[Closed] Apparently I don't communicate well!

Why are you stressed?

What is the cause of stress?

Firstly, you are talking about it so that's good. In terms of finding out why this is so - I think that could take a lot of exploring with a professional.

I have a similar problem. I get animated when I'm under pressure - good or bad - and a lot of people consider it aggression. Except I'm *never* aggressive towards people, just things.

All I can do is make sure I add light-hearted or humourous comments in, so people know I'm not really upset with them.

GP and happy pills...seems to be the norm.

You appear to be a bloke. A normal one.

Gin

If you know you're becoming stressed you could try deliberately taking longer, slower breaths.

Something to do with fight-or-flight response, adrenalin, and so-on.

I was quite a lot like you, snappy and aggressive. I gave up my job started doing my own thing. My wife commented on how much I had changed for the better. Seems my old employer was dragging me down to his bitter and twisted level. Look at your work that could be the root of the problem.

Are you me?

It's also important to note that I'm a very blunt instrument and do not change my behaviour depending on who is around and where I am

Is this a new development or have you always been like that ?

Adapting behaviour to suit different situations is quite an important life skill.

[edit] that's a genuine question, not a dig. Just wondering if the stress is causing that too.

Defo Gin.

Gin

Defo Gin.

Hmmm.....

http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/love-drinking-gin-and-tonic-you-could-be-a-psychopath-research-suggests-a3336906.html

Ride more.

More sex too.

Join a gym too.

Meditation to reduce anger. Buddhist monks or meditation shrinks will help.

Apologise to your wife and grovel/TLC for 2 months as she didn't walk out on you.

At least you know you have an issue and it needs sorting.

Work and home life are the causes of the stress.

Work pays quite well and is generally very enjoyable, I like it but no position is without some stress. Every 6 months or so it gets very challenging.

One of the members of the household is extremely high-maintenance because they're emotionally fragile, they're paranoid/neurotic and need constant reassurance and support, this comes from me.

NealGlover - Always that way, I'm immature. It's why I'm not a good manager, I know it affects relationships with staff and senior management but I function pretty well as an individual. Work is not as important as home so it can wait.

Frankenstein - Both excellent suggestions and have the desired affect as it happens, it has been commented on in the past by my dear Wife.

Sadly however the source of the stress at home means that increasing either of those activities is NEVER going to happen.

EDIT: Meditation, that could be a go-er, I practiced mindfulness at school during examinations to help me focus, that worked.

I'm a very blunt instrument and do not change my behaviour depending on who is around and where I am

Any chance you might be somewhere [i]"on the spectrum"[/i]?

There are variois undiagnosed people with aspergers that get written off as being [i]"a bit abrupt"[/i] when it is (at least partly) due to an underlying condition... Or they're from Yorkshire.

You've made enough observations of yourself already to be able to make huge changes in your personality and behaviour. Next, consider finding a quiet corner, sitting comfortably, and having a word with yourself. You are the source of most of your stress.

lazybike - Member

GP and happy pills...seems to be the norm.

don't do this...

more sport. go to the sauna. less time time what stresses you, even if this means changing job.
smoke weed. chill a little.

Any chance you might be somewhere "on the spectrum"?

i thought this, too... but not going to make a difference if he is or isn't. what good does knowing that do him?

Well yes it will.

doubt he is going to wear a badge saying "certified social spas

Really?

Alpin did you actually say that? Not saying it's Aspergers or not, but it if were and he knew, he could then have a much better understanding and some strategies to help. Why on earth would you describe it like that?

Ignore people who immediately suggest aspergers.

You have testosterone running though you, some people have higher levels than others and some peoples fight or flight mechanisms are set off more easily - these are the roots of your behaviour - and you have to remember that if you were a hunter gatherer, your behaviour would be quite normal.

The best thing is self-awareness and some CBT, you'll eventually catch yourself before you start acting the way you describe - and you'll be able to nip it in the bud.

Good luck.

ok... sorry. not the best term to have used.

would i have been better off saying retard?

have a few friends & colleagues who are "on the scale". they are what they are. i and others still have to deal with them and it can be frustrating at times despite knowing that they are awkward characters. you can't expect everyone else to change their attitude towrds you becuse you have labelled yourself as having some condition.

@ drac.... maybe it may help him, but he is a grown man and has got this far in life without the label... i think he can sort himself out without a label.

The best thing I've ever done for my mental state and happiness is meditation. Try the Headspace app - accessible guided meditation. It takes a bit of commitment but once I'd done a few weeks of it I realised it made me a better husband, father (3 and 1 year olds so it's fairly intense at times) and boss (I run my own small business, which is pretty full-on too).

I've become a complete evangelist but honestly, I think everyone would be happier and the world a better place if they did this.

My advice would be to learn the one lesson of NLP that I found useful. There are only positive concepts. Not negative ones.
So if someone says "don't" it translates as "do". How's the only way to get a kid to stick baked beans up his nose? Tell him not to.
So don't tell yourself not to be a gobshite. Tell yourself to talk nicely to and about people. Because your lovely and interesting personally will come across that way.

You are the source of most of your stress.

This.

I have problems with stress. I grew up in a stressful household and had a very stressful upbringing... so I essentially inherited it.

However, as an adult, the fact I still let it impact me comes primarily from my own inability to have properly dealt with those past events. Whilst it's perfectly normal to fail to deal with past events, it's not helpful.

The big lesson I learnt ten years ago when I mismanaged my stress to such a level that I pretty much had a breakdown was that it wasn't the environment I was in so much as my inability to get a broader sense of perspective on my situation. That's not denying that my situation wasn't deeply unpleasant, but the fact it nearly broke me was my own response...

I would suggest CBT - it'll really help you deal with the underlying issues as well as raise your awareness of how you think and how you talk to yourself and why you behave the way you do. It can be transformational if you go into it with an open mind, determined to deal with your issues... The fact you've posted on here suggests you are

@ drac.... maybe it may help him, but he is a grown man and has got this far in life without the label... i think he can sort himself out without a label.

It's an illness and only considered a label by senseless people who use retard and spastic.

Thank you all

I'm going to try some meditation for the stress and CBT for the prickishness, can anybody suggest a good book for CBT?

The Aspergers thing is very interesting, looking at the symptoms I exhibit an awful lot of them, not just what I've outlined above. However I'm not sure what the diagnosis will give me other than a possible referral for counselling, CBT and maybe medication.

Or you may just be an introverted asshole, like a lot of other men.

can anybody suggest a good book for CBT?

A proper therapist is the gold standard solution

Do you ever say Sorry?

also this

Ignore people who immediately suggest aspergers.

^^ this

Don't be too hard on yourself. You have spotted the problem and you are doing something about it. You will continue to behave in ways you regret but if you spot yourself doing it try to step away from that behaviour, try to apologise, try to move on. Don't fight the bad behaviour, just let it go. It isn't who you are, it's just how you're behaving at that moment.

...I'm a very blunt instrument and do not change my behaviour depending on who is around and where I am. Therefore if my ire is directed at you, it could be in public which is obviously very embarassing for the recipient of my obnoxious manner. I know that I'm embarassing myself also but that's not the issue.

You aren't a blunt instrument, that is just a learned behaviour pattern. Anything can be changed, if you're open to change. People into fall into habits and behaviours because it's the easiest in the short term but they're rarely the easiest in the longterm.

Your problems cannot be solved by meditation, in fact if not handle well with meditation you might get worst before you get better.

Mindfulness perhaps is better but that's just temporary as you are not dealing with the root cause of the problem.

The root cause of the problem at the moment seems to be external to your internal well being.

Yes, you might be able to control yourself but at some point you are going to break and there will be no going back.

People will break ... mind will break ...

deadpool - Member
Work and home life are the causes of the stress.

Work pays quite well and is generally very enjoyable, I like it but no position is without some stress. Every 6 months or so it gets very challenging.

One of the members of the household is extremely high-maintenance because they're emotionally fragile, they're paranoid/neurotic and need constant reassurance and support, this comes from me.

If this is self centered attention seeking behaviour then you need to really put this person in his/her place ...

Hi
I am answering this on my phone so can't really do a full answer

This is a very similar situation to how i found myself a few years back. Counselling helped greatly. So did having a trigger phrase for both of us to use to get time out.

You can change your behaviour. I did. Seems to me that a lot of your issues stem from your behaviour so change it.

I'll answer more in the morning

Do you play lots of video games? They can have a tendency to make you anti-social and develop poor commnication skills. I remember a kid we used to hang out with back in the early 80s. Good kid he was, but one year he got a comphter at Christmas and we barely saw him again. Whenver we did, he seemed to have little time for us and barely spoke. All he really wanted was to play his video games. Came a time when we stopped calling for him, it was just pointless. Conversations tended to run like this. "Hey, shall we call on Jak and go and hang out in the park?" "Nah, there's no point,he's on the spectrum"

As per TJ I was pretty much like that a few years back, my missus was getting seriously pissed off with me as I was going apeshit at everything and anything, wherever whenever. Looking back I have no idea who that person was and where they came from.

I never got professional help, most mindfulness stuff (or whatever it was) just annoyed me and talking about it did bugger all. Finally got my head together after reading a book and using the techniques in it. Occasionally redo for a "topup" but to be honest I never get anywhere near as bad as I was.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/59-Seconds-Think-little-change/dp/0330511602

Not saying it'll work for you but did for me.

I'd put a year's wages that your friend Jak had far more going on than his spectrum. I bet his spectrum was his escapism from what was really troubling him but no it wasn't something else it was the evil of Jet Set Willy.

For me it was simple realisation. Mine wasn't stress related, i was just an arrogant wan5er. Just a complete muppet really at times. Being sarcastic, harsh, cutting and offensive...

I sat there and thought to myself "is this really who i want to be"

I changed there and then, sorted my head and became a far more rounded person, more tolerant and more friendly.... People noticed very quickly and my life got better.

I'm not sure if everyone can 'change' just through choice, but to me it seems like you have to set your mindset yourself to a great extent.

You can choose to be stressed and feisty... or you can choose to be happy and enjoying the world... Once you do the latter, it all becomes that little bit easier to just accept things.

Good suggestions above. Well worth going to couples counselling as a mediated conversation that can help you to see each others perspectives and help with your communication.

Good suggestions above. Well worth going to couples counselling as a mediated conversation that can help you to see each others perspectives and help with your communication.

Er, yeah, that too.

OK - got access to a full keyboard now

this is learnt behaviour by you - its not who you are its who you have learned to be.

15 years ago0 me and t'missus nearly destroyed our relationship in a cycle of arguing distrust and blame. Two things saved us - wanting to save it and being prepared to take the steps no matter how painful. You seem to have reached the first of those - wanting to save it. the second is what you need to do next.

To show you how ridiculous and overblown it can become one of our biggest rows was over the merits of alternative taxations systems. the rows / behaviour are not the cause - they are the symptom. ~The cause is whatever drives those behaviours

If your job is making you stressed to the point of damaging family relationships then you have to do something about that. Either change the job or change the way you react to it. The stress drives the behaviours that damage the relationship.

I am a big fan of counselling. We didn't do much - 3 sessions IIRC but it was a huge help having someone else who can dispassionately look at the dynamic and suggest ways of coping.

I am not sure you need full blown psychotherapy just someone who can see whats happening without emotion

One thing that helped us was having a trigger phrase that we both could use that the other had to respect and take a time out. Another was to take all the judgement out of it ie not " why is he being a shit" but "what is leading him to behave like that".

YOu need to reset your behaviour patterns and this can be done and in our case it wasn't actually that hard and I doubt it would be for you either as you seem to recognise that your behaviour upsets your family and you want to save your marriage.

so how do you save your marriage? By stopping the behaviour that damages it. What behavioir damages your relations ship? being snippy. so if you want to save the marriage then stop being snippy. all you then need to do is find a route to do this

Break it all down into little steps like that it becomes easy. one thing leads to another in a positive spiral not a negative one.

One final thing is to apologise to yourwife now in a maeaningful way and tell her that you want to change but will need her help and support. She is your ally in allthis

Hope that makes some sense and good luck. You are already well on the way here just need a map to find the path out of the woods.

One thing I'll add,

Dealing with people you don't know and dealing with people like your wife are two different things. Talking with my OH I can be the same (as can she TBH), but we thrashed out that when we get like this that it's not personal and that sometimes we're just abrupt and "matter of fact" without being angry or spiky. When the other takes what one says the wrong way, we back out and go "no, sorry, I wasn't angry, just blunt" and it prevents it escalating into a pointless argument where she's angry because I am, or I'm angry because she is, and in fact neither of us was actually angry in the first place. After a while it becomes second nature, but you need that understanding to enable a change in behaviour.

Dealing with other people, well, when you work that one out let me know. (-:

IME a simple regular meditation practice (perhaps mindfulness of breathing or similar)will make a big difference to the way you feel and behave. I get stressed very easily am quite arrogant sometimes and suffer with anxiety and an inability to relax.
when i meditate regularly ( i've done it for 25yrs ) I seem to change , become calmer and better to be around/more content and the anxiety and stress seem to melt away. Lots of people seem to like the headspace app to help but I can recommend Insight Timer ( paid version £2? ) which is really good allowing you to customise your sessions or choose from thousands of great guided meditations.
Also you might like to try Yoga Nidra which is also available guided on the app.
HTH
Bill

Stress can be a consequence of loss of control of one's situation. If you find disagreements or arguments difficult to handle or stressful, you might find a book called 'The Power Paradox' by psychologist Dacher Keltner useful. It isn't a self-help book, it isn't marriage guidance, more a discussion of some theories, with practical implications.

Kaiser - That sounds familiar, I'll set aside the time I think, I don't see how it can hurt.

Had my first counselling session last week and half way through the counsellor said that she had repeatedly put in her notes about aspergers. She continually referred back to that thereafter.

She was careful not to make a diagnosis but made it plain that her opinion was that I had aspergers.

I'm not sure what to do with this, I'm conscious that it could become an excuse and I really want to avoid that.

I'm not sure what to do with this, I'm conscious that it could become an excuse and I really want to avoid that.

I'd worry less about the possible diagnosis and more about learning how to adjust your behaviour. Relationship counselling is 50% about understanding each other's behaviour and 50% learning how to communicate better, which requires both parties to make an effort to change behaviour.

She was careful not to make a diagnosis but made it plain that her opinion was that I had aspergers

Then change your counsellor immediately. Aspergers is no longer a thing, she should have been aware of that and should not be using the term.

What are her credentials?
Counselling has the problem of attracting enthusiastic amateurs.

Kaiser - That sounds familiar, I'll set aside the time I think, I don't see how it can hurt.
Had my first counselling session last week and half way through the counsellor said that she had repeatedly put in her notes about aspergers. She continually referred back to that thereafter.
She was careful not to make a diagnosis but made it plain that her opinion was that I had aspergers.

That doesn't sound very helpful... she not 'making a diagnosis' but she is clearly making an assessement and letting you know - which is as near as.

Aspergers is no longer a thing, she should have been aware of that and should not be using the term.

Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're getting at, I'm not sure as "incorrect terminology" is a compelling reason to be kicking out a counsellor?

You are misunderstanding. Use of 'incorrect terminology' is not a reason to kick out a counsellor. Failure to keep up with recent changes within a largely unregulated profession, is.

What do you mean when you say aspergers is no longer a thing?

aspergers is no longer a term used in the medical world and it hasn't been for a long time. Its ASD or Autistic spectrum disorder

Having said that I don't think its particularly important what term is used but I would question a councillor even thinking that and especially telling the person.

thats not the sort of counselling I know.

I....agree....with....with.....T.....J.

Agreed with TJ
it's not their place to say so at all.

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day 🙂

Failure to keep up with recent changes within a largely unregulated profession, is.

Perhaps she's perfectly well aware and is deliberately using language that she thinks a client is more likely to understand?

"Asperger's" may well no longer be a thing in the medical profession, but I doubt it's going away any time soon in public. I've heard many more people refer to themselves as Aspie than I have saying "I have Autistic Spectrum Disorder." "Aspie" is here to stay if only colloquially.

I would question a councillor even thinking that and especially telling the person.

It's a good point, I did wonder the same myself (and by extension, whether it's in a counsellor's remit to be up to date on Asperger's / ASD).

I'm not sure what to do with this, I'm conscious that it could become an excuse and I really want to avoid that.

It can/could become an excuse if you let it, but formal diagnosis can also be quite liberating and can open doors to help/support that otherwise would not be there.

all NHS trusts have to have a diagnostic path in place for ASD, and your first point of call would be the GP, who can refer you on, but the wait can be significant (I was initially referred by GP for a MH assessment, and they referred me on to specialist ASD team, it took just under a year for a formal diagnosis, which was on the basis of score sheets and a two hour plus interview)

IMO its a somewhat unusual thing to say and goers completely against the ethics of the counselling I was trained in. Differnt models of counselling have differnt rules tho.

As others have said CBT might be a way forward, however I would not advise a book, you can't really get it from one! More towards group or solo with a therapist. My therapist steered me away from CBT as my mind would dissect it too much, and would destroy the group dynamic (her words not mine!).

I found it useful to realise that I am on the spectrum, not because it gives me an excuse, but rather it allows me a prism to view my behaviour through! I think that along with the therapy I developed a toolbox of strategies for interacting with people in a more positive way!

Perhaps she's perfectly well aware and is deliberately using language that she thinks a client is more likely to understand

Yeah, perhaps! 😀

Keep up the fight! 😀

, whether it's in a counsellor's remit to be up to date on Asperger's / ASD).

If you're going to talk about it in a professional context? Yeah, I reckon it's important to know about it.

Seems to me that I should be ignoring the councillors faux assessment and look to address the issues myself.

I'll ask about a formal diagnosis but I'm not going to hang my hat on it for now.

Thank you all

There's a certain irony to people getting all pedantic about the counsellor calling it Aspergers here.

Seems to me that I should be ignoring the councillors faux assessment

Speak to your GP in the light of what she's said? Take the online test? I have to admit I was way ahead of her based on your OP.

And +1 for Ninfan that you could find knowledge of the condition liberating and helpful, even if you don't go down the formal diagnosis route.

Keep up the fight!

I've no interest in a fight, I just thought "find a new counsellor" was a bit of an overreaction is all.

Deadpool. Its a minor issue and fairly irrelevant really. the key thing is do you get on with the counsellor? IMO that is the one critical thing in counselling. Styles etc are all secondary to that

As someone who struggles with stress management myself and who struggles to get myself out of the house unless I have a "proper" purpose, such as cycle commuting to work, try and do more aerobic exercise.

I've no interest in a fight, I just thought "find a new counsellor" was a bit of an overreaction is all.

I'm expressing an informed opinion, If you have a different one, you should express it, not just criticise mine. You already accepted that you misunderstood the initial statement with regard to finding a new counsellor. Your discussion should be with the OP, not me.

There's a certain irony to people getting all pedantic about the counsellor calling it Aspergers here.

And I don't really want to derail the thread, but this misrepresentation n and misunderstanding of ASD is just not helpful. Not to mention the misunderstanding of the word irony

Sorry OP.

I'm like you OP. I sporadically use mindfulness, and I've read a lot of self help books.

For me its my work that leads to stress, which then gives me a short fuse and I also am rubbish at communicating hindered by a very dry sense of humour which some don't "get".

I found that using mindfullneess principles - 10 minutes of meditation to relax, not "wanting" for material things. not reacting to others but thinking before I respond. The best thing I find is a really short (and cheap) book available in paperback and Kindle books called "The poet of acdepying yourself" by Michael Cohren. Its a really good plan English book about simple stuff, which when you actually apply then really helps.

The one very applicable to me - and perhaps this short fuse situation - is The tale of the two arrows. The basic metaphor is that, if you are in pain because someone has shot you with an arrow, would you pick up another and stab yourself with it? The example given is missing a train. Ok, so your annoyed, you'll be late for work, you have to wait now for another 10 minutes and you'll have to explain yourself to your boss. BUT, if you stand on the platform watching the clock slowly getting angry at further delays, stressing over the fact your perhaps could have brushed your teeth quicker, or blaming the guy that walked slowly in from of you just now aka all of which represent the second arrow, do you think it'll get better? No. You'll be more stressed. So forget the first train, wait patiently for the second without the above and deal with the aftermath intelligently as it comes.

That general metaphor has helped me quite a bit.

this misrepresentation n and misunderstanding of ASD is just not helpful.

I think I have a fairly good understanding of it.

Of course it's a mistake to generalise for ASD, but a tendency towards pedantry and "being a clever clogs" is a common feature - and is something I have to deal with on a daily basis.

And being aware of this tendency can help modify its expression IME - so, y'know, I thought that comment might be helpful in a way.

🙂

I generally pretty much as myself 'Am I about to be a cock?' before I respond to anything potentially stressful. I'm generally quite manic and can be quite volatile.
It's generally helped on 4 fronts, not all of which were intended.
- I say less things that make me a cock.
- My general outlook is more positive as that pause for thought allows me to see beyond my knee jerk reaction.
- My general reflection and planning skills are more positive. Some people find this in itself annoying as I'm too upbeat.
- I really focus my ire at people who I want to be upset.

If looking for a good book, I'd definitely recommend Steve Peters' "The Chimp Paradox"
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Chimp-Paradox-Management-Programme-Confidence/dp/009193558X

He trained and worked as a forensic psychiatrist and now works with British Cycling, and lots of others.

His basic premise is that there are three main parts to your mind that shape your personality, and the main one that acts first without you having time to govern it is your inner chimp. Chimps react emotionally, they want to fight and they want to win. They're not good, they're not bad, they're just chimps.

It's an excellent approach to looking at why you think about things, and why you react to things, the way you do. And how you can understand and change it, and prepare for challenges in future.

Of course, it's not the only approach, and not the only answer, and may not even be the answer, but I've found it excellent (so far) in making me think about how I react at times and - sometimes - at least making me pause before acting like a dick.

I'm expressing an informed opinion, If you have a different one, you should express it, not just criticise mine.

I wasn't criticising anything, you're seeing arguments that don't exist. I don't particularly have an opinion as I've no idea what sort of counsellor the OP is seeing and thus don't believe I'm in a position to pass judgement on what she should or shouldn't know. I was trying to understand why you held the opinion you did is all.

misunderstanding of ASD is just not helpful.

Sadly, it's all too common.

I was once pulled up at work for allegedly being abrupt & confrontational.
When I asked for examples it turned out some tosser had taken a dislike to me because I was northern and was economical with my vocabulary ..and then several years later it appears that I'm on the autistic spectrum . You ought to ignore the last bit though...ffs.
Hope the counsellor helps .

And here I was putting a post on here cos I thought it was mainly educated and self reflective blokes with a desire for self-improvement.

Turns out we're mostly a bunch of dysfunctional cocks on the spectrum!!!

No wonder I feel right at home.

🙂