[Closed] Am I allowed a rule of 6 thread?

We can only do it if there's an exemption specifically crafted for us. So I'll be going out with a 12 bore, just in case.

Government link

Allowed - "organised sport or exercises classes or licensed outdoor physical activity. This does not include informal sport or fitness activity with family or friends - this must be limited to a group of 6"

So if you're organised, you're fine. Assuming the guidance matches the ill thought out law that the Home Secretary doesn't understand.

If you are paying someone to organise your outdoor activity... you're okay... if no money changes hands... you're breaking the rules. Or something like that. Guides are allowed to take big groups out... two families can't go out together without a guide.

I know it is ment to be simple but I am still not clear. Are sporting events not allowed now? Or is it only if you can't social distance?

If someone arranges a ride is that a social gathering or a sport events? Or is it ok if there were 12 in groups?

I am generally a bit of a loner and social distance when I am around people but it's some of this stuff that's a bit unclear.

Pop sorry while I was writing my question answered

I'm assuming the OP is joking about not understanding it. It seems pretty obvious to me, though my life is fairly straightforward as I don't have 5 friends

Well definitely seem like bullshit distinction! I will make sure I wear a suit so that anything I take part in is formal.

It seems pretty obvious to me

It's only simple if you don't look at the contradictions!

the fact the rich can meet in groups of 30 and shoot foxes is just further proof this virus does discriminate its us and them. I don't even get how this got passed as an exception. I cannot stand the tories and anyone that votes for them.

I know it is ment to be simple but I am still not clear. Are sporting events not allowed now? Or is it only if you can’t social distance?

organised sporting events are ok for example southern enduro series. But obvs you and 10 mates cant meet for a mates race or general ride in the forest. Realistically its impossible to police

If a sanctioned event, somebody is identifiably in charge and therefore responsible for contact tracing and ensuring people stay suitably apart and wash hands, etc.

If it's a bunch of mates they could all be sharing bottles and licking each others saddles.

the fact the rich can meet in groups of 30 and shoot foxes is just further proof this virus does discriminate its us and them

..... you don't have a clue about shooting and how it's way safer [in a Covid 19 sense] than going shopping and any form of group biking.

(just FYI a shooting group would be made up of, usually, 12 people maximum spread over an area of 200-300m)

Honestly, arranging a bike ride with more than 5 others sounds like the worst sort of hell anyway. If there are say 10 of you wanting to ride the same area, why not just arrange two meeting times?

If you are highly specific and very limited relative to the grand scheme of things with regard to your transgressions of the rule you should be fine. Remember the bench mark for what is acceptable is the Barnard Castle exemption. Best to write down the scale and nature of the transgression in case you are called to account in the garden. If you are called to account - remember it's five witnesses or less. Unless you are going to indulge in field sports.

Or if the answer to the question - am I trying to get round the rules is yes then no your not allowed to. Why even ask!

The better question is do you really want to want the virus to get away from us again with all the attendant impacts on day to day life. If the answer is no then think about the consequences of everyone trying to get round the rule. Just knuckle down, the less the compliance the more likely harder curbs on out behaviours are coming.

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Are sporting events not allowed now?

Yep, my wife can play Hockey with 22 players but I can't go for a road ride with more than 5 people at the same time....

The better question is do you really want to want the virus to get away from us again with all the attendant impacts on day to day life

That is inevitable Nothing has been learnt from the late lockdown in UK. It is clearly starting to spread with current limitations so a change from 30 to 6 is not going to cut it.

(just FYI a shooting group would be made up of, usually, 12 people maximum spread over an area of 200-300m)

That's when they're shooting, but the meet before hand, driving up to the moors with Landies full of beaters and then the lunch etc all have groups in close proximity.

you don’t have a clue about shooting and how it’s way safer [in a Covid 19 sense] than going shopping and any form of group biking.

(just FYI a shooting group would be made up of, usually, 12 people maximum spread over an area of 200-300m)

You're right I don't have a clue about shooting im not that posh. If a group is usually made up for 12 why set it at 30?  its more than double what us normal people can do. From the outside it feels like Tarquin and Jeffrey want to shoot on the weekend so they added this loop hole.

From the outside it feels like Tarquin and Jeffrey want to shoot on the weekend so they added this loop hole.

That's exactly what it is, the rules only apply to non-Tory voters.

No, I'm not joking.

Example 1: paddling with a club tonight, there will be more than 6 people arriving on the same car park at the same time. There will be coaches present (probably). Actual paddling will be in groups of less than 6. I think this is OK.

Example 2: informal biking with mates organised via Whatsapp usually two groups (fat and not yet fat). Most weeks less that 6 in a group. Groups meet at the same car park. Is this OK or not?

Just go and ride, be sensible, and enjoy it. That’s my approach. Most of the ride is socially distanced so you can see the trail in front and as others have said I don’t see how the risk is any higher than playing an amateur football or hockey match where you a have no idea who half the people on the pitch even are

I think it comes down to accountability and track and trace, having had some exposure to all the hurdles our dinghy sailing club have had to jump through, as directed by the RYA, who have worked hard to get things going again. Shooting has been singled out, but for balance, there is a comprehensive list here, scroll down to 3.16: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do#visiting-public-places-and-taking-part-in-activities
I'm sure you could go on a club ride, with mitigating measures in place, if your club had followed british cycling guidelines, which would have been approved by DCMS (assuming BC have been working with govt to get organised cycling going again).

Here's a list of exempted sports:

Angling
Baseball/Softball
Basketball
Canoeing/Kayaking
Caving
Climbing
Curling
Cricket
Dodgeball
Dragon Boat Racing
Equestrian
Floorball
Football
Gaelic Sports
Goalball
Hockey
Ice Hockey
Lacrosse
Netball
Octopush (underwater hockey)
Polo
Roller Sports
Rowing
Rugby League
Rugby Union
Rounders
Sailing
Shooting (including hunting and paintball that requires a shotgun or firearms certificate licence)
Ultimate Frisbee
Volleyball

Ride Penmachno, then it can also legitimately be described as kayaking.

FYI. Me and my mates can't play our regular weekly football match because we aren't doing 'organised sport'. In this instance 'organised' means FA affiliated league (with 3rd party insurance cover), led by coaches, having a Covid Officer and having a Covid Risk Assessment carried out. We are well organised with online attendance register (Doodle) and payments so Track and Trace works. However, the sports centre we hire the pitch off won't have us - which I suppose is understandable. You and your mates (and mates of mates etc..) aren't organised enough, I would say.

I use to shoot. Things must have changed dramatically as I’ve never heard of the maximum of 12. Even the small syndicate I was in had 18 then usually 1 beater per gun if not more.

Anyway it’s all organised sports not just blasting innocent animals for fun.

Shooting can only be considered a sport if the hunted can shoot back.

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the fact the rich can meet in groups of 30 and shoot foxes is just further proof this virus does discriminate its us and them

….. you don’t have a clue about shooting and how it’s way safer [in a Covid 19 sense] than going shopping and any form of group biking.

(just FYI a shooting group would be made up of, usually, 12 people maximum spread over an area of 200-300m)

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<div>Been out with many shooting parties have you? They might be spread out while they are shooting but the beaters travel to the shoot cramped in the back of old landy's and the shooting party are in the back of a modified stock trailer around here.</div>

FYI. Me and my mates can’t play our regular weekly football match because we aren’t doing ‘organised sport’. In this instance ‘organised’ means FA affiliated league (with 3rd party insurance cover), led by coaches, having a Covid Officer and having a Covid Risk Assessment carried out.

im in exactly the same situation, in a whatapp group with friends who all play basketball. Court wont let us play for these exact reasons. Last i heard they said we could play basketball but had to socially distant AT ALL times which obvs isnt possible when playing basketball or any sport.

Example 1: paddling with a club tonight, there will be more than 6 people arriving on the same car park at the same time. There will be coaches present (probably). Actual paddling will be in groups of less than 6. I think this is OK.

Example 2: informal biking with mates organised via Whatsapp usually two groups (fat and not yet fat). Most weeks less that 6 in a group. Groups meet at the same car park. Is this OK or not?

Both are ok as the activity bit is in groups of 6, and when you are in the car park you will all be keeping to your groups of 6 because that is the sensible thing to do.

Shooting can only be considered a sport if the hunted can shoot back.

Would certainly make darts a much more interesting televised sport

Shooting can only be considered a sport if the hunted can shoot back.

Sounds like a dangerous game.

and remember if in Scotland, and non 'organised sport' then the group of 6 is only doable if it is made up of no more than 2 households.

(just FYI a shooting group would be made up of, usually, 12 people maximum spread over an area of 200-300m)

No mixing before or afterwards? No mixing in vehicles? social distancing at lunch and when they hit the drinks table?

its pure bullshit and everyone knows it. Its just about posh boys getting their thrills. rules only apply to the plebs

It's de rigeur to call them "the poors" TJ, they don't use "plebs" round Henley way.

Blahblahtoffsblahblah

Apart from the usual whining class warrior types, no one gives a shit.

Yes - the 2 households factor for sports and exercise in Scotland has scuppered my plans a bit. But so would a lung full of Covid so happy enough to play the game for the greater good.

having a Covid Officer and having a Covid Risk Assessment carried out.

It does seem to be taking a bit of getting through to people that this is what organised sport means.

Random aside - are kids football/rugby etc matches still surrounded by yummy mummies and competitive dads on the sidelines or have they knocked that on the head to keep the risks down?

It feels to me that there is one pertinent question around this; Will you or anyone in your close family bubble be statistically likely to be seriously affected by covid, taking into account what we now know?

Yes - shield the best you can and hope for the best

No - crack on but try to be socially responsible.

My opinion on this has significantly shifted in the last month - wife's a teacher, heehaw safe practices implemented and the teenagers ignored any anyway. As expected I got ill and now just recovering from Covid. Got ill, never spread it to our vulnerable family members, now mostly better. I just hope this provides us with immunity for the coming winter.

football/rugby etc matches still surrounded by yummy mummies and competitive dads on the sidelines or have they knocked that on the head to keep the risks

Our experience has been no games with other clubs for U9 Rugby, but parents present at training (safeguarding). Cricket - had a few games, all socially distanced, and parents present but well spaced out. Both clubs and volunteers involved have bent over backwards to get things going again as safely as possible and within guidelines. The spectre of a track and trace call to the club seems to keep them focussed.

Dodgeball

If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge Covid-19.

Tarquin and Jeffrey want to shoot on the weekend

So Jeffrey is a posh name now?! I'm not sure how I feel about this!

Our experience has been no games with other clubs for U9 Rugby, but parents present at training (safeguarding). Cricket – had a few games, all socially distanced, and parents present but well spaced out. Both clubs and volunteers involved have bent over backwards to get things going again as safely as possible and within guidelines. The spectre of a track and trace call to the club seems to keep them focussed.

Yep, same here. Hand gel every six overs or so for village games, my hands havrnever been softer!

Rugby is the same, all very well sorted and managed.

We played football (6 a side) outside last night for the first time since March - the people who own the pitch we hire (attached to a school) had a bunch of rules we had to follow, including that one of us had to keep a record of the names and phone numbers of all players

So I guess it's "organized" but only in so much as we have a Whatsapp group we use to work out who's available to play

Conversely we can't start playing squash again as the local leisure centre is still going through the risk assessment process

Whereas we've been playing outside in a similar manner for several weeks until the 'rule of six' kicked in. Hey, Mr Hancock: thanks for the clear, unequivocal rules. You've never had a handle on this virus or indeed, the general public. Hopeless.

So I guess it’s “organized” but only in so much as we have a Whatsapp group we use to work out who’s available to play

But I suspect the centre has a register named covid officer and the rules you had to follow were part of the risk assessment and that's what makes it organised.

Could a bike club do the same?

I need to go look up what Mountaineering Scotland have to say about the forthcoming winter. There are times when I'd rather be in a group of 3+ than 2. I guess I'll just have to pass up those situations. And with a next wave imminent putting the rescue services in a tricky position should probably be avoided anyway like we all (mostly) did in lockdown. No Gnar etc.

If you do the SportScotland e-module; sort out a register of people attending - date, name and contact number; do a risk assessment of the route and you are the point of contact, then I think you are classed as organised so can have more than 6...social distancing to be done before and after (and if you stop during the ride).

Double check what needs to be done and how long the register needs kept for and you should be good to go.

If coaches are present then rule of 6 doesn't count.

The above means that the activity isn't informal so is organised.

I think doing the e-module means you are then 'known' so again, less informal.

I've typed all that out but, I'm now doubting my understanding...as said, double check the above but that pretty much covers it (for Scotland) - I think.

Ultimate Frisbee

A friend of my daughter got pregnant playing Ultimate Frizbee, so I'm pretty certain you could catch Covid playing that.

Makes you think....

It would be much better if it was a recommendation from a respected health professional. Then we would all know what we were trying to do to reduce the risks.
Because it's a mandated policy from a distrusted government all we want to do is exploit loopholes and ambiguities.

Been a nightmare for my local swinging group

limit of 3 couples at once or just 5 men for the wife at friday night gangbang

🙂

the answer is obviously to wear tweed & pretend you are shooting grouse?

Lots of things I'd like to post about this governments mixed messaging/mess but I won't.

Instead I'll post this gorillas response to the confusion.

I've got a group of 6 of us MTB'ing in North Wales end of next month. Now, we'd be 6 from different households from England, but in Wales it's 6 from 4 households. We are staying at my caravan for a couple of nights.
Confusing ?

If you go out as a seven just remember that you are only breaking the law in a 'very specific and limited way' - which is true.

It is specific because there is exactly one person too many in the group. It is limited because there aren't eight of you.

If this fails just claim you only thought there were five others because you are only riding as a test of your eyesight and it turns out your eyesight is bad because you can only see five other people.

I'll be sticking to the rules, but to be honest I ain't going out of my way to grass up people who aren't.

Not really...unless you meet the requirements then it isn't 'right'...

A friend of my daughter got pregnant playing Ultimate Jizzbee, so I’m pretty certain you could catch Covid playing that.

QFT

Am I missing something? Aren't there loads of sports which seem to be getting the same treatment?

MTB races are still on. I think sportives are on as well. No idea how hard it is to register your group ride as a sportive though.

Am I missing something? Aren’t there loads of sports which seem to be getting the same treatment?

No, you’re right lots of sports can take place with a limit of 30 participants.

Am I missing something? Aren’t there loads of sports which seem to be getting the same treatment?

no, you are correct. Many sports (with greater chance of infection than shooting) have and still are allowed to go ahead.
Some people sadly have fallen for the "one rule for toffs, one rule for the rest of us" narrative that the tabloids have spun with the grouse shooting story though.

Apart from the usual whining class warrior types, no one gives a shit.

Bollox. Most of the country hate blood "sports" partly on moral grounds and partly because of the damage they do. I understand some of the nuance in this - but driven grouse shooting and foxhunting are pure sadism with no utility and do huge damage.

the Mirror has a reason why shooting has been exempted - its because at a tory fundraiser shoots were sold off to the highest bidders for tory funds. so once again its about one rule for the torys , one rule for the rest of us.

the point is that blood "sports" were not going to be exempt and there was a specific cabinet meeting where several ministers insisted they would be exempt - for the reasons above.

I have enjoyed the Thames Valley Cricket league for the last 9 weeks - half the usual season, with no promotion or relegation.

Hand sanitise every six overs, bring your own drinks and your own tea, no spitting on the ball to shine it, no giving your cap to the umpire while you bowl, no going inside the pavillion except for the toilet. And fist bump your team mates in cleebration, and touch elbows rather than shake hands afterwards.

Every player recorded and submitted to the league (as happened already). As far as I'm aware, of ~120 teams, no problems.

final point on blood"sports" Driven grouse moors and fox hunts have shown many many times that they do not obey the law. why trust them on this.

Am I missing something? Aren’t there loads of sports which seem to be getting the same treatment?

is fox hunting really an organised sport I thought it was done to "control" the population of animals. I don't know a lot about it but im assuming there isnt a winner at the end... well only the fox if he gets away.

fox hunting is illegal. But they still do it anyway. vile scum

Apart from the usual whining class warrior types, no one gives a shit.

Er, I do give a shit about birds being shot for 'fun' but I don't give a shit about the class of twot doing it.

You should try booking accommodation in the Lakes for 5 blokes....

"Sorry, you are from more than 2 households so no can do"

"BUt is has changed from yesterday, now it is no more than 6 in a group!"

"Not heard that one. Sorry, you can only stay if you're from just 2 households"

So even those whose livelihoods depend on knowing the rules have no idea any more.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do/coronavirus-outbreak-faqs-what-you-can-and-cant-do

It’s really quite simple, if your activity is organised - that is it is running under the “control” of a national governing body, then the rule of 6 does not apply DURING the activity but there should be no groups >6 forming before/after.

If you don’t know if the “Event” is running under rules agreed between the NGB and the government then it almost certainly isn’t because the organiser would have told you in advance what you would be required to do.

If two groups who don’t know each other turn up in the car park at the same time they will socially distance and it will be legit. If two groups of 6 know each other and “happen” to turn up at the same time, the fact they know each other risks the social distancing breaking down and it becomes possible/likely for people to exchange between the groups. You can solve this problem by simply agreeing the two groups meet a sensible time apart, or go to different venues.

Look at it this way, the more people you are in proximity to, the more likely you are to get a TT&T phone call telling you to self isolate. If you are lucky you’ll get a test and result quickly so that it’s perhaps only 24-48 hrs you are not allowed to leave the house, but it could be several days or even two weeks. If you’ve not been stuck in your own house for two weeks - take it from me it’s not worth meeting the second group for!

Part of me suspects these sort of vague, inconsistant rules are deliberately intended to distract people from questioning other, genuinely important stuff as some of the population inevitably project whatever class/culture war narrative is buzzing round their heads onto pretty much everything, while others just want to go watch wendyball or shoot at birds badly enough to up the risk their families health (by whatever percentage)...

Part of me suspects it's just that we've been given reactive, rushed rules with a lack of attention to detail or consideration of all the angles...

Either way the main message should be minimise social interaction for the good of everyone. The fact that half the population start looking for loopholes and ways to do whatever they fancy while staying just inside the letter of the (confused) law suggests the "rule of six" and all its exemptions haven't had the intended effect...

It might be easier to just splash "Rule 1" across some billboards and see who actually complies...

It might be easier to just splash “Rule 1” across some billboards and see who actually complies…

Few scientists came out yesterday and said the rule of 6 is pretty pointless. It may limit the risk but its more important to socially distance when meeting 6 or 600 people. Cover you face and wash hands the best we can do currently.... or as our glorious leader puts it hands, face, and space.

Part of me suspects these sort of vague, inconsistant rules are deliberately intended to distract people from questioning other, genuinely important stuff

I'd agree with that but the government have an impossible task. Ideally the message would be "use some common sense as the R number is rising and we don't want it to get out of control".

The problem is a large number of people don't have any common sense and need to be told exactly what to do. So they decide on a number of 6 as it gives the hard of thinking a rule. The problem is 6 is an arbitrary number and it doesn't really make sense as 6 people can sit next to 6 other people in Costa and of those 6, each have mixed with colleagues, school mates and everybody else that day.

So where do the government go from there? Do nothing and they are accused of sitting back and letting it get our of hand. Another lockdown would further destroy the economy and there are a growing number of people who wont wear masks or distance as they think the whole thing is a hoax and wearing a paper mask means the government have direct control of your brain.

I don't envy Boris at the moment.

I don’t envy Boris at the moment.

But he is in a job he desperately wanted and lied and manipulated to get. If he doesn't want to do it any longer or realises he isn't up to it then he can quit or call an election.

The problem is a large number of people don’t have any common sense and need to be told exactly what to do.

Everybody has common sense... yours is just different to theirs, and to mine. And people need to interact... when they do so, having shared rules that everyone knows and can follow helps enormously.

Is it any wonder this country is f*****.

Government: We've prepared this really simple bit of guidance to keep idiots who cant deal with complicated rules safe from Covid. Groups must be less than 6.

Idiots: I don't consider myself an idiot therefore I dont need to follow rules that were made simple enough for idiots to understand.

Could a bike club do the same?

If it's affiliated to BC or CUK then yes (I guess that would also be a good criteria to judge whether your "club" is a social gathering or a sporting event).

Our clubs rules derived from the BC guidance are group rides are all <6.

They all meet at different times/places (only generally round the corner but ensures there's no mixing).

They're all pre-registered via e-mail to the club secretary who'll post out a list of who's organising what (generally fast, brisk, gravel, steady x2, social x2 groups) on a thursday, then send a meet time/point to the group once its full/Saturday night.

Anecdotally it's proved really popular at bringing in new riders as a social paced group of 6 is less intimidating and easier to controll the speed of and doesn't attract "big fish in a small pond" types who should have moved up to something quicker.

I see this as just an interim step anyway.

Looking at current figures we are at approximately 3,000 new infections a day, at the peak we were up to 6,000. On March 23rd (when we entered lockdown) we had approximately 1,000. (Or is this because we are doing more testing now? )

I know that the Government is trying to avoid another lockdown but is it just me that has noticed this and thinks we are heading for another lockdown?

Can we meet in groups > 6 if we are more then 2 metres apart (my mate asked while sat in a huge sea kayak). I guess so.

Everybody has common sense

Common sense is where a large majority (in common) would think ad act the same. People who think and act very differently from the large majority therefore don't have common sense, they just have individual sense.

Been a nightmare for my local swinging group...the answer is obviously to wear tweed & pretend you are shooting grouse?

Both involve butts in various states of disrepair, so why not?

Common sense is where a large majority (in common) would think ad act the same

That is one meaning of the term, yes. There’s another meaning/understanding of the term as well, which sort of reinforces my point, doesn’t it.

The Rule of Six was nice and clear. Oh at last i thought. Then came the exemptions. Now it's all over the place again.

And well said TJ on the shooting / hunting issue.

Well we had 9 turn up this morning for our Wed ride, so we rode in two groups-ish which randomly changed people over the course of the ride. We sat in two separate groups at the cafe. As always the return from cafe disintegrated into an all out race with 9 people spread over several miles as they got dropped one by one...

No one got fined, so must have been ok.

Common sense is where a large majority (in common) would think ad act the same. People who think and act very differently from the large majority therefore don’t have common sense, they just have individual sense.

Common sense is for commoners! ****ing 50 percentiler normies ruin everything for the rest of us no matter which side of that distribution you lie on. 😀

The two five a side games I play in have been up and running since ~ end of July, both are casual games and not FA affliated, and my veterans XI a side is still going despite not being FA affiliated.

I think the organised bit is specifically trying to discourage people just taking a football down the park to bypass the rule of six by pretending they are playing football.