[Closed] Any professional photographers here?

Bands never want to pay.
i would maybe look at the NUJ website for some guidance on rates, the thing is it’s all about licensing and she needs to get savvy with this quickly. as somebody with 20 years in the business i would shoot the band and give them a 2 years U.K. licence for just about all media for whatever fee i was happy with (off the top of my head i would want £600-£1k but it’s the kind of job i avoid). this protects you against the band getting famous and the image being used for the next 20 years on posters/cd’s etc.
so if they go huge you don't lose out.
it’s no different to what bands do with publishing deals, its the same way of protecting their income.
stick to dealing with businesses (architecture/construction) would also be my advice.

No longer in the game but used to shoot a bit and buy a lot for a major publisher and also an ad agency or two. I was going to say £800, but don't forget to button down the licensing. So basically an endorsement of wot Mr Smith said. The problem is we are in a world where everyone is a 'professional photographer' and it's down to those that really are professionals and good at it to put the brakes on the race to the bottom.

Thanks for the advice. Any pointers where she can get some good info on the licensing bit?

beyond the lens from the AOP. and i think there might be some info on EPUK website

Liability insurance might be prudent also. And a backup camera for if her primary breaks.

Cougar has it spot on - she needs to be insured. Costs start from around £10 p/m and will cover her kit, public liability and just as importantly professional indemnity.

I would recommend Markel or Towergate - both have excellent products and Markel in particular have an excellent claims team.

NOTE - I used to underwrite the Markel product and it really is very good...

Williamson Carson for insurance, they are film and photography industry specialists. And if you have to claim don't hike your premium massively like towergate.

Can I just mention that where you are in the UK will make a difference in what you can charge. MrSmith, I believe is in London? If so his rate is justified. If like me you are in Leeds/north of England it's a different story.

As a new/unknown photographer who is getting her name out she might only get 2-300 per day.

I know plenty of freelance photographers working directly for clients (no agency involved) who have a base day rate of 300-1000 per day. It all depends on the client and what their images are worth to them. You have to be pretty savvy. Repeat work could mean a lower price, if the work is easy.

As MrSmith said she would be better off dealing with businesses directly. Way more lucrative.

Something else I would advise your daughter to do is to approach local commercial studios and see if they offer work experience or see if they need an assistant. It won't pay much but it would give her a good insight into the way things work. She might even pick up some experience of lighting with flash. It's one thing knowing how to use available light but to use flash effectively is a different thing all together.

Can I just mention that where you are in the UK will make a difference in what you can charge. MrSmith, I believe is in London? If so his rate is justified. If like me you are in Leeds/north of England it's a different story.

As a new/unknown photographer who is getting her name out she might only get 2-300 per day.

Fair point, I hadn't thought of the regional aspect.
The key to all this is to be good and produce imagery that's a cut above Johnny in accounts with a dslr and an unhealthy camera gear fixation and to charge accordingly.

For God's sake make sure she doesn't get done over by the sort of restrictions the likes of Taylor Swift put on any photos that are taken; basically she assumes all rights for any photos in perpetuity.
This has stirred up a real shitstorm among photographers, and the last thing photographers need is this setting a precedent:
http://petapixel.com/2015/06/30/major-irish-newspaper-boycotts-taylor-swift-concert-photos-over-restrictive-contract/

The problem is we are in a world where everyone is a 'professional photographer' and it's down to those that really are professionals and good at it to put the brakes on the race to the bottom.

+1

My Sister in law in a professional photographer (as in that is her sole income) and she still does fashion shoots for commercial magazines for free as that is the going rate and she would rather have some work than none! This is in London as well. She's not bad either had front cover of Sunday Times magazine and a few others as well. It's just very hard to make real money as there are so many semi-pros doing work for free to try and get in to the business.

Bands are notoriously tight and there's always a steady stream of students/enthusiasts willing to shoot stuff like that. I think you'd get laughed out of the room if you asked for £600-£1000 for something like this.

I avoid doing much band/music industry stuff for this reason - unless I'm not busy and it's something fun that I actually want to do.

She's not bad either had front cover of Sunday Times magazine and a few others as well. It's just very hard to make real money as there are so many semi-pros doing work for free to try and get in to the business.

the problem is not the semi-pro’s as any half decent magazine would dismiss them in an instant unless their work was stellar, it’s that the editorial rates can be quite low. getting a cover shot is fine but it’s the commercial work that follows because of the exposure that pays the real money. my own policy is to only shoot for the best magazines (wired GQ Telegraph etc) and shoot interesting crafted images not a page full of ’10 best shavers’ that anyone could shoot, and to use it as a way of self promotion as shooting just editorial isn’t going to pay all the bills if you live in London.

the easier to shoot and more generic the imagery the more likely [s]grum[/s] a keen amateur is going to try and pick up the work 😉 if it involves high production values/stylists/make-up/studios/model makers/retouching etc an weekend warrior isn’t going to have the experience of putting all that together if they only have a Cat lover magazine cover or ‘pic of the month’ in national trust newsletter to their name.

[img] [/img]

some of my early work

Tell us more about how incredibly successful you are MrSmith. I don't think you've ever mentioned it before. Or maybe tell us about how expensive your coffee machine and vintage Japanese selvedge denim jeans were, [i]again[/i].

I think there's a few people left on the forum who don't yet realise how [i]incredibly[/i] cool you are. 😉

hook line and sinker. 😈
i’m not cool i dont have any hair or a niche mtb.
(my gaggia classic was £90 secondhand)

what is it that she has actually been asked to provide?

hook line and sinker.

I reckon your carefully crafted 'narcissistic hipster' persona must come in quite handy in the sector you work in.

You do carry it off extremely well. 🙂

FWIW if I do commercial work for an agency oop north I get around around £550 per day plus expenses. If I was going to shoot a band I'd expect to get a lot less than that. YMMV etc.

Well at the very least charge minimum wage..

i hope you declare that grum 😉

the other thing is ‘repeat work’ well thats probably going to be more of the same thing so you have to ask yourself do you want more of that kind of work for the same money as what happens on that first shoot will probably set a precedent for fee’s and what they expect from you. do an amazing job for peanuts? well thats a hole you just dug for yourself!