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Came across this BBC article and thought it worth sharing
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-50986683
But then changed your mind?
[edit due to OP edit]
😁
Yes, it’s where we send our beef cattle.
S’ya point?
Used to live half a mile (if that) from one
We're mainly omnivorous, there's few truly carnivorous humans.
yes worked in a pig/pork place in the early 90's.
was clean and had very good practice.
pigs were calmed then put to sleep prior to slaughter.
Yes, why do you ask?
When we were kids there was an abattoir near us. We'd ride our bikes out to it and sit and watch them dump all the heads into the skip like the article mentions. Didn't even register with us as being gross or upsetting.
I've been in a couple of large ones, still eat meat. It's certainly interesting - I think most people would be surpirsed at the industrial scale of it (as in a few thousand animals arriving and being processed in a morning).
One thing I hate more than abbattoirs is folk starting threads but not offering any additional insight or opinion.
Yep, with our pigs. They went in calmly, had no idea what was going on and were slaughtered quickly and professionally.
Unfortunately a few bad practices by a handful gives the whole industry a bad name. Vegan and animal activists concentrate on the extreme end.
No, I hunt for my meat in the wild.
I’ve been to one, slaughter was Kosher/Halal style. Cows struggle less, but pigs make a hell lot of a scream. Overall abattoir wasn’t that big, more local style but it was managed rather well and tidy.
I’m not emotionally attached to the food I eat, so no snowflake opinions.
I've been to a few, including a factory style chicken dismantlers.
I know my food used to have a face, so I wasn't surprised.
One thing I hate more than abbattoirs is folk starting threads but not offering any additional insight or opinion.
I hate Nazis and white supremicists much worse than both those things.
Seems like a bit of a weird article, as an example:
There's animal faeces on the floor
Anyone who has ever worked anywhere dealing with livestock will realise what a fatuous statement that is. Of course there is - where else are the animals supposed to go!
Working in an abbatoir is definitely not for everyone, and some people would defintely see their mental health suffer. The author of the article clearly falls into that category, and rightly got themselves out of the industry.
Abattoirs are fine. If you are going to eat meat then animals need to be killed.
If there is a problem it is the massive consumption of meat and how many animals are killed, not how they are killed.
slaughter was Kosher/Halal style. Cows struggle less, but pigs make a hell lot of a scream.
Why would an abattoir bother slaughtering pigs in a Kosher / Halal style?
I used to call on one in Middlesbrough about 30 yrs ago, delivering ham of all things!
One day a pig going for slaughter escaped and was running around, outside, but within the area of the abattoir, it was running straight at me and squeeling (like a pig!) and you could see the terror in its eyes, it knew what it had in store. To escape I just dived through a door into the building, it was the onto the production line with dozens of pig carcasses moving down the line as the workers gutted them, they got a shock seeing me, then fell about laughing as the penny dropped as the pig ran past.
Wasn’t pleasant, but I still eat (and love) meat!
OP should probably also learn what a carnivore is. I bet there aren't any on this forum.
You delivered ham to an abattoir..!? Talk about coals to Newcastle..!!!
Vegan and animal activists concentrate on the extreme end.
Not so, the last pigs we sent to a local abattoir for slaughter were delayed by activists. Their FB video stated that the pigs had been over 24 hours without food or water. Strange that as it's 30 minutes from the farm to abattoir and they were fed the previous evening and have a mains fed drinker in the sty.
Why would an abattoir bother slaughtering pigs in a Kosher / Halal style?
This.
Some of my family members own a small one - I have no problem with it. It's efficient and deaths are immediate and undramatic using the bolt.
My uncle who runs it has said there's been problems since they started doing halal - that's traumatic for the staff and the animals compared to the usual method. Unfortunately the market for meat in the M62 corridor that isn't nice butchers (who they sell to) and supermarkets (who they are too small to sell to) is for halal stuff.
I've been to one, I've also been to a food trade show that had a section of it with the machinery for mechanically reclaiming meat from a carcass and that bothered me more than the abbatoir
Yes
I’ve been round abattoirs a couple of times. With one exception everyone who I know who has worked at them are exactly the sort of people you would want working there (good with animals, well balanced humane). The exception to this wasn’t aloud near the live animals till they had sized him up but he didn’t last a month so it never came to that.
A friend works in one of the local ones, as well as sending his own animals there. Given the care he takes in looking after the animals he raises and his inside knowledge, I can’t imagine him sending them somewhere he knows don’t treat the animals well.
Yes but I’m not a carnivore.
OP have you been? Seems you haven’t shared your thoughts or opinions.
The article is interesting a bit dramatic but interesting and I have no doubt some will find it tough slaughtering animals daily but not convinced that article is a reflection of all abattoirs.
I've never been to one but I accept they are necessary and most do a good job. I have worked on a farm so I understand animals and the process we have to use to get our food.
However I believe that Kosher/Halal slaughter should be illegal - animals should not be allowed to suffer to please some religious types.
Unsurprising and perhaps comforting that many people are uncomfortable with industrial-scale animal slaughter. I'd be more worried if they were fine with it to be honest.
I couldn't care less about how lovely and clean and efficient it is. The way we take dominion over and use animals on such a scale is just appalling. I'm far from perfect but I'm glad as hell I'm not directly responsible for this industry. 😔
However I believe that Kosher/Halal slaughter should be illegal – animals should not be allowed to suffer to please some religious types.
They don’t if it helps you feel better.
Yes a huge one about 25 years ago.
I was surprised at the efficiency of the place. I'd watched something about how Native Americans were super respectful of Animals they killed and used as much of it as possible, but I reckon this huge place would have them beat. I can't remember if it belonged to ASDA or ASDA was a big customer of their but it works on a filter basis. They first removed all the whole cuts, steaks, then onto smaller bits for processed foods, then somewhere else for other bits and finally all the guts went off to the place they raised fishing bait.
Yes. I was the meat eating temp and the veg full timers did not want to go do the inspection, which was fair enough. Only issue being the paperwork - they were not best pleased to see it all covered in blood when I got back. Not a pleasant place to go, and I still eat meat.
Yes.
One of my first jobs at 15 was turkey killing (by hand), gutting and plucking.
Yes, World's biggest apparently it was very efficient and I am still eating meat. I am an omnivore so do mix it up a bit. Carnivore only diet would be a bit dull.
Yup, been round a couple as part of work.
I've only ever been to pretty major ones which were extremely industrial. Animals have to die if you want to eat meat. I have no issue with this.
Hopefully the majority of the industry meets decent welfare standards.
I'll be honest, I read that article this morning and struggled to see what the point of it was. It was a very click-bait headline and then nothing really shocking in the article itself. OK, so cows shit on the floor and then their heads are chucked in a skip afterwards. I'm not sure what is supposed to be shocking about that. I don't mean that in a blase way, but what do folk expect? It was hardly an expose on terrible standards and behaviors in abattoirs; just some normal practices of mass meat production that an individual found unpleasant. So they, quite rightly, got out of the industry.
Drac please read the document that ajaj linked to.
I'll say it again...
I believe that Kosher/Halal slaughter should be illegal – animals should not be allowed to suffer to please some religious types.
yes, in my job I get to see all sorts of industries and processes that aren't pretty or can be considered a bit grim. Im not a big fan of abattoirs, but far worse were the beagle puppy compounds and decommissioning the great ape testing houses (chimps and orangs) for the pharma industries in the early 90's . I had a colleague that managed 1 day of surveying in the puppy house and then handed his notice in. to be honest I dont blame him, it was horrific. Also things like lab mice being killed with a biro etc... as standard practice at the time for one particular client.
A work colleague inspects abattoirs for his job for environmental standards but sees all of the processes. He’s a vegan but not because of what he’s seen in them, he was one beforehand.
He said they are normally very well run and gave me advice to try and buy meat from UK suppliers, especially pork (so Uk rather than Danish bacon) and lamb (no New Zealand lamb) as the UK has some of the highest standards of welfare in the world.
Doesn’t upset him going to these places and isn’t against them.
Drac please read the document that ajaj linked to.
I’ll take a guess and it’s the reports on vets about non stunned kosher meat. Most kosher meat produced in the U.K. is stunned hope that helps.
The Guardian tells me that Kosher meat, pretty much by definition, isn't stunned. Most Halal meat is.
Maybe it’s halal I’m thinking of then.
Drac
OP have you been? Seems you haven’t shared your thoughts or opinions.
Yes, I've spent a fair bit of time in them. They're generally well run, and are masters of efficiency IMO.
The people in them were generally decent and humane, and got upset if they came across an animal that had been poorly treated.
The abattoirs I saw certainly weren't filthy (this was in Oz), mess happens, but quickly got cleaned up.
I didn't give an opinion because I don't know how they are run in the UK.
What bothered me about the process was how much psychological suffering the animals underwent when they were lined up for the bolt. It seemed to me that the fear was strong and they knew something awful was about to happen to them. Even though they couldn't see it happening to the beast in front, the could hear and smell it. I think that's an area that needs improved (and it may have been, my experience is now well out of date).
Have had a tour of one back in the late 90's, a small one so it was very well run and the animals were treated well. It ran for a day at a time and always had a vet supervising. Never put me off meat.
My day job takes me to two industrial ones on a regular basis, never been past the delivery bays but you get a feeling for them anyway. One processes sheep and cows, looks clean and doesn't have any smell to talk of. Staff there seem happy and it's got a good reputation for animal welfare. The other one deals in chickens and the smell from that is quite off-putting, always have lunch before going there! Some of my colleagues refuse to go there due to it. I regularly see the inspectors there at both, only the chicken one has suspended production due to an issue in the 11 years I've been delivering to them.
I also lived in an area decimated by the foot-and-mouth outbreak and seeing big piles of dead animals daily for a few weeks was far more disturbing.
None of these experiences put me off eating meat. As long as the abattoir meets (or preferably exceeds) welfare standards regardless of it's size the animals shouldn't suffer.
Worked in one very briefly, and did slaughter work during Foot & Mouth - all pre-stunned stuff, no non-stun. I'm comfortable with my diet and still eat meat.
I'll agree that it wasn't the nicest of experiences, but I always drew the positive that between growing up in a farming community, working on farms as a kid, and doing some slaughter work, even only fairly briefly, I have a much better idea than a lot of people about exactly where my food is coming from and what's been done to it. I've been into a couple that I didn't work in as well and while abattoirs will never be as 'nice' as the industry/marketing would like to portray, they're also generally* not as 'nasty' as some campaigners would like to make out. The slaughter rooms can be messy, obviously, but the processing rooms were scrupulously clean. Yes, some of the animals get a sense of what's going on and get stressed, but the vast majority didn't seem to.
*There's exceptions to every rule, in both directions...
Yup. When I worked for Welsh Water we sometimes used to get a call about blood in the river. That meant that our sewage pump had been blocked by bits of animal as the bucket sieves in the abattoir hadn't done their job (someone had removed them and washed everything down the drain). So I went off to the pump station and asked the guys fixing it to give me whatever was blocking the pump as evidence and then to the abattoir.
Clearly reading someone their rights isn't the best way to get to know them but they were professional people (apart from washing stuff they shouldn't down the drains), pleasant with me, helpful even as I went round taking notes and asking them to be more selective about what went down the drain.
The animals were stressed: stressed by the transport, unfamiliar surroundings and no doubt the smell. They were treated well within the limits of what is possible when hearding animals to their death.
The abattoir came well down in my ranking of most disliked places to sample behind some farms. Second was the tannery (the place stank and they used to set the dogs on me - but the dogs soon learned to keep their distance). Number one was the knackers yard, especially the Summer the machinery broke down and they had a couple of months of dead animals in a big heap festering, the stench was quite something lingering for days on me, the guys who worked there... .
Cows flip out over loud or sudden noises, a bright flash, sudden movements or just randomly they’re pretty wired animals nearly as bad as horses but more tasty.
Never been to an abattoir but living in assorted low budget bits of Morrocco, Tunisia and Egypt of the years I have seen a lot of animals slaughtered in the street and and of course hung up to be bled.
Still eat meat. But not a lot these days.
What bothered me about the process was how much psychological suffering the animals underwent when they were lined up for the bolt. It seemed to me that the fear was strong and they knew something awful was about to happen to them. Even though they couldn’t see it happening to the beast in front, the could hear and smell it. I think that’s an area that needs improved (and it may have been, my experience is now well out of date).
There is a lot of animal psychology being employed at the more modern facilities, look up Temple Grandin and her methods of destressing cattle.
The Ethical Carnivore by Louise Gray was a good read and covers most if not all of this.
I have- it was way better than I expected tbh, a bit old and worn out feeling (it was approaching closure) but it seemed like treating the animals reasonably well was a win-win as they were more managable. To be fair, that was for larger animals and pretty high value output so I wouldn't assume it was representative.
No, I hunt for my meat in the wild.
That Burger Cafe on top of Portsdown Hill??
There’s animal faeces on the floor
Anyone who has ever worked anywhere dealing with livestock will realise what a fatuous statement that is. Of course there is – where else are the animals supposed to go!
Anyone who’s ever been for a walk in the countryside where livestock graze will probably have stepped in cow, sheep or horse shit, so I’d be asking exactly what point they’re trying to make!
I have helped turn a live cow into dinner. It was walking around the farm in the morning and on our plates that evening.
Meat is animals and a valuable lesson many folk could do with learning
Meat is animals
And (more importantly) vice-versa.
We refurbished the one in Dundee in the mid to late 80's when I had just started my apprenticeship. They would close off an area while we tiled and screened it. Haven't eaten meat since.
That Burger Cafe on top of Portsdown Hill??
That's just taking the Mick.
one company I worked at had meat processing plant as part of customer base and we would get a copy of something like "meat processing monthly" circulated...quite an eye opener as to what can end up in meat products
I used to go to one almost weekly - in order to get maggots for fishing.
Used to take animals from the farm to one, also went to one to get some gastric juices from cattle for my phd, wouldnt want to work in one but they seemed about as good as they could be considering.