Anyone tried/trying to quit sugar?

Following with interest. I know I need to reduce my sugar and bready intake. I'll pack a salad and fruit for work. As soon as I get home I'm raiding the cupboards, and the easiest thing to grab is chocolate bars or a quick sandwich before tea!
Maybe I need to force myself to have a bowl of porridge instead.

I think personally you'd probably do better avoiding ultra highly processed food.

Nova groups for food processing (openfoodfacts.org)

I try to limit my sugar intake as much as possible as diabetes runs in the family, I don't want that as I've a penchant for craft beers that I plan on continuing to enjoy too much once a week for as long as possible without worrying about blood sugar levels and eyesight etc, I also really like sour sweets.

I find for me, I notice the effects of the strong highs and lows when eating things with Palm sugar in which tends to be most supermarket available chocolate these days, I find aldi tends to use normal sugars in their own brand chocolate still. Looking at a lot of the research coming out from the US where it's Palm this and Palm that, is in almost everything as well as high fructose corn syrup, it seems a hell of a lot worse compared to traditional cane sugars.

For me now, I tend to only have a couple of sour sweets and a small chocolate biscuit a day as I'm dieting, most of my sugar intake is from natural stuff like fruit which I ensure I eat the skin with as I read before there's something to do with the fibres in the skin which changes how our body uses the sugars in the fruits and how they're digested, which is why an apple is fine for diabetics but not pressed apple juice with no added sugar. Wherever possible as I've always had a mega sweet tooth I've replaced sugar with either sweeteners or natural sugars like honey, so coffee on a morning is with sweetener like stevia which you get used to the taste of after a while but is a natural sweetener, porridge with honey in etc

I've not noticed any other health benefits other than being less tired/more stable due to no ups n downs, less over all lethargy and sleeping better, not waking up in the morning feeling like you've been dragged through a hedge backwards but that being said my sugar intake 6 months ago was massive especially on an evening watching telly I wouldn't think twice about eating a mars bar duo or the better part of a big bar of dairy milk and a bag of tangfastics with a couple of beers

There's a difference between certain naturally-occurring sugars, and processed shite. I have a terrible sweet tooth, so I know hard it can be.

Like coming off any drug, it will feel rough to break the cycle because you have become dependent on the short-term peaks you get from eating large quantities of sugary foods. You're going to have to train your body to look to other energy sources rather than just cry out for a bag of Tangfastics.

Sounds like you're going to need your partner's help if you have a problem with willpower though.

You can start heading in the right direction with some of the advice above about slow-release carbs etc, or go full turkey with some kind of Keto(ish) effort, after a few days of feeling like shite you might be amazed at how good you feel, and how steady your energy levels are during the day.

If you don't fancy that, a good starting point is evening discipline, laying off pretty much everything after, say, 7pm, so you get a 12 hour fast.

Yup, I have along with a few other things...
Back at the end of March I cut out Alcohol, Wheat, salt and sugar, and bacon...
I didn'tthink I'd be able to do it but it was no harder than quitting fags.
Quitting sugar meant a change in habit. Gone were the cups of tea I thrived on as tea without half a spoonful is revolting. I swapped to Ginger with lemon or lime juice. So caffeine was out too...
I have since relaxed a little with regard to the other things but sugar is still out and will stay out! I do have half a spoonful of local honey with my porridge (for hayfever reasons, honest!), and plenty of fruit and nuts, but nothing refined.
I feel so much better! Sleeping much better but not having any vivid dreams yet...
10kg lost, 5 to go until I am the same weight I was at 40....
Do it! Bread is harder....
But don't rule out the effect an enthusiastic partner can have...

Yes, I cut all refined (white) sugar and associated products many years ago now. Best thing I ever did. It completely changed my palette and taste buds and even food I didn't like previously I started to enjoy.

Best advice is to remove all temptation from the house. Have something to nibble on as replacement - salted nuts or something like that. Don't give in to temptation 'as a reward' - you need to treat it like smoking. After a while you just forget about it really. Once you get to that stage then you've done it, there's no temptation at all - sugary crap tastes like sugary crap, so you don't even want to eat it. Other foods - real foods - become much more appealing and tasty. I still eat a few sweet things occasionally, but only what I can make with natural (nutritious) sugars e.g. honey, malt extract, maple syrup, molasses etc.

I wouldn't try and do too much at once. E.g. cutting bread is pointless unless you have a problem with gluten. Just buy (or better make) quality bread. As for cutting bacon, well that's just insane.

But don’t rule out the effect an enthusiastic partner can have…

This is a massive one, having a partner that wants to achieve the same goal helps hugely, or even if they don't they don't do whatever it is you're trying to quit around you. Like if you wanted to quit mcdonalds but then they take you through the drive through and start scoffing a cheeseburger in front of you is gonna make willpower 10x harder, as all of those who have quit smoking and have partners who also smoked, it's easier to quit together.

I think personally you’d probably do better avoiding ultra highly processed food.

I think that is the key, but I guess most bread falls under that banner too.

Get rid of processed stuff and you reduce unnecessary sugar and salt.

I’m type 2 diabetic so I have to watch my sugar (and other carb) intake.
Step 1 for me was many years ago, switching from sugar to sucrose or aspartame sweeteners in tea - to the effect that now I don’t like sugar in tea
Step 2 has been harder - do the same for coffee…

The rest is basic diabetes blood sugar management - take the pills the doctor gives me but also ensure I’m not eating standard chocolate in full-size bar sized doses. A little bit now & then doesn’t hurt but one or two Mars Bars a day certainly will.

However, you can go too low - hypoglycaemia - in which case the advice is eat a couple of Jelly Babies and a Rich Tea biscuit. Haven’t gone that low since I started monitoring my blood sugar levels, thankfully

Pseudoscience aside, I think it's a good idea to cut down generally. We consume vast amounts of the stuff and it's just not necessary. And I'd quite like to keep my teeth.

I cut out sugar in tea forever ago. I cannot stand sweet tea now, it's just wrong. I tapered off over time with coffee, I take like half a spoon these days, I haven't quite made the jump completely but probably should / could. I switched to diet fizzy drinks a few years back, that was initially unpleasant but after about a fortnight I'd acclimatised and it was normal. That was probably the big one, the amount of sugar in stuff like Coke is scary and I drink a fair amount of it.

Everything in moderation though, including moderation. I'm still partial to the occasional chocolate bar or handful of sweets. Anything that come from a "sharing" bag (ho ho!) I'll decant into a bowl rather than sit there troughing the entire bag; this was actually a happy accident because I started doing it to avoid disturbing others with sitting there rustling whilst watching TV, but as it turns out it's an effective means of portion control. If I want more I'll go and get more, but I actually have to get up and get it and often I can't be arsed.

Have I noticed a health difference? Honestly, not especially. But my innards probably thank me and when I saw the dentist last month for the first time in about five years he wasn't having at me with an ice pick.

Sounds like you’re going to need your partner’s help if you have a problem with willpower though.

Yeah, I'm trying to lead by example rather than insist she cuts back on the stuff she enjoys, she doesn't really need to anyway, she seems to have found the perfect balance of exercise (little, often, not cycling 🙄) and lifestyle where she can control her weight/mood/no back pain and still enjoy nice stuff.

As soon as I get home I’m raiding the cupboards, and the easiest thing to grab is chocolate bars or a quick sandwich before tea!

Pretty much this for me, but helpfully I started to really notice the binge effect that sugary stuff had on me, e.g. I couldn't possibly eat just one cookie/one Gregg's millionaire shortbread slice etc. I had to eat the entire pack at probably a billion calories and a weeks intake of sugar in one sitting. I'd then feel like crap for the rest of the day. Acknowledging this is gradually making it easier for me to resist the first cookie. It's not really willpower but just having faith in how much I'll regret giving in after that initial, glorious 30 minute binge 😎

I've mentioned on here before, I was diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes linked to my second bout of COVID, between that and a Type 1 diabetic teenage daughter I have become a bit of an expert on carb consumption and reading packets.

I am lucky in that i take no medication and have placed myself back into remission purely with diet exercise.

Things I have learnt along the way...

- Carbs themselves are not bad, whatever an american flogging the keto diet tells you, it is about the type of carbs, when they are consumed and what they are consumed with.

- As my body is rubbish at dealing with carbs, I periodise my carbs around when they are needed, so if i know i am riding my bike as 6pm, I have overnight oats or similar about 3.30-4pm, so that i know i am going to be using them as fuel.

- There is a very big difference between low GI an high GI carbs, I can consume steel cut oats, quality granary bread, as much veg as I like, i can eat fruit but tend to couple with a fat/protein, eg an apple with peanut butter.

- The most important thing is to couple carbs with quality fats and protein, as they slow the absorption of the carbs into the bloodstream, stopping the peaks in blood glucose. So "food pairing" is important, so if i eat potatoes, they have to be eaten with a quality protein at the same time etc.

- Hydration is very important, if you are dehydrated, it is difficult to regulate blood glucose levels.

- How you prepare things makes a difference, weirdly if you allow potatoes to cool and then reheat them, it lowers GI significantly

I cut out all refined sugar a while back and switched only to locally-sourced raw honey.

Problem is now I keep raiding the honey jar like some sort of literal Whinnie the Pooh.

I’m with Cougar and pretty much cut out sugar in drinks and full fat coke a lifetime ago and am pragmatic about my diet.

I also avoid biscuits but have as a treat, I think the problem is when treats become habit and you’re consuming sugary processed stuff daily, loading up every drink with when you go thru a lot of cuppas is very easy.

Full fat cokes good on a long hard ride thou but meh the taste.

"– Carbs themselves are not bad, whatever an american flogging the keto diet tells you, it is about the type of carbs, when they are consumed and what they are consumed with."

Not forgetting the bleedin' obvious...
How Many?

I went for a month or two avoiding added or processed sugar. Still had fruit and booze but tried to stick to slimline G&T but that was about it.

The main things I cut down on were jam, biscuits and chocolate although I didn't eat loads of that in the first place. Don't generally eat cereals or have sugar in tea/coffee so maybe not loads to remove in the first place.

I'll be honest I didn't notice any real difference.

but I guess most bread falls under that banner too.

Pretty much any bread that lasts more than a couple of days and hasn't gone stale, yep. But that's true of all these sorts of UPF. There's no reason that a chocolate bar like say; a Twix should be able to sit on an un-refrigerated shelf for up to a year, unless it's not really food.

If you have a raw-ish, unprocessed and, where possible, organic diet you will feel repulsed by highly processed, refined and sugary food and drinks. I throw together in a container oats, oat bran, mixed seeds, dried fruit and on the day add blueberries, grapes, apricots whatever and that gives a nice rush into the day without the highs and lows and blubber.

I cut out all refined sugar a while back and switched only to locally-sourced raw honey.

I think it’s also easy to drop into the substitution trap whereby you think you are exchanging bad for good but in reality it’s more nuanced.

A healthy food item isn’t necessarily healthy at all doses 🙂

I couldn’t possibly eat just one cookie/one Gregg’s millionaire shortbread slice etc. I had to eat the entire pack

I'm more than capable of the same. I'd routinely buy two packs, one for me and one for everyone else to share.

As I said above though, the trick (which worked for me, YMMV) is to take one slice or whatever, put the pack back in the cupboard and go and sit down. Get a plate, savour it, make it a bit of an event rather than ramming it straight in your face. You get the same 'reward' and if you want more you actively have to get up and get it, and that (again, for me) was surprisingly persuasive. Putting a minor barrier in the way meant I could have a treat without automatically caning through a catering pack of Maltesers, if you're sat there distracted by the telly with an open box on your knee it's all too easy to go into autopilot and you then suddenly realise you're fishing around for more in an empty box.

Yeah, I gave up sugar in my tea/coffee. Went from about 2.5 sugars to one, then just stopped. Took bloody ages to get used to it.

Don't habitually eat sweets/pop/chocolate/biscuits so I'm doing ok there.

The writing's on the wall with bread too. Been suffering from chronic heartburn/bloating/inflammation for years, tried everything looking for the cure/cause. But if I don't eat bread it all goes away... shame cos bread is lovely.

You just have to be on it when organising your meals. Taking a packed lunch is most important for work otherwise you have to go to the supermarket. Try finding something in the shop to have for lunch that isn't sugar/wheat.

I cut out all refined sugar a while back and switched only to locally-sourced raw honey.

Didn't some experiment recently reveal that most UK honey is so adulterated that is more or less entirely sugar syrup anyway?

All UK honey tested in EU fraud investigation fails authenticity test | Food | The Guardian

I also avoid biscuits but have as a treat, I think the problem is when treats become habit

Precisely. I've had more than one girlfriend over the years with the attitude "well, I've broken my diet today, so I might as well go all-in." Eating two squares of Dairy Milk isn't going to make a difference in the grand scheme of things, polishing off the rest of a half kilo bar and washing it down with six cans of lager probably is.

There’s no reason that a chocolate bar like say; a Twix should be able to sit on an un-refrigerated shelf for up to a year, unless it’s not really food.

Chocolate doesn't go off, at all. It may 'bloom' and discolour but it's still good. (source: a chocolatier in Belgium)

Lots of things don't go off, in fact. Is honey not really food?

Step 2 has been harder – do the same for coffee…

Just stop drinking shite coffee. Honestly good quality coffee does not need sugar in it.

Didn’t some experiment recently reveal that most UK honey is so adulterated that is more or less entirely sugar syrup anyway?

not if you buy it straight from the bee 🙂

Chocolate doesn’t go off

I'll take you word for it, but the biscuit in Twix sure as shit should after just a couple of days, given that's is supposed to be shortbread. And it's not just chocolate, there's all sorts of stuff that is shelf stable at room temperature for years that really shouldn't be.

... and?

We learned how preservatives work. You seem to think this is inherently bad for as yet undisclosed reasons. I assume you don't have a freezer? Those unnatural bad boys can keep fresh food for years.

The biscuit in a Twix is wholly enclosed in chocolate which is wholly enclosed in a foil wrapper, presumably made and packaged in a sterile environment. Of course it's going to have a long shelf life, that doesn't make it "not really food".

weirdly if you allow potatoes to cool and then reheat them, it lowers GI significantly

that combined with your comment about combining with protein & fat, makes me feel a lot better about stuffing every last crispy roast potato down my throat. Can't resist them! They really are the highlight of a Sunday roast / Christmas dinner / etc.

I'm salivating just thinking about them.

I'll second the coffee thing as well - a good espresso made with relatively lightly (and recently) roasted beans is almost sweet in itself. Nothing wrong with the standard supermarket italian style coffees but they do seem to be aimed at those who like the kind of bitterness hit you can get with coffee and/or to cut through milkiness. That's a whole 'nother debate though and has been discussed ad nauseam on here.

Carbs and bread (basic man science) turn into sugar (effectively)

Lower them too, except before/during/after endurance exercise

Good job! Sounds like you're doing well. On the expensive part, just embrace that for now - while you are fighting addictions (it is an addiction) it's worth spending money to fight the cravings. eg, at the MOMENT, sinking £10 on Nando's chicken + veg is significantly better than eating a jacket potato and sandwich despite being 2x the cost. Once you've started changing your body and kicking the addiction to the effects of sugar/carbs, you can then find much cheaper ways. But for now, keep throwing everything you have at it. If that's an expensive lunch - the money is worth it for what you're doing for yourself 🙂

Good job! All sounds positive

If you have a raw-ish, unprocessed and, where possible, organic diet you will feel repulsed by highly processed, refined and sugary food and drinks.

This. This WILL happen for you. It's worth what you're doing, for this. And the ultimate health/life benefits this will lead to.

Most Honey probably is adulterated, but local raw honey is a world apart from the shit you buy at Tesco..

that doesn’t make it “not really food”.

This is nutritional label of a Twix, see if you can spot the actual food things.

Used to have two teaspoons in tea/coffee, cut down to none, now back to one very heaped of soft dark in each of my hourly coffees that get consumed until ~1700.

After eating up to ~5 bags of chocolate raisins and two 6-packs of hot cross buns most weeks got rather out of hand from around 2019, I now have one bag of liquorice allsorts per week; a bag of chocolate limes every fortnight and a 6-pack of hot cross buns every four weeks or so.

Often guilty of a jam sandwich in the evening since ditching the weekly choc raisins and x buns around Feb.

Biscuits are a very rare treat, we can have packs in the house unopened for months.

Very rarely buy my own chocolate, if I open a bar I can't stop, while my better half has a huge stash and can happily eat a square or two and then put the rest of the bar down.

Typically drink 6/8 litres of coke a week, but it's sugar-free.

Quadruple strength squash has no added sugar.

Baked beans often have sugar in these days, as the low sugar tins are almost twice the price.

Don't add sugar to cereal, might add some raisins or sultanas.

I was super ruthless with snacking in June '16 to August '17, dropped from ~95Kg to ~73Kg, now back at ~90Kg having put on 10+ since covid eight months ago.

... And that's all I can think of right now.

But don’t rule out the effect an enthusiastic partner can have…

and the need for a mid-session refueling?

The only thing I sweeten is coffee but I switched years ago to xylitol which apparently is suitable for diabetics (I am not diabetic).

Xylitol is ridiculously expensive compared to ordinary sugar but it is as "natural" as sucrose, tastes exactly the same to me, kills the bacteria that causes dental decay, has few calories, and has one tenth the GI of sucrose.

Worth remembering that xylitol is dangerously poisonous to cats and dogs though.

I started using a fibre supplement called Inulin. It has a bonus in that it's a natural sweetener, so a spoon of that in my coffee does the trick.

As I said above though, the trick (which worked for me, YMMV) is to take one slice or whatever, put the pack back in the cupboard and go and sit down.

Doesn't work for me. I'm happy to get off my arse if there's some sugar involved.

I need some kind of timelock on the cupboard. If I press a button I'm not allowed to open it again for five hours!

Typically drink 6/8 litres of coke a week, but it’s sugar-free.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/10/07/1044010141/diet-soda-may-prompt-food-cravings-especially-in-women-and-people-with-obesity

I love my Diet Coke, but I'm increasingly aware that it really doesn't help you diet!

xylitol is also a laxative in large quantities!

I’ve had T1D for 25 odd years and had always ignored low carb up until 2-3 years ago. As well as T1D, it was inflammatory bowel disease that helped steer me into it and the desire to avoid drugs with lots of side effects. I had a very traditional healthy diet at the time, minimally processed, lots of “good” carbs, along with lots of fresh vegetables which all equalled a very unpleasant life. I did an extensive exclusion diet with a registered dietitian, in conjunction with my consultant, and ended up in low carb land. It’s worked really well for me, diabetes (and bowel) can still be a challenge, but my life is a lot more pleasant and just liveable really. I’m 51 on Sunday and feeling as fit and strong as I was in my 20s and 30s, so it’s certainly put me in a good place.

Blanket statements about the affect of “good carbs” or combining foods on BG are not true, we all respond differently, what happens to me won’t necessarily happen to someone else.

Other random thoughts:

Do I think everyone should be low carb? Definitely not, carbs aren’t inherently evil. But if you’re unhealthy or consuming food that has lots of ingredients or vast amounts of sugar, then maybe you could improve things.

Do I miss carbs? No is the simple answer. I really enjoy my food, I don’t mind having some carbs (usually 10 - 50g/day) but they are not something I would seek out now.

Do I struggle with fuelling on rides? No, I’m better now than I was a decade ago, even with a few hours of high intensity, I often feel stronger towards the end of a ride, even without any refuelling. But that’s personal to me.

I make my own low carb granola, mainly walnuts and pecans, that I have with high protein yoghurt. I make “keto” pizza, which I absolutely love, thin and crispy is the way forward! There are now some great low carb beers now too, Lean Brew IPA is one. Otherwise, I just eat real food, with a protein focus.

I have been lucky enough to have been using CGM since the first clinical trials of them started, so I have had millions of data points over many years on vegetarian, high carb Mediterranean (?) and low carb diets including many many experiments of fuelling during exercise. It’s finding what works and doesn’t make us miserable, although there was definitely a transition period for me that lasted a few months. 🙂

Went from white to brown, and I only really use it in coffee, but I dont put sugar on anything else, white or brown. Actually white now tastes ridiculously sweet with a bit of an after taste that on the rare occasions i do come across it its not a pleasant taste.

This is nutritional label of a Twix

Are you sure that's for a Twix? The package labelling on a UK Twix lists the ingredients as -

Sugar, Glucose Syrup, Wheat Flour (17%), Palm Fat, Skimmed Milk Powder, Cocoa Butter, Cocoa Mass, Milk Fat, Lactose, Whey Permeate (from Milk), Fat Reduced Cocoa, Salt, Emulsifier (Soya Lecithin), Raising Agent (E500), Vanilla Extract

I know sugar, more sugar, flour and fat aren't a great start to an ingredient list and that they sneak some unexpected things into our diet but the info you've found seems to have an unusual amount of cheese!

This is nutritional label of a Twix, see if you can spot the actual food things.

No it isn't. That's a US label for a start. If the URL is to be believed it says it's a "Twix Cookie."

In any case, ZOMG CHEMICALS ARE BAD!!

Are you sure that’s for a Twix?

That's what I googles, although looking at it, it's probs a US version? Point still stands really though, if you can't make it without stuff from a lab - Whey Permeate? Palm Fat? etc etc, then what is it really? Some scientist are suggesting that the fact that these products are almost imperishable and have "hyper-palatable" qualities have moved them from beyond food and into an entirely different category.

Which scientists?

 ZOMG CHEMICALS ARE BAD!!

what d'you think sugar is exactly? Everything essentially is chemicals, Some food scientists are saying, some of the chemicals that are present in our diets in quite large quantiles, are not what humans should be eating, and have trouble digesting and could have unintended consequences. I don't care whether you eat them or not, I'm not your mum. but at the very least; ultra processed food is full to the brim with the sorts of things (fats, sugars and salts) that we know are bad for us so avoiding them will automatically cut huge amounts of them from your diet.

... and what does any of this have to do with quitting sugar? This would be better as a separate thread IMHO.

The scientists at  the Centre for Epidemiological Studies in Health and Nutrition, School of Public Health, University of Sao Paulo, Brazil.

… and what does any of this have to do with quitting sugar?

Highly processed foods are full of them.

Everything essentially is chemicals

Correct. Which negates your point entirely.

Some food scientists are saying,

Again, which scientists? Show your working.

at the very least; ultra processed food is full to the brim with the sorts of things (fats, sugars and salts) that we know are bad for us so avoiding them will automatically cut huge amounts of them from your diet.

Too much sugar and salt is bad. That's nothing to do with "processing," all food is processed unless you've just plucked it off the tree.

Again, which scientists? Show your working.

look up thread.

That’s nothing to do with “processing,” all food is processed unless you’ve just plucked it off the tree.

NOVA-Classification-Reference-Sheet.pdf (educhange.com)

There's compelling evidence to show that your more you **** about with food (industrialise it's processes) the worse it is for your health.

Didn’t some experiment recently reveal that most UK honey is so adulterated that is more or less entirely sugar syrup anyway?

All UK honey tested in EU fraud investigation fails authenticity test | Food | The Guardian

@nickc We're living in Spain now and I can get a kilo of proper good raw honey (with bits of bee et al) for around ten euros direct from the farmer. The taste is mind-blowing - completely different to the supermarket-bought stuff and is as addictive as crack.

Went from white to brown

Apart from a small amount of molasses being added to white sugar to make it appear brown I don't think there is much difference between the two.

Agree 100% with the posts above about the importance of avoiding ultraprocessed food. If you manage that the added sugar thing sort of fixes itself but you also benefit by removing dozens of chemicals from you diet. Additives in ultraprocesses foods are there to make it cheaper, last longer or make you eat more of it. They're not there to benefit your health and wellbeing.

I'd also watch with things like raisin wheats and overnight oats. Everybody is differnet but my body blood sugar wise responds to those in the similar way having a twix for breakfast. If I start the day with that sort of food I'll be craving stuff all day.

It's not an accident that countries that eat the most UPFs are fat as ****.

I’d also watch with things like raisin wheats and overnight oats

I'm prepared to be a bit relaxed with porridge oats and shredded wheat, assuming you're talking about the degree of processing both go through? I'm very unscientifically assuming there's still more fibre and general goodness than more finely processed oats or wheat.

Shreddies can get in the sea though, didn't realise they had sugar in them (even the plain ones 🙄)

Yep. There's more and more evidence to show that rather than try to remove individual items from your diet (Fat, Sugar, Carbs etc etc) let how much it's processed be your guide to how healthy it is. i.e.. prefer minimally processed food (made in your own kitchen with raw ingredients) over foods that have been highly processed regardless of the health benefits they proclaim to have.

Shreddies can get in the sea though, didn’t realise they had sugar in them (even the plain ones 🙄)

A good rule of thumb that I've developed is that if it has to be advertised at you, it's probably best avoided.

I’m prepared to be a bit relaxed with porridge oats and shredded wheat, assuming you’re talking about the degree of processing both go through?

They're both processed rather than ultraprocessed foods so good in that respect, but a lot of people (me included) get big sugar spikes from oats, wheat and raisins.

Steel cut oats generally get absorbded much slower than rolled oats if you can use those.

Not read any of above as on phone so probably repeating others.

I ditched the majority of sugar in my diet. I don't obsess about it and will still have the odd sugary thing as a treat - just had a homemade flapjack.

But in general as a day to day way to live, it's awesome. I get so much less hungry, all the highs and lows are gone. I'm also probably a nicer person to be around. Other food taste amazing (raw broccoli is the food of the gods and, to me now, tastes super sweet). Also, as a rules kind of guy it knocks out foods I'd otherwise cave in and eat "cos I'm not allowed" even if it's a self imposed rule. And that mindset that if you haven't got 1000 calories of refined sugar in your back pocket on a ride you are a bonk waiting to happen......if you live mostly sugar free it's dosn't seem to happen.

Outside looking in my vegan, (mostly) sugar free diet must look like self flagellation gone mad - but inside looking out it feels like a win win.

Just finished a tin of condensed milk. 200grams of sugar. 1300Kcal

Yummy 😀

A good rule of thumb that I’ve developed is that if it has to be advertised at you, it’s probably best avoided.

My rule of thumb is that the better it tastes the more it should be avoided.

Always check the ingredients if something tastes great!

Did keto, lost 3 stone. Now mostly eat a ketogenic (or rather very low carb) diet but allow myself to eat what I like if I'm being social.

Cholesterol went from 6 to 4. Feel loads better. Generally only eat home-cooked food, from fresh, with ingredients you can either pull out of the ground, pluck off plants or cut off animals.

If we eat badly, we try to make sure it's in the middle of the day, with some exercise happening afterwards. But we're not self-harming zealots about it.

Zero ultra processed food. Zero added sugar. Zero sweeteners (that comes in the ultra processed bit) - so none of that low-fat ultra-processed yoghurt crap.

Don't miss sugar at all. In every measurable way I'm fitter, slimmer, happier, less hungry, more healthy.

Most Honey probably is adulterated, but local raw honey is a world apart from the shit you buy at Tesco..

Definitely. We bought a jar from a farm with beehives near my mother-in-law's place in Devon and it was like liquid fudge, absolutely amazing.

A squeezy bottle of runny amber stuff for £1 from Sainsbury's is obviously mostly sugar syrup.

Just finished a tin of condensed milk. 200grams of sugar. 1300Kcal

Yummy 😀

Report back when the sugar low hits at about 4pm. 🙂

Just finished a tin of condensed milk. 200grams of sugar. 1300Kcal

Yummy

What a waste. That tin of condensed milk (along with another kilo of sugar and some butter) could have been part of a delicious slab of tablet by now.

Yep - given it up completely day to day, including fruit juice and most fruit - mainly to support my wife who has a medical condition- so can’t have sugar. I occasionally fall off the wagon, but it’s infrequent.

My experience fwiw, is that if you stop eating rubbish like cake, biscuits and other sugary snacks, you stop craving them pretty quickly. I found all that stuff properly affected me when I had long covid. I stopped eating them, I don't miss any of it.

On the ultra-processed food front, there was an interesting podcast by a pair (obiviously) of twin doctors focussing on just that. One of them went through a process of eating lots of the stuff, eventually he found it revolting. Their rule of thumb was that if you read the ingredients list and found a shedload of stuff you wouldn't find in your own kitchen, it was a good bet that it was 'ultra-processed'.

I always find it a little bewildering the way otherwise quite sane people seem infantilised by the lure of cake or biscuits - beer too, but that's another topic - as if it's some sort of irresistable crack cocaine derivative. There are, apparenlty, hard-wired genetic reasons why we crave sugary stuff - as hunter gatherers, finding a bees' nest full of honey for example, was a great way of stocking up on valuable calories when there was no telling when your next opportunity might be.

Unfortunately evolution didn't reckon with a world where sugary stuff is effectively available on tap. All the time. Anyway, I would just stop eating sugary stuff, you may be surprised at how little you crave it after a day or two of abstinence.

Yes, definitely harder than cigarettes, but also like cigarettes the cravings died down after a month or so. Also best to go as cold turkey as possible, otherwise you're just torturing yourself

My wife challenged me to reduce sugar in my diet.

I managed about half a week, despite claiming it would be easy.

Good luck, give clearly got more will power/ reason to go for it than me :⁠-⁠)

Yeah it's hard. I think what worked for me was focusing on adding in better quality non-ultraprocessed foods. It was kind of fun trying to find new stuff to eat and even learning to make stuff were I couldn't find a non-UPF version.

There's a huge mindset difference between "I'm not going eat cakes / chocolate etc this week" and "I'm going to find as many cool non UP foods to eat this week".  It doesn't need to be about denial and restriction.

Yes, the podcast, "A Thorough Examination" by Chris and Xand Van Tulleken is an excellent listen. Very enlightening about UPF, and tackled in an interesting way. We've been trying to be more aware of highly processed food since... and realising it's everywhere!

The podcast series is on the BBC website, episode one at https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0017tcx

Too much sugar and salt is bad. That’s nothing to do with “processing,” all food is processed unless you’ve just plucked it off the tree

@cougar the issue is „Ultra Processed Foods“ as defined by Prof Monteiro at University of Sao Paulo around 2009.

You may be interested in The Maryland experiment in 2018 that gives good evidence that UPFs make people put on weight through a mechanism that is unclear, exerting an effect independent of their sugar/salt/carb/fat content.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31105044/

You may also find Prof Tim Spector’s (of Covid App, Twin Study and Microbiome fame) interview on the subject interesting:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/5VSvk8JFw0Y15KZdDAupNr?si=GPp0UBYlRxqPJ-2nIB2dYg&context=spotify%3Ashow%3A1xDawqT8Cgm6HAnbpFX5T5

You keep linking to a classification system. I've found an actual article, but it's a long read.

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/public-health-nutrition/article/un-decade-of-nutrition-the-nova-food-classification-and-the-trouble-with-ultraprocessing/2A9776922A28F8F757BDA32C3266AC2A

I was diagnosed as T2 diabetic about 5yr ago/. It was only after cutting it out that I realised how much shite I was eating, mostly at work (big shared office where there was always chocolate/sweets for sharing - turned out it was really only me eating them !)

That was all I changed and I lost about 7-8 kilos (90 to 82) in a summer, fast enough to frighten my colleagues

Thought I was pretty sorted diet-wise as a result of that, though not mega-strict, but my A1c is still quite raised so I bought a month's worth of freestyle libre monitors early this year to see what was doing what. Turns out it's very easy for me to get glucose level up to 12-15 (and 20 doesn't take any "effort") but from that it takes several hours to normalise, which is the bit that I don't like. I can pretty much keep glucose below 7-8 all day if I effectively do an Atkins diet but **** me, it's boring.

I've also tried to work on my microbiota a bit - kefir, fermented stuff and increased my fresh fruit/veg

What I like LEAST about all this is that I feel pretty much NO different bewtween a careful day (or week) and a carefree one

... and completely coincidentally (because a friend commented on it), this just popped up on LinkedIn. Though it's an opinion piece and what the validity of the author is, I don't know.

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/ultra-processed-foods-whats-all-aaron-loveman-1f%3F/

The first 2 weeks was hard, as I really craved biscuits and sweet tea, but after that I wasn’t interested in them and now they taste too sweet so I have ruined biscuits for ever 🤦‍♀️

I quit most sugar back in October. We were about 18 months into child number 1 and I was dying on my arse at work every day. Interrupted sleep every night left me craving chocolate and fizzy drinks all day to try and power through. I was going through mulitpacks of chocolate bars and bottles of Coke and Lucozade every day. I was up and down on an energy rollercoaster with no end in sight.

So I just quit.

Cravings for the first week were bad but then they vanished. My energy levels stabilised. I was still tired but normal tired without the unbearable afternoon crash. My double chin and love handles were gone in a month.

I'm not on an obsessive diet or anything I just quit chocolate, croissants, all fizzy pop, donuts, ice cream, crisps. That alone was enough to make a huge difference to how I feel.

I've had the occasional chocolate or ice cream recently and there's no joy in it at all.

Oh, and pigs. I don't eat pigs anymore. Bacon and pork is dead to me. I was on the fence until I saw the videos of the piglets being herded into the gas chambers. I don't need that shit on my conscience.

I’ve had the occasional chocolate or ice cream recently and there’s no joy in it at all.

Conversely I've never really had a sweet tooth, only have chocolate or ice cream occasionally, but enjoy both when I do.

I'm prone to a bit of cakeage on a ride or after a cold swim but never buy any for home consumption. .

What a waste. That tin of condensed milk (along with another kilo of sugar and some butter) could have been part of a delicious slab of tablet by now.

Utter pain in the bum to make and it usually means sacrificing a pot.
My own recipe is condensed milk, sugar, butter, vanilla pod and gold top milk. Its the full fat milk gives it its special taste.

The original recipe for tablet is simply double cream and sugar, but apparently its really difficult to make without the cream splitting and it has to be tested for consistency using the iced water technique*.

*The ice water technique involves putting one hand into a bowl of iced water, then plunging that hand into the boiling sugar mix, rubbing the mix between your fingers to judge if it is ready, then into the iced water again before the heat burns your hand off.

A nutritional therapist helped me with a low sugar diet years ago now.
Boy was it hard. Even fructose was 'banned', but giving up fruit was a step too far.

We no longer have sweets, biscuits or shop bought cake in the house, but I do bake. Home baked goods are a weekend treat now. No fizzy drinks or even cordials such as ribena.
I gave up sweets in my 20's but cannot give up chocolate (it has to be good quality), Cadbury's tastes like a bar of fat and sugar.
In America every food item seems to be encased in some form of sweetness.

As others have said, it's easier to avoid most sugar by making all meals and snacks yourself.

Echoing some of Bunnhop's comments. Years ago I gave up chocolate, after a while I started eating some decent chocolate. Think it was hotel Chocolat stuff (before they went massive) single origin tastes nowt like most chocolate. One square was enough. I tried a dairy milk and it was horrid, sickly, sticky fatty. Then I slipped and went back to the crap stuff.
The funny bit is I don't get much enjoyment from it but I must get a hot from it somehow.

I gave it and processed foods up during the end of COVID restrictions. Was relatively easy and made me learn new recipes, ideas for meals etc. However, I've fallen off that routine and I'm back shovelling anything I can into my mouth during the day, telling myself I'll start again next week. 20kg put on in weight since.

Finding it hard to start again. I had a good few weeks at the start of the year with STW Chub Club but the wife's birthday cake set off the sugar rush again end of Jan. Need to crack it again and not go back.