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like the Wacom Cintiq, but way better
I hope it is but thats a pretty big leap to make based on what was shown. For starters the cintiq works with existing desktop applications, i've yet to see anything for iOS that I would use in preference to photoshop or illustrator.
Wacom has different styluses so you can pick the type that you feel most comfortable with, apple has 'pencil'. Now pencil might be great but you'd need to try it to see how it moves across the surface, what the level of friction is like, how well the tilt works.
The big cintiq is a 27" screen, iPad pro is less than half that.
In it's favour the iPad pro is portable and half the price, whereas I've seen flight cases available for transporting the cintiq.
At the moment for studio use I would still rather have the cintiq, but I certainly wouldn't buy one until I'd had a good test of both devices.
iPad Pro is going to kill the laptop market below 600 quid, I'm not sure why you would bother with anything else?
Really?
Surface pro 3. Same price, damn near same size, better storage, comes WITH stylus, better freedom of use (don't like Apples closed way of doing things) and, if the theories are to be believed, more RAM. Also a better front facing camera (but you lose 3MP on the back).
Or, you could get an actual laptop with an actual keyboard with actual upgradable RAM.
There are plenty of reasons not to choose an iPad Pro. In fact I struggle to think why I would choose one in the first place (but accept that I'm not the best person to ask).
like the Wacom Cintiq, but way better
isn’t the iPad limited to working on 50meg images? and i doubt it runs the whole of photoshop so no good for proper work but great presentation tool and second screen on location using capture1 (tethered camera software) screen is 2732×2048
Highlights then?? & your choice for "best in show"
Erm....
The iPen.
I also accept a lot of the cost of it was to pay for marketing and not R&D and manufacturing.
Annoying as Apple marketing and advertising is, the money spent is dwarfed by what Samsung and Microsoft are spending on such things.
Annoying as Apple marketing and advertising is, the money spent is dwarfed by what Samsung and Microsoft are spending on such things.
Apple is pretty lean as a tech company, but their margins are off the scale! They make something like 98% of all margin for all smart phones, even though they have something like 30% of the smart phone market.
Edit: 92% of all margin from 20% of market
http://www.wsj.com/articles/apples-share-of-smartphone-industrys-profits-soars-to-92-1436727458
Oh, and big tablets are great, in a 2001 style, but using the moniker “Pro” is ridiculous. That goes for both the Apple and the MS toys. Patronising. “Pros” can use all sorts of hardware and software for their work… but adding the “Pro” name to these items is just about convincing consumers that it's worth spending more on their toy, and making them feel special about themselves.
Yes, Apples margins are off the scale… but their spending on marketing and advertising is still tiny compared to Microsoft and Samsung. Go look at the figures… it's amazing what those two spend on advertising tablets and phones.
I'll see if I can dig up some links, not looked for a while:
[url= http://adage.com/article/news/blue-chip-advertisers-spending-hits-record-109b/293819/ ]2013 US advertising spend[/url]
[url= http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/11/27/us-samsung-marketing-idUSBRE9AQ18720131127 ]the GDP of Iceland[/url]
[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/media/11455879/Samsung-breaks-records-with-45m-push-behind-Galaxy-S6.html ]Galaxy S6 launch[/url]
[url= http://www.thestreet.com/story/13055049/1/microsofts-big-marketing-push-for-surface-tablet-is-starting-to-pay-off.html ]Latest Surface push[/url]
Steve Jobs would never have allowed a [s]stylus[/s] pencil. Before you know it there'll be a forward delete.
using the moniker "Pro" is ridiculous. That goes for both the Apple and the MS toys. Patronising.
Likewise "Elite", for when "Pro" isn't quite "Pro" enough:
[img] 
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http://www.cad-comic.com/cad/20150617
Have you heard about the Apple fanboi with constipation?
He sat down and worked it out with an iPen.
Coat? Thanks.
Apple is pretty lean as a tech company, but their margins are off the scale! They make something like 98% of all margin for all smart phones, even though they have something like 30% of the smart phone market
And who gets to pay for the margin and Apples profits?
Not an Apple hater btw, I like their stuff but think its a bit overpriced.
Saw the second half of the presentation. Glad to see the updates to Apple TV, the addition of apps is very significant and I like the new remote and although I'm not a user of Siri on phone or iPad I could see myself using it for the TV. I expect to see BBC iPlayer and CurzonHome Cinema apps for example. I have 2 ATV3's and depending on UK pricing and app releases I might switch one
Phone updates are evolutionary, the improvements to the camera look very impressive. The force touch looks useful. Neither are enough on their own to get me to sell my 6 but I might be tempted to go for a 6S Plus.
Larger iPad will sell well especially to business, I stopped using my work laptop 4 years ago and used an iPad I'd bought myself. This will accelerate the trend. The new model will generate switches from other iPads and given the size of that market now that's significant for Apple. iPads and Minis getting sold/given away will bring new users into the Apple eco system
@footflaps interesting stats, the competitors can only compete on price and by selling phones at no profit margin they are doomed as other revenues like apps and games they do t have either
The iPad Pro is a bit like that really posh Chromebook thing - lovely tech, but with the wrong software and OS. I've got an iPad and it's great for games and casual web surfing. but I'm typing this on a Surface Pro 3 with BikeCAD, a decent 2D CAD program, Fireworks and my online order credit card system running in other windows.
Can't do that with the Pro, no matter how big the screen or pretty the keyboard. And the keyboard doesn't have a touchpad.
Can't be arsed sitting through the presentation - are existing Apple TVs getting any of the new stuff or are they being left for dead?
Yup, Apple stuff is priced very high, with big margins… but why lower the price to a point where they'd struggle to meet demand, only to then have less of a contingency buffer for when the inevitable lean times come for the company again in the future? Unless you're dripping with money, then I don't see the point in buying the latest anything from any tech company; buy “last season's” at a cut down price instead.
@disco I hear you but they can sell the stuff as fast as they can make it so they are pricing it efficiently. Also second hand value of Apple kit means cost of ownership is arguably less than competitors. I certainly felt that way for laptops, my Microsoft machines used to conk out after 2 years and be worthless whilst a MacBook lasted 7 years and ran pretty much the latest software, phone and iPads you can sell for 60% of purchase price after a year or more
@Graham there was no mention of compatibility with ATV 3 and no press comment so I am guessing not sadly. That would be a pity as a Jailbroken ATV2 can run apps so a 3 could if they opened it up, currently I run apps on phone and send content to ATV. My guess is some of the interface at least will make it over but clearly SiRi cannot work as no mike
@ben I find iPad very useful for work but most of what I do is email, document review and markup (eg with excellent iAnnotate), some report writing, custom secure apps for subscription news and data services. There where many occasions I would sit at my desk and use my iPad even with a desktop computer in front of me. I suppose it depends on what you need but for many people the iPad Pro is enough with occasional desktop use.
That's disappointing. I was hoping it would get a little love - even if it just opened up the ability to add more streaming services.
@graham let's see, I see no reason as to why they wouldn't open up more streaming services and apps. There may be an update when iOS 9 is released.
if they can jailbreak the new appletv and get Kodi running on it then I will definitely get one. I may get one anyway depending on its ability to handle connecting to my NAS.
I've not bothered with Plex for ages but if it works on the new apple TV and there is no Kodi then it might make me take the plunge
12" tablet and stylus? Yep, it's Apple blazing a trail AGAIN and definitely not copying any other competitor who definitely didn't do that in March 2014 http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/tablets/samsung-galaxy-note-pro-12-2-1210001/review
Love that 'keyboard cover' too. What innovation! Oh... http://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-gb/products/surface-pro-3
Good job that no-one associated with Apple ever suggested that a stylus for use on the iPad represented a failure.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/04/08/jobs-if-you-see-a-stylus-or-a-task-manager-they-blew-it/
I may get one anyway depending on its ability to handle connecting to my NAS.
I think the existing Apple TVs can already connect to NAS drives can't they?
(I don't have a NAS but I can certainly stream stuff off my PC easily enough)
Funny really when you think about it the Ipad Pro success or not really hangs on others outside of Apple i.e. MS Office, Adobe Photoshop and IBM business software. The game is changing and Apple are starting to look more like a Lenovo and MS are going back to what they always did software.
To me 2015 feels like the tide has changed and MS is now the future again and Apple the past, like the 90's.
As a lifelong apple fan boy I am quite disappointed by the announcements.
The iPad pro should have been a large tablet but running a full OSX so it could compete with the surface.
Iphones were evolutionary but nothing great. Apple TV is too late to the party and too expensive compared to chromecast etc.
It's not like there was no good stuff announced - I'm sure I'll buy the new Apple TV - it's just that there was little to surprise me. Basically, all the rumours that have been circulating for months have been proved to be true.
The only thing that’s changed is everything
Really?! The Apple marketing machine is losing a lot of credibility for me 😕
MS is now the future again
Yet another new version of Office which is 99,9% the as the last 20 versions and another version of Windows with or without the task bar. Hardly cutting edge stuff....
Hardly cutting edge stuff....
Yes but it just works 😉
isn't that sort of the point. They got it more or less right many years ago which is one of the reasons the vast majority use it.Yet another new version of Office which is 99,9% the as the last 20 versions and another version of Windows with or without the task bar. Hardly cutting edge stuff
The same could be said for iPhones. If they were half the price they'd possibly have a similar market share that Windows has in computing.
Office 365 is hardly the same as the last 20 versions. Plus Apple are desperate to get it onto the ipad, because without it they are dead in the water at an enterprise level.
WIn10 is different as it will scale across all platforms.
Apple TV is too late to the party and too expensive compared to chromecast etc.
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Source: [url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34198410 ]BBC report[/url]
@GrahamS How many of those users will get the new ones and have to shell out more cash and how many will go for the simpler cheaper alternative?
I dunno - but I think underestimating Apple's marketing power is a mistake.
As is saying it was "too late to the party".
The first Apple TV was released in 2007.
Chromecast was released in 2013.
isn't that sort of the point
I'm not knocking Office, I use it most days, but it's not 'leading the way'. 99% of features people use on a regular basis haven't changed in 15 years.
The market for Word Processors etc is a bit like online auctions, it favours one vendor so you have universal compatibility. I wouldn't say MS got it right first time, they just got big enough market share and managed to squeeze out all the competition at the time. Now it's just momentum keeping it there.
Apple TV is great, watching somebody trying to find a you tube video with the crap search function and the remote is quite funny.
^^^ I don't believe that graphic. Do sky, humax, panasonic, youview, etc have 4.3% between them?
I haven't looked in detail at Apple TV, but what does it allow me to do my Smart TV or Xbox360 can't?
iPad Pro is going to kill the laptop market below 600 quid, I'm not sure why you would bother with anything else?
Genuine LOL.
No. Can't be arsed to watch the presentation again but IIRC that was specifically referring to the cut-down Photoshop tool which will be available initially. It's (obviously) not a limitation of the device. They also said Adobe are working on new software so it's a case of "wait and see". IMO whatever they come up with will make or break the device as far as graphics pros are concerned.isn’t the iPad limited to working on 50meg images?
^^^ I don't believe that graphic. Do sky, humax, panasonic, youview, etc have 4.3% between them?
I've not read the Frost & Sulivan report but I suspect they are talking about the very specific "dedicated premium content streamer" market rather than the much vaster "everything that connects to a telly" market.
Apple TV is great, watching somebody trying to find a you tube video with the crap search function and the remote is quite funny.
The YouTube app is pretty appalling, especially the search.
It's much easier to search for videos on your phone/tablet and then just AirPlay them to the TV.
I already wish I'd bought an iPad Mini instead of iPad Air (only really use it for web browsing and games and it gets heavy quite quickly). I guess there's some niche usage cases for the Pro but I struggle to see the point for the home market. I'd rather a laptop than an iPad I had to use with a stand/keyboard.
iPhone 6s was as expected, still holding out hope for a smaller version come the iPhone 7
I haven't looked in detail at Apple TV, but what does it allow me to do my Smart TV or Xbox360 can't?
Currently, not much, other than play nicely with the rest of the closed Apple ecosystem.
I wouldn't say MS got it right first time
^This
In my experience, MS are playing catch-up not on bells and whistles of their office suite, but on cross-platform cloud/sharing. Google Drive is a superb implementation of a truly productive suite of business tools that offers easy collaboration and sharing which is so critical for business/enterprise and even personal users. Of course Excel offers much more power in a spreadsheet and Word has loads more that some people need for word processing, but the adoption of Google Drive instead of Office by so many colleagues and businesses in my line of work tells an interesting story for Microsoft that they've no doubt had to listen to.
Apple are neither as good as MS in terms of office productivity suite functions nor as slick and easy to use for collaboration/cloud as Google. After the fanfare of the new Pages, Numbers and Keynote a year or two back, they've gone quite quiet on it all in my opinion, and it comes as no surprise they've put their eggs in the MS basket.
Genuine LOL.
explain to me, why the home user, with 600 quid to spend on a laptop, would now buy a laptop?
I can see how it might be a good option for someone with £600 to spend but if you have £150 - £500 then I suspect you'll still buy a laptop. Hardly [i]"going to kill the laptop market below 600 quid"[/i]explain to me, why the home user, with 600 quid to spend on a laptop, would now buy a laptop?
explain to me, why the home user, with 600 quid to spend on a laptop, would now buy a laptop?
They do a lot more than a tablet, they are better for writing/typing, they run full versions of software, they have storage, you can use a mouse use a different photo management tool than your tablet maker wants you too. The screen sits up without holding it. Nice for doing lots of stuff and 600 quid gets you a nice spec laptop these days....
As for any mid level business user tablets are just not there yet.
explain to me, why the home user, with 600 quid to spend on a laptop, would now buy a laptop?
Much more versatile, better storage, better processor power.
I'd only buy an iPad after a laptop.
By calling it "Pro" they're obviously trying to crack the business/professional market (I'd hardly call that a niche area!) so it isn't necessarily even aimed at home use.I guess there's some niche usage cases for the Pro but I struggle to see the point for the home market.
By calling it "Pro" they're obviously trying to crack the business/professional market
and how does this crack the market?
and how does this crack the market?
All companies automatically buy any product with the name 'Pro' for all their staff?
ah, nobody got fired for buying IBM but 400 ipads and a massive RSI claim later?
TBF it could be useful for sales reps or creative ad types, but it ain't going to take over for those of us who have lots of programs open and big screens. Heck in the O&G industry in most offices (outside of the ones in the dark ages) just about everyone are running dual screens. Likewise same in a lot of Government offices.
just about everyone are running dual screens.
Imagine selling the idea that one screen gets blanked out every time you want to type something...
@ben I find iPad very useful for work but most of what I do is email, document review and markup (eg with excellent iAnnotate), some report writing, custom secure apps for subscription news and data services. There where many occasions I would sit at my desk and use my iPad even with a desktop computer in front of me.
Aye, I used a keyboard with my iPad quite a bit, it wasn't half bad for that kind of thing. Until it came to trying to copy and paste something and the touch wasn't behaving, or an attachment wouldn't open and couldn't just save it to the hard drive or something like that.
As someone else said, if the iPro was running OSX it'd make more sense, running full versions of software at least instead of cut-down apps.
Just learning a bit about AirStrip on the Apple Watch. I will concede that it is quite impressive and very innovative. If that's a sign of where wearable technology is going the next few years could be very interesting. I can't see NHS Trusts buying them for all their Doctors just yet tho' 🙂
I should probably read up on airstrip in the morning when I'm more awake but I've just got about 5 buzzwords in every 50... but the remote monitoring stuff is up there now, the biggest part is platform agnostic in that though
As someone else said, if the iPro was running OSX it'd make more sense, running full versions of software at least instead of cut-down apps.
That was what I said iPad should have done since day 1. Effectively a laptop with a touch overlay. It'll be in the archives on here and/or the ski forum as proof. But then I ripped the wee-wee out of the M$ surface etc. which is the only vague attempt at doing exactly that. Ignoring Ubuntu of course and their vapourware.
Impressed that some people claim to write reports etc. on one. Most use I could find for one in the enterprise *for what I do* is to display a pdf to one side of my laptop and external monitor. I could quite happily run dual 24inch monitors with full OS, preferably with one of those monitors rotatable between landscape and portrait.
just about everyone are running dual screens.
Only two?
I seriously doubt Apple are envisaging it replacing a conventional setup in that scenario. I've no doubt (from a graphics professional POV) it's meant to be a complementary device - an additional touchscreen device that adds functionality to the 2 screen setups we're already using. The fact that it's portable is also a bonus.TBF it could be useful for sales reps or creative ad types, but it ain't going to take over for those of us who have lots of programs open and big screens. Heck in the O&G industry in most offices (outside of the ones in the dark ages) just about everyone are running dual screens. Likewise same in a lot of Government offices.
im a designer and between my phone, pad, laptop and desktop, spend an awful lot of time with apple.
for me, i think that there is a whole lot of clever stuff going on but i secretly pine for things to get simpler and more striped back. just like the old 29/650b/26 discussions, its all about the same stuff being offered at different sizes with other 'features'. having recently upgraded my phone from a 5s to a 6, I'm reminded that my hands haven't actually got bigger, so why has my phone?
an apple pencil? I'm easily seduced but i like the 3d touch of a 2hb pencil on a daler rowney pad - old skool or what?
was very much an apple fan boy, perhaps I'm just getting older and grumpier.
I think calling it 'Pro' is a cynical ploy to crowed the Surface Pro market.
But the Surface Pro is more than just a bigger Surface, it has a 'Pro' OS for a start which means it can be networked in a work environment properly and you can have proper big, PC Processors - Intel i3, i5, and I7 processors, up to 8GB RAM and 256GB storage IS a replacement for a laptop - I share an office with 4 guys who've done exactly that, in the office, in it's cradle and used with a wireless keyboard / mouse and a monitor it's just as good to use as a desktop. On the road it's a beast of a mobile device and the flip down mat/keyboard is just enough to knock out something more than a game of Candy Crush. I wasn't a fan when I first saw them, but they are very good.
I haven't looked in detail at Apple TV, but what does it allow me to do my Smart TV or Xbox360 can't?
In my case, connect to Netflix, which my smart (?) TV refuses to do 🙁
The YouTube app is pretty appalling, especially the search.It's much easier to search for videos on your phone/tablet and then just AirPlay them to the TV.
Or use a Bluetooth keyboard paired with your AppleTV.
yep, just highlights how average the tech is....
there isn't much out there that apple really excel at, unless you count being expensive
I'm no Apple fan but I don't get this complaint against the 6 being too big, it is fine IMO. The 6 plus maybe, but not the 6.
I don't get this complaint against the 6 being too big
Maybe apple spent a long time telling people that they made the perfect sized phone and that big phones were wrong that now they made a bigger one people have been convinced/brainwashed into thinking that
I haven't looked in detail at Apple TV, but what does it allow me to do my Smart TV or Xbox360 can't?
It's a much more compelling sell if you already use Apple Music, iCloud Photo Library etc. As usual with Apple, the more you're in their ecosystem, the more their solutions appeal.
there isn't much out there that apple really excel at, unless you count being expensive
I think the stuff they're doing with Health Kit, AirStrip and all the other health related stuff has potential to be really game-changing. The most innovative stuff they're doing is actually not for the consumer, for whom the fact something is "new" is enough for them to part with their cash.
I think the stuff they're doing with Health Kit, AirStrip
Strange Airstrip don't mention apple as a partner
http://www.airstrip.com/airstrip-partners
Microsoft is on the list though
^probably because they were only allowed to announce it yesterday and haven't got a huge team of web developers ready to roll out a new site like Apple do after these events 😆
So it's been announced and it's not up?
Pinning yourself to minority hardware isn't that clever. Making something that works on all devices much better.
Maybe apple spent a long time telling people that they made the perfect sized phone and that big phones were wrong that now they made a bigger one people have been convinced/brainwashed into thinking that
Or maybe, just maybe people are basing it on experience of using one.
Joking Drac, imagine a world where you can choose what size phone you want
Strange Airstrip don't mention apple as a partner
You're right. Probably Apple were lying.
No .... wait ...
http://automation.airstrip.com/9-9-15-event-landing-page2.html
... maybe mike was just stretching a bit in his usual crusade against Apple.
So unless there is another airstrip in HC
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they already have massive partners in Micrsoft and Samsung?
Not exclusive is it, not on their main page of partners
Your point being, beyond the usual "whatever Apple do is automatically wrong"?
my point being as stated they don't mention apple as a partner, they might be mentioned in a sales pitch but they are in bed with windows and samsung, hardly a massive kill for apple. If I was working with them I'd have had it all over the site 15s after the announcement. One of their big claims is being platform agnostic which means they are clever and will ride whatever is going - best plan, don't pin yourself on a specific hardware especially where competitive tender is involved.
But anyway as I said airship don't mention apple as a partner on their list of partners they said
AirStrip was on the main stage at #AppleEvent in
San Francisco on September 9, 2015
What does that actually mean?
What does that actually mean?
I suppose it means that their product was demo'ed being used on Apple Watch at the Apple event in San Francisco on September 9, 2015. But hey, maybe it means something completely different?
I must admit I'm with Mike here. Either AirStrip have dropped the ball by not updating their website or there's something they/Apple aren't telling us.
If I was working with them I'd have had it all over the site 15s after the announcement.
Me too