to work?

Don't believe everything you read in the Daily Mail or see on the tele.....

I haven't bought any newspaper for about 3 years and I don't watch news as a rule. That was a pure observation.

Shirley with all these shops ie hmv, jessops etc going under partly through things like people buying on line with the likes of amazon,play.com etc this is creating less competition and will then allow them to charge whatever they want as there will be less other places for you to buy those goods?

Shirley with all these shops ie hmv, jessops etc going under partly through things like people buying on line with the likes of amazon,play.com etc this is creating less competition and will then allow them to charge whatever they want as there will be less other places for you to buy those goods?

You've worked that out then? 🙂

I sure have, Ive got lots of free time on my hands at the moment!

We've no one to blame but ourselves (actually, being in my twenties I can blame everyone older than me, but I digress).

We allowed chains to monopolise the high street. We allowed the councils to implement punitive rates and parking (they are elected, after all), and we chose to shop in these doomed stores until we found the internet.

European cities don't have this problem because it's not about the shops; it's about socialising. They have effective, cheap public transport and safe cycling. In Amsterdam, the only shops allowed off public squares are bars, cafés, restaurants etc because the authorities understand this.

We're incapable of seeing this in the UK, and to be honest, when the last few chains are gone and the street is just a row of bookies, pawnbrokers, pound shops, halal butchers, and charity shops, it'll be almost impossible to fix.

The only place I can think of that comes close is Didsbury in South Manchester, which was a great place to live.

Didn't Argos post really shit figures recently as well?.

Thing is, that that is a business with such huge potential, with over 700 locations countrywide, to capitalise on the internet, as with a load of teenagers on mopeds and a few vans they could offer same day delivery in every major town in the country.

We allowed chains to monopolise the high street.

We?

Chains have dominated our high streets because shoppers aren't discerning enough. They regularly flock like sheep and buy the "landfill" on offer, thus perpetuating a cycle of waste, keeping the shelves stocked with uninspiring intangible rubbish.

My experience of large chain retailing is of overpriced, but often mediocre/inferior merchandise, presented in lavish palaces of consumerism - large modern covered shopping centres.

The high street is failing because it is not convenient, choice is limited and prices are most often uncompetitive.

Not convenient because of commercially oblivious imbeciles in town council offices who regard motorists (customers) as a menace, make popping into your local shop virtually impossible without considerable hassle.

Choice is limited because large stores are scarce and any big chain would keep limited stock. Many chains are put off by limited footfall and high cost per square foot. They don't have confidence in this traditional and rather outdated type of shopping experience.. The abundance of businesses that deprive shoppers of store frontage interrupting the footfall is also off putting (estate agents, banks, accountants, letting agents, solicitors, too many food outlets, and any other buildings where you can't buy goods - think how large shopping centres are laid out).

Smaller retailers cannot make their businesses competitive due to greedy landlords' high lease costs, uniform business rates that are not sensitive to the local market situation. Councils do not receive this tax, so have little incentive or power to stimulate local commerce. The Internet offers consumers huge choice and it's easy to buy products at prices below a level that a high street retailer could realistically make any profit.

Local chambers of commerce are dominated by the local establishment (land owning parish councillors and significant influential business people). So any new entrepreneurs are seen as a threat to the status quo and won't get anywhere without their approval.

Converting shops to dwellings will only happen if the high street in question has become a boarded up wasteland, as a body of traders will justifiably oppose the further demise of their shopping centre with great gusto. The local council will also have to provide some residents parking too.

1) Retailer associations should have much more control of their high street.

2) I think there should be the relaxing of parking restrictions for short stay.

3) Business rates collected by local councils and set according to the collective prosperity of the shopping area in question, with dispensation for lower footfall areas. This incentivises the council to work to improve the situation.

4) Regulation of landlords/lease renewals to prevent them from bleeding tenant shop holders dry. Landlords should feel a sense of duty of care to the local economy!

5) The whole thing needs managing with all interested parties talking to each other in a collaborative way.

6) Worst cases subject to some careful government investment - raised on the back of taxes on out of town retailing.

7) Encouraging large retailers to establish a presence in the high street.

8 ) Develop a chamber of commerce that is vibrant and dynamic - these guys need shaking up and the men past retirement age should gracefully step down and let new blood take the reins!

9) No more new shopping malls - the UK has far too many retail outlets.

10) Rather than convert traditional high streets, some of those old Arndale centre type places should be converted into housing.

I need to get out more!

ROLL ON SUMMER!!!!!

I couldn't believe the number of empty shop units in Bristol city centre when I wandered round today. This included quite a few in the recently opened Cabot Circus shopping centre which was supposed to revitalise the city.

Only thing I ever buy from a "real" shop these days is clothes, coffee, RC things model shops and food. I hate going shopping, always have. I will avoid going to a high street if at all possible. Maybe I'm the epitome of all that's wrong?

I hate going shopping, always have. I will avoid going to a high street if at all possible. Maybe I'm the epitome of all that's wrong?

I agree. I only realised how much I shopped online since I moved to Australia - there's not as many internet retailers over here, and so I find myself having to go to the shops more often. It's rubbish.

I reckon Millets are on borrowed time. Popped into the Glasgow Sauchiehall Street branch today and on top of an already good sale they had a further 20% off everything. That reeks of liquidity problems.

They really must struggle to compete against the like of Decathlon etc. The shops are shabby and their range is very limited.

Thought Millets had gone already, it has in Derby I heard. And the Co-Op dept store just up the road (opposite HMV) is closing soon.

Used to be lots of little shops then big chains took over and could sell more stuff cheaper. People migrated to these stores.

Now internet is cheaper and people have moved on again. Small shops can't compete with internet or afford rents in city centres. Already going to pound/charity/coffee shops.

10-15 years ago very few coffee shops in city now 2 Costa's, 2 Starbucks, a Nero plus loads of smaller ones including a Cafe Kona!