You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
Genuinely not me so details are a little sketchy and may not be fully representative of the situation but its made me angry on their behalf and wanted to provide some better friendly advice.
Background: he works as a trainer for a business where he runs courses for internal and external customers. He accidently left some details of some customers on his desk over night, and his business considered this a breach of GDPR.
several days later (payday, end of day on Friday) hes pulled into an office and told that he has to either face disciplicnary process nad told it would result in him being fired or he can resign on the spot. He wouldn't be allowed to think about it, take any time, talk to anyone, and must resign with immediate effect (ie with no notice period, or gardening leave). He wasn't given any warnings, and was IMO pretty much bullied into resigning to ensure a favourable refercene in the future. Also was told not to tell anyone about what had happened ( again highly suspicious behaviour)
He explained all this to me a few days later and I feel he's been properly screwed over, but he's not sure if there's any case to be had here or worth fighting over to rock the boat etc.
I want the company to realise that this kind of behaviour is unacceptable and letting them get away with it is far worse, but its not my case to fight.
So WWSTW do? I'm not sure he's been there over 2 years if that affects things, and the fact that he's already (effectively forced to) 'voluntarily' resign changes things.
Non-union member either i'm afraid and not a major major corporation but once that supposedly takes 'ethics' seriously.
Next steps? get peeved but move on?
Two years is important
Resigning was stupid
Being told to resign or no references is illegal
he has very little recourse now if any. If he is over two years he could threaten tribunal but thats a stressful and difficult road to go down
This is why everyone should be in a union
Leaving customer data unattended on desk is unlikely to be GDPR breach.
For a start - very low risk personal data if just customer contact details.
An incident/near miss at most. If nobody saw it who shouldn't and it wasn't disclosed outside of the company - no breach, let alone breach reportable to ICO.
Breach of company policy yes likely - if policy and consequences of breaking it are documented and clear.
That sounds to me either 1. you haven't got the full story. or 2. the company are utter shits anyway, and he's probably best out.
Yes, he has been screwed over, by the sounds of it. But as TJ says, under two years employment = far fewer rights.
The company is clearly not adhering to any recognised disciplinary procedure by announcing the likely judgement before it has even taken place, and bullying him into resigning on the spot. As for GDPR, does the company have a defined policy on document handling within the business premises? Sounds like either they were trying to get rid anyhow, or the managers have just had a GDPR seminar and are having a panic attack about what they see as potential penalties for breaches. Either way, no excuse for their behaviour.
By resigning, he's given himself very little opportunity for redress, though. If he has received a favourable reference, then that might be the best outcome.
It sounds like they want him out and were looking for an excuse, any excuse.
Very little point fighting it as they clearly don't want him there.
If he's already resigned, what can he do?
That's a bum deal.
Yeah seems they just wanted him gone and were looking for a reason, as has been said now he's actually resigned he has little recourse. If all the facts are as presented the company were arseholes and he's better off gone, hopefully he'll find a new job soon and look at it as a blessing in disguise.
If he’s already resigned, what can he do?
He may have a case for constructive dismissal, but more details are required - specifically his length of employment.
No point going any further until that is known TBH.
The GDPR breach is interesting. The civil service is extra sensitive on the subject after some well known cock ups. We are taught that letting any colleagues see customer details of a case that they have no reason to see could be a breach, so details left on desk, screen not locked if you are away from the desk etc, are all monitored closely.
Constructive dismissal sounds like a consideration.
Not much to add to the above but has he resigned in writing and (for my own interest) is a verbal resignation sufficient for the company?
Could you just turn up to work and say it was said in jest or something (or deny it outright I guess)?
Lewngth of service is they key. More than 2 years and you have options. Less- not so much.
Unless- he is a member of a group with protected characteristics, in which case- rightly or wrongly, he has a number of other rights and protections "Although your employer doesn't need to show a fair reason to dismiss you if you've been employed for under 2 years, they're not allowed to discriminate against you. Discrimination means you've been treated less favourably because of a protected characteristic, such as race, gender, religion etc."
Not sure I understand the inference of the point you make hb70
Unless- he is a member of a group with protected characteristics, in which case- rightly or wrongly, he has a number of other rights and protections
None of the protected characteristics bring a right to break other policies. Nor do they overrule the right of the employer to enact the '2-year rule' which by definition is arbitrary.
Even if his case is not very strong, if its not completely hopeless many an employment lawyer would write a robust letter at which points many HR departments will agree a settlement - the waste of management time and legal fees fighting something like this to save a few months salary is usually not worth it. Failing to follow your own disciplinary policy is usually a good start for an employment lawyer.
@csb- I'm sorry i'm not sure how to do quotes.
Assuming that the two years service is not in place, and that the story is as told, then it feels like a pretty shoddy dismissal, almost certainly not gross misconduct, and with a poor disciplinary process to back it up.
If the OP has protected characteristics, then as @poly says a letter from an employment lawyer has a reasonable chance of securing a settlement offer from HR, because of the risk of a no-limit award.
Again I'm not saying this is right or wrong, but just that this is a strategy that could be an option if there are protected characteristics in place.
I'd be tempted to speak to the ACAS helpline quickly, they cannot give specific advice but they are aware of the law and can definitely inform you whether the process followed is likely to be legal.
On the outside - doesn't seem to be - it might be the best outcome in the end with a reference and no blemish on the record but the undue haste to make that decision and resign on the spot seems unreal.
Sort of similar - we had an employee at a previous firm that was spending far too much time on the internet*; conspicuously so and although the websites weren't illegal (gambling or porn, etc.) they were pushing acceptability too. So he was given the opportunity to resign or go through a misconduct process, and he created sufficient problems by asking for IT to verify that his usage was vastly different to others and if so, why weren't everybody having a similar meeting. It's a shaky case but created enough noise about unfair treatment that he got a payout to go to avoid any trouble.
Can your friend enquire whether any others have been warned, officially or otherwise for the same thing, just to verify they aren't being singled out for specific treatment?
* and FWIW, it wasn't me and I've got the week off this week so I'm not shirking today either.
Constructive dismissal sounds like a consideration.
Very very hard to prove but the threat of even attempting to do so might just get him a settlememnt
@hb70 cut/paste the bit you want and plonk the B-quote button thing in front and behind.
My point about the 2 year rule is that the employer doesn't have to give a reason for terminating employment, so I'm not sure how they'll be revealed to have discriminated. A shit rule for sure.
I agree that a threat of fuss in letter form might secure a without-prejudice payment.
My point about the 2 year rule is that the employer doesn’t have to give a reason for terminating employment, so I’m not sure how they’ll be revealed to have discriminated. A shit rule for sure.
I agree that a threat of fuss in letter form might secure a without-prejudice payment.
The protected characteristics point is important because you can secure a tribunal without 2 years service if you allege discrimination. Which is useful as a negotiating lever to the likely outcome which is- as you say, a without prejudice offer of cash. I think we're saying the same thing, just in different ways.
And @csb thanks for the B-quote tip 🙂
Very very hard to prove but the threat of even attempting to do so might just get him a settlememnt
Resign or we will fire you, with no oppportunity for advice is a lot easier to show than a typical “they made life unbearable”
It's Carly isn't it? She left the beer recipes out?
My point about the 2 year rule is that the employer doesn’t have to give a reason for terminating employment, so I’m not sure how they’ll be revealed to have discriminated. A shit rule for sure.
Suggests there's more to it, as why concoct some GDPR bollox to fire someone when they could just politely show him the door?
Perhaps he is over the 2yrs, though, OP wasn't sure.
Effectively, they're saying that a GDPR breach is gross misconduct but I would question whether inadvertently leaving some stuff around amounts to that - more likely a written warning / attend some training if it was a first offence. I used to see some case management stuff in HR and this is pretty mild for a dismissal unless they've had prior warnings?
Even with GMC there should still be an investigation and hearing. Doesnt sound like GMC from the description to be honest but if under 2 years service or if resignation is in writing it's not worth pursuing.
Seems like an opportunity to do a ‘Lester Burnham’ on his employer...
I think there is a lot more to this.
I have seen scenarios where a good employee had a major fu and as a favour, been advised to resign (keeping reputation and references) rather than face disciplinary, stress, eventual sacking anyway plus loss of reputation and a reference saying "fired for gross misconduct" which would make getting a new job hard.
Constructive dismissal would be my first consideration...how can the employer threaten a disciplinary process yet already have determined the outcome would be dismissal? That's the whole point, it's an investigation to determine the facts and resulting outcome (no action, verbal or written warning etc)
I've had a few colleagues go through disciplinary, and even when it was a clear cut gross misconduct (going sick to work for another employer, informally warned, then going sick one afternoon and being offered light duties to save his sick record, and then being spotted at his other job) the manager was not allowed to suggest resignation as an option as although probably the best option, it could come back as constructive dismissal, however gentle that suggestion.
...but if under 2 years service or if resignation is in writing it’s not worth pursuing.
Except - he's being asked to resign without notice - as a bare minimum he should be getting paid his notice.
My point about the 2 year rule is that the employer doesn’t have to give a reason for terminating employment, so I’m not sure how they’ll be revealed to have discriminated.
If they have under 2 yrs then why on earth would they force them to resign?
This in itself would seem to me to be a desperate act by the company that have now utterly failed to follow their own process.
the manager was not allowed to suggest resignation as an option as although probably the best option, it could come back as constructive dismissal, however gentle that suggestion.
This ^^^^
Assuming they’re under 2 years the best option IMO would be to try to negotiate a PILON payment and move on. Anything else will simply cause more trouble than it’s worth. If they really are that moronic you’re better off out of it.