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Here goes. I was listenihng to R4 this morning and heard the report on disquiet within the Labour Party over the speed with which Corbyn is dealing with alleged anti-semites in his party.
Now, obviously I'm aware of the origins and the reasons put forward for anti-semitism in WW2 Facist Germany and that some people are ill disposed towards the Israelis over their treatment of Palestinians in more recent times.
The hole in my knowledge is why Jewish people have been villified throughout history (for hundreds of years at least) in all forms of artistic endeavour and at all levels of society - from what I can gather it seems to have the excepted cultural position.
Apologies if this is an obvious or ignorant question but I'm no historian and just want to know.
iirc they ended up - somehow - as the main money lenders, bailing out kings and churches. When said kings and churches couldn't pay back, they turned on the Jews.
I believe that one of the first anti-Jewish "pogroms" was led by King John against the Jewish moneylenders in Lincoln, but I may have my facts muddled there.
They touched on this on a BBC4 show last night. Ancient Greeks had a beef with the jews which resulted in genocidal slaughter.
They don't help themselves by hoarding all the gold and mutilating little boys penises.
They are different.
[url= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_deicide ]There is a history of the Christian churches encouraging hatred because the jewish people were deliberately not buying the right type of religion[/url].
[url= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_England_in_the_Middle_Ages#Jewish_contribution_to_the_English_economy ]Things weren't helped IIRC in that in some cases the lending of money for interest was considered un-christian and it wasn't a problem for those of the jewish faith - so those jews who lent money did well for themselves and jealously encouraged hatred.[/url]
There's also the small matter of the Catholic church blaming the Jews for betraying and killing their Christ, omitting, of course, that Christ was a Jew himself.
"They don't help themselves by hoarding all the gold and mutilating little boys penises."
And here is a perfect example of why anti-Semitism is still, in the 21st century, following one of the worst genocidal holocausts in history, a massive problem.
The other issue is that every time anyone complains about Israel killing Palestinians, they just respond with he / she is an Anti-Semitic. So the whole subject is rather complex...
Yes, BBC4 had very good programme about the history of Jerusalem last night
I suppose combination of factors as to why they have got so much stick, certainly implied last night that culture was strengthened the more persecuted they were, and the more insular they became, which is a viscous circle, similar to attitudes towards Roma, Irish Travellers etc
possibly the oldest montheistic religion in an area that helped shape modern humans outside africa and acted as a conduit between africa and europe, its a hotly contested region, we started farming there, building cities and have spent a long time doing horrible things to each other in that part of the world
The first actions in the first crusade were pogroms against the jews in Germany and eastern Europe
I'll be interested to follow this. I also have no formal knowledge of the how and why we got to where we are now with regards to the Jewish religion.
I sometimes wonder if the Anti Semitism card is played rather like the "race card" is sometimes perceived to be played. (But maybe this is just my ignorance on the subject)
Having spent the last 8 years in South Africa I can tell you first hand how hard it is to criticize a politician (for instance) without being labeled either a racist, an apartheid sympathizer or both.
In the interests of balance, if you complain about Palestinians killing Israelis you are the running dog of the imperialist Zionist war mongering machine.
It really is very complex.
So many wrongs, over so many thousands of years, coming nowhere near making a right.
The other issue is that every time anyone complains about Israel killing Palestinians, they just respond with he / she is an Anti-Semitic.
Apparantly [url= http://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/nov/29/comment ]Anti-Zionism is anti-semitism[/url] ! 🙄
Having spent the last 8 years in South Africa I can tell you first hand how hard it is to criticize a politician (for instance) without being labeled either a racist, an apartheid sympathizer or both
I have an aunt and uncle in South Africa, MrsMC has an aunt and uncle in Israel. We tend not bring it up at the liberal hand wringing Guardianista dinner parties that we [s]never[/s] get invited to....
following one of the (worst) [i]most publicized[/i] genocidal holocausts in history
Is there a word for how Native Americans are treated?
The other issue is that every time anyone complains about Israel killing Palestinians, they just respond with he / she is an Anti-Semitic. So the whole subject is rather complex...
Agreed - it does appear that if you offer the opinion that Israel is not whiter than white in its behaviour in the troubles of the last 60 years you are branded an antisemite. I can't see that any current labour politician has done more than that.
I think you mean "First Nation".
My gut feeling is that most of the current Anti-Semitic accusations being thrown at the Labour party are more to do with it's stance towards the Israel / Palestine conflict than any actual anti-Semiticism.
I think you mean "First Nation"
Yep, Canada too:
And here is a perfect example of why anti-Semitism is still, in the 21st century, following one of the worst genocidal holocausts in history, a massive problem.
Its a crudely written point but i'm not sure its actually racist. one could make the point considerably better
We have a strange situation as we do still have anti semitism. We also have some Jewish organisations hiding behind this to avoid justifying what is happening " in their name". The holocaust was horrific but that fact does not mean we should turn a blind eye to what Israel does. Many Jews are just blindly loyal to it as if a Jewish state is more important than doing the right thing. I think it says something terrible about humanity [ possibly religion to] that the most persecuted race on earth get a homeland and then become one of the most [ certainly liberal western democracy] persecutors on the planet
There is no place for anti semitism not for shouting it every time someone criticises Israel
OP your issue was covered above as to why the hatred - they lent the money and were wealthy whilst worshipping thw ring god.
OP your issue was covered above as to why the hatred - they lent the money and were wealthy whilst worshipping thw ring god.
It's the same God.
Thank you all, now before this thread (quite rightly) veers off at a tangent, can anyone tell me the name of the BBC4 programme for a bit of catch up tonight?
Cheers.
Same God, but at a higher interest rate.
Driving through Prestwich (Manchesters kosher moat) this morning I can only conclude that others are just jealous of their fantastic hats
Some would say posting these pictures from Gaza is anti semitic:
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Don't get me wrong, I think prejudice of any sort is wrong, however, all too often the word anti-semitic is used as a shield for some very dark activity.
I find the difference between how Jews and Muslims are treated by the press very disconcerting.
Is there any studies available on how often 'Anti-Semitic' is used vs 'Islamophobia'?
Absolutely fair to say that some people invoke anti-semitism as a catch-all defence regards anything to do with the 'Palestine question'
Also fair to say that some people use the Palestine issue as a defence against a deeper underlying anti semitism.
Also worth reading up on the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem: http://www.timesofisrael.com/full-official-record-what-the-mufti-said-to-hitler/
I'm really concerned about my reaction to my medication. Junkyard is making a lot more sense to me these days.
They were\are different, any other explanation is just muddying the issue.
Human beings are sh!t and anything that is not part of the tribe is to be cast out and blamed for all the things that are going wrong.
Jews, Muslims, Catholic Christians, Protestant Christians, Scots, English, Welsh, European, Conservative Tax Dodgers, Benefit Scrounging Scum, Eastern Europeans, Syrian Migrants, African Migrants, Skinheads, Long haired people, people with tattoos, people who dress funny, people who do weird sex things, people who like 650b wheels ....
List just goes on and on. Anytime anyone is having a run of bad luck, if there is a "them" that can be blamed then people will blame "them".
As for the Labour Party, I would hope that they have regulations about any discrimination not just anti-Semitic. I may live in an idealistic world but I don't think any kind of discrimination is more important than any other.
Bloody dangerous stuff this prejudice...
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Gen Wesley Clark Reveals US Plan To Invade Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Lybia, Somalia, Sudan, And Iran:
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[url= http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.611001 ]
U.S. Military Aid to Israel Exceeds $100 Billion[/url]
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Why doesn't ISIS attack Israel anyhoo?
[i]
I have an aunt and uncle in South Africa, MrsMC has an aunt and uncle in Israel. We tend not bring it up at the liberal hand wringing Guardianista dinner parties that we never get invited to....[/i]
In SA the issue is so huge and effects everybody everyday (government policy towards black owned business etc etc) that is it impossible to avoid.
clodhopper
"They don't help themselves by hoarding all the gold and mutilating little boys penises."And here is a perfect example of why anti-Semitism is still, in the 21st century, following one of the worst genocidal holocausts in history, a massive problem.
And today's award for self righteous internet crusader goes to.....
As regards:
I find the difference between how Jews and Muslims are treated by the press very disconcerting.Is there any studies available on how often 'Anti-Semitic' is used vs 'Islamophobia'?
This may be worth your consideration:
In response to a few points raised earlier I thought I'd add a bit of context.
The hole in my knowledge is why Jewish people have been villified throughout history (for hundreds of years at least) in all forms of artistic endeavour and at all levels of society - from what I can gather it seems to have the excepted cultural position.
In many parts of Europe Jews, as non Christians, were barred from joining guilds or practicing many of the the more respectable professions, therefore those with an enterprising bent tended to end up as landlords, money lenders and tax collectors as they were some of the few professional careers left open to them.
All three professions are hardly likely to make you popular and that, combined with their visually distinct appearance made them an easy scapegoat for society's ills. The 'Jews killed Jesus' was an intensifying factor and made it easier for the authorities or the Church to use them as society's whipping boys.
My gut feeling is that most of the current Anti-Semitic accusations being thrown at the Labour party are more to do with it's stance towards the Israel / Palestine conflict than any actual anti-Semiticism.
The current row has blown up due to specific instances of Labour party councillors and activists being anti-semitic indeed on social media, specifically [url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-36009544 ]HERE[/url] and [url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35810636 ]HERE [/url]
No I'm not taking sides here, both sides have legitimate grievances and reason to be hugely cynical about the motives the other, it's going to take some truly inspiring leadership on both sides to unpick his situation and sadly I suspect we'll have to be very lucky see this happen in my lifetime.
@jimjam:
They don't help themselves by hoarding all the gold and mutilating little boys penises.
This is one of the most anti-Semitic things I have read in a long time.
First of all, neither your words nor your tone hint at any irony, and secondly, your specific comment about circumcision is clearly meant to ridicule and not merely critique or question the practice.
Nice one. 🙄
Re the latest Labour anti-semitism issues, councillors are always getting fired for saying racist/islamophobic comments and tweets, UKIP seem to loose a candidate/councilor a month
yet I see no Major papers headlines about the Tories having an Islamophobia problem...
http://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/surrey-news/tories-investigate-runnymede-councillors-alleged-9949326
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-34191917
or indeed an anti-semitism problem
http://www.jewishnews.co.uk/exclusive-tory-council-candidate-id-never-support-the-jew-miliband/
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/top-tory-councillor-suspended-over-7738953
To clarify, I think Hitler was evil and the holocaust was horrific~ by the same merit, the people who provided the funds to allow it to happen in the 1st place,
[url= http://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar ]How Bush's Grandfather Helped Hitler's Rise to Power[/url]
[url= http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/bank-of-england/10213988/Never-mind-the-Czech-gold-the-Nazis-stole....html ]The Bank for International Settlements actually funded Hitler's War Machine[/url]
The documents reveal a shocking story: just six months before Britain went to war with Nazi Germany, the Bank of England willingly handed over £5.6 million worth of gold to Hitler – and it belonged to another country.
Thomas McKittrick, an American banker, was president of the BIS. When the United States entered the war in December 1941, McKittrick’s position, the history notes, “became difficult”. But McKittrick managed to keep the bank in business, thanks in part to his friend Allen Dulles, the US spymaster based in Berne. McKittrick was an asset of Dulles, known as Codename 644, and frequently passed him information that he had garnered from Emil Puhl, who was a frequent visitor to Basel and often met McKittrick.[b]Declassified documents in the American intelligence archives reveal an even more disturbing story. Under an intelligence operation known as the “Harvard Plan”, McKittrick was in contact with Nazi industrialists, working towards what the US documents, dated February 1945, describe as a “close cooperation between the Allied and German business world”.
Thus while Allied soldiers were fighting through Europe, McKittrick was cutting deals to keep the Germany economy strong. This was happening with what the US documents describe as “the full assistance” of the State Department. [/b]
Aided by its powerful friends, such as Montagu Norman, Allen Dulles and much of Wall Street, the BIS survived the attempts by Morgenthau and White to close it down. The bank’s allies used precisely the argument detailed on page 1,295 of the Bank of England’s history: the BIS was needed to plan the post-war European economy.From the 1950s to the 1990s the BIS hosted much of the planning and technical preparation for the introduction of the euro. Without the BIS the euro would probably not exist. In 1994, Alexander Lamfalussy, the former BIS manager, set up the European Monetary Institute, now known as the European Central Bank.
along with those who helped Nazis escape:
[url= http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/juliankossoff/100030163/the-pope-eichmann-and-the-nazi-ratlines/ ]
The Pope, Eichmann and the Nazi 'Ratlines'[/url]
Germany is fighting to keep sealed the Adolf Eichmann files detailing the years the Holocaust chief logistical organiser spent on the run before he was captured by Mossad agents.Those hoping to have a 50-year secrecy order overturned believe the government is embarrassed by details within that may prove German and Vatican officials colluded in his escape and freedom.
[b]Indeed, the Church's practise of protecting its own perpetrators of vicious crimes has already been well established with the tragic revelations of thousands of victims of child sex abuse by cleric paedophiles.[/b]
For the current papacy under the German pope, Benedict XVI, the 4,500 page Eichmann dossier could be the 'smoking gun' that would shoot down his plans to canonize Pope Pius XII (1939-58), aka 'Hitler's Pope.'
The role of Pope Pius XII during World War II, his relationship with Nazism and his efforts (or lack of them) to save Jews from the gas chambers are hotly disputed. Even within the Jewish community there are strong opinions on both sides of the debate.
But the latest Eichmann revelations suggest that Pope Pius XII's moral stature – and qualification for sainthood – should be judged on its conduct in the aftermath of Nazism's defeat. Once the evil of the Holocaust was revealed for all to see, the Holy See should have been at the forefront of the campaign to bring the war criminals to trial.
[b]In fact history's most savage mass murderers – Adolf Eichmann, Dr Josef Mengele, better known as Auschwitz's 'Angel of Death', Franz Stangl, commandant of the Treblinka extermination camp – escaped justice down the 'ratline' that ran straight through the Vatican state in Rome.[/b]
are also very much to blame.
gobuchul - MemberIt's the same God
That's even worse!
jive " why don't Isis attack Israel ?" is probably answered by looking at the map you posted and working out where isis is currently located , and also by considering the efficiency of Israeli internal security the ruthless might of the IDF and the fact that Hamas and Hezbollah sort of control the anti Israel game in the area and wont be keen to admit rivals.
ruthless might of the IDF
Fair point...
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So why are the US supplying such extensive military aid to Israel?
and why are MI6 and the CIA so balls deep in creating the mess in Syria?
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I'm really concerned about my reaction to my medication. Junkyard is making a lot more sense to me these days.
Dont worry its mine that has stopped working 😉
JHJ you're stuff is too "western-centric" of who/what is happening in the Mid East, you need to broaden your horizons, chap.
Can you explain to me the supply chains to Arms to Israel?
How about Saudi Arabia?
Who funds and exports the most extreme form of islam?
How did the current situation in Iran develop?
Have there been any junctures in modern history when MI6 and the CIA didn't have a presence before or during significant conflict?
Can you explain to me the supply chains to Arms to Israel?
Lizards
The QueenHow about Saudi Arabia?
Who funds and exports the most extreme form of islam?
The BBC
How did the current situation in Iran develop?
Jimmy Saville
Dont know as its a secret.Have there been any junctures in modern history when MI6 and the CIA didn't have a presence before or during significant conflict?
I'll take that to mean you can't answer...
[b]saxonrider[/b] +1
jimjam - what you said was straight forward antisemitism. Sorry and all that.
It's complex isn't it? Centuries of prejudice and dislike against the jews, blood libels, lies, conspiracy theories of which JHJ would be proud...
And then they start treating other people, the way they have been treated and on one side you see a US lobby resisting any criticism, and on the other side a desire by some arabic countries to drive them all into the sea...
Complicated and nuanced.
I'm Anti-Semitic for saying this, but I do feel "Anti-Semitism" as a phrase or word is discriminatory. Everyone else on the planet has to deal with racism but one group however has an elevated crime of Anti-Semitism that's worse than racism, because, well I'd really like to know why.
Of course, racism is treated as against a race. Anti-Semitism is against a religion. Or is it? http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/dec/02/antisemitism-is-racism-malky-mackay-david-whelan-mario-balotelli
There are many debates that Anti-Semitism is racism and if that is so, then isn't it just racism. Why the need for a distinction, and in some countries laws with harsher penalties than just plain racism?
Point I'm making is racism is racism, whatever the race, colour or creed.
errr.... are you sure all Jews are one race?!
Well, they have been defined as one in ('merican) law, but actually, it's fair to say that even jews themselves [url= http://www.jewfaq.org/judaism.htm ]don't really have a good answer to that question.[/url]errr.... are you sure all Jews are one race?!
Stoatsbrother
saxonrider +1jimjam - what you said was straight forward antisemitism. Sorry and all that.
It's complex isn't it? Centuries of prejudice and dislike against the jews, blood libels, lies, conspiracy theories of which JHJ would be proud...
And then they start treating other people, the way they have been treated and on one side you see a US lobby resisting any criticism, and on the other side a desire by some arabic countries to drive them all into the sea...
Complicated and nuanced.
Well, lets look at what I said again.
[i]
[b]"They don't do themselves any favours by hoarding all the gold."[/b][/i]
Since the thread was about the historic roots of anti-semetism, which I had alluded to, I decided to sign off with this as an example of one of the ridiculous stereotypes frequently leveled at the Jews in times gone by, much less so now.
I chose this because to my mind it was so hyperbolic as to to be obviously tongue in cheek. Or so I thought. Something which wouldn't be out of place in say, The Merchant of Venice but absurd today.
[i][b]"mutilating small boys penises"[/b][/i]
Something Jews actually do which has no place in the modern world. I decided to included this to juxtapose the first part of the sentence as there are things which the Jews still do which don't win them many fans. Small boy penis mutilation and genocidal slaughter being two examples.
Complicated and nuanced you might say.
I was under the impression that Arabs were one of the Semitic group, so being opposed to Israel for what they are doing to the Palestinians is hardly anti-semitism.
"Something [b]Jews[/b] actually do which has no place in the modern world. I decided to included this to juxtapose the first part of the sentence as there are things which the [b]Jews[/b] still do which don't win them many fans. Small boy penis mutilation and genocidal slaughter being two examples."
More anti-Semitism. That you don't realise just how anti-Semitic your remarks are, shows the depth of the problem facing our society.
"Complicated and nuanced you might say."
There's nothing 'nuanced' or 'complex' about anything you've said; it's just downright ignorant and xenophobic.
which don't win them many fans. Small boy penis mutilation and genocidal slaughter being two examples.
Is circumcision justification for hating Muslims as well?
As for genocidal slaughter - population of Palestine has risen by over 100% in the last quarter century #Worst.Genocide.Ever!
Reading a lot of 'theys'...I never knew Jewish people were a homogenous group.
With the same logic I guess we're all the same since we ride biikes...
Oh my god imagine that... Nifan and I are the same...all his behaviours are the same as me cos we ride bikes...
Well we are homogenous in terms of we cycle, so we are cyclists, like all Jews are Jews
Is it impossible to differentiate within either group - NO.
Not quite the same definition i'd use for homogenous JY...only alike in a label has been applied..we don't have the same characteristics...also, i'd never call myself a cyclist...
Anti semitism is real and abhorrent as is any form of racial or religious persecution.
However, there are cases of people crying anti semitism when someone criticises Israel. Most prominent example I can think of is when the Guardian published the cartoon of Benjamin Netanyahu building the Israeli / Palestinian wall using the blood of Palestinians as mortor.
There was a huge outcry that the Guardian should publish such an anti semetic cartoon when in fact it was nothing of the sort - it was political satire (and in my opinion spot on).
It's a very fine line and a deeply devisive issue...
To look at it another way. In the various apparently "anti-semetic" remarks here where the word [b]Jews[/b] is used, replace the word with [b]Christians[/b]. The same sentence then seemingly becomes inoffensive or far less so, and certainly there isn't an "anti" word specific to them.
i've often had the same thought as the OP....
i went to the Nürnberg City Museum years ago before i could speak and understand German. on the top floor they had a massive, ~3mx3m wooden carving of Nürnberg made in the 1930's. myself and a few other tourists who couldn't speak German hung around for the English "tour" of this minature city. various areas or locations were lit up with a spotlight and some woman babbled on about something "interesting".
i remmeber one area being lit up and the audio saying something like:
"und hier in sirteenhunderedundsirteetoo zeer vas ze synagoog of ze jews. it was burned down"
"hier was ze neew synagoog of ze jews. it was burned down in sixteenhunderedundneintyzwree"
"zis was ze last synagoog in Nürnberg. it vas burned by ze nazis in neinteenhunderedundsirteenein"
it left me wondering why the jews just didn't job off after the first round rather than coming back for more...
as an aside, why do Jews generally have big noses? i'm not being funny, but they do. i was going out with a girl from north london for a few months a long while ago. when meeting a new group or people on a night out it was kinda obvious who's group of friends they were, if you know what i mean.
Christians. The same sentence then seemingly becomes inoffensive or far less so, and certainly there isn't an "anti" word specific to them.
maybe we should invent one?
mutilating little boys penises
That's not anti-Semitic. I'm afraid it's a fact. There is more than one religion seeming to be a bit fixated on removing infant foreskin... With modern hygiene - there is a very slim case for removal and the case there is is more about reducing HPV transmission.
What does both interest and concern me is the way we focus almost singularly on one act of genocide from the last 200 or so years. Globally, we seem far more concerned with the Jewish holocaust than we care about ethnic cleansing in the former Yugoslavia, the wholesale destruction of Native American people's or the very recent attack on the aboriginal peoples of Australia... It may be just my perception but we seem to spend a lot of time, effort and money appeasing the state of Israel and not a lot helping other (Direct and descendants of) victims of similar actions.
Quick point.
Many British males pre WW2 were circumcised as a matter of course.
It was pretty common practice and had been for years.
.
Done in the name of health, rather than in the name of god.
A lot of what was done in the name of health, moral or common sense has been perverted over the years to be the word of god.
Rusty - where did you get your info from please? I did a quick search and came up with the following link which disputes your claim:
[url= http://www.historyofcircumcision.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=category§ionid=7&id=72&Itemid=51 ]http://www.historyofcircumcision.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=category§ionid=7&id=72&Itemid=51[/url]
EDIT: It seems to say that at the end of the 19th Century and early 20th it was more common.
I'm not against circumcision per se (indeed I'm a 'member' [ho ho] of the club myself). However I strongly believe that it should be the individual's choice, which means 'adult'. The creepy thing about religious circumcision is the sucking of the child's cut penis. [url= http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Herpes-Infant-New-York-City-Circumcision-Jewish-Ritual-Oral-Suction-Orthodox-268327522.html ]A couple of infections have happened in the past[/url].
I deleted that bit because it was irrelevant to the point, just for clarification.
But if people are going to use circumcision as a criticism of Judaism, best to be aware of the bigger picture.
Theres reduced transmission of HIV in circumsised males (antigen presenting cells on the inner lining of the foreskin take the virus in to illicit an immune response, but that's just what HIV wants)
That said, it's still genital mutilation (results in loss of sensation) and should be treated as such, regardless of religious or cultural bullshit. Condoms are much better protection.
Biggest...tangent...ever...And I have been here a fair while!
From talking to people who were around at the time, mostly Adam.
My dad was born in Sheffield in 1916 and raised as a Catholic.
He recalled that the vast majority of his generation were routinely circumcised.
It was discussed then as we're discussing it now, religious aspect and all.
I've also worked with lots of blokes from the same generation from the Manchester/West Yorkshire area who reported the same thing.
It's an issue in care work for obvious reasons, with many older folk unable to take care of their own personal hygiene.
It appears to be very prevelant in that particular generation.
Theres reduced transmission of HIV in circumsised males
This makes it sound like the reason for circumcision is because they're spreading their seed a little too widely amongst the flock.
Theres a certain irony to a discussion about an important racial and religious issue being reduced to bell ends
🙂
It's for the best.
jivehoneyjive - Member
I'll take that to mean you can't answer...
Hey, [i]your're[/i] the one with all the answers!
as an aside, why do Jews generally have big noses? i'm not being funny, but they do. i was going out with a girl from north london for a few months a long while ago. when meeting a new group or people on a night out it was kinda obvious who's group of friends they were, if you know what i mean.
That's a trait of many of the North African and Mediterranean peoples, Jews and Arabs are the same ethnic group, as are the early Christians because they're all Abrahamic, the People of Abraham.
I believe it may possibly be to do with increased surface area of the nasal cavities due to living in hot climates, but I've not done any research to back that up.
Woah, back up there a minute...
the sucking of the child's cut penis
Erm, what?
There's also the small matter of the Catholic church blaming the Jews for betraying and killing their Christ, omitting, of course, that Christ was a Jew himself.
Notwithstanding that, isn't Jesus being killed kind of critical to what Christianity is all about?
Theres a certain irony to a discussion about an important racial and religious issue being reduced to bell ends
Good work 🙂
As others have already said, anti-Zionism (criticism of Israel) and anti-Semitism (hatred of Jews) shouldn't be considered one and the same.
But, it is convenient for pro-Zionists to conflate anti-Semitism with criticism of Israel because it instantly shuts down debate.
Norman Finkelstein; The Holocaust Industry, a book worth reading.
nose size is a function of sinus cavity size and thats all about climate, humidity, temperature etc.
There are certainly regional clustering of nose shape, but the aquiline profile isnt just limited to Jews, native amrican, some african, Roman...
Close religions/cultures dont like marriage outside the community so traits are less likely to be diluted out, could just have help preserve it
also interesting that genetic studies have suggested that Ashkenazhi Jewish populations may have originated in prehistoric Italy, before becoming established in the middle east (at least the women), maybe its a pre-roman Nose!
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2013/10/did-modern-jews-originate-italy
@devash-that is the most succinctly worded summary of the issue I have ever read. Good work - permission to steal it...
Not really my comfort zone, but here goes: male circumcision is not limited to Jewish boys, it still happens in Colonial countries, caught on in NZ and Oz after all the troops came back from the desert campaigns in WWI and WWII. Certainly in mine and my parents generation it was prevalent, I understand it was considered to be cleaner in some way.
Proud round head.
Cavaliers are weird
Not Jewish but I am a Yiddo
C'mon you Spurs